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From: owner-80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com (80-96-list-digest)
To: 80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com
Subject: 80-96-list-digest V3 #364
Reply-To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
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80-96-list-digest Saturday, December 25 1999 Volume 03 : Number 364



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980-1996 Trucks and Vans
Visit our web site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/
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To unsubscribe, send email to:
majordomo ford-trucks.com
with the words "unsubscribe 80-96-list-digest" in the body of the
message.
=======================================================================
In this issue:

FTE 80-96 - 351M/9" rear
Fw: FTE 80-96 - Sometimes Hard To Start
FTE 80-96 - Chrome Molding Around Wheel Wells
RE: FTE 80-96 - Chrome Molding Around Wheel Wells
FTE 80-96 - 4,000 rpm brick wall
Re: FTE 80-96 - 4,000 rpm brick wall
Re: FTE 80-96 - 351M/9" rear
Re: FTE 80-96 - 4,000 rpm brick wall
Re: FTE 80-96 - 351M/9" rear
FTE 80-96 - (no subject)
Re: Fw: FTE 80-96 - Sometimes Hard To Start
FTE 80-96 - T-18 fixed and shifting good!
FTE 80-96 - Merry Christmas
Re: FTE 80-96 - (no subject)
FTE 80-96 - Happy Holidays
Re: FTE 80-96 - Merry Christmas
Re: FTE 80-96 - 4,000 rpm brick wall
FTE 80-96 - Name that part [3]
FTE 80-96 - No oil pressure

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 11:06:53 EST
From: RobWaz316 aol.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - 351M/9" rear

I recently got a 351M out of a 1980 F150. I plan to rebuild it, and
hopefully modify it a bit for more power, mostly low end as it is going into
a truck. Anyone have experience with this motor? I read that the cylinder
walls are fairly thin and that boring out will lead to overheating. From the
spec sheets, it looks like it can be made into a 400 with just a crank, even
the connecting rods appear to be the same size. I would like to know about
other swaps to gain more displacement or power. Are 427, 429, or 460 parts
interchangeable? Mainly, I am looking for heads. I will go aftermarket if I
have to, but I would rather find something used and cheap.
Also, I am looking to swap a 9" rear into my 89 F150 for strength, and
because it is easier to change axle ratio. Has anyone done this? Will my
rear ABS be a problem? Has anyone converted a 9" to a full floater? Any
help would be greatly appreciated. Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays to all.
Rob
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 10:49:46 -0600
From: "Justen Noakes" texas.net>
Subject: Fw: FTE 80-96 - Sometimes Hard To Start

Listers,

The problem turned out to be the starter. However, I did go ahead and
replace the battery also. I hope to be set, at least starting wise, for
another 5 years.

Happy Holidays!

Justen
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Justen Noakes texas.net>
To: <80-96-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Saturday, December 18, 1999 4:46 PM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Sometimes Hard To Start


> Folks,
>
> Got in the truck yesterday, everything started fine. Stopped to get
donuts
> about a block away and when I got back in the truck wouldn't start. I had
> to
> get the clerk to give me a jump (always have cables). It started right up
> on the
> first try while connected to the jumper cables...OK the battery is finally
> shot I thought.
>
> Went to work (had a presentation or would have gone to get battery then)
and
> sure
> enough had to be jumped again after work (expected that).
>
> This morning, hoped in and it started right up. Soooo, I took the battery
to
> Monkey
> Wards and had them test it...OK under the regular test and the load test
> (gotta
> love Motorcraft). Cleaned cables, connectors, posts, top of battery
(looks
> good!).
> Corrosion wasn't that bad, I try to keep an eye on it, but there was some
> build up.
> Put battery back in, truck started right up. Went out an hour ago to go
to
> the store,
> and what do you know...click, click, click and finally it started. I none
> the less took
> the wife's car.
>
> What's going on...The truck is a '95 F-150, 300 I6, 5spd., will have owned
5
> years
> in May..so the battery (OEM) is at least 5 years old and has probably been
> on-line that long
> as well.
>
> Is it the battery? Starter?
>
> I have never had a problem with my truck and I don't want to get stuck
> because of a damn
> maintenance item.
>
> Any help greatly appreciated.
>
> Justen Noakes
> San Antonio
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 10:55:15 -0600
From: "Justen Noakes" texas.net>
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Chrome Molding Around Wheel Wells

Fellow Ford Truckers,

Has anybody replaced/removed the chrome moldings around
their wheel wells?

I would like to replace them with something black and rubber,
but I do not have a 4wd so I do not want the really big fender
flares like bushwhacker offers.

Any ideas on a good replacement or leaving them off all together?

As always, thanks.

Justen Noakes
'95 F-150 XL
2wd, S/C
4.9L, 5sp
jrnoakes texas.net


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 12:05:37 -0500
From: "Michael R. Dunbar" vtc.vsc.edu>
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Chrome Molding Around Wheel Wells

I'm in the process of removing mine. I've got a little rust under them which
I need to grind out and finish off though. However, it doesn't look bad at
all if done right, and if the rust is not too extensive.

Mike Dunbar
89 F-150 XLT Lariat
White River Jct., Vermont

"Just remember, the wheel's spinning but the hamster's dead"

Pet Peeve of a Goldfish:
"Just because I have a three-second memory, they don't think I'll mind
eating the same fish flakes ... Oh boy! Fish flakes!"

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 25 Dec 1999 05:42:04 +1100
From: les williams cyber.net.au>
Subject: FTE 80-96 - 4,000 rpm brick wall

Hi All,
Have an '87 F150, 2x4, SWB, 351 Clevo, Thermoquad 4 BBL, C6 Auto, 9"
Diff, Dual Exhaust system. Just can't seem to get that engine to spin
over 4.000 rpm. Done all the usual things, wet & dry Comp test OK, Carby
rebuild, Bosch ignition, cap, rotor, leads check out OK. Checked and
rechecked timing. Get out on the road and into the real world, and it
just will not exceed approx. 4 g's. Couldn't pull the skin of a rice
custard!! This truck should do better than this. I've offered a
ridiculously low price for it, and threaten the truck with a propane
conversion & MSD Ignition, not to suggest that this is the cure -
current owner not impressed!!

All suggestions gratefully received.

regards

Les
Lost in the Land of OZ


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 12:00:01 -0800
From: Bob Kennedy uswest.net>
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 4,000 rpm brick wall

That Cleveland should see 4 Grand, pretty easy. Is there a throttle limiter
on the carb?
Given that this is a retro fit, is the throttle cable long enough to get to
4 grand? Will it do it with the C6 in park? If it just hits the wall without
any drop off, then it's got to be a linkage issue. Try disconnecting all
linkage and see if it'll reach it.

Forgive me if you've tried all this, it's the first time I've seen the
question.

Bob


les williams wrote:

> Hi All,
> Have an '87 F150, 2x4, SWB, 351 Clevo, Thermoquad 4 BBL, C6 Auto, 9"
> Diff, Dual Exhaust system. Just can't seem to get that engine to spin
> over 4.000 rpm. Done all the usual things, wet & dry Comp test OK, Carby
> rebuild, Bosch ignition, cap, rotor, leads check out OK. Checked and
> rechecked timing. Get out on the road and into the real world, and it
> just will not exceed approx. 4 g's. Couldn't pull the skin of a rice
> custard!! This truck should do better than this. I've offered a
> ridiculously low price for it, and threaten the truck with a propane
> conversion & MSD Ignition, not to suggest that this is the cure -
> current owner not impressed!!
>
> All suggestions gratefully received.
>
> regards
>
> Les
> Lost in the Land of OZ
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 11:55:13 -0800
From: "Tom Humphreys" seanet.com>
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 351M/9" rear

Hey Rob,

I just happened to used to own an '80 F150 with a 351m. Not the original
motor in my truck, the PO pulled it from a Ranchero. It wouldn't happen to
be a two-tone blue cab and a brown/primer gray bed in Seattle? Anyway, I
had to do a top end rebuild on it and looked for used heads forever. All
cracked. Apparently those heads are notorious for cracking. Finally found
a set that were cracked but weldable. Many people warned me away from the
351M during that process. I wish you luck.
Tom Humphreys, West Seattle
'71 Westy "Mach Schnell"
'67 Beetle
'83 F250
- ----- Original Message -----
From: aol.com>
To: <80-96-list fordtrucks.com>
Sent: Friday, December 24, 1999 8:06 AM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - 351M/9" rear


> I recently got a 351M out of a 1980 F150. I plan to rebuild it, and
> hopefully modify it a bit for more power, mostly low end as it is going
into
> a truck. Anyone have experience with this motor? I read that the
cylinder
> walls are fairly thin and that boring out will lead to overheating. From
the
> spec sheets, it looks like it can be made into a 400 with just a crank,
even
> the connecting rods appear to be the same size. I would like to know
about
> other swaps to gain more displacement or power. Are 427, 429, or 460
parts
> interchangeable? Mainly, I am looking for heads. I will go aftermarket
if I
> have to, but I would rather find something used and cheap.
> Also, I am looking to swap a 9" rear into my 89 F150 for strength, and
> because it is easier to change axle ratio. Has anyone done this? Will my
> rear ABS be a problem? Has anyone converted a 9" to a full floater? Any
> help would be greatly appreciated. Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays to
all.
> Rob
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 15:34:14 EST
From: FULSZBRONC aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 4,000 rpm brick wall

Hi Les,
I'll bet you checked all the basics (exhaust restrictions, ignition
advance, plugged air cleaner,blah-blah-blah) but what about that Thermo-Puke?
On this side of the Date Line, I've never seen a Carter 4 bbl. on anything
other than a Chrysler. Did it come that way? I suppose it would physically
bolt up to the Ford manifold in place of a Holly (or Motorcraft) but isn't
the TQ a spread-bore? Just a thought...
Alex

> Hi All,
> Have an '87 F150, 2x4, SWB, 351 Clevo, Thermoquad 4 BBL, C6 Auto, 9"
> Diff, Dual Exhaust system. Just can't seem to get that engine to spin
> over 4.000 rpm. Done all the usual things, wet & dry Comp test OK, Carby
> rebuild, Bosch ignition, cap, rotor, leads check out OK. Checked and
> rechecked timing. Get out on the road and into the real world, and it
> just will not exceed approx. 4 g's. Couldn't pull the skin of a rice
> custard!! This truck should do better than this. I've offered a
> ridiculously low price for it, and threaten the truck with a propane
> conversion & MSD Ignition, not to suggest that this is the cure -
> current owner not impressed!!
>
> All suggestions gratefully received.
>
> regards
>
> Les
> Lost in the Land of OZ
>
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 13:13:50 -0800 (PST)
From: Keith Lawyer yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 351M/9" rear

- --- RobWaz316 aol.com wrote:
> Also, I am looking to swap a 9" rear into my 89
> F150 for strength, and
> because it is easier to change axle ratio. Has
> anyone done this? Will my
> rear ABS be a problem? Has anyone converted a 9" to
> a full floater?

This is gonna get a BIG reaction, but the 9" just
ain't that much stronger than the 8.8. It is easier
to change the axle ratio as you said, and it is easier
to replace broken axles, but the effort of a swap to
the 9" in contrast to the small amount of strength you
might gain is disproportionate, IMHO.
For those of you wanting to say "c-clip" I've seen
two 9"s fail at the flange in which case you STILL
lose your wheel!
Yes, your ABS may be a problem, particularly if you
have the E4OD as it, in some way, determines shift
points from the ABS sensor. This may only be on '92+,
I'm not sure. Also, somewhere in the '90s the speedo
gets it's reading from the ABS sensor, no ABS, no
speedo. As you have an '89 this may not apply to you,
but it's easy to figure out: unplug your ABS plug on
top of the diff and drive around.
As far as the 9" full-floater, Andy Skaar has done
it, here's his BigBroncos registry page:
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=186

The pic entitled "Hmm that's not good" is in fact
one of the two times I have seen a 9" fail at the
flange. I believe this incident is partly why he went
to the full-floater conversion. I've seen video of
this recovery and it was quite an ordeal, many hours.
Anyway, a swap to consider would be the Ford
Sterling rear, aka 10.25. This already has an
identical ABS plug, and is second in strenth to
perhaps only the GM 14 bolt. However, just how you're
gonna get 8 lugs on your front TTB is whole 'nother
adventure. . . if you figure out how to do this LMK.

Keith L.
Full flame suit and body armor on. . .

_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 17:13:19 EST
From: Lingus0169 aol.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - (no subject)

hi, I have a 1985 f150 xl 300 i6. The i6 300 has a cracked head and some
other problems. I bought an 82 351 windsor, it was out of a fullsize bronco.
I need a computer module not the ignition module. i found one but it is
from a 85 bronco with a 351 windsor, does the year of the module matter.
Will the 85 computer module work in the 82 engine? thankc for the help, and
have a merry christmass and a happy new year
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 16:33:33 -0600
From: Jim Cannon gtalumni.org>
Subject: Re: Fw: FTE 80-96 - Sometimes Hard To Start

At 10:49 24/12/99 -0600, you wrote:
>Listers,
>
>The problem turned out to be the starter. However, I did go ahead and
>replace the battery also. I hope to be set, at least starting wise, for
>another 5 years.

Check out the condition of all the starter cables while you are in there
and replace any in bad condition. If you do, you really will NOT have to
mess with the starting system for a number of years. (I don't know about 5
years on the new battery, though... depends on what brand you bought and
where you live.) I spend the extra $$$ on the 2 guage starter cables to get
the most volts and amps into the starter. Not too much more money than the
standard 6 guage cables.


Jim Cannon
Houston, TX "A Ramblin' Wreck from Georgia Tech
'29 Ford Model A Phaeton and a helluva' engineer!"
'80 Ford F-150 300 I-6 2WD '63 Buick Riviera 401 V-8
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Dec 1999 18:48:09 -0500
From: "The Lublin Family" tir.com>
Subject: FTE 80-96 - T-18 fixed and shifting good!

Friends:

Well The problem with my T-18 is the "Trunnion Pin" for the shifter. It
was wore way out...That and the fact the keyway in the shifter is severely
worn....I ordered the new trunnion pin from the dealer for about $2. and
some odd change. Installed the pin in the lot at the Ford dealer and the
truck is good to go! True, it dont shift as firm as a new one, but it is a
90 percent improvement. it still has a "Weak" shift from 3rd to 4th...The
dealer says it is the shift interlock spring that is either broke or weak.
I would order one..but they are $3.50 each, and you have to order them in 6
or more....I dont need six..just one!

Thanks for the help all..Merry Christmass!

Chris "Lube" Lublin
Lube's auto.

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 20:12:44 PST
From: "Scottie Schmidt" hotmail.com>
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Merry Christmas

Just wanted to wish everyone a blessed and happy Christmas.

Merry Christmas
Thanks,
Scottie Schmidt JR.


______________________________________________________

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 23:16:48 -0500
From: "slik" mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - (no subject)

The 85 computer wiring harness should work on the '82. However, are you
carbed? The '82's were carbed, but I assume that you are going to FI and
that's why you need the computer. If it's carbed, you don't need no
stinking computer!! Anyway, the engines themselves are pretty generic
through the '80's.

Slik

> hi, I have a 1985 f150 xl 300 i6. The i6 300 has a cracked head and some
> other problems. I bought an 82 351 windsor, it was out of a fullsize
bronco.
> I need a computer module not the ignition module. i found one but it is
> from a 85 bronco with a 351 windsor, does the year of the module matter.
> Will the 85 computer module work in the 82 engine?

== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 23:46:13 -0500
From: "Michael R. Dunbar" vtc.vsc.edu>
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Happy Holidays

Just a quick note wishing all a happy and safe Christmas. Hope everyone gets
new toys for their trucks.

Mike Dunbar
89 F-150 XLT Lariat
White River Jct., Vermont

"Just remember, the wheel's spinning but the hamster's dead"

Pet Peeve of a Goldfish:
"Just because I have a three-second memory, they don't think I'll mind
eating the same fish flakes ... Oh boy! Fish flakes!"

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 25 Dec 1999 00:10:57 -0800
From: mcphoto provide.net>
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Merry Christmas

Me too. Blessings to everyone.


Max W. Cottrell


Scottie Schmidt wrote:

> Just wanted to wish everyone a blessed and happy Christmas.
>
> Merry Christmas
> Thanks,
> Scottie Schmidt JR.
>
> ______________________________________________________
> >
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 25 Dec 1999 00:25:32 -0500
From: S Spaulding worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 4,000 rpm brick wall

It's been a while since I worked on a TQ, but if the spring on the
secondary flap (I forget the real name for it) isn't adjusted right, the
secondaries won't work, and it really bogs at WOT. The adjustment is a
little touchy, and it is easy to make it so that the flap opens at the
wrong time or not at all. It is independent of the secondary throttle
plates.

I had a Chrysler 440 that acted as you describe until I straightened it
out. If you want, I can try and find the TQ documentation (no
promises).

Steve

les williams wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> Have an '87 F150, 2x4, SWB, 351 Clevo, Thermoquad 4 BBL, C6 Auto, 9"
> Diff, Dual Exhaust system. Just can't seem to get that engine to spin
> over 4.000 rpm. Done all the usual things, wet & dry Comp test OK, Carby
> rebuild, Bosch ignition, cap, rotor, leads check out OK. Checked and
> rechecked timing. Get out on the road and into the real world, and it
> just will not exceed approx. 4 g's. Couldn't pull the skin of a rice
> custard!! This truck should do better than this. I've offered a
> ridiculously low price for it, and threaten the truck with a propane
> conversion & MSD Ignition, not to suggest that this is the cure -
> current owner not impressed!!
>
> All suggestions gratefully received.
>
> regards
>
> Les
> Lost in the Land of OZ
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 23:59:36 -0600
From: Steve Deis attglobal.net>
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Name that part [3]

> > >
> > > << Al, a perfect example of "if you're gonna' work on your truck with a
> > > factory shop manual, you should read the thing"... >>
> > >
> > Al, the above comment was directed at the guy who first replied about
> >using a Ford manual, and then misidentified what you were looking
> >for...I did NOT intend that as a flame/shot/attitude toward you.
> >
> > > Well, I agree with that....hoiwever, all I have is a Haynes and a Chiltons
> > > manual. I read both of them.
> >
> > .........snipped......
> >
> > I've got Chilton/Haynes also...neither cover the vacuum cannister or
> >injector cooling fan. If you know somebody in a shop that's set up with
> >AllData CD's, they get into it a little bit, but certainly not
> >completely.
> >
> > > I appreciate the answers I received. This is my first foray into anything
> > > like this so I am learning as I go. Maybe I'm out of my league here, but
> > > everyone has to start somewhere. Thanks again to all who replied, and I
> > > assure you I won't ask if I can find the answer on my own.
> > >
> >
> > > Al,
> > >
> > > Ask away. There's always someone willing to answer your questions. The
> > > flamers need only to be left alone.
> >
> > Again, NO flame intended toward Al. Just thought it ironic that the
> >"shop manual master" hadn't read his before he replied.
> >
> > >They asked questions once. Now they
> > > just know it all. If we didn't ask questions here that we could find
> > > answers for elsewhere if we looked, this would be a lackluster site.
> >
> > Absolutely correct. I've learned a lot from the list in just a month
> >or so.
> >
> > Many thanks to Kevin Reed in Canada for his fuel gauge fix...worked
> >perfectly.
> >
> > Happy holidays to all
> >
> > steve in tx
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 23:05:57 PST
From: "James Poylio" hotmail.com>
Subject: FTE 80-96 - No oil pressure

Hello,

I have a problem that I hope someone on the list can help with.
On Sunday the 19th I drove my 1990 F-150 with 302 V8, 4x4, from
Los Angeles to Minnesota for Christmas. Made the trip in 36 hours,
and the truck ran well all the way. Stopped to rest in Colorado
in sub-freezing temperatures, and the engine started fine the
next morning.

But when I got home, I parked the truck outside in the snow,
in -10F cold. The next morning, when I tried to start it,
the engine made a "breaking" sound and started right up, but
it ran very noisily for the few seconds it took me to realize
the oil pressure gauge was on zero and the red ENGINE light was
on. I ran it again in this condition for a few seconds for
my brother to verify what I had noticed, that the valves were
making lots of noise due to lack of oil.
The truck had 10W-30 oil in it, which was OK for California but
not so for such cold weather. Therefore, I thought that the
high viscosity may have caused my oil pump to fail. So, I
went through the trouble of replacing the oil pump. What troubles
me now is that the old oil pump, when we manually turned it
in a pan of oil, seemed to pump very well. The pickup screen
is not clogged, the distributor shaft and intermidiate oil pump
drive shaft are in good shape. I have not yet replaced the oil
pan and tested the engine with the new pump, but I've a feeling
that the pump was not the problem.

Let me ask these questions: Does my 302 have an oil pressure
relief valve, and could it cause a no oil pressure condition?
If so, where is it located and how do I test and then repair
or replace it? Or, could an oil gallery plug have come loose
and caused this problem? If so, where are THEY located, and
how do I replace them? The engine is lifted, the oil pan and
upper intake manifold are off. How much further would I have
to dig into the engine to get at these?

Many thanks in advance for any advice you could provide.
I hope to drive this truck back to California on January 3,
so somehow or other this problem must be fixed.

James Poylio

BTW: in the middle of all this, I replaced my cracked
exhaust manifold with the one sent by Dave Heverin. Thanks!
It's in good condition and fits beautifully.
Also replaced both front engine mounts-- the two halves of each had
completely separated. The rubber had split down the middle.
Apparently gravity was the only thing holding my engine in place.
______________________________________________________

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