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Received: with LISTAR (v0.128a; list 80-96-list); Tue, 07 Mar 2000 03:45:30 -0500 (EST)
Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 03:45:30 -0500 (EST)
From: Ford Truck Enthusiasts List Server ford-trucks.com>
To: 80-96-list digest users ford-trucks.com>
Reply-to: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: 80-96-list Digest V2000 #27
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80-96-list Digest Mon, 06 Mar 2000 Volume: 2000 Issue: 027

In This Issue:
Re: Chevy vs Ford engines
Re: 1 more tranny Petersen missed
Bed skins?
Fun from the Weekend --- thin ice
Bad Clutch Design
Re: Chevy vs Ford engines
Re: 1 more tranny Petersen missed
Re: ch*vies again
Read and Laugh!!!
Re: Read and Laugh!!!
Re: Read and Laugh!!!
[Fwd: Returned mail: User unknown]
Re: Locking gas cap
New '96 questions
please help
Re: Your truck
Re: Locking gas cap
Re: Matter Of Ethnic Principal


From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)" visteon.com>
Subject: Re: Chevy vs Ford engines
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 08:04:53 -0500

Any decent mechanic can make any engine run well. That is not the point
here. This is a ford list and if you want to talk about the qualities of a
chevy motor then you are on the wrong list and your comments are not welcome
here, they are totally inappropriate here and that's the end of it, pure and
simple. Accuracy of your statements are irrelevant.

If you want to brag about chevies, do it on a chevy list where it will be
appreciated :-(

Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary


From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)" visteon.com>
Subject: Re: 1 more tranny Petersen missed
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 08:24:56 -0500

I'm sorry if I missed mentioning that these were "bullet proof" HD trannys
for off road use. The 4 speed OD is not in that class but the C-6
certainly is. We all have our favorite trannys so don't feel insulted at
this remark. The AOD and toploader OD's all have a cherished place but not
behind large engines off road which is what this article was about :-) I
guess my real point is the way the media plays up the the GM crowd and seems
to "deliberately" miss good ford and dodge stuff, what a shame :-(

In doing this they seem to fail to remember GM's pulling out of racing
simply because they could not be top dog in 63-64 and left their factory
teams dead in the water. Good thing about all that was that most of that
talent went over to Ford and stayed there :-) When they developed the 396
and managed to get the racing associations to ban larger engines (which ford
and chrysler had been concentrating on) they came back. Just saw a really
neat show on this subject on speed vision. It, of course, centered on the
GM aspect, the 409 in particular but in the process they made GM look
foolish because they admitted to these facts.

I would love to see a show like this in the same era about the Ford racing
effort and from Ford's perspective. I bet that would be an eye opener, eh?

Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary

>Petersens also forgot to mention the 4 spd, Manual O.D. in my
>85 150, behind
>a 351W 4x4.
>I think it was technically called a TOD? Stock : 3.01, 1.78,
>1.00, 0.71


Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 08:40:31 -0600
From: Steve Randa ch-advertising.com>
Subject: Bed skins?

I'm getting ready to paint the '84. Got the typical cancer above the
rear wheel wells and wanted to throw out this question. Is there a
decent skin replacement for these trucks and how does it compare in cost
to just picking up a new (old) bed. What about longevity of the skins.
Will I have the same problem a few more years down the road? Seems like
the drainage problem was fixed in '87-up beds. It might just be my
imagination too though! ;)

Steve Randa


From: "Moore, Jimmy" ZymeTx.com>
Subject: squeak
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 11:46:47 -0600

Somehow I sprayed some Gunk brand Carb/choke cleaner into my little one
barrel carb on my 300 Six, and now it squeaks when at idle in drive. The
squeak goes away when accelerated. Any clues?

Jim Moore
1964 Ford F-100 292
1981 Ford F-150 300 Six
Oklahoma City, OK


From: Greg Carter entrust.com>
Subject: Fun from the Weekend --- thin ice
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 12:48:39 -0500

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://eatporsche.stangnet.com follow the off-road links.

We (well just me, my friends are not quite as adventurous) were actually
trying to break through...

Greg Carter
Entrust Technologies - http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.entrust.com


From: rdhunt sandia.gov
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 13:01:30 -0700 (MST)
Subject: Bad Clutch Design

I have a 95 F-250 with the PowerStroke Diesel and 5-spd manual
transmission. It has 50K miles most of which are from city driving.
The other day my clutch made a popping noise when I pushed it in
so I looked under the dash and noticed the plasitc bushing that
connects the clutch lever to the rod going through the firewall
was worn out. I replaced the part ($4) and the next day it
broke again. I took the truck to the dealer and was told I needed
$1500 worth of work. The clutch and clutch pedal assembly had
to be replaced. Talking to another dealer I was told the reason
for replacing these parts was to install the redesigned system
to prevent this from happening in the future.

I want to know why I am having to pay for a poorly designed
clutch system when I did nothing wrong. I feel Ford should
at least split the cost with me as the clutch itself probably
had another 50K+ miles left on it. I know it is very subjective
but at most I pull about] 7000 lbs. woth of camper and boat a
few times a year.

Has anyone else had this problem and has anyone looked at trying
to get Ford to help pay for the fix?



| |
| Richard D. Hunt |
| Sandia National Laboratories |
_| P.O. Box 5800 M/S 0965 |_
/ | Albuquerque, NM 87185-0965 | \
/ /| Voice: (505)844-3193 |\ \
_( (_| Fax: (505)844-5993 |_) )_
(((\ \| /-) mailto:rdhunt sandia.gov (-\ |/ /)))
(\\ \_/ /________________________________\ \_/ ////)
\ / \ /
\ _/ \_ /
/ / \ \
/ / \ \


Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 15:12:42 -0500
From: flagship worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Chevy vs Ford engines

I don't want to stir it up again but I appreciate the comparisons.
Hopefully Ford reads the list and will support aftermarket companies
attempts to build performance enhancing accessories at a reasonable
price. Discussion on this list to accomplish that end is helpful. Does
anyone have a feasable reason why the costs are always more for the
Fords? Even on the aftermarket? I think comparisons to other makers is

Peters, Gary (G.R.) wrote:
> Any decent mechanic can make any engine run well. That is not the point
> here. This is a ford list and if you want to talk about the qualities of a
> chevy motor then you are on the wrong list and your comments are not welcome
> here, they are totally inappropriate here and that's the end of it, pure and
> simple. Accuracy of your statements are irrelevant.
> If you want to brag about chevies, do it on a chevy list where it will be
> appreciated :-(


Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 15:18:18 -0800 (PST)
From: Keith Lawyer yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 1 more tranny Petersen missed

I agree Bob, no Borg Warner t-cases. There's got to
be millions of these things on the road, every Bronco
and F-series since the mid '80s got one. And they're
relatively trouble free and very strong.

Keith L.
'90 Bronco

--- Bob Kennedy uswest.net> wrote:
> That article wasn't even the tip of the iceberg, No
> ODs no Borg Warner cases.
> Since that's all I've got it left me a little
> disappointed as well.
> Bob

Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.


From: FLR150 aol.com
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 19:52:22 EST
Subject: Re: ch*vies again

In a message dated 3/5/00 4:20:56 PM Eastern Standard Time,
scott ford-trucks.com writes:

< < The bottom line is this: there is more "bang for the buck"
>with a Chevrolet small block.
OK...on the more bang for the buck theory. I have a buddy that started
building his 350 in his Z-71 pickup about the same time as I started my 5.0
buildup. He has a lighter truck and a bigger motor, has actually spent MORE
than I have, and I smoke his A$$ everytime we meet. You wanna know why?
Because I love my truck!!! I take care of it, only beat on it when asked for
by an unsuspecting Garbage Merchandise driver, and I have picked my parts
very carefully and bought thriftily to achieve my goal. After all totaled, I
have spent just under $4000 total on all the mods to my truck (including
suspension, fuel system upgrades, interior mods, tires/rims,slicks, and motor
parts) which by the way can be seen at HREF="www.members.aol.com/flr150/index.html"> my website or at HREF="http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.cs.fredonia.edu/~stei0302/WWW/DRAGTRUK/">DragTruk...Trucks
on the Dragstrip?
The sad part is he has spent almost $5000, has a supercharger and still cant
beat my heavier smaller, motored truck. He beats the crap outta his
machinery, runs it hard everyday, smashes the pedal to the asphalt as much as
he can, and chose those "everyone else has used them" cheap bolt on parts.
Now this is a Ford List, for Ford Truck Enthusiasts, if you wanna talk Fords,
stay around and chat, if not go the hell on so we can!!!
MY $4000 worth,
Wayne Foy
'94 Flareside SC
(Stock 18.33, now running 14.40s soon to be 13.90s with new combo)


From: FLR150 aol.com
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 20:17:51 EST
Subject: Read and Laugh!!!

I thought you guys would love this!!!

You Know You're A Riceboy If..

... you find yourself using the excuse `yo, but you gots twice as many
cylindas, du` after EVERY race
... you drive a 4 door `type R`
... your gumby pants make it hard to shift
... more than 20 of your mods involve sheilding You Know Youre A Riceboy
If.. whats actually underneath
... you have stickers that even most asians dont get
... you have stickers for parts you dont have
... you refer to 50hp as the `big shot`
... your car has so much camber it can drive on its side
... when you drive by, WWII veterans run for shelter
... your exhaust tip diameter is 4 times the inner muffler diameter
... you have `power by` anything anywhere on a car made by the engine
... birds make nests on your spoiler because its taller than the trees
... you sell crack for the image...not the money
... you have `N/T` polished on the side of car and you dont know what
bracket racing is...
... you will only race if the other guy removes four sparkplugs
... you can`t race uphills
... you have "All Motor" emblazoned on your rear hatch right next to your
14.50 dial in
... you brag to have nitrous and have a 14.50 dial in
... your exhaust system for your 1.8L is bigger than most Pro-stock cars
... you spent more money on stickers and stripes than your parents paid for
your car
... you go to a performance shop and immediately start rummaging through the
decal bin
... your tach is bigger than your head
... you have a shiftlight and your car is an automatic
... you refuse to race because it`s a "show car"
... your only mods are cut factory springs and a 5" chrome exhaust tip
... at Autocross events you don`t participate because you have a drag race
setup and at drag events you brag about kicking ass on the autocross.
... you have more lights on the front of your car than the USS Voyager
... you brag about a turbo kit that never seems to get installed.
... your exhaust sounds like a dying Moose
... your bright green $300 air filter is bigger than your engine.


From: SlamedF150 aol.com
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 21:12:14 EST
Subject: Re: Read and Laugh!!!

then................ when u try to pass a car like that, that actually has
something done to it then u lose, don't cry. I have seen many imports kill
v8's all day. :)


From: "Michael R. Dunbar" vtc.vsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Read and Laugh!!!
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:07:28 -0500

I could care less if an import can kick my ass any day. My brother has a
stock Honda that easily beats me in high end. However, who do you suppose
would win in a minor fender bender? And during the winter months, will an
import be able to tow you out of a snowbank? Nope, but a fellow Ford
F-series driver will, in fact I had that happen to me once already this
winter. And I'm not sure if this is just my youth speaking, but looking
under the hood of my truck is a bit of an ego boost, especially after
looking under the hood of an import. I dunno, maybe it's just me. I'll take
my Ford any day of the week, long as I can afford to put gas in the tanks.

Mike Dunbar
89 F-150 XLT Lariat
White River Jct., Vermont

"Just remember, the wheel's spinning but the hamster's dead"


Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:45:49 -0500
From: Rich snet.net>
Subject: [Fwd: Returned mail: User unknown]

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Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:44:32 -0500
From: Rich <"rdtectsnet.net,richard_tomas"bigfoot.com>
Organization: "Lead me not into temptation. I can find it myself."
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-SNET (Win95; U)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: 80-96-listford-trucks.com
Subject: re:Locking Gas caps
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Well, being as the price of gas here in Connecticut is $1.65 avg
for 87 octane!!!!!, Does anyone know of a good locking gas-cap, that
won't make the "check engine" light come on? It's only a matter of time
before some starts to siphon gas.



Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 22:51:48 -0500
From: Rich snet.net>
Subject: Re: Locking gas cap

Well, with the way the gas prices are here in Conn. Avg $1.65 for
87, self serve, I am thinking of getting 2 locking gas caps. Does anyone
know of ones that will work for our trucks, without making the "check
engine" light ome on?


From: "Harris, Scott" dfwairport.com>
Subject: New '96 questions
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:30:51 -0600

Just bought a '96 F250 SuperCab with the 5.8L EFI. Just wanted to ask a
couple of questions about it.
It has 78,000 miles on it. It runs great and is in great shape.

I didn't buy it for mileage but what can I expect from it?

If you have one around that year, what type of performance goodies have you
added and performed well?

Any service bulletins or gremlins I should watch for?

Thanks alot!

Scott Harris
'85 F150 SC 302EFI
'96 F250 SC 351EFI


From: "Joel Thomas" prodigy.net>
Subject: please help
Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:45:30 -0600

I have a 351W,edelbrock 600
performer manifold
and stock otherwise engine
except mallory unilite and promaster coil
my problem is pinging at 2500rpm and over with the secondaries opened
i have messed with the metering on the carb and to no avail
i was told that it was the vacuum advance so i turned to all the way and and it was the same
i also turned it all the way in just to see and i pinged real bad from 1000rpm and up
so i limped back home to readjust:)
is there a kit i can buy to adjust the advance even more and am i on the right track????
it is the 47 series so i am told unilite distributor??
i don't have an advance timing light but can borrow to see what advace timing it is pulling. the guy at summit tech said it should be around 36 timing and 3200 rpm
is that right ????
please help
i am having problems with this.

Joel Thomas
Little Rock,AR


Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:02:50 -0800
Subject: Re: Your truck
From: Bill Berninghausen juno.com>

On Mon, 6 Mar 2000 22:56:52 -0500 "Duane Brosky" ibm.net>
> I read your report on MSD performance and noted that you got your
> truck up
> to 85.

Actually, I backed off at 85--it felt like there was some left.

> a SROD 4 speed and 2.47 gears. Is this the same setup you use?

Car-type 3-speed (used to be on the column), 235/75/15 tires--all bone

It seems to run a bit rough in
> high
> gear around 60, at 1250 rpm.

At 60, I'm turning 1900 rpm, but my third is 1-1...I was too scared to
check the tach passing 85.

Did the ignition you talked about
> improve this
> performance enough to justify it's cost, and if so how much did it
> set you
> back.

The MSD-5 lists for about $120, but it's routinely available for $85-95;
add $30 or so for an MSD coil; add more for wires, plugs, as you need
them. It's too early to make a rational judgement based on evidence, but
the SOTPI (seat of the pants index) is right up there. Smooth as glass
from idle to 2200 rpm, no lumps, no hitches.
> I like this truck but it is embarrassingly slow on the highway. With
> the oil
> cartel getting ready to stick it to us I can't imagine getting a V-8
> model
> instead. How does your setup compare to mine?

The biggest difference I see, Duane, is intake or exhaust--breathing
volume makes a difference. I have a stock Carter 1bbl carb, recently
rebuilt, and a new muffler, but the cat is probably 120K miles old

My first thought when I read your post, and please don't be insulted, was
that your throttle cable has some slack in it. This problem limits your
throttle opening--when the pedal hits the floor, you can't get the last
bit of throttle travel. Yes, Blake, I am acquainted with this difficulty
via close, personal, embarassing experience.

Look for intake or exhaust restrictions of any kind, and make sure the
EGR is right (or 'fell off'). Check base timing and make sure you get
full advance. Dragging brake? C'mon, list folks, jump in--with a 2.47
rear end, Duane should be flying!

Bill in Portland



From: "Michael R. Dunbar" vtc.vsc.edu>
Subject: Re: Locking gas cap
Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 01:44:58 -0500

I've got a pair of locking gas caps for my dual tanks on my 89. However, I
can't tell you right off the top of my head who exactly makes them. They do
work however, and the check engine light doesn't come on. My aunt, the
previous owner, used to live in Orlando, Florida before moving to Richmond,
VA. In Florida, there were reported problems of people syphoning your tanks
or dumping sand in them, etc, therefore she got locking caps. If it weren't
so cold right now, I'd venture out and check on them for you. Unless someone
else on the list comes back with a response, I'll run out tomorrow between
class and let you know. Good luck in your search.

Mike Dunbar
89 F-150 XLT Lariat
White River Jct., Vermont

"Just remember, the wheel's spinning but the hamster's dead"


Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 03:45:34 -0500
From: Blake Malkamaki little-mountain.com>
Subject: Re: Matter Of Ethnic Principal

>Am I the only one who uses the word "Jap" WITHOUT any negative
>connotations? Its short for the word Japanese! Hell, I can't read
>everyone's mind to search for negative perceptions about every
>word I use in conversation.
>Same w/Americans calling British "brits" or a detective calling a
>victim a "vic" or a perpetrator a "perp". Just semantics.
>I can tell you this...the Japanese have a common word for
>Americans that might not be so perceived as neutral. Many other
>countries do too.
>If I call a catalytic converter a "cat" are the Al Sharpton's of the
>catalytic converter industry going to lambast me?
>Sheesh! Some people need to release some of their inner

When I use "jap" (lowercase), I am refering to trucks and products from
Japan (including Ford's stupid Mazda 5 speeds [on topic]). It may be a
negative connotation to the product, not to the country it came from.

I am part Finn, Brit, Kraut, and a Dutch Lowlander. These don't bother me a
bit. I am even occassionally called a Flatlander by my Pennsylvania friends
(this hurts!). My girlfriend is a proud Hillbilly from West Virginia.


End of 80-96-list Digest V2000 #27
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