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Received: with LISTAR (v0.129a; list 80-96-list); Sat, 08 Jul 2000 03:25:49 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 03:25:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Ford Truck Enthusiasts List Server ford-trucks.com>
To: 80-96-list digest users ford-trucks.com>
Reply-to: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: 80-96-list Digest V2000 #131
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80-96-list Digest Fri, 07 Jul 2000 Volume: 2000 Issue: 131

In This Issue:
Re: 1983 6.9 L Diesel water pump
Dying Battery?
Re: gas mileage
Re: gas mileage
Re: gas mileage
Re: gas mileage
Clutch Master Cylinder
Re: gas mileage
Re: TPS measurements
'93 F150 3:55 Lim Slp Diff
Re: '91 Aerostar driving lights
Re: Dying Battery?
Re: TPS measurements
Re: Dying Battery?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rnar_Huse?= bgnett.no>
Subject: Re: 1983 6.9 L Diesel water pump
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 08:42:17 +0200

I'm not quite familiar with the 6.9, but I'd take it that you'd be able to
unscrew the propeller from the fan assembly and extract it first, then you
have much more room to work (also saves you from punching a hole in the
radator with the fan blades while rummaging around).
Since you're taking off the water pump you may just as well take out the
radiator as well.
Have a bolt extractor tool set ready. The possibility for stuck bolts that
you mention is real.
Make sure you don't pour the antifreeze on the ground where cats and dogs
get at it, it'll kill them.

Bjørnar Huse
N-6012 Ålesund, Norway
Tel. 70 10 24 30, fax 70 10 24 51
1994 Ford Escort 1.3i
1947 Studebaker M-15
2000 Ford Excursion PSD


------------------------------

From: "Obert, Scott AT3" constellation.navy.mil>
Subject: Dying Battery?
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 00:03:25 -0700

Hi all, I just bought a 1995 F150 with a 302 about 3 months ago. I am
having a problem starting it sometimes. It happened once a couple weeks
ago. I tried to start it but it wouldn't even turn over, just made a bunch
of clicks like the battery was dead. I checked to see if I left anything
on, but the lights were all off and everything. Tried to start it again and
it turned over once, really slow. I waited another minute or so and then it
turned over about 3 times real slow. I waited a couple more minutes and
then it turned over a bunch of times real slow and then fired up. I let it
run for a little while and tried to start it again and it started up just
fine. It ran fine all weekend, drove it about 800 miles with some 4
wheeling too. Then it did it again just the other day. Then it started
fine until just today. Tried to start it and it turned over real slow 4 or
5 times and finally fired up on the first try. I drove it a mile or so and
shut it off. Started it up again and it turned over real slow a couple
times and it started up. Is my battery dying? Is my motor all gummed up?
I just changed the oil yesterday after 3500 miles. It has 114,000 miles on
it. Thanks for any thoughts.

Scott Obert
1995 F150 302
4X4 Short Bed

------------------------------

From: "Steve Schmeckpeper" home.com>
Subject: Re: gas mileage
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 07:00:24 -0500


Hey Jason,
I get ~14 around town with a LIGHT foot.
Haven't figgered out Hwy MPG yet.

Smeck
87 302EFI 2WD LB T-18 3.55 140k


> Subject vehicle: 93ish F150 4x4, Ext cab shortbed, 302, 5
>speed, 3.55 gears. What kind of mileage could be expected
>with this setup?
> Jason
> '69 Bronco 5.0 EFI
> '96 F250 Ext Cab 4WD Powerstroke E4OD


------------------------------

From: "Obert, Scott AT3" constellation.navy.mil>
Subject: Re: gas mileage
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 07:51:12 -0700

I average 11 MPG with a pretty heavy foot and about 60% highway miles.
1995, F150, 302, 114K, 5spd, 3.55, 33" BFG Mud terrains, 7" lift

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Schmeckpeper [mailto:stv99 home.com]
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 5:00 AM
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: [80-96-list] Re: gas mileage



Hey Jason,
I get ~14 around town with a LIGHT foot.
Haven't figgered out Hwy MPG yet.

Smeck
87 302EFI 2WD LB T-18 3.55 140k


> Subject vehicle: 93ish F150 4x4, Ext cab shortbed, 302, 5
>speed, 3.55 gears. What kind of mileage could be expected
>with this setup?
> Jason
> '69 Bronco 5.0 EFI
> '96 F250 Ext Cab 4WD Powerstroke E4OD

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Please remove this footer when replying.


------------------------------

From: soffiler centraltools.com
Subject: Re: gas mileage
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 11:40:23 -0400

> > Subject vehicle: 93ish F150 4x4, Ext cab shortbed, 302, 5
> >speed, 3.55 gears. What kind of mileage could be expected
> >with this setup?
> > Jason
> > '69 Bronco 5.0 EFI
> > '96 F250 Ext Cab 4WD Powerstroke E4OD

Fuel economy varies a LOT based upon:

* driving habits (leadfoot? lightfoot?)
* your terrain (Colorado? Kansas?)
* your climate (cold=thick fluids=poor mpg; hot=A/C=poor mpg)
* optional equipment (the guy with the Mudders that gets 11mpg)
* your mix of city and highway driving
* load (always carrying sacks of cement? 500lb of tools?)
* etc.

With all of that said, I would hazard a guess that a 302 w/ 5-spd and
3.55's, driven pretty easy, on stock tires, with about 50/50 city and
highway, in mostly flat terrain, would return about 16 mpg.

For comparison, my '97 F250HD with 351, E4OD automatic, 4.10 axle (heavier
truck, bigger engine, auto trans, steeper axle ratio) gives 13mpg winter and
14mpg summer.


Steve Offiler
soffiler centraltools.com
'97 F250HD XL 4x4, 351, E40D, 4.10's




------------------------------

From: rexbennett eibiz.net
Subject: Re: gas mileage
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 11:32:36 -0500

That's about right, my 95 F150, 4X4, Ext. Cab, 302, Auto, 3.55 gears gets
around 15-16 MPG back and forth to work which is about half Interstate half
city. It might get a little better if I drove it a little easier.

Rex

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Offiler [mailto:soffiler centraltools.com]
Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 10:40 AM
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: [80-96-list] Re: gas mileage

Fuel economy varies a LOT based upon:

* driving habits (leadfoot? lightfoot?)
* your terrain (Colorado? Kansas?)
* your climate (cold=thick fluids=poor mpg; hot=A/C=poor mpg)
* optional equipment (the guy with the Mudders that gets 11mpg)
* your mix of city and highway driving
* load (always carrying sacks of cement? 500lb of tools?)
* etc.

With all of that said, I would hazard a guess that a 302 w/ 5-spd and
3.55's, driven pretty easy, on stock tires, with about 50/50 city and
highway, in mostly flat terrain, would return about 16 mpg.


------------------------------

From: "Steve Pannasch" badsector.com>
Subject: Clutch Master Cylinder
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 15:27:55 -0500


1984 F-150 2 wd 302 V-8 3-speed
I have to push my clutch pedal hard into the floor to make it so I can put the truck in reverse, and unless I wait about 30 seconds I get some pretty good grinding while the clutch is spinning down. The pedal adjustment where it connects to the master cylinder clutch rod is correct. Thinking maybe that I had a problem with the slave I decided to replace it. The book (Haynes) calls for a one piece unit, master to slave, which is what is on the truck now. Parts houses list seperate pieces, and the Ford parts dept. looked at me like I was crazy. Anyone have experience with this, do I buy seperate pieces and make it work that way? Can I just get a slave cylinder and hook to whats there? Cluth feels fine except for the need to push the pedal into the floor and the grind if I go into reverse without waiting 30 seconds.
Thanks for any help sent my way.



------------------------------

From: b-khanson juno.com
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 17:48:44 -0500
Subject: Re: gas mileage


>From: Jason Derra

> Subject vehicle: 93ish F150 4x4, Ext cab shortbed,
> 302, 5 speed, 3.55 gears. What kind of mileage could
> be expected with this setup?

> Jason
> '69 Bronco 5.0 EFI
> '96 F250 Ext Cab 4WD Powerstroke E4OD

Not an indentical truck...but for comparison/contrast, I
get 12.0-12.5 from an '86 F-150, 5.0 FI, 4X4, 4 speed
(no overdrive final gear), 4X4, w/3.50 gears.

Bruce Hanson
Apple Valley, MN

------------------------------

From: Fred Moreno dualcurve.com>
Subject: Re: TPS measurements
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 11:17:37 -0600

KB9ODG asked:

How do you measure your TPS voltage to see if it is working? I just
tried and got a constant 12.4 volts between it and ground on both
leads.
I tried resistance between the two leads and got a constant
resistance no
matter how I moved the throttle. I thought I knew how to do this,
but I
guess not. Any help would be appreciated.

Phred replies:

Hey "KB9-Ohh-Dog-Gone", you should not have 12 volts around the TPS circuit
because the sensor has three wires, one is 5 Volts power, one is PCM ground,
and one is the TPS signal. Usually at idle position you will have 0.7 to 0.9
Volts.
If you are measuring off the '88 5.0L engine, this TPS is at the bottom of
the throttle body, at one end of the butterfly shaft, you can see it, touch
it but working with it is a bear because it is hard to get right on it.
Removing the throttle plate assembly (4 bolts, clamp the coolant lines off,
disconnect throttle cable from linkage, its a 1/4 beer job to remove).

Where you are getting the 12 Volts reading, is it this same sensor? I got
the impression your sensor had two wires, the TPS has three. I hope you have
another sensor because otherwise you might have some bad news coming to you.


Hey, BTW, who is "Creed"? I am good at asking dumb questions aren't I?

Phred KD5AQB
1995 4X4 E.B. with propane or gasoline fed 5.0L, 5-speed short bed.




------------------------------

From: Spruce1495 aol.com
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 20:30:57 EDT
Subject: '93 F150 3:55 Lim Slp Diff

Has anyone had the diff. drained and new friction additive and new fluid
replaced. I think mine is slipping. When I floor the accelerator I get a
rumble from the drivetrain, not U-joints. I can't chirp the rear tires
either. Has 95,500 miles on it. No other problems.

Bill in KY

------------------------------

From: "Dave Marshall" bmts.com>
Subject: Re: '91 Aerostar driving lights
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 21:28:08 -0400

Thank you very much for your help Al.

Although I can't get at fixing this problem till Monday, I am quite sure it
is the module after reading your message. I was unable to call up the
recalls for the Ford. I am going after 92M78.

Hope you had a great Canada Day July 1. Aren't we lucky.

Dave Marshall
Owen Sound, Ontario
1991 Ford Aerostar
1987 Audi 5000CD Quattro Avant
1986 Merkur XR4Ti


----- Original Message -----
From: "acor" aebc.com>
To: <80-96-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 05, 2000 11:27 PM
Subject: [80-96-list] '91 Aerostar driving lights


> Hi Dave
> Since your headlights are ok, then the headlight switch, fuse and ground
> are ok. I suggest the problem is in the DRL (daylight running light)
module
> or the grounding switch for the DRL. On my '91 F250 the DRL is grounded
> with a switch on the emergency brake lever. Brake on - DRL off, brake
off -
> DRL on. Find the switch and check it first.
> Ford Canada issued recall notice 92M78 feb 5/92 to replace the original
DRL
> module in "certain '89 thru '91 cars and trucks". Symptoms included
> "reduced, flickering or no DRL illumination". In some cases the DRL may
> remain "on" even when the ignition is turned off. Normal Lo and Hi beam
> operation is not affected.
> My DRL module was replaced June '92 and I have had no problem since. If
you
> have any questions email me directly. Good luck
>
> Al Cornish
> Vancouver
> 91 F250 4 x4
> 99 Saturn
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe:
> http://www.ford-trucks.com/mailinglist.html#item3
> Please remove this footer when replying.
>
>


------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 20:25:52 -0500
From: Jim Cannon SoftHome.net>
Subject: Re: Dying Battery?

At 00:03 07-07-00 -0700, Scott wrote:
>Hi all, I just bought a 1995 F150 with a 302 about 3 months ago. I am
>having a problem starting it sometimes. It happened once a couple weeks
>ago. I tried to start it but it wouldn't even turn over, just made a bunch
>of clicks like the battery was dead. I checked to see if I left anything
>on, but the lights were all off and everything. Tried to start it again and
>it turned over once, really slow. I waited another minute or so and then it
>turned over about 3 times real slow. I waited a couple more minutes and
>then it turned over a bunch of times real slow and then fired up. I let it
>run for a little while and tried to start it again and it started up just
>fine.



Scott-
Sounds more like bad connection somewhere on your cables, probably
corrosion. Bad batteries don't heal themselves in the summer like that.
(They do in the winter, but that's a different story.) If you are anywhere
that is humid, you can get the moisture in there aggravating the corrosion,
but trying to crank it a few times will warm that spot up and dry it out
enough to let it start. This will only get worse.

I suggest you remove your cables one at a time and look for any signs of
corrosion. Clean up everything you can with fine sandpaper and a small
steel wire brush. Clean the battery posts, clean the posts on the starter,
on the relay, everywhere. Corrosion can sometimes be up under the
insulation at the end, so look there, too. If in doubt, replace the cable.

If you do replace cables, I recommend the thickest ones you can find.
Thicker wire means more power to the starter (less resistance), especially
under high cranking load situations. Cable size is measured in
"gauge". Bigger numbers are smaller diameter. I use all 2 gauge to the
starter (my ground strap from engine to frame is 4 gauge).


Jim Cannon
Houston, TX "A Ramblin' Wreck from Georgia Tech
'29 Ford Model A Phaeton and a helluva' engineer!"
'80 Ford F-150 300 I-6 2WD '63 Buick Riviera 401 V-8


------------------------------

From: "Mark Salvetti" mediaone.net>
Subject: Re: TPS measurements
Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 22:20:36 -0400

Mark Reimers is wondering how to measure his TPS voltage.

Mark, I just went through this on my 1986 5.0L EFI. I'm not a big fan of
the Haynes manual, but it was surprisingly accurate in it's TPS section.

You need to connect your voltmeter to the signal wire and ground wire of the
TPS by backprobing the electrical connector. You probably had the wrong
wires. With the ignition on but the engine not running, you should have
0.5-1.0 volts at idle, and 4-5 volts at full throttle position. I carefully
inserted two sewing needles into the connector, and then attached the
voltmeter to the needles.

You can also disconnect the electrical connector, and check the TPS for
proper resistance. With the voltmeter connected to the TPS signal wire and
the ground, you should have a resistance of 3K to 4K ohms at closed
throttle, and it should decrease smoothly to about 350 ohms at full
throttle.

I'm not positive about the wire colors, but I believe ground is a
black/white wire, and the signal wire is dark green/light green.

Hope this helps!

Mark Salvetti
1986 F150 5.0L


------------------------------

From: "Obert, Scott AT3" constellation.navy.mil>
Subject: Re: Dying Battery?
Date: Sat, 8 Jul 2000 00:36:52 -0700

Thanks for the input Jim. When I tried to start it today, the battery was
dead. Lights barely came on, radio wouldn't turn on, and the windows would
only roll down real slow. I tried several times to start it but could only
get an occasional click, didn't even turn over once. Had to get a jump to
start it, and then it started fine. Drove it around for a few miles and
after that it started perfectly. Drove it around some more, then shut it
off and listened to the radio for an hour or so, I got a small amp powering
the back speakers so it draws more current than a stock radio would. After
that I tried to start it and it started perfectly again. I haven't had a
chance to check any connections yet. Maybe a bad connection or something is
causing more strain on my battery. I don't even know how old the battery
is. What do you think?

Thanks,
Scott Obert
1995 F150 302
4X4 Short Bed


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jim Cannon [SMTP:jcannon softhome.net]
> Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 6:26 PM
> To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
> Subject: [80-96-list] Re: Dying Battery?
>
> At 00:03 07-07-00 -0700, Scott wrote:
> >Hi all, I just bought a 1995 F150 with a 302 about 3 months ago. I am
> >having a problem starting it sometimes. It happened once a couple weeks
> >ago. I tried to start it but it wouldn't even turn over, just made a
> bunch
> >of clicks like the battery was dead. I checked to see if I left anything
> >on, but the lights were all off and everything. Tried to start it again
> and
> >it turned over once, really slow. I waited another minute or so and then
> it
> >turned over about 3 times real slow. I waited a couple more minutes and
> >then it turned over a bunch of times real slow and then fired up. I let
> it
> >run for a little while and tried to start it again and it started up just
> >fine.
>
>
>
> Scott-
> Sounds more like bad connection somewhere on your cables, probably
> corrosion. Bad batteries don't heal themselves in the summer like that.
> (They do in the winter, but that's a different story.) If you are
> anywhere
> that is humid, you can get the moisture in there aggravating the
> corrosion,
> but trying to crank it a few times will warm that spot up and dry it out
> enough to let it start. This will only get worse.
>
> I suggest you remove your cables one at a time and look for any signs of
> corrosion. Clean up everything you can with fine sandpaper and a small
> steel wire brush. Clean the battery posts, clean the posts on the starter,
>
> on the relay, everywhere. Corrosion can sometimes be up under the
> insulation at the end, so look there, too. If in doubt, replace the cable.
>
> If you do replace cables, I recommend the thickest ones you can find.
> Thicker wire means more power to the starter (less resistance), especially
>
> under high cranking load situations. Cable size is measured in
> "gauge". Bigger numbers are smaller diameter. I use all 2 gauge to the
> starter (my ground strap from engine to frame is 4 gauge).
>
>
> Jim Cannon
> Houston, TX "A Ramblin' Wreck from Georgia Tech
> '29 Ford Model A Phaeton and a helluva' engineer!"....


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