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Received: with LISTAR (v0.128a; list 80-96-list); Wed, 28 Jun 2000 17:50:35 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 17:50:35 -0400 (EDT)
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Subject: 80-96-list Digest V2000 #124
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------------------------------------
80-96-list Digest Tue, 27 Jun 2000 Volume: 2000 Issue: 124

In This Issue:
Re: '93 f150 a good buy?
Excessive cranking on a cold start
Excessive cranking on a cold start
Re: Excessive cranking on a cold start
Re: '93 f150 a good buy?
Re: Engine Woes (300 I-6, EFI)
Re: '93 f150 a good buy?
Re: '93 f150 a good buy?
Re: warm running 300 UPDATE
Re: AC hiss
Re: '93 f150 a good buy?
351W Oil Press
Oil Filters
Changeover
Re: can't remove fuel filter
Re: 84 come 96
Re: warm running 300
Re: AC Hiss
Re: Changeover
Re: Engine Woes (300 I-6, EFI)
Re: Engine Woes (300 I-6, EFI)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: soffiler centraltools.com
Subject: Re: '93 f150 a good buy?
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 14:23:27 -0400

I just checked Edmunds's (www.edmunds.com) and got a bottom-line price of
about $3000 trade-in and $4400 retail. As far as equipment I had to take
several guesses, so I chose short cab long bed 2WD, 5.0 liter, automatic,
nice stereo, A/C, etc. The high miles is a killer as far as value, knocking
$3000 off the price.

Steve Offiler
soffiler centraltools.com
'97 F250HD XL 4x4, 351, E40D, 4.10's

> -----Original Message-----

>
>
> how do,
>
> it looks like I need a truck to haul some stuff 'round town.
> I found a
> '93 f150 xlt here with 187000 miles on it. asking $5000.
> seems to run
> okay, new (cheap) paint, body good, interior okay. the side
> of the bed
> nearest the cab is dented against the cab (as if somebody
> shot a telephone
> pole into the cab...) somebody wanna give me an estimate
> about if it's an
> okay deal...I don't know enough about f150s to be sure.


------------------------------

From: "Larry" ilhawaii.net>
Subject: Excessive cranking on a cold start
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 10:03:52 -1000

Hi Jason and Chuck, I got my PCM out today to copy down the numbers. I found
it on
the drivers side behind the kick panel. Have one quote so far of $134.00
exchange on a reman. Napa said they could send mine to the mainland for
rebuild but said stuff had got lost in the past. Thanks for all the help.
Larry



------------------------------

From: "Larry" ilhawaii.net>
Subject: Excessive cranking on a cold start
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 10:09:01 -1000

Hi Chuck,

Some coincidence, you being ex Maui Boy and me having lived in Torrance.

Thanks for the offer to check out P/N, and price but there's several parts
houses here in Hilo. I"m going slow cause I'm out of my element now.

I ran a 327, 340 HP vette in a 61 Studebaker Hawk in the 60's (nice sleeper)
but when we moved to Alaska in 67 I kinda got away from car stuff and am not
up to speed on smog stuff or computer controlled engines. The wife's Honda
has a blinking light code on the computer and this makes more sense to me.

Lately I've been thinking D-O-D-G-E like with a Perkins Diesel, something I
can work on W/O all the diagnostic equipment but hey!, I might be assuming
to much :-) Wonder if we'll ever see on board diagnostic equipment that you
can read while driving :-)

Thanks again, I really appreciate all the listmembers help, Larry in Hilo




------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 13:30:40 -0700
From: Chuck Sanborn deltanet.com>
Subject: Re: Excessive cranking on a cold start

At 10:09 AM 6/27/00 -1000, you wrote:
>but there's several parts
>houses here in Hilo

Seems as though Hilo has grown since I was there :-)
SEVERAL parts houses??!!
Chuck



------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 16:46:53 -0400
Subject: Re: '93 f150 a good buy?
From: chris hinckley juno.com>

for 5K you should be able to find a truck in better shape. I would look
for an older truck than a 93 with fewer miles or at least something with
a straighter body. I was just looking through the truck trader last
night and saw a few clean older trucks for 5k and under that are claiming
sound engines and bodies.

chris h

Chris Hinckley
92EB Bronco- stroked, lifted, & locked (Pepe)
95 F150 - ext. cab 4x4 (Newt)
00 Excursion - PSD (Titus)
95 Buell - for 2 wheel street fun


On Tue, 27 Jun 2000 13:30:16 -0400 (EDT) Scott Hall
garnet.acns.fsu.edu> writes:
> how do,
>
> it looks like I need a truck to haul some stuff 'round town. I
> found a
> '93 f150 xlt here with 187000 miles on it. asking $5000. seems to
> run
> okay, new (cheap) paint, body good, interior okay. the side of the
> bed
> nearest the cab is dented against the cab (as if somebody shot a
> telephone
> pole into the cab...) somebody wanna give me an estimate about if
> it's an
> okay deal...I don't know enough about f150s to be sure.
>
> and while I'm at it, what mind of mods can I do to this truck, wrt
> body?
> specifiaclly, can I change it from a regular bed to a stepside? if
> not,
> can I at least replace the bed, or the section of it that's damaged,
> like
> an older truck where the bed lifts off? how much coin am I lookin'
> at?
>
> thanks
>
> scott
>
>
> <><><><> Win $50,000, Sony TV's and Sony Radios! <><><><>
> Simply sign up for RacingOne.com's free e-mail newsletter.
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> Please remove this footer when replying.
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 07:01:29 +1000
From: les williams cyber.net.au>
Subject: Re: Engine Woes (300 I-6, EFI)


Mike,

I'm not sure that it's your problem either and Alex covered much the
same points, and even if you didn't have a K & N filter, you will still
have an oil trace in the manifold. It's caused from hot oil vapour
bleeding through the PCV and condensing in the cooling inlet manifold.
The
more fumes the engine produces, the more oil vapour to condense in the
manifold. If you don't believe me, fit a road draught tube and give the
pcv the flick, now you will have a oil free inlet manifold, But then
watch the smog police pop their rocks when they see what you have done
!!

Apart from physically crawling under the truck and eyeballing the system
for something blindingly obvious, such as a crushed pipe etc., what else
are you going to do ???

Well, may I suggest that if you have or can borrow an old fuel
pressure/vacuum gauge, remove the O2 sensor and scrounge some pipe
fittings so you can use the pressure gauge on the O2 fitting. Give it a
blast up Horsepower Hill and observe the readings. You don't have to
drive very far, if it's bad you'll know in a 100 yards or so.
Back pressure will be hopefully less than 1 psi but about 1.5 psi. is
tolerable. If it's around 3 psi or more, then your cat/muffler is in
trouble.

I would appreciate it if someone has a 302/351 with known cracked
exhaust manifolds, and has not yet replaced them, to do the same test
and report back. Is the EGR functioning correctly ? Only in the
interests of science of course .....

regards

les




deacondemon wrote:
>
> In talking to one of the guys I work with, they recommended that I look into
> my cat. If it is old/gummed up, could this possibly create similar problems?
> I figure since I have little to do tomorrow until I go to work at 5pm, that
> I might as well give it a look, but am unsure on what to look for and if
> this could be a source of problem.
>
> Mike Dunbar
> 89 F-150 XLT Lariat
> White River Jct., Vermont
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.xoom.com/mdunbar420/truck.htm

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 17:32:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: Scott Hall garnet.acns.fsu.edu>
Subject: Re: '93 f150 a good buy?

On Tue, 27 Jun 2000 soffiler centraltools.com wrote:

> I just checked Edmunds's (www.edmunds.com) and got a bottom-line price of
> about $3000 trade-in and $4400 retail. As far as equipment I had to take
> several guesses, so I chose short cab long bed 2WD, 5.0 liter, automatic,
> nice stereo, A/C, etc. The high miles is a killer as far as value, knocking
> $3000 off the price.

sorry for the lack of info. it's a short-bed, short-cab, and 2wd. dunno
what the stereo is...seems to be the stock tape player. has a v8 and
auto. a/c is there. $4400 retail...hmmm...and they're acting like it's
the world's best deal.

thanks

scott


------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 17:39:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: Scott Hall garnet.acns.fsu.edu>
Subject: Re: '93 f150 a good buy?

thanks for the response, chris,

is the truck trader online? got a url?

thanks

scott

On Tue, 27 Jun 2000, chris hinckley wrote:

> for 5K you should be able to find a truck in better shape. I would look
> for an older truck than a 93 with fewer miles or at least something with
> a straighter body. I was just looking through the truck trader last
> night and saw a few clean older trucks for 5k and under that are claiming
> sound engines and bodies.


------------------------------

From: "Skerrett, Michael" adstii.com>
Subject: Re: warm running 300 UPDATE
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 18:28:54 -0400

On Mon, 26 Jun 2000 19:10:50 -0500 (CDT), David Trowbridge asked:

....well guys, i finally had enough time the other day to change out my
stat on my truck....

Are you overlooking the obvious by not attaching a real water temperature
indicator to the engine? By using the un-calibrated dash indicator you may
not really have an overheat problem. Connect a temperature gauge and run
your truck the same way you did after you changed the thermostat. Recording
the actual water temperatures will enable you to better determine if you
have an overheat condition. If you do not then you will also be able to now
associate real temperature with the letters on your dash indicator. If the
engine is really running hot and you have done all you say to cure the
problem, write back and give us another chance to assist. You shouldn't
worry too much unless (with a 195 thermostat) the temperature stays above
about 230 f. and won't return closer to 200 during steady driving at over
35-40 mph. with little or no load in your truck.

Michael S. in Central FL.

------------------------------

From: "Skerrett, Michael" adstii.com>
Subject: Re: AC hiss
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 18:40:36 -0400

The other day I started my truck and turned on the AC...

Please help, It's starting to get real hot here in New England...

Nelson,

It doesn't sound like you have the inclination nor the equipment to repair
this yourself. Sounds to me like a seal failed or you have a bad hose on
the high pressure side. Running the compressor without coolant will cause
it to fail in short order (the lubricant travels around the system with the
coolant gasses). Best thing to do is keep the A/C off and get your truck to
a reputable shop to have them find and fix the leak and recharge the system.
Continuing to run the system until failure will cost significantly more than
getting it repaired now.

Its still not as hot where you are as it is where some of on the list live.
The swamp here is burning around me....

Michael S. in Central FL.


------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 18:47:48 -0400
Subject: Re: '93 f150 a good buy?
From: chris hinckley juno.com>

www.autotrader.com a couple of examples 1990 f250 xtnd cab, pretty much
power everything clean $5,600; 94 f150 flareside pw/pl dual tanks,
running steps $5500; 89 f150 excellent condition $2450; etc... you can
see what i mean. 5k for what it sounds like they are offering you is
crap.

chris

On Tue, 27 Jun 2000 17:39:28 -0400 (EDT) Scott Hall
garnet.acns.fsu.edu> writes:
> thanks for the response, chris,
>
> is the truck trader online? got a url?
>
> thanks
>
> scott
>
> On Tue, 27 Jun 2000, chris hinckley wrote:
>
> > for 5K you should be able to find a truck in better shape. I
> would look
> > for an older truck than a 93 with fewer miles or at least
> something with
> > a straighter body. I was just looking through the truck trader
> last
> > night and saw a few clean older trucks for 5k and under that are
> claiming
> > sound engines and bodies.
>
> <><><><> Win $50,000, Sony TV's and Sony Radios! <><><><>
> Simply sign up for RacingOne.com's free e-mail newsletter.
> Our newsletter provides you with breaking auto-racing news.
> For each person who signs up for the free newsletter, we will
> make a donation to Speedway Children's Charities. You get the
> inside story on breaking auto-racing news and children get a
> better future.
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://opt-influence.com/a/racing3/

> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe:
> http://www.ford-trucks.com/mailinglist.html#item3
> Please remove this footer when replying.
>

------------------------------

From: "Adam" hotmail.com>
Subject: 351W Oil Press
Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 21:00:33 -0400

I have a 351W in an 84 F350 4x4 w/granny gear 4 speed- what is considered
good oil pressure? The in dash guage was reading low- so i installed a
mechanical guage- it shows 55psi cold idle(750rpm), rises to 65 psi at
3000rpm when cold- when fully warmed up it is 15-20psi idle, rising rapidly
to 50psi at 2000 rpm then dropping to 45 at 4000 rpm- is this good or OK or
time to rebuild? It has 135000 miles on it and im running castrol 20w-50
oil- would it be ok to switch back to 10w30?
Thanx

Adam

------------------------------

From: "Al Powell" home.com>
Subject: Oil Filters
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 19:32:05 -0600

Feel free to check http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.xoom.com/minimopar/oilfilterstudy.html for
Russ Knize's well-known Oil Filter Study site.

If you want to scare yourself, go out and buy a half-dozen mixed brand oil
filters, then cut the case off with a hacksaw or a stout can opener. What
you'll find inside most of them is a ehavy piece of filter paper one layer
thick, glued on to the case top and bottom, with (in the case of Fram) a
string tied around the middle. NOT encouraging. I've done it and was not
impressed.

Then find an Amsoil dealer and take a look at his filter display. Filter
medium is about 1 inch thick all around, and it filters down to about 15
microns in particle size. Every filter has a bypass valve and
anti-drainback valve (so the filter doesn't drain empty and cause wear while
pressure re-fills it at start.)

I've studied them - and I don't ever use anything but Amsoil filters in any
car I have. (And as a bonus, my F-150 and 280ZX use the same filter!)
Simply my opinion, based on experience and modest research. Price for the
SDF-15 which fits most Fords is $10.10 each, and they're a good
value...especially compared to a nearly empty tin can with one layer of
filter paper and no anti-drainback valve inside.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Al Powell
Fort Collins, CO
'58 Fiat 1200 Spyder "Transformabile"
'83 Datsun 280ZXT
'90 Audi 200
'93 F-150 4X4
New email address: powellae home.com
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



------------------------------

From: DBblueboy webtv.net (Jerome Kelly)
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 22:09:10 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Changeover

I have a 1987 F150. It has a 302 EFI.
The engine is bad. I have a 1989 351
with TBI out of a police cruiser. It has
a four speed OD. It has the computer
intact. Could I just unhook the electric
fuel pumps and use this engine as is
with the computer it has? I have had a
hard time trying to locate an intake mani
fold to go the other route. The cost is more than it is worth because
of the manifold price. This way if it would work,
all I would have to buy is routine things and an exhaust system. I
could run the gages manual. Can anyone help me on
this thought?



http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://community.webtv.net/DBblueboy/DayBreakblueboyblue


------------------------------

From: "melissa emanuelson" btc-skynet.net>
Subject: Re: can't remove fuel filter
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 21:16:22 -0500

The fuel filter problem, I have a '95 and had to go to the local NAPA store
and purchase a special wrench to get the fuel filter seperated from the fuel
lines. Warning: if that '92 is fuel injected, you have to shut off the
fuel via an inertia switch to relieve pressure. I cheated and had a
chiltons manual to help me out. Hope this helps.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Cyber9" lmtonline.com>
To: <80-96-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2000 12:53 AM
Subject: [80-96-list] can't remove fuel filter


>
> My brother has a 1992 F150,302,2wd,supercab, i cant seem to get the fuel
filter out, its easy to take it out from my 1990 F150 truck, any suggestions
on how to remove the filter? Having trouble disconnecting the fuel lines off
the filter.
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 80-96-list" in the subject of the
> message.
>
>


------------------------------

From: "Justin Queen" door.net>
Subject: Re: 84 come 96
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 23:17:45 -0700


Yes it is possible, and I don't think it was very difficult. I work at a parts store and we had a man come in that had 1994 front body panels on a 1981 ford truck. He said that the mounting holes for the fenders went in at a different angle, but all he had to do was clip & bend the bracket. I couldn't even see the modification - It was under the truck anyway. The hard part was the bumper, because the newer bumpers have bolt on with bolts that run side to side, whereas the older models have front-to-back mounting bolts. However, the modification was supposed to be pretty easy- just weld on a bracket. If I see him again, I'll refresh my memory on that.

Justin Queen
'86 Ford F-150 XLT Lariat, 5.0 f/i
'95 Ford Mustang 3.8


In response to:
"Is it possible to bolt the later model sheet metal, bumper and grille to
an earlier truck?"
posted by Steve Randa




------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 21:37:32 -0700
Subject: Re: warm running 300
From: Joan and Walt Posluszny home.com>

David, Sounds like you've covered most of the bases. A leaking head gasket
could cause it to overheat. Is it running rough? Does it ping as well?
Could the engine be running way lean?

I'm not to familiar with the straight six so please excuse these next two
items if they do not pertain to the I-6. Could exhaust be getting into the
intake manifold(bad EGR) or crankcase. ?

Just some brainstorming. Good Luck Walt
>
> From: DTrowbridge webtv.net (David Trowbridge)
> Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 19:10:50 -0500 (CDT)
> Subject: warm running 300 UPDATE
>
[snip]
i'm almost at my
> whits end with this.
>
> David
> 85 F-150 300 I6


------------------------------

Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 21:42:47 -0700
Subject: Re: AC Hiss
From: Joan and Walt Posluszny home.com>

Nelson, My 85 has been making a similar sound when the A/C is on. Believe
it or not, the bearings in the A/C cycling clutch on the compressor are shot
and when the clutch disengages and freewheels, the bearings rattle and
sounds like a hiss from inside the truck. I squirt oil in the holes in the
A/C clutch and that stops it for a month or two. I've been doing this for a
few years now. A Band-Aid but it works. I know this may be a longshot but
anything is possible. It doesn't explain your diminished cooling however.
Let us know what it is. Walt

> From: "Nelson Vasconcelos" mindspring.com>
> Subject: AC hiss
> Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 22:36:28 -0400
>
[snip]
>
> Please help, It's starting to get real hot here in New England...
>
> Thanks
>
> Nelson
> 89 F150 4x4, 300I6, 5spd
> 3" body lift,4"skyjacker lift, 33x12.50x15 Bfg AT's


------------------------------

From: "Jason Derra" internetcds.com>
Subject: Re: Changeover
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 22:19:36 -0700

Why would you want (or need) to disconnect the fuel pumps? If you are
planning on running the TBI, you will need a electric fuel pump to supply
it. Since the TBI and MPI engines use nearly the same operating pressures,
the stock pump and fuel system will work well. Since the gauges are
separate from the engine control system, you can use your old wiring as well
as the same sending units. Some things that will be needed for the new
engine would be MAP sensor, O2 sensor(s), all manifold mounted sensors (air
temp, coolant temp) EGR and sensor, plus all of the engine control wiring
harness.
Jason
'69 Bronco 5.0 SEFI
'96 F250 Ext Cab 4WD Powerstroke

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerome Kelly" webtv.net>
To: <80-96-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2000 7:09 PM
Subject: [80-96-list] Changeover


> I have a 1987 F150. It has a 302 EFI.
> The engine is bad. I have a 1989 351
> with TBI out of a police cruiser. It has
> a four speed OD. It has the computer
> intact. Could I just unhook the electric
> fuel pumps and use this engine as is
> with the computer it has? I have had a
> hard time trying to locate an intake mani
> fold to go the other route. The cost is more than it is worth because
> of the manifold price. This way if it would work,
> all I would have to buy is routine things and an exhaust system. I
> could run the gages manual. Can anyone help me on
> this thought?
>
>
>
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://community.webtv.net/DBblueboy/DayBreakblueboyblue
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe:
> http://www.ford-trucks.com/mailinglist.html#item3
> Please remove this footer when replying.
>
>


------------------------------

From: kb9odg.mark juno.com
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2000 17:28:34 -0500
Subject: Re: Engine Woes (300 I-6, EFI)

Alex, where would one find the MAF? Under the hood that is. Also, any
idea how much they can run at Napa or equivilant?

Thanks,

- Mark


>
> Mike,
> The dealer was right in suggesting that you cover the basics, being
> sure the
> engine is tuned-up, air and fuel filters up-to-date etc., but your
> drivability complaint sounds suspiciously like a bad MAF. It's hard
> to say
> from here, since other things such as a fuel pump or a TPS or a
> pressure
> regulator can present similar symptoms. There's no hard and fast
> rules
> here.... a specific complaint can't always be positively pinned down
> to a
> particular component. I used to think that if the MAF was unplugged
> and the
> engine ran better it was proof positive of a bad one, but I recently
> ran into
> a case where unplugging it made the engine run worse, but replacing
> it cured
> the complaint (hunting idle, hesitation on acceleration). Try
> gently
> cleaning it with some brake cleaner on a Q-tip and see if it
> improves any,
> oil from the K&N can sometimes foul the MAF filament.
> Alex
>
________________________________________________________________





------------------------------

From: kb9odg.mark juno.com
Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 15:39:13 -0500
Subject: Re: Engine Woes (300 I-6, EFI)

Alex, where would one find the MAF? Under the hood that is. Also, any
idea how much they can run at Napa or equivilant?

Then Josh says:

<< when a
89 300-I6 doesn't even have one. In 89 the I6 used Speed Density EFI.
Speed Density Fuel injection uses a MAP sensor.

If your MAP sensor is bad it would have a similar effect as MAF sensor,
so
this could still be your program>>>

So, where is the MAP then? On the intake tube?

Thanks,

- Mark


>
> Mike,
> The dealer was right in suggesting that you cover the basics, being
> sure the
> engine is tuned-up, air and fuel filters up-to-date etc., but your
> drivability complaint sounds suspiciously like a bad MAF. It's hard
> to say
> from here, since other things such as a fuel pump or a TPS or a
> pressure
> regulator can present similar symptoms. There's no hard and fast
> rules
> here.... a specific complaint can't always be positively pinned down
> to a
> particular component. I used to think that if the MAF was unplugged
> and the
> engine ran better it was proof positive of a bad one, but I recently
> ran into
> a case where unplugging it made the engine run worse, but replacing
> it cured
> the complaint (hunting idle, hesitation on acceleration). Try
> gently
> cleaning it with some brake cleaner on a Q-tip and see if it
> improves any,
> oil from the K&N can sometimes foul the MAF filament.
> Alex
>
________________________________________________________________





------------------------------

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