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Subject: 80-96-list-digest V3 #327
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80-96-list-digest Saturday, November 20 1999 Volume 03 : Number 327



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980-1996 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

Re: FTE 80-96 - ZF and M5OD gearing...
FTE 80-96 - RE: fuel pump
FTE 80-96 - FTE 80-96 stumbling idle, uneven accel solved
Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's
Re: FTE 80-96 - Shock Absorbers
Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's
Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's
Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's
Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's
Re: FTE 80-96 - Shock Absorbers
RE: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's
FTE 80-96 - Rangers w/302
FTE 80-96 - Re: Ranger
FTE 80-96 - Damper removal
FTE 80-96 - Damper removal
RE: FTE 80-96 - Timing
Re: FTE 80-96 - ZF and M5OD gearing...
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Ranger
FTE 80-96 - ADMIN: New store items
Re: FTE 80-96 - ZF and M5OD gearing...
FTE 80-96 - crooked truck bed

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 09:22:17 -0600
From: bennettr hiwaay.net
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - ZF and M5OD gearing...

I have an 87 F-150 with the 4.9L and 4 speed OD (SROD?) that has a bearing
going bad. Anyone know what the gearing is on this transmission? I would
like to replace it with a 5 speed, preferably a wide ratio ZF from what I
see here. Anyone have any experience with this swap? Will the ZF bolt up
to 4.9? If I am not mistaken the ZF has a removable bell housing with the
external slave cylinder like the 4 speed I currently have.

Thanks
Rex
- ------------------------------

Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 02:17:10 -0600
From: Blake Malkamaki
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - ZF and M5OD gearing...

>Mark is right on with the gearing, minor differences I noted right out of
>the Ford book (bible?);
>
>Mazda M5OD:
>3.39:1 (Reverse), 3.9:1, 2.25:1, 1.50:1, 1:1, 0.8:1


>>
>>ZF Model S5-42 Close Ratio (Diesel):
>>3.79:1(Reverse), 4.14:1, 2.37:1, 1.42:1, 1:1, 0.77:1
>>
>>ZF Model S5-42 Wide Ratio (Gasoline & Diesel):
>>5.24:1(Reverse), 5.72:1, 2.94:1, 1.61:1, 1:1, 0.76:1
>>
>> According to my 1995 Ford Service manual, the model number S5-42 can be
>>described as S meaning Synchronized transmission, 5 designates the number
of
>>forward gears, and 42 is the approximate maximum input torque capacity in
>>tens of lb-ft. So for this tranny, 42 implies it can accept 420 ft-lb of
>>input torque capacity.
>>
>> The wide ratio is made available for all vehicles over 8500lbs GVW, all
>>engines except F-Super Duty Commercial Stripped Chassis w/diesel. The
close
>>ratio is for 7.3L diesel engines and GVW over 8500lbs.
>>
>
>This is great information!!
>
>So will any wide ratio fit a 302? Or will it have to have been from a
>smallblock or 300? I presume that if it is from a 4x4, the transfer case
>will be no problem. Anyone know the actual length compared to the mazda?

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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 08:11:57 -0800
From: "Dennis"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - RE: fuel pump

My dad drives an 84 F250 with dual tanks and a 460 carbuerated, but since
the in tank pumps are high volume-low pressure you may be able to do the
same thing. He got tired of messing with pump problems and installed an
aftermarket electric fuel pump after the switching unit, and left the old
pumps in place, he cut the power to the old pumps and powered the new pump
off of the inertial switch(on inside fire wall behind brake pedal) problem
solved, total cost under $60.
Dennis
89' F250

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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 08:16:19 -0800
From: "Dennis"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - FTE 80-96 stumbling idle, uneven accel solved

Over the past month I have used the forum extensively to solve my problem,
after checking every sytem on the truck I replaced the "new" distributor cap
and rotor with an old one I had around(cleaned it up real good first)
Problem solved runs like a champ!!
Thank you everybody for the great feedback, I know my truck inside and out
now.
Dennis
89 F250 351W

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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 08:51:45 -0800
From: "Matt Hodel"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's

>The first year for EFI on the 4.9L I-6 was 1987. 1988+ trucks with manual
>transmissions will have 5 speeds instead of 4.
>
>Rob

Not quite true, I have an 89 F-150, 4.9 I-6... with a 4 speed manual tranny,
first gear non syncronized.. So far as I know it is a stock setup...

Rich, as far as getting an F-150 or F-250 for $4000, good hunting, those
types of deals are rare in my area... I found mine for $3500, but it was a
friend of a friend type deal, and it is definately a matter of "pay now or
pay later". The body has some hefty front end damage and it leaks oil
almost as fast as it drinks gasoline... But I couldn't see giving it up for
anything else...
So I don't think you'll find a pristine truck in your budget range, but you
can find a truck, also don't forget to go make some money now that you're
done with school - it helps the truck fund a lot! :)

P.S. I think the 4.9 went from carb to EFI in 87, possibly 86... don't
remember which motor started the transition first. A good resource
(especially for no mechanical experience people like me) is "The Ford Truck
Bible" by Moses (forget his last name) which I found at Summit, lots of info
about the different years and models of ford trucks along with some good
advice on what to look for and how to maintain them...

Matt Hodel
Java/Asp Programmer, GeekBoy (wishing he'd waited after college before
financing a *gasp* Isuzu)
iPONG Game Community
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.ipong.com


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 09:44:38 -0800
From: johny
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Shock Absorbers

In regards to the rancho 9000's. If you are switching from empty to max GVWR and
back, the adjustability can't be beat. I have a 99 SD with a PSD and carry a
pretty heavy truck camper, and am quite happy with the ride.
It's also a 4x4 so it higher, and I can do the manual adjustments without having to
crawl around under the truck

If you remain mostly unloaded, then the 9000's may be a bit of overkill.
If it's a 2x4, then manual adjustablity may be an issue, and you may want to
include the in-cab setup/air compressor. The price goes up at least 130+ or so.


Mark Behling wrote:

> Looking into buying new shocks, since the OEM shocks have felt worn-out since truck was
> new and have progressively become worse. Looking to keep the truck from bouncing too
> much after bump or dip, but still want a decent freeway ride over the expansive joints.
> Just wondering if anybody has any experience with the following brands?
>
> Gabriel protruck gas shocks +ACQ-24 each
> (Most economical choice from Pep boys)
>
> Bilstein gas shocks +ACQ-60 each
> (They claim to be one of the best shocks you can buy, used on Mercedes and Chevy trucks
> (Yuk+ACE-) offroad package upgrade)
>
> Rancho RS9000 +ACQ-70 each
> (I like the fact that they are adjustable, but could be just a gimmick)
>
> Mark
> San Diego, CA
> '96 F150 I6 5spd
>
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 12:56:32 EST
From: CJ5FL aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's

Thanks Matt, I'm still in school for another 3 months, so a job is out of the
question. As for the area, NC has a lot of used F150's for sale from what
I've seen. I thank y'all for the info you've been able to give me. I hope I
find something pretty good out there.
Rich


> Not quite true, I have an 89 F-150, 4.9 I-6... with a 4 speed manual tranny,
> first gear non syncronized.. So far as I know it is a stock setup...
>
> Rich, as far as getting an F-150 or F-250 for $4000, good hunting, those
> types of deals are rare in my area... I found mine for $3500, but it was a
> friend of a friend type deal, and it is definately a matter of "pay now or
> pay later". The body has some hefty front end damage and it leaks oil
> almost as fast as it drinks gasoline... But I couldn't see giving it up
for
> anything else...
> So I don't think you'll find a pristine truck in your budget range, but you
> can find a truck, also don't forget to go make some money now that you're
> done with school - it helps the truck fund a lot! :)
>
> P.S. I think the 4.9 went from carb to EFI in 87, possibly 86... don't
> remember which motor started the transition first. A good resource
> (especially for no mechanical experience people like me) is "The Ford Truck
> Bible" by Moses (forget his last name) which I found at Summit, lots of
info
> about the different years and models of ford trucks along with some good
> advice on what to look for and how to maintain them...
>
> Matt Hodel
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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 11:59:33 -0600
From: Andy Norris
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's

>Rich, as far as getting an F-150 or F-250 for $4000, good hunting, those
>types of deals are rare in my area... I found mine for $3500, but it was
>definately a matter of "pay now or
>pay later". So I don't think you'll find a pristine truck in your budget
>range, but you
>can find a truck.
>
>Matt Hodel
>Java/Asp Programmer, GeekBoy

Rich,

I found my '89 F250 351 C6 (automatic) EFI, supercab, long bed, AC, abs,
126k mi, et. al. on the side of someone's rural driveway with a "For Sale"
sign in the windshield. They were asking $4k for it, but after test driving
it and feeling how it wandered and feeling how loose the steering was, and
seeing how bald the tires were getting, I knew it would need some work, but
it was probably worth it. Offered $3800 to offset tags/taxes and he went
for it.

Since then,

$500 for tires all around (cheap K-Mart Penskes... I like 'em, enough though)
150 to fix the steering and put in new camber bearings and align
140 diagnose and replace TPS (forget actual amount)
18 upper radiator hose
40 starter exchange (did the work myself)
12 solenoid (myself)
660 gas (5900 mi)
- -----
$1620 -- ~7 months ownership, not counting plugs, wires, oil, oil filters,
things I've forgotten or blocked out because they were too painful...

Not bad. Parts have been pretty reasonable so far for it. Sure beats
payments on a new truck! But it isn't really as reliable as I'd like my
daily driver to be. Also looking at having to replace the tranny with a
rebuilt one soon... doesn't shift into forward gear until it's warmed up
some (seals are bad). Need shocks, need to fix the manifold and some other
things, too. Definitely always something to spend money on for it, and I'm
talking about keeping it running in stock condtion! No fancy
customizations, and the body's in fair to good shape... Was pretty much
what we were looking for, though. Don't feel bad throwing fire wood in the
back of it, like I might if it were a new one costing $500/month in payments!

Good luck in your searching,

Andy Norris
C++/Perl/OmniMark Developer
de facto Ford Truck Mechanic


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 12:59:21 -0600
From: "Steve Schmeckpeper"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Norris

Also looking at having to replace the tranny with a
> rebuilt one soon... doesn't shift into forward gear until it's warmed up
> some (seals are bad)

Andy, Before you replace/rebuild the transmission.............try some
"Trans-x"
It's a solvent that dissolves varnish buildup and is available just about
everywhere. Might just cure the sluggish symptoms you mention. Worked for me
on a couple of trannys, and has a moneyback guarantee. You have to see it to
believe it.
Drain a quart of fluid and add the Trans-x, then drive the truck a hundred
miles or till the trans starts shifting right. Then change fluid & filter
(don't forget to drain the torque converter). Hope this works for you 8^))
Smeck


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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 14:22:06 EST
From: CJ5FL aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's

Thanks for the info, I'll be looking for a good deal, and I know it won't
come to me right away. I just wanted to find some of this info so that when
I can buy, I will know what to look at and what to pass on. So far I've
learned a lot more then I thought I would. I'm a Jeeper not a Ford owner,
but I'm looking at becoming one soon enough. LOL
Rich


> Rich,
>
> I found my '89 F250 351 C6 (automatic) EFI, supercab, long bed, AC, abs,
> 126k mi, et. al. on the side of someone's rural driveway with a "For Sale"
> sign in the windshield. They were asking $4k for it, but after test
driving
> it and feeling how it wandered and feeling how loose the steering was, and
> seeing how bald the tires were getting, I knew it would need some work,
but
> it was probably worth it. Offered $3800 to offset tags/taxes and he went
> for it.
>
> Since then.....
>
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 06:32:48 +1100
From: les williams
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Shock Absorbers

Mark Behling wrote:

> Looking into buying new shocks, since the OEM shocks have felt worn-out since truck was
> new and have progressively become worse. Looking to keep the truck from bouncing too
> much after bump or dip, but still want a decent freeway ride over the expansive joints.
> Just wondering if anybody has any experience with the following brands?
>
> Gabriel protruck gas shocks +ACQ-24 each
> (Most economical choice from Pep boys)
>
> Bilstein gas shocks +ACQ-60 each
> (They claim to be one of the best shocks you can buy, used on Mercedes and Chevy trucks
> (Yuk+ACE-) offroad package upgrade)
>
> Rancho RS9000 +ACQ-70 each
> (I like the fact that they are adjustable, but could be just a gimmick)
>
> Mark
> San Diego, CA
> '96 F150 I6 5spd
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

Hi Mark,
For what it's worth, after much procrastination, I have installed Koni adjustables set
at 50%, that has tamed the suspension for me. To adjust you must drop the top of the shock,
depress & turn. But as usual, what I consider as a 'reasonable feed back' you may consider
'harsh'. Auzzies aren't use to the typical 'american boulevard' suspension set-ups. Only
Koni make Koni,( I think?), are used extensivly down here as Ford factory installs, and
were $30 cheaper than Rancho RS9000's, at $160aud. Rancho's are easier to adjust. So it's
your call......look at the bright side, if it's a bad call, your still at least 50% cheaper
than OZ prices, even allowing for the $ conversion.

regards

Les
Lost in the Land of OZ


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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 13:51:42 -0800
From: Eric Sneed
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's

Are you sure? I have an 89 F150 4.9L FI 4x4 w/factory 4sp manual.
Is this truck rare?

Eric

-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Bryan [SMTP:rbryan netgate.net]
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 6:22 PM
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's

The first year for EFI on the 4.9L I-6 was 1987. 1988+ trucks with
manual
transmissions will have 5 speeds instead of 4.

Rob

> From: CJ5FL aol.com
> Reply-To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 19:27:41 EST
> To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
> Subject: FTE 80-96 - Intro and a few Q's
>
> Howdy y'all, just thought I'd drop y'all a line and tell you who I
am. I
> just got on the list this afternoon. I'm also on many Jeep lists
as I have a
> 79 CJ5 too. Anyway, I'm looking at buying a mid to late 80's Ford
F150 or
> F250. I was wondering when the 4.9L went from the carb to EFI?
Also, I'd
> like to use it for towing and a daily driver. Anything I should
try to stay
> away from or to look for? I only have about $4000 to play with
here as I'm
> just graduating from college. I've looked up in NC where I'm
moving and see
> that I can get some good trucks for that price, but not sure if
there are
> things to stay away from. I've heard that there were problems
with the E4OD
> in the early years, anyone have any? I've had a Ranger before,
but that's a
> far cry from a F150 or 250. LOL Anyway, nice to meet y'all, and
if you have
> any hints or tips like us Jeepers have on looking for trouble on a
used
> vehicle, let me know. If you need any Jeep info, e mail me off
line and I'll
> help y'all out.
> Rich
> 79 CJ5
> Looking for a truck
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>

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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 17:29:55 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Rangers w/302

Ken H. writes: >>I've seen Rangers with 302s. Hooker makes mounts and headers.


Thank you, Ken.

Azie


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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 17:54:27 -0500
From: "Serian"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Ranger

> There is an '87 Ranger that my bank is taking bids on, and I've
> always kinda wandered what it would be like to have one of these
> little trucks with a HOT 302 or maybe a 351W in it. Will either
> of them fit with out too much modification to the front??? I don't
> have a clue as to how it is currently equipped?? Don't know if I
> will even bid on it if you guys tell me it will accept the small V8s,
> but I've always been curious.

I had a 1985 ranger at one time ... they are typically equipped with
a horribly underpowered 2.8 or 2.9L V6, and EFI was common
(mine had a carb). I have seen the ranger hold a 289/302 (in
trucks at shows), so the ranger will handle a narrow Windsor block.

I very much question that a 351 would fit well ... the 351 is a wider
engine than the 302 or 289, and would fill all the space under the
hood of a ranger. You could probably cram it in, but forget about
workin on that 351 if you can get it to settle in there :-P

The standard equipped 2.8/2.9 has a smaller bell housing pattern
than the W block, so if you put a 302 in it, you will need a bell
housing for it. Automatics were the C4, which also work nicely
with a W block; manuals were some Mazda-made underbuilt
pile of gearworks.

Typical transfer case on the 4x4 models was a New Process
something or other, but one that isnt built quite as heavy as the
NP208, so if it is a 4x4 and you would want to keep it a 4x4,
a change of transfer case might be in order.



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Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 13:42:00 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Damper removal

Crrected copy:

Someone wrote : >>how are you supposed to remove the damper after you have
removed the pulley >from

I use a steering wheel/damper puller. Have to have one that you can put bolts
into the damper for pulling on. You have to remove the center bolt and that
requires you to "lock the engine down". I usually use a screwdriver(L A R G E)
in the teeth of the flywheel or stuck thru one of the holes in the flywheel if
it is automatic..

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 13:38:17 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Damper removal

Someone wrote : >>how are you supposed to remove the damper after you have
removed the pulley >from

I use a steering wheel/damper puller. Have to have one that you can put bolts
into the damper for pulling on.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:25:36 -0600
From: "Moore, Jimmy"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Timing

Slik,

I don't have any timing chain, the gears interlock with one another (300
straight six). How would I rotate the engine? I think the second method
you mention, where you suggest sliding a small dowel rod into the hole,
should work. I shall do this tomorrow.

How will I know when the engine is ten degrees before top-dead-center, and
why is it necessary? (I'm not questioning it, just wondering why ten
degrees, and not fifteen or something of the sort?)

Hope I'm not being a pain,
Thanks,
Jim
1981 Ford F-150 300 Six, Automatic

Remember, Conway Twitty knows you've never been this far before (:



- -----Original Message-----
From: slikness mindspring.com [mailto:slikness mindspring.com]
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 7:39 AM
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Timing



Jim wrote:

>Someone said bring the number one piston up, but I have no earthly
idea how to do this.

The easy way to do this is find your timing pointer and rotate the engine
(by hand) to 0 degrees. That would be top dead center if the timing chain
was put in properly. One way to check is to remove the plug and slide a
small 8-9" long dowel into the #1 plug hole (and yes, the #1 plug fires the
#1 cylinder, should be the front plug) and watch the dowel as you rotate the
engine. When the dowel is all the way to the top (before it starts down
again), that's top-dead-center or 0 degrees on your pointer.

Then, once it is up, what do I do? Do I need to
adjust the distributer?

Rotate the engine until it reaches 10 degrees before top-dead-center (BTDC),
pull the distributor cap off and see if the rotor is pointing to the number
one plug wire. If not, rotate the distributor until the pointer lines up
with the number one plug wire. This will insure that the number one
cylinder fires at 10 BTDC.

How do I know what the gear ratio is on my current axle,
and then, what axle should I get? Do I need to make any other changes,i.e.,
the drive shaft or transmission changes or modifications?

There should be a tag on the passenger side of the axle with two rows of
numbers and letters. The second row should begin with something like 2 73.
That would correspond to a 2.73 ratio rear. Remember as you lower your gear
ratio, you raise your RPMs at highway speeds which will lower your gas
mileage. Also, as you get larger tires, you raise your ratio and start
loosing your power. If you have an overdrive transmission you should be
able to lower your ratio into the upper 3s. If not, then stick to the lower
to mid 3s.

Hope that helps,

Slik
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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 21:57:19 -0600
From: Blake Malkamaki
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - ZF and M5OD gearing...

>I have an 87 F-150 with the 4.9L and 4 speed OD (SROD?) that has a bearing
>going bad. Anyone know what the gearing is on this transmission? I would
>like to replace it with a 5 speed, preferably a wide ratio ZF from what I
>see here. Anyone have any experience with this swap? Will the ZF bolt up
>to 4.9? If I am not mistaken the ZF has a removable bell housing with the
>external slave cylinder like the 4 speed I currently have.
>

From the pictures I have seen, it has the one piece bell
housing/transmission, just like the madza one. You could probably cut a
hole in the side and use your clutch mechanism.


Blake
Little Mountain
Concord, Ohio
Early Oil Well Historian http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/oilwell
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/blake
"Society is safest when the criminals don't know who's armed."
"An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject...."


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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 22:00:26 -0600
From: Blake Malkamaki
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Ranger

>> There is an '87 Ranger that my bank is taking bids on, and I've
>> always kinda wandered what it would be like to have one of these
>> little trucks with a HOT 302 or maybe a 351W in it. Will either
>> of them fit with out too much modification to the front??? I don't
>> have a clue as to how it is currently equipped?? Don't know if I
>> will even bid on it if you guys tell me it will accept the small V8s,
>> but I've always been curious.
>

If it is a 2 wheel drive, I have a nice Mercedes diesel and 4 speed that
would fit pretty nice.

A smallblock Ford should be pretty straight forward if it is a 2 wheel
drive and you use the tranny from the V8.


Blake
Little Mountain
Concord, Ohio
Early Oil Well Historian http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/oilwell
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/blake
"Society is safest when the criminals don't know who's armed."
"An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject...."


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Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 22:20:13 -0500
From: Ken Payne
Subject: FTE 80-96 - ADMIN: New store items

The Ford Truck Enthusiasts online store has been updated
with an additional 122 products. We now carry Continental
Accessories (including TubeTreads), Westin Step Bars,
SportWing and Muth products. These products cover most
new Ford trucks and SUVs and many of the older trucks.

Check it out! The store enables us to continue to offer
the free web and mailing list services.

Now returning you to our regularly scheduled program....

Ken Payne
Admin

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