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Subject: 80-96-list-digest V3 #298
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80-96-list-digest Sunday, October 24 1999 Volume 03 : Number 298



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980-1996 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

Re: FTE 80-96 - Re:I6-300 on Propane
FTE 80-96 - Re:Uneven acceleration
FTE 80-96 - re: Shell Rotella 15w40
FTE 80-96 - Two questions...
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re:Uneven acceleration
FTE 80-96 - Update on Key Problem, still not fixed!
FTE 80-96 - re: Shell Rotella 15w40 in 302 gas
Re: FTE 80-96 - Engine Thermostats
Re: FTE 80-96 - Motor oil and additives
FTE 80-96 - Don't hold off
FTE 80-96 - 7.3 diesel
Re: FTE 80-96 - 7.3 diesel
FTE 80-96 - Sway Bar
FTE 80-96 - fuel guage
Re: FTE 80-96 - Sway Bar
Re: FTE 80-96 - RE: ROTFLMAO about......
Re: FTE 80-96 - re: Shell Rotella 15w40

=======================================================================

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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 20:57:23 +1000
From: les williams
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re:I6-300 on Propane

Hi Mike and All Others,
My comment was made with tongue firmly in cheek, I do appreciate your comments on OIL
or anything else, as I do anybody's comments relavent to Ford Products & their particular
usage. Some of the political comments go a bit over my head, what with being a resident of
Australia, I think some list respondents don't realize that e-mails on this list go world
wide, not just mainland USA. and F series trucks assembled in Oz can be quite a different
animal under the skin/paint, to what obviously you see out of Detroit.
Actually the 195F thermo did sort of work, it would open etc. BUT as the ambient
temperature goes up, the performance, particularly thru the hottest part of the day was
non-existent, it wasn't just a flat spot, just a real dead feel under acceleration, not
dis-similar to a very badly retarded engine, the 'Getup & Go' was gone. However driven at
night it was a different truck. The difference was schizophrenic like. Yes, I understand
the denser cold air theories etc. but with Propane the results for effort are far more
spectacular ( been known to have had a mis-spent(?) youth driving up and down a few drag
strips in my life & engaging in the science(?) of 'dial-in' run-what-you-brung street
racing ) In fact we have lovingly refered to this truck as Dragula, Two reasons, only runs
good at night, and up until I purchased it, it's always carried bodies (human) in one form
or an other..( they didn't install a Chiller unit for no good reason...) I'm having so
much Fun.
The 160F solved some of the problem, and have been working on other ways to expand on
this principle - But all this is relevent to Propane Engines Only. Don't get the idea that
this truck's performance is 'Leisurely', it's capable of low 16's over the qtr on propane
in a 2 ton Block O' Flats at night. - used to be 18's or 19's in office hours. After 30
years of messing around with Petrol Only Technology, I'm Impressed....and still working on
it !

Regards

Les
Lost in the Land of OZ



> Mike Wrote:
>
> Propanes a totally different story. Low ash content oil and cooler temperatures are the
> way to go. The engine probably wouldn't open a 195 thermostat.
>
> Mike
>
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 04:47:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: rokkinhorse webtv.net
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re:Uneven acceleration

Dennis writes:
accelerates unevenly when I get on it. Disconnected the egr and plugged
the hole, but made no difference. I just replaced the fuel pressure
regulator, also to no help. 66,000 miles and all new tune up parts. Also
the mileage is bad, about 11mpg. Any help would be greatly
appreciated!!! >> Dennis, pull the codes from the OBD. If there is a
problem with a sensor or if something is screwed up with fuel
delivery,it will be reflected in the trouble codes. If you aren't
comfortable pulling the codes (it is really pretty easy;write me off the
list if you want,and I'll send you a link that has instructions on how
to do this) it'd be worth the money to take it to the local dealership
and have them put it on the diagnostic machine.Process of elimination by
parts replacement is the most expensive way to troubleshoot the EEC
system. Having the dealership pinpoint the problem for you would cost
about as much as a new O2 sensor.Just from what you have said,it sounds
like a bad TPS(throttle position sensor),but you'll have to pull the
codes to confirm this.

Randy Goolsby-94 Bronco EB/85 F250 4x4

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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 08:00:36 -0400
From: ric tomas
Subject: FTE 80-96 - re: Shell Rotella 15w40

I wonder if this oil can be used in my F150. The engine calls for
10w30, but I have 5w30 in it now. Maybe this is why it sounds like a
diesel at idle. It just sounds very different. Does anybody else have
this? It is a 96 f150, with the 302, 76k miles. Other than that I love
the truck, and want to put an exhaust on it, something with a bit of a
sound to it, but not to loud, where it will drone in the cab.
Thanks,
Rich in CT
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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 05:36:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Christopher Tirone
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Two questions...

Hello all,
>
>My '86 302 (new to me) has two little problems I'm
not sure where to
start on.
>
>1. If it sits for a short while after being driven
and then I start it
again, she won't hold idle
>
> by herself until she's run awhile.
>
>2.Sometimes the oil pressure guage works, sometimes
it doesn't.
>
>Any thoughts?
>
>Greenman



=====

__________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 09:30:09 -0700
From: "Tony & Chris Phaneuf"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re:Uneven acceleration

Randy,
I would like to know the like that you have for instructions on pulling
computer codes.
you can send it here or just e-mail to me at aphaneuf home.com
would appreciate it...........

Tony P.
- -----Original Message-----
From: rokkinhorse webtv.net
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Saturday, October 23, 1999 6:23 AM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re:Uneven acceleration


Dennis writes:
accelerates unevenly when I get on it. Disconnected the egr and plugged
the hole, but made no difference. I just replaced the fuel pressure
regulator, also to no help. 66,000 miles and all new tune up parts. Also
the mileage is bad, about 11mpg. Any help would be greatly
appreciated!!! >> Dennis, pull the codes from the OBD. If there is a
problem with a sensor or if something is screwed up with fuel
delivery,it will be reflected in the trouble codes. If you aren't
comfortable pulling the codes (it is really pretty easy;write me off the
list if you want,and I'll send you a link that has instructions on how
to do this) it'd be worth the money to take it to the local dealership
and have them put it on the diagnostic machine.Process of elimination by
parts replacement is the most expensive way to troubleshoot the EEC
system. Having the dealership pinpoint the problem for you would cost
about as much as a new O2 sensor.Just from what you have said,it sounds
like a bad TPS(throttle position sensor),but you'll have to pull the
codes to confirm this.

Randy Goolsby-94 Bronco EB/85 F250 4x4

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 09:53:52 -0700
From: "mike mueller"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Update on Key Problem, still not fixed!

Thanks for all the replies and even the phone call!

(This is a little wordy but you get the whole story now)

Originally I thought the key was like a normal vehicle and had a cylinder
and lock set that actuated the electrical half below it making all the
right contacts. I bought the cylinder and key, and a new switch assembly,
came home and started to take it all apart. The cylinder comes out with no
tools except a small drift pin. After looking down the hole I was surprised
to find no contacts. So off came the wheel and I traced the mechanism down
the column to the switch. Replaced the switch, put it all back together and
still the same problem! The key doesn't have the spring return at the start
position, and doesn't make the necessary contact to turn over the starter.
Now I started looking at the rod and how all this was supposed to work.
The rod seemed to move most of the way but didn't move back. I ended up
pulling out the whole steering column and that's when I found the broken
part. At the back and deep inside of the unit, right before it goes to
straight column under the dash, there is a little pivot lever that actuates
the rod. The pivot is made of pot metal and has a 3" long shaft that
connects to a spring that pulls the rod back at start position. This shaft
had broken. I took the whole column down to the dealer and as I walked up
to the counter, column and little broken shaft in hand, the parts boy (all
of 18 yrs), said "I'll be right back". I thought he may be going to get a
parts guy but he returned with the exact part I needed without asking me a
thing about year, make or model! He said they always keep about 6 on hand
as they are prone to break. The only problem was he knew t took some
special tool to get the old one out and put in the new one. He walked me
over to one of the mechanics who spent the next 30 minutes replacing it with
me standing next to him. He was on his lunch hour. There was no mention of
time or labor and he really was doing this out of kindness. I thanked him
greatly, slipped him a twenty and now the only thing I have left to do is
put it all back together.

BTW: the name of the Pivot thingy is an "Actuator",
the part number is E9TZ*3E715*B, and the cost was $11.14 from the local
dealer who always has parts at the highest rates. (Walnut Creek Ford, CA)

I'm off today so I should be able to get it back in. I'll keep you posted.


Thanks!

Mike Mueller
Loan Officer
National Pacific Mortgage
800 899-3070 xt. 408


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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 12:24:51 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Mike Persell"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - re: Shell Rotella 15w40 in 302 gas

On Sat, 23 Oct 1999 08:00:36 -0400, ric tomas wrote:

>I wonder if this oil can be used in my F150. The engine calls for
>10w30, but I have 5w30 in it now. Maybe this is why it sounds like a
>diesel at idle. It just sounds very different. Does anybody else have
>this? It is a 96 f150, with the 302, 76k miles. Other than that I love
>the truck, and want to put an exhaust on it, something with a bit of a
>sound to it, but not to loud, where it will drone in the cab.

My 85 302 loves it and has for many miles. I also use it in my wifes tired 4 cyl minivan
and the oil consumption goes way down. Cold starts are not a problem with 15w-40
unless you're in severe cold climates. The pour point is not as good as 5w-30 but its
pretty low.

Mike

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 11:17:28 +0000
From: SNE REALTORS
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Engine Thermostats

Mike Persell wrote:
>
> On Tue, 19 Oct 1999 06:47:58 EDT, FLR150 aol.com wrote:
> >It seems lately I have a differing opinion to a quite a few posts. Again I
> >disagree. While I do not know much about the I-6 motors, I can tell you that
> >MOST of the V-8 Ford motors favor a cooler than stock Tstat. The stock Tstat
> >runs at 195-210 depending on the model year, application, and motor size.
> >Most of the Ford V-8's will run much better and cooler with the 180 degree
> >Tstat. Although, any temp below this will keep the EEC computers in their
> >start up "closed loop" modes.
>
> In every test I ran while working in oil company test labs, we found that engines would
> fail the Sequence tests if they ran less than the factory temp thermostats. Ford small
> blocks in particular have such a fast flame speed in the chambers that when they run
> less than optimum temp they stick the rings bad.
>
> In the 240 inch inline six we completely killed an engine at the equivalent of 55,000
> miles running a 180 deg thermostat. In the hotter climates a hotter thermostat can
> help the thermodynamics of the cooling process IF the radiator is clean and the block is
> relatively free of contamination in the water jackets.
>
> In my own 85 302, a factory recommended 195 deg thermostat means no condensation,
> more power, smotther idle, less oil consumption and better fuel mileage.
>
> In the words of the marketing suits, your mileage may vary.
>
> Mike
>
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please take us off your mailing list, snerlts flash.net
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 11:18:51 +0000
From: SNE REALTORS
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Motor oil and additives

Ed Mount wrote:
>
> >There were so many variables that I quit to a simpler business...I now am a
> software
> >engineer at IBM.
>
> >I can pick a few variables, like longevity and synthetic vs conventional
> and dribble out
> >some info if the list moderator will allow it.
>
> >Mike
>
> Mike,
> I always wondered about the Shell Rotella oil. As a kid I heard the
> truckers always ask for it at my Dad's service station, but never new if it
> was ok in car engines, or just for big trucks.
>
> My dad was also big on what he call Pennsylvania oils, such as Quaker State
> and Wolf's Head. He thought Wolf's Head was the best oil made in his time.
> I guess Pennzoil is also of that category, but I'm not sure.
>
> I recently read a technical (to me) article about Slick 50 and other
> additives, the jist of which is that you are better off without it. It uses
> Teflon, which apparently changes its characteristics at the temperatures
> that internal combustion engines run. Additives such as this can also
> upset the balance of the formulas used to make the original oil.
>
> I have been using Pennzoil Supramax, a blend of synthetic and regular oils,
> for no particular reason other than I wanted to get the extra benefits of
> synthetic, it is made by a reputable company, and it less expensive than
> other blends. Do you have any opinion on the various blends and synthetics?
> Do you see any problems switching from a blend to a full synthetic, then
> back again? I watch for bargains, since they are expensive, and Walmart
> just had a sale on Mobil 1, so I stocked up. Some folks think you ought to
> stick with one brand, but I question the need for that, since most are top
> quality. But just to be on the safe side, I don't mix oils between changes,
> and I don't use any additives.
>
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"""please take us off your mailing list, snerlts flash.net
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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 13:54:39 -0700
From: "J.S.H."
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Don't hold off

> If you don't like the TTB,Super Cab or the color I would keep looking.
>

> I hear ya, but I need a heavy duty tow vehicle and S-10 blazers lose
>their value by the second.


I forgot there was a s-10 in the equation.By all means get another Ford
immediatly,regardless of color ,equipment etc
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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 14:10:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: rich may
Subject: FTE 80-96 - 7.3 diesel

I am looking at a 1993 F250 powerstroke diesel and was
wondering if there were any performance upgrades that
are available for these motors. I saw that Banks makes
a kit for them. Has anyone had experience with Banks?


=====

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 18:14:40 -0400
From: S Spaulding
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 7.3 diesel

Careful - If it is a 1993, it is not a Powerstroke.

rich may wrote:
>
> I am looking at a 1993 F250 powerstroke diesel and was
> wondering if there were any performance upgrades that
> are available for these motors. I saw that Banks makes
> a kit for them. Has anyone had experience with Banks?
>
> =====
>
> __________________________________________________
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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 19:55:34 -0700
From: "Kevin Crandall"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Sway Bar

I have a 94 F-150 Xcab with a 4 inch suspension lift. My problem is that
the front sway bar is rubbing on the front springs. The shop that installed
the left said I can remove the sway bar to stop the rubbing. Does anyone
know how this will affect handling. It is a 2wd and I don't do any off road
driving. Any help or suggestions is appreciated.

Thanks

Kevin

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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 23:32:22 -0400
From: Peter Wong
Subject: FTE 80-96 - fuel guage

I'm certain the following problem has been posted before, so I apologize
for the redundancy.

My 87 F-150 has an erratic fuel guage. The level read 3/4 before the
needle started acting up. It now jumps around in the area of "full"
mark. It seems to settle down (moving toward 3/4) when coming to a stop,
then jumps around back up to "full." The truck has a single tank.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Peter
(Charlotte, NC)

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Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 20:35:05 -0700
From: Bob Kennedy
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Sway Bar

You should disconnect it and run for a while and see. I've lifted my Bronco 6"
and am running with no sway bar with no noticeable loss of steering control.

Bob


Kevin Crandall wrote:

> I have a 94 F-150 Xcab with a 4 inch suspension lift. My problem is that
> the front sway bar is rubbing on the front springs. The shop that installed
> the left said I can remove the sway bar to stop the rubbing. Does anyone
> know how this will affect handling. It is a 2wd and I don't do any off road
> driving. Any help or suggestions is appreciated.
>
> Thanks
>
> Kevin
>
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 23:49:29 PDT
From: "ken haley"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - RE: ROTFLMAO about......

But were you juggling three kittens while facing east????

One of my Broncos has a 302, 180 degree thermostat, manual trans, 3.55 twin
grip, no A/C, and no fan at all. It's main uses are to tow the high school
color gaurd trailer and get around when snow and ice are on the roads.
Today's trip was 284 miles round trip, and the temp gauge never got over 1/3
from cold.


Oh, and to the Datsun B-210 load of drunk farmworkers who decided it woud be
fun to try to get a bus loaded with band members to run off the road:
Repainting that 4 inch pipe on the front of my Bronco will be a lot cheaper
than replacing the trunk, quarters, roof, and back window of your car, but
I'm confident your insurance company will be interested in why the police
report states you "backed" into a parked vehicle. haahaahaahaa Like you
really have insurance. NOT!!!!

#1 reason for driving an SUV is other people's delusions of manhood.

Ken, the road warrior.


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Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 04:20:55 -0500
From: Blake Malkamaki
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - re: Shell Rotella 15w40

>I wonder if this oil can be used in my F150. The engine calls for
>10w30, but I have 5w30 in it now. Maybe this is why it sounds like a
>diesel at idle. It just sounds very different. Does anybody else have
>this? It is a 96 f150, with the 302, 76k miles. Other than that I love
>the truck, and want to put an exhaust on it, something with a bit of a
>sound to it, but not to loud, where it will drone in the cab.
>Thanks,
>Rich in CT

I would never use 5w30 in an engine. I think this is a sceme to get
slightly better milage at startup to increase the fleet overall mpg to meet
epa requirments. I think the stuff is just too darn thin. The best part of
the 15w40 is not its weight, but the fact that it is a better oil made to
higher specifications. You can also buy the same oil in SAE 10 or SAE 30
and probably more grades. Mainly you look for at least an SF-CD rating. S
....

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