From: owner-80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com (80-96-list-digest)
To: 80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com
Subject: 80-96-list-digest V3 #223
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80-96-list-digest Tuesday, August 10 1999 Volume 03 : Number 223



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980-1996 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

RE: FTE 80-96 - leaking rear axle seal
Re: FTE 80-96 - Bad Motor Mounts. Was: Noise in 4LO
Re: FTE 80-96 - Gas Mileage
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-Can't find my 02 sensor
FTE 80-96 - axle help
FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap
FTE 80-96 - water and antifreeze
Re: FTE 80-96 - axle help
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-Can't find my 02 sensor
Re: FTE 80-96 - water and antifreeze
Re: FTE 80-96 - ABS/Brake light on dash
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap
Re: FTE 80-96 - ABS/Brake light on dash
FTE 80-96 - Overheating or false reading?
Re: FTE 80-96 - water and antifreeze
FTE 80-96 - Re: axle code
Re: FTE 80-96 - 302 V8 or 300 I-6?
Re: FTE 80-96 - 302 V8 or 300 I-6?
FTE 80-96 - Cooling ? Cont.
FTE 80-96 - Cat Back 351
FTE 80-96 - Cruise Control
Re: FTE 80-96 - 302 V8 or 300 I-6?
Re: FTE 80-96 - ABS/Brake light on dash
Re: FTE 80-96 - ABS/Brake light on dash
Re: FTE 80-96 - water and antifreeze
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 09:14:31 -0400
From: Greg Carter
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - leaking rear axle seal

Hopefully you still have the owners manual, the code will be in there.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Edward Saunders [mailto:pucker21 usit.net]
Sent: Saturday, August 07, 1999 7:36 PM
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - leaking rear axle seal


The tag on the door has the following specs on it:

WB 133
TYPE-GVW F142
BODY LKY
TRANS A
AXL (Its either a 16, or I6, or L6 its hard to
read)
SPRING B L

Based on those what does it sound like? I appreciate the help to everyone.

Ed Saunders 96 F-150 302

Jim Cannon wrote:

> The easiest way is to read the "rear axel" code on the data label on the
> driver's door frame, if you are pretty sure you still have the factory
> axel. You can read the tag, if it is still attached to the axel, but that
> requires crawling down to look at it.
>
> At 11:24 07/08/99 -0500, you wrote:
> >Is there a way to tell from the outside?
> >Ed Saunders
> >
>
> Jim Cannon
> Houston, TX
> '29 Ford Model A Phaeton '63 Buick Riviera 401 V-8
> '80 Ford F-150 300 I-6 2WD
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Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 08:27:40 -0500
From: Steve Randa
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Bad Motor Mounts. Was: Noise in 4LO

I'm thinking about replacing mine along with the tranny mount (AOD).
Does anyone know if and what year to get for best design.

Steve Randa

PMckee5253 aol.com wrote:
>
> if you dont know what motor mounts look like you should have it done
> professionally. Or you could have a friend who knows what he is doing to
> help you. Thats how I learned.
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Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 07:17:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Gary Peterson
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Gas Mileage

I have an 86 F-150 4x4 with a 300 I-6, 4 sp., 3.08 axle. I get around 17 mpg mostly highway.





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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 08:19:18 -0700
From: "Beth and Tony Fischer"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-Can't find my 02 sensor

It has a carburetor.

Tony


- -----Original Message-----
From: Blake Malkamaki
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Sunday, August 08, 1999 11:12 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-Can't find my 02 sensor


>>If that truck has a vacuum advance ignition system (Duraspark 2), and not
a
>>TFI-IV with the feedback control carb, then it probably doesn't have and
O2
>>sensor. I knew a guy who had and 86 with a 351 that had the D2.
>>
>
>Does it have a carburetor or fuel injection?
>
>Blake
>Little Mountain
>Concord, Ohio
>Early Oil Well Historian
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/blake
>Web site design http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://hitechdesign.com
>Desktop Publishing service
>"Society is safest when the criminals don't know who's armed."
>"An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject...."
>
>
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>

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 09:01:23 PDT
From: 2insane excite.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - axle help

speaking of axles. 3L55 8 8 means that i have limited slip with 3.55
gears right? 8.8 rear end would that be? or am i just confusing myself
more?




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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:17:28 -0400
From: "Serian"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap

> Just out of curiosity, why would the engine run cooler
> (water temp remain lower) if the radiator is under pressure?

It keeps the water from boiling away and escaping, so that
there actually *is* water in the cooling system. :-P

Seriously, though ...

Under pressure, the water itself has to get hotter in order to achieve
boiling, and thus it is able to transfer more heat under pressure to
the radiator without frothing out the overflow.

Actually, the engine will run cooler for a short while if you leave the
radiator cap off, since evaporating water carries off more heat with
it than just flowing through vaned pipes, but this depletes the water
that cools the engine, and after a while of doing this, no more
coolant, and the engine gets WAY hot. Definitely, remember the
radiator cap.
:-)


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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:32:16 -0400
From: "Serian"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - water and antifreeze

> But straight water conducts heat better than an
> antifreeze mixture. Just don't use distilled water
> as it is very corrosive.

Distilled water is corrosive ?

This gentleman is essentially correct in the end
result, but there is more to the story of why ...
Distilled water in and of itself is quite neutral
and safe. Actually, the fact that without the
conditioners and protectant additives of antifreeze,
plain water in the cooling system dissolves air, and
brings it into contact with the internals of the engine
block. Wet air + iron ==> rust
thats the actual corrosive part of using just distilled
water in your cooling system ... its not the water
itself that is the problem, but the lack of protectants
and the dynamics of dissolved gases that is.

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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:51:41 EDT
From: FLR150 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - axle help

In a message dated 8/9/99 12:07:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
2insane excite.com writes:


gears right? 8.8 rear end would that be? Or am I just confusing myself
more? >>
You would be correct, that is what those numbers mean.
Later
Wayne Foy
'94 Flareside SC
Wayne's Page
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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 12:53:16 -0500
From: Blake Malkamaki
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-Can't find my 02 sensor

>It has a carburetor.
>

It probably does not have a computer... therefore no O2 sensor.

Blake
Little Mountain
Concord, Ohio
Early Oil Well Historian
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/blake
Web site design http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://hitechdesign.com
Desktop Publishing service
"Society is safest when the criminals don't know who's armed."
"An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject...."


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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 13:17:09 -0500
From: Blake Malkamaki
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - water and antifreeze

>> But straight water conducts heat better than an
>> antifreeze mixture. Just don't use distilled water
>> as it is very corrosive.
>
>Distilled water is corrosive ?
>

Yes distilled water is very corrosive. It is void of ions and minerals and
is therefore very "hungry" and will eat metal. If it is mixed with
antifreeze or cooling system cooling system corrosion inhibitor it is ok.


Blake
Little Mountain
Concord, Ohio
Early Oil Well Historian
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/blake
Web site design http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://hitechdesign.com
Desktop Publishing service
"Society is safest when the criminals don't know who's armed."
"An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject...."


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 13:32:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Mark F. Burgo ( Mark F. Burgo"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - ABS/Brake light on dash

I know that if you insert an incorrect bulb with a higher wattage you can cause
problems with the electrical system. Everything is set up to run at a
specifice wattage and if you are drawing more power with your lights you can
cause other failures due to not enough wattage to another system....

Mark

On 08-Aug-99 redmist mb.sympatico.ca wrote:
> Jim Cannon wrote:
>>
>> The ABS computer checks the system when you start and the light does not go
>> out if it senses any problem. By shutting the truck off, you had the
>> computer check it all again and it came up OK.
>
> So why did it stay on for so long the first time? Could there be an
> intermittent problem? I only mentioned the bulbs in my doors because
> that's the last thing I did to the truck (just hours earlier). I also
> have some noise coming from the front wheels when turning sharply that
> is new, but this could be more problems due to the bad motor mounts that
> need to be replaced, just as low gear gets the fan rubbing on the
> shroud.
>
> Shel
>
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- ----------------------------------
Burgo Systems / Consulting
E-Mail: Mark F. Burgo ( Mark F. Burgo
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.surfshop.net/users/mfburgo/pub

Date: 09-Aug-99
Time: 13:30:40

This message was sent by XFMail
On RedHat Linux 5.2
Burgo Systems / Consulting is happy to preload Linux on your new
BS/C System, Factory Direct
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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 14:19:58 -0400
From: "Michael McCarthy"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap

- -----Original Message-----
From: Serian
To: 80-96 FordList
Date: Monday, August 09, 1999 12:19 PM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap


>Under pressure, the water itself has to get hotter in order to achieve
>boiling, and thus it is able to transfer more heat under pressure to
>the radiator without frothing out the overflow.
>
Great answer. Of course, it dissipates more heat to the air, through the
radiator, if it isn't boiling out. In fact, one important issue would be how
effectively the radiator dissipates the heat it receives in the form of hot
water. the more heat it can dissipate the cooler the engine will run. If the
radiator is ineffective in dissipating heat the engine will run hotter.

Michael McCarthy
Export, PA

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Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 14:34:22 -0400
From: Mike Sloane
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap

There is something else to remember: the hotter an engine gets, the more
efficient it is. So part of the job of the "coolant" is to circulate and keep
the temperature of the block and head even and hot. Of course, if the engine
gets too hot, damage to the lubricant and metal parts will occur, so the cooling
system must maintain the highest possible temperature that the engine components
can handle. All that is part of the design of the engine and associated system,
and supposedly, the various components are combined to achieve that optimum
temperature.

Mike

Michael McCarthy wrote:

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Serian
> To: 80-96 FordList
> Date: Monday, August 09, 1999 12:19 PM
> Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap
>
> >Under pressure, the water itself has to get hotter in order to achieve
> >boiling, and thus it is able to transfer more heat under pressure to
> >the radiator without frothing out the overflow.
> >
> Great answer. Of course, it dissipates more heat to the air, through the
> radiator, if it isn't boiling out. In fact, one important issue would be how
> effectively the radiator dissipates the heat it receives in the form of hot
> water. the more heat it can dissipate the cooler the engine will run. If the
> radiator is ineffective in dissipating heat the engine will run hotter.
>
> Michael McCarthy
> Export, PA
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

- --

- ------------
Mike Sloane
Allamuchy NJ
(msloane att.net)



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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 18:07:48 EDT
From: Hitman6136 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - ABS/Brake light on dash

check your brake fluid level if both your paking brake light and abs light
come on it means you have a low fluid level
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Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 19:43:18 -0400
From: Mike and Suzie
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Overheating or false reading?

I'd first like to say hello and thanks to everyone here that make
this group such a great place to learn and exchange information. My
truck is an '89 with an I-6 and the Mazda tranny and 75K on her. I've
had her since mile 6 and now am facing a unique situation. This trucks
temp gauge has only registered from dead left at start up to the
beginning of the arc which shows the gauges range since day one. This
is only about 3 or 4 widths of the needle. This weekend after a short
trip the needle began approaching the N in normal. All of the other
gauges are steady in their expected ranges.
I have replaced the thermostat (the old one tested good) and have in
my hands a new sending unit in anticipation of the day when I can find
where it goes. Today a 5 mile trip showed same results, gauge much
higher than before first incident, but no loss of power or hot smell.
The upper radiator hose is hot so I assume the new stat is good.
So, raise your hands if you think this lazy gauge has started to
work properly after 10 years, or do I have something to worry about.



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Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 20:24:10 -0400
From: S Spaulding
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - water and antifreeze

Careful, Blake. There is a difference between deionized water and
distilled water. Deionized water is what you have to watch out for.

Steve



Blake Malkamaki wrote:
>
> >> But straight water conducts heat better than an
> >> antifreeze mixture. Just don't use distilled water
> >> as it is very corrosive.
> >
> >Distilled water is corrosive ?
> >
>
> Yes distilled water is very corrosive. It is void of ions and minerals and
> is therefore very "hungry" and will eat metal. If it is mixed with
> antifreeze or cooling system cooling system corrosion inhibitor it is ok.
>
> Blake
> Little Mountain
> Concord, Ohio
> Early Oil Well Historian
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/blake
> Web site design http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://hitechdesign.com
> Desktop Publishing service
> "Society is safest when the criminals don't know who's armed."
> "An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject...."
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 22:05:16 -0400
From: "Kevin"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: axle code

Well, its geared higher than I thought. I still want to replace my T-18 with
a 5 speed.
Thanks for the reply.

Kevin

>
>Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 21:04:32 -0700
>From: Bob Kennedy
>Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - axle code
>
>Code 18 between years 83-86 is a 3.08 gear ratio.
>
>Bob
>
>
>Kevin wrote:
>
>> Hello, My rear axle code is 18...does anyone happen to know what ratio
this
>> is? I beleive it is pretty low, I will probably be changing it sometime
to
>> get better gas mileage, as I really don't need a truck geared quite so
low.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Kevin
>>
>

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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 22:08:28 -0400
From: "Troy"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 302 V8 or 300 I-6?

On 3 Aug 99, at 22:22, Blake Malkamaki wrote:

>From people I have talked with who have had either engine, they seem to get
>about the same milage. The six is nicer to work on cause you can get right
>in there and sit next to it to work on it.

It's the same case with my '84 F-150. Has quite a bit of room
under the hood for me to climb on in.

You might be a redneck if... You have a set of 16 matching salad
bowls, and they all say 'Cool Whip' on the side' - Jeff Foxworthy


Troy Williams
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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 22:08:28 -0400
From: "Troy"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 302 V8 or 300 I-6?

On 2 Aug 99, at 20:41, Kyle McC. wrote:

> In the next three months or so I am going to buy a Ford pickup
>and wondering which is a better motor? It will be in the 80's to
>early 90's range. I do not pull anything just throw camping gear in
>the back and the motorcycle every now and then. So I am not
>concerned about whether enough power just the best gas mileage and
>reliabilty. Also if I ever want to in the future trick out the motor
>which would be better? 302 or 300? Also the vehicle will be a Short
>Box with four wheel drive. Just to throw that in there. Thanks for
>any help. Kyle

I have an '84 F-150 with a 302. I must say that the truck has
enough get-up-and go for my liking, it has the power that it needs
incase I do need to haul or pull something, and yes, it is pretty
efficient as long as you have a gentle foot on the take-offs.

You might be a redneck if... A tornado goes through your trailer park
and makes it look neater. - Jeff Foxworthy


Troy Williams
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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 21:14:39 MDT
From: "DeseretMail"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Cooling ? Cont.

I also had heard that we did want to use distilled water to avoid the scale build up.

I have also heard that soft water is better then regular water, both of these made sense to me with my experience in bathrooms, fish tanks, and other uses around my home.

The question I have is on my 92 E-350/Club Wagon extended, that I bought last week, I noticed some holes in the top of the radiator. No signs of scale build up, but some rust. It appears that the top of the radiator is being eaten up from the inside. Is this rust?

I have had scale build up before, but not holes in a radiator top.

What is the cause, and how bad is likely to be in other parts of the radiator/cooling system.

Kris
92 E-350/Club Wagon 143k/mi


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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 21:17:18 MDT
From: "DeseretMail"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Cat Back 351

I just took my first trip in my 92 E-350, with a 351 and 4 spd eod. I averaged 13.6 mpg, I was hoping for better.

Does anyone have an idea what a Cat back will add real world in driveability and MPG to this setup.

Kris
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Date: Mon, 9 Aug 1999 21:26:44 MDT
From: "DeseretMail"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Cruise Control

I just bought a 92 E-350 and the cruies is dead.

The owner told me that it was a vacuum problem, my mechanic looked quickly, and said that the vacuum and electricity were good.

I checked the steering wheel switches and they are working as far as I can tell.

My mechanic did not have enough time to finish it before we took it on our first trip from Alpine UT to Turlock Ca (Near Modesto Ca of American Graffiti fame.)

Driving with out cruise was a pit. Going back I am concerned that a Nevada Hiway Patrol might notice before I do that this bugger is pegged. I can not afford a ticket right now.

Some questions, from what I can see there is no vacuum for this Crusie control set-up.

SO that leaves only three other areas, (1) the cable going to the throttle is broken, (2) the Cruise module is out, (3) the wires between either the steering wheel or the fuse panel are broken.

Does anyone have an idea which is most likely, or how to troubleshoot to determine the correct component.

Kris
Alpine Ut
92 E-350
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Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:37:34 -0500
From: Mike Persell
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 302 V8 or 300 I-6?

Troy wrote:
>
> I have an '84 F-150 with a 302. I must say that the truck has
> enough get-up-and go for my liking, it has the power that it needs
> incase I do need to haul or pull something, and yes, it is pretty
> efficient as long as you have a gentle foot on the take-offs.

I have an 85 F-150 and i completely agree with Troy. I'm in no hurry to
buy a newer truck and would probably spend the money to rebuild the
85.

Mike
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Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:14:56 -0700
From: redmist mb.sympatico.ca
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - ABS/Brake light on dash

Hitman6136 aol.com wrote:
>
> check your brake fluid level if both your paking brake light and abs light
> come on it means you have a low fluid level
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

Thanks. Actually, my father was in from out of town with his F350 crew
cab last week and one thing he mentioned was that I should top up my
brake fluid. It was at or very close to the max line, but I went out
and bought some brake fluid. When this happened, I checked the fluid
level, and it looked about the same. I could've sworn I topped it up
after buying the fluid, but I guessed I hadn't. I went over to the
shelf and sure enough, the seal was off. I had topped it up. I did so
again, and it hasn't come back on. There is some damp areas on the
frame around the drivers side front whhel well, but I though this was
probably a leaky power steering pump or something. Maybe I should look
further, eh? I'll definitely keep an eye on it now. Thanks again...

Shel ~:O)


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 23:14:56 -0700
From: redmist mb.sympatico.ca
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - ABS/Brake light on dash

Hitman6136 aol.com wrote:
>
> check your brake fluid level if both your paking brake light and abs light
> come on it means you have a low fluid level
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

Thanks. Actually, my father was in from out of town with his F350 crew
cab last week and one thing he mentioned was that I should top up my
brake fluid. It was at or very close to the max line, but I went out
and bought some brake fluid. When this happened, I checked the fluid
level, and it looked about the same. I could've sworn I topped it up
after buying the fluid, but I guessed I hadn't. I went over to the
shelf and sure enough, the seal was off. I had topped it up. I did so
again, and it hasn't come back on. There is some damp areas on the
frame around the drivers side front whhel well, but I though this was
probably a leaky power steering pump or something. Maybe I should look
further, eh? I'll definitely keep an eye on it now. Thanks again...

Shel ~:O)


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Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 02:24:30 -0500
From: Blake Malkamaki
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - water and antifreeze

>Careful, Blake. There is a difference between deionized water and
>distilled water. Deionized water is what you have to watch out for.
>
>Steve
>

Distilled water has no minerals and is therefore hungry to eat up more.
Condensate from a steam engine is very corrosive to return to feedwater
tanks and boilers unless it is treated.


Blake
Little Mountain
Concord, Ohio
Early Oil Well Historian
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://little-mountain.com/blake
Web site design http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://hitechdesign.com
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"Society is safest when the criminals don't know who's armed."
"An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject...."


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 02:31:58 -0500
From: Blake Malkamaki
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Remember the radiator cap

>There is something else to remember: the hotter an engine gets, the more
>efficient it is. So part of the job of the "coolant" is to circulate and keep
>the temperature of the block and head even and hot. Of course, if the engine
>gets too hot, damage to the lubricant and metal parts will occur, so the
>cooling
>system must maintain the highest possible temperature that the engine
>components
>can handle. All that is part of the design of the engine and associated
>system,
>and supposedly, the various components are combined to achieve that optimum
>temperature.
>
>Mike
>

For this reason Rumely Oil Pull tractors were oil cooled. Their temperature....


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