80-96-list-digest Thursday, April 15 1999 Volume 03 : Number 105



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980-1996 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 80-96 - Removing Mechanical Fan??
RE: FTE 80-96 -fuel problem resolved!
RE: FTE 80-96 - 81 Ford F100 Custom, questions
FTE 80-96 - Brakes spongy
FTE 80-96 - RE: Electrical Connections Near Battery
FTE 80-96 - Air-Fuel monitors
Re: FTE 80-96 - Removing Mechanical Fan??
FTE 80-96 - stake bed
Re: FTE 80-96 - Removing Mechanical Fan??
FTE 80-96 - ladder racks
Re: FTE 80-96 - stake bed
FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter
Re: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea
RE: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea
Re: FTE 80-96 -fuel problem resolved!
Re: FTE 80-96 -fuel problem resolved!
Re: FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter
FTE 80-96 - wiring diagrams
RE: FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter
RE: FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter
Re: FTE 80-96 - Air-Fuel monitors
Re: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea
Re: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea
FTE 80-96 - Spark Plugs

=======================================================================

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Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:52:03 -0400
From: "Golly, Scott M"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Removing Mechanical Fan??

Good Day All,

I have a simple, quick question. Is it feasible that removing the
mechanical fan and going to two electric fans (or something) can increase
the engine output by a lot. I mean 10 to 20 horsepower by different stories
I have heard.

Scott M. Golly
Researcher/Fire Protection Engineer
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:58:21 -0400
From: "Ratcliff, Dale"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 -fuel problem resolved!

Where is this valve located and what is involved in changing it?
I have had this problem for about a year now. I just run the front tank
first. I have a
92 F150 SC.
- -Dale Ratcliff
- -Email : dratc Telxon.com




- -----Original Message-----
From: ROlson1039 aol.com [mailto:ROlson1039 aol.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 1999 7:40 PM
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 -fuel problem resolved!


Hey guys a while ago I wrote the list regarding a problem I was having with

my 1989 F 250 which ran a 5.8 with dual tanks. The truck was having a
problem when I ran off the rear tank fuel refiled the front tank. In
addition I had a problem during refueling as when I pumped fuel into the
front tank it wasnt venting causing the gas to back up and the tank to take

about five cents worth at a time before the nozzle popped ( real fun
pumping
gas at the self serve in the rain LOL)
The local Ford dealer suggested that there was something broken in the tank
and wanted me to spend $513 on a new tank.. I ended up replacing the tank
because the fuel pump went in it and the tank was starting to rot again (
and I already had this one repaired once) so I got an aftermarket one ( JC
Whitney $129 or thereabouts) which did nothing to alleviate the problems
Finally I went and bought the crossover valve ( the six line one as is
standard in my truck) and replaced it. I can pump gas in the truck again and

it fills normally... and the rear tank dont fill the front one!
AMEN problem resolved!
So anyways if y'all have the problem now ya got the fix..
Also be wary of the parts department prices i live in NYC and i find that
if
i shop aropund the parts at the local Ford dealers there is a big difference

in costs the valve was way more expensive at a larger dealer than it was in

a smaller one
regards
Bob
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:01:59 -0400
From: "Ratcliff, Dale"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - 81 Ford F100 Custom, questions

If you can pump the brake peddle up then it goes down as you hold it, you
probably have a bad master cylinder. The break fluid is leaking past the
valve in the cylinder.

- -Dale Ratcliff
- -Email : dratc Telxon.com




- -----Original Message-----
From: Corey & Jennifer Norton [mailto:jcnorton axs.net]
Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 1999 9:39 PM
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com">"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - 81 Ford F100 Custom, questions


Hi there,

I have a couple of questions regarding my 81 F100 Custom. My truck is in
good shape with 60,000 miles on it, I've only owned it a year so I don't
know the maintenance history.

My first question is with the brakes. What generally causes a spongy pedal?
When I come to a stop at a light, I can feel the pedal travelling on down
almost to the floor, just to keep the truck still. I've had the pads
checked and they all have much wear left. There is plenty of fluid in the
master cylinder, and it doesn't seem to be leaking.

My second question is about towing capabilities. This is a 302 v-8, auto,
with a new carb as of last year. We've recently bought a boat (only 2,500
lbs) and I barely have enough power to reach highway speeds. I definitely
have trouble with hills. Is there anything that can be done to increase
horsepower on this engine? Or is this model just not geared for towing. I
understand that 81 was in the early years of emissions restrictions as there
are hoses going everywhere on this engine, would that have any effect on
power?

Any help is appreciated.

Corey Norton


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Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 10:25:33 -0400
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Brakes spongy

Corey writes: >>When I come to a stop at a light, I can feel the pedal
travelling on down almost to the floor, just to keep the truck still.

Master cylinder gone bad. Fluid is seeping by the seals internally, if you
aren't losing fluid.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:10:40 -0500
From: Paul M Radecki
Subject: FTE 80-96 - RE: Electrical Connections Near Battery

Dave Baldwin wrote:
>>I have a convenient grounding lug about a foot from the battery
terminal
>>mounted to the fender. This is the common return for all things
electrical
>>in the truck. This is where you should run your ground return.

True, but be very careful when you try to remove the nut. The current
flow through such a heavily used ground can, over time, weld the nut to
the stud and the stud to the fender. When you try to remove it, you risk
breaking off the stud flush with the fender (go ahead, ask me how I know
this...)

lordjanusz juno.com
'94 F150 300ci
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 09:48:01 -0700
From: Moe Gendron
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Air-Fuel monitors

Hey Guys,
Anybody using those air-fuel monitors in the summit, paw, etc.
catalogs? If so which one is best? K&N, Edelbrock, MSD and so on......
Also, I'm gettin ready for a muffler system for my swap project
(300-6 to 302HO V8) on my 85 F-150. I have a 3" SS "Y" pipe with a
fittin for a O2 sensor, but nothing else, and I want to run duals, not to
loud. Any muffler, resonator combination sugesstions? I don't want it to
sound like a Harley.

Thanks,
Moe
72T
85 F-150
89 Maxima


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Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:03:14 -0400
From: Andre Roy
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Removing Mechanical Fan??

"Golly, Scott M" wrote:
>
> Good Day All,
>
> I have a simple, quick question. Is it feasible that removing the
> mechanical fan and going to two electric fans (or something) can increase
> the engine output by a lot. I mean 10 to 20 horsepower by different stories
> I have heard.
>
At high RPM, 10 or 20 HP seems to be an Ok guess. Thing is, unless
you're racing all the time, what's the point? An electric fan will
usually also add weight and increase drag from the alternator when it's
on. That power has to come from soemwhere.

You won't see much improvement at all in normal driving. But it's your
truck :-)
- --
Andre
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:14:48 PDT
From: "Scottie Schmidt"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - stake bed

Hi,
It has been a while since I posted so I am going to refresh you on
who I am. I am the person who asked all those questions on
snowplowing, and a farm truck! Now I will update you. My grandfather
who owns the 12 acre farm, has his car on the market for about $14000,
and is going to buy a truck when he sells his car! He is planning on
spending know more than $12500. My dad who was interested in snow
plowing, still is, but is not quite in the position to buy a truck,
but we are still keeping our eyes open for one. Now for who needs
what. My grandfather needs a good farm truck, it has to be 4x4 and
with low miles, and most likely a 150. My dad wants a 250 4x4, under
$5000.
Questions:
- How are the F350 stake beds for plowing? I am talking
about the ones with 6 wheels. Do they have such a one that is 6 wheel
drive? On the 4 wheel drive trucks, do the 4 rear tires spin, or is
it 2 in the front and 2 in the back? Basically I would like to know
the different kinds (2whl. drive, 4whl. drive etc.) and which ones can
do plowing. My dad is kind of looking at those for the bed space on
them, he will adventually be pulling trailers, and hauling steel. He
also wants to do a little plowing.
- What are your thoughts on lift kits? My dad hauls alot
of steel, will a lift kit help when hauling heavy loads? Or does it
just make it higher for the looks? Basically what effect does it have
on the suspension?
- What is the bed size for a 86-96 truck with an extended
cab? Grandfather might be onterested in one!

I hope these are not to many questions, but you guys are wonderful and
I appreciate all the info you give me!

Thanks,
Scottie Schmidt JR.



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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 10:14:54 -0500
From: Jim Cannon
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Removing Mechanical Fan??

I would find that hard to believe. 1 or 2 HP I would believe. Someone must
have some actual dyno data on this somewhere.

At 08:52 14/04/99 -0400, you wrote:
>Good Day All,
>
>I have a simple, quick question. Is it feasible that removing the
>mechanical fan and going to two electric fans (or something) can increase
>the engine output by a lot. I mean 10 to 20 horsepower by different stories
>I have heard.

Jim Cannon
Houston, TX
'29 Ford Model A Phaeton
'63 Buick Riviera
'80 Ford F-150
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Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 08:37:35 PDT
From: "Scottie Schmidt"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - ladder racks

Hi,
Would like to build father and grandfather ladder racks for their
trucks. They both need and will need them badly. Father has a 93
F-150 XL. And grandfather does not have anything yet but will most
likely getting a F-150 4x4. I am currently mainly concentraiting on
my fathers truck.
It has a 8 foot bed, and a bedliner. For now we are going to make it
out of would till we get the tools to make a nice steel one. I took
some measurements, please tell me what you think about them! If I am
correct, from the floor of the bed to about 2 inches above the cab is
4 feet. The bed is just about 6 feet wide. And from the back of the
truck to the front is 12 feet long.
If those measurements are correct I believe I will need the following
lumber for sure.
4 - four footers (for the "legs", will be going up and down in the
corners of the bed.
4 - six footers (for the top of the rack to go left to right, to put
the equipment on)
2 - twelve footers for the two sides (will attach to the 4 legs, and
will attach the 6 footers to them.)

I am still looking for better designs, and better ideas of how to make
it. If anybody has any good webpages for this kind of stuff, please
let me know ASAP!
Thanks,
Scottie Schmidt JR.



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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:40:36 -0400
From: Andre Roy
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - stake bed

Scottie Schmidt wrote:
> - How are the F350 stake beds for plowing? I am talking
> about the ones with 6 wheels. Do they have such a one that is 6 wheel
> drive?
>
Dual axle or dual wheel? I have no idea about the dual axle (two rear
axles), I would guess that only the front of the two is driven, but I
don't know. As for a dual wheel (two wheels on each end of the rear
axle), they should be fine.

> - What are your thoughts on lift kits?
>
My thoughs? I don't like 'em much at all.

> My dad hauls alot
> of steel, will a lift kit help when hauling heavy loads? Or does it
>
Makes it higher. Some raise the ground clearance a lot, but they don't
do much for load handling. In fact, the load winds p higher, which can
make the truck tippier. I can see the use for them if you're seriously
into bushwhacking.

> just make it higher for the looks?
>
Looks or groundclearance. Not payload.

> Basically what effect does it have
> on the suspension?
>
Some have no effectm, because it's the body that's lifted, some mess up
the geometry quite seriously and some seem to be ok.
- --
Andre
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:34:30 -0500
From: "Kevin Reed"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter

List,

I have an 86 F150 302 w/dual tanks. I have bought a fuel filter, and it's
cylindrical with a diameter of about 3", and a height of about 1.5". The
only place along the fuel lines that I can see this thing fitting in is the
crossover valve. (at least I think it's the crossover valve. It has 4
lines coming from the two tanks, and two lines going to the fuel rail.) If
this is where the filter goes, how do I get it in there? does the bottom
screw off? (I've tried, but didn't want to try too hard because the part
looks expensive!). If this isn't where the fuel filter goes, then where the
heck does it?

Kevin Reed
Burlington, ONT.



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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 11:53:38 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea

>From: 2insane excite.com
>Subject: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea
>
>THE GREAT "GAS OUT"

Yo Insane One:

Do you believe in market economics? What would this do to prices on the
preceding Thursday and following Saturday? If you assume that prices react
instantly to the change in supply and demand (which they don't), then prices
would increase on Thursday and Saturday exactly by the amount they dropped on
Friday (which they won't), since everyone who would have bought gas on Friday
will simply re-schedule that purchase to Thursday or Saturday.

If you really want to have an impact, just quit driving your truck and using
petroleum products altogether. Now, if we could get a few hundred million
people to go along with that, there'd be more gas (and cheaper) for the rest of
us!

Dave R. (M-block devotee)


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 13:53:53 -0500
From: "Baldwin, Dave (CPCP Design)"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea

....or convert to propane or CNG. Or maybe rig up to run on chicken manure!

> -----Original Message-----
> >
> >THE GREAT "GAS OUT"
>
> Yo Insane One:
>
> If you really want to have an impact, just quit driving your
> truck and using petroleum products altogether. Now, if we could get a few

> hundred million people to go along with that, there'd be more gas (and
> cheaper) for the rest of us!
>
> Dave R. (M-block devotee)
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 12:32:17 -0700
From: Mark Ponsford
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 -fuel problem resolved!

>Hey guys a while ago I wrote the list regarding a problem I was having with
>my 1989 F 250 which ran a 5.8 with dual tanks. The truck was having a
>problem when I ran off the rear tank fuel refiled the front tank. In
>addition I had a problem during refueling as when I pumped fuel into the
>front tank it wasnt venting causing the gas to back up and the tank to take
>about five cents worth at a time before the nozzle popped ( real fun pumping
>gas at the self serve in the rain LOL)
>The local Ford dealer suggested that there was something broken in the tank
>and wanted me to spend $513 on a new tank.. I ended up replacing the tank
>because the fuel pump went in it and the tank was starting to rot again (
>and I already had this one repaired once) so I got an aftermarket one ( JC
>Whitney $129 or thereabouts) which did nothing to alleviate the problems
>Finally I went and bought the crossover valve ( the six line one as is
>standard in my truck) and replaced it. I can pump gas in the truck again and
>it fills normally... and the rear tank dont fill the front one!
>AMEN problem resolved!
>So anyways if y'all have the problem now ya got the fix..
>Also be wary of the parts department prices i live in NYC and i find that if
>i shop aropund the parts at the local Ford dealers there is a big difference
>in costs the valve was way more expensive at a larger dealer than it was in
>a smaller one
>regards
>Bob


You should get Ford to buckup for this one. This is a known problem and
there is a safety recall to deal with it.

See http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.autosafety.org/fseries.html

(F in f-series stands for "fireball")


- -------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Ponsford721-7397 or mponsfor uvic.ca


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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:48:13 EDT
From: ROlson1039 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 -fuel problem resolved!

the valve is located on the left frame rail of the truck near the front
wheel there were two 10 or11mm bolts holding the valve to the frame and six
lines the lines were held on with clips that just pop off you sort of pull
them out .. very simple a small screwdriver was used to pry them slightly..
very very easy.. there is an instruction kit and new clips enclosed with the
new part.. if you could change your battery terminal this is a comparable
job.. just make sure you have a pan to let the gas in the valve drain out
into. Any more questions feel free to email me off list
Bob
ROlson1039 aol.com
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 16:50:51 EDT
From: ROlson1039 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter

the gas filter on my truck is forward of that location close to the front
left wheel
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Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:53:55 EDT
From: craig n eggerman
Subject: FTE 80-96 - wiring diagrams

Any body know a source or have posted wiring diagrams. Just got my 61-88
Chiltons for vans from barnes and noble and was a little disappointed at
the content. I may send it back.
Craig Eggerman juno.com
Casper,Wyoming
O|||||O

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Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:26:58 -0500
From: "Harris, Scott"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter

My '85 has the same set-up but the filter height is about 3" high and 3"
across. The filter goes in the location you are describing. I use an oil
filter wrench and remember lefty-loosy. The filter should also have an
o-ring with it because it seals the filter cup and the installed one is
screwed up when you remove the cup. Don't know the torque specs but I just
snug it up, 192,000 miles can't be wrong.

Don't know about the '86's but the '85's had a selection of 3 diff. filters
for that year depending on when or where your truck was manufactured.

> -----Original Message-----
> From:Kevin Reed [SMTP:kreed ICAN.NET]
> Sent:Wednesday, April 14, 1999 1:35 PM
> To:80-96-list ford-trucks.com
> Subject:FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter
>
> List,
>
> I have an 86 F150 302 w/dual tanks. I have bought a fuel filter, and it's
> cylindrical with a diameter of about 3", and a height of about 1.5". The
> only place along the fuel lines that I can see this thing fitting in is
> the
> crossover valve. (at least I think it's the crossover valve. It has 4
> lines coming from the two tanks, and two lines going to the fuel rail.)
> If
> this is where the filter goes, how do I get it in there? does the bottom
> screw off? (I've tried, but didn't want to try too hard because the part
> looks expensive!). If this isn't where the fuel filter goes, then where
> the
> heck does it?
>
> Kevin Reed
> Burlington, ONT.
>
>
>
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 22:31:07 -0500
From: "Harris, Scott"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter

One more thing before you start, follow the fuel lines to the engine. I've
heard that some trucks have the filter cup but it is not used. They have a
filter somewhere forward of the crossover.

> -----Original Message-----
> From:Kevin Reed [SMTP:kreed ICAN.NET]
> Sent:Wednesday, April 14, 1999 1:35 PM
> To:80-96-list ford-trucks.com
> Subject:FTE 80-96 - Fuel Filter
>
> List,
>
> I have an 86 F150 302 w/dual tanks. I have bought a fuel filter, and it's
> cylindrical with a diameter of about 3", and a height of about 1.5". The
> only place along the fuel lines that I can see this thing fitting in is
> the
> crossover valve. (at least I think it's the crossover valve. It has 4
> lines coming from the two tanks, and two lines going to the fuel rail.)
> If
> this is where the filter goes, how do I get it in there? does the bottom
> screw off? (I've tried, but didn't want to try too hard because the part
> looks expensive!). If this isn't where the fuel filter goes, then where
> the
> heck does it?
>
> Kevin Reed
> Burlington, ONT.
>
>
>
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 23:37:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: Ken Woods
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Air-Fuel monitors

On Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Moe Gendron wrote:
> Anybody using those air-fuel monitors in the summit, paw, etc.
> catalogs? If so which one is best? K&N, Edelbrock, MSD and so on......

HalmeterAF30

- --
Ken Woods
kwoods kens.com

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Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 23:08:25 -0500
From: Matthew Banevich
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea

These people are missing the point, it is to show how outraged we are
with the current fuel products!!!!

Catch a clue



Dave Resch wrote:
>
> >From: 2insane excite.com
> >Subject: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea
> >
> >THE GREAT "GAS OUT"
>
> Yo Insane One:
>
> Do you believe in market economics? What would this do to prices on the
> preceding Thursday and following Saturday? If you assume that prices react
> instantly to the change in supply and demand (which they don't), then prices
> would increase on Thursday and Saturday exactly by the amount they dropped on
> Friday (which they won't), since everyone who would have bought gas on Friday
> will simply re-schedule that purchase to Thursday or Saturday.
>
> If you really want to have an impact, just quit driving your truck and using
> petroleum products altogether. Now, if we could get a few hundred million
> people to go along with that, there'd be more gas (and cheaper) for the rest of
> us!
>
> Dave R. (M-block devotee)
>
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Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 00:23:45 EDT
From: DJ250r aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Good Idea

i dont know if u guys are morning comuters but iv seen a big dif in people on
the road every morninga lot less i drive from victorville ca. to santa ana ca
every morning and its alot better
dwayne jackson
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------------------------------

Date: 14 Apr 99 23:18:50 PDT
From: William Berninghausen
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Spark Plugs

Anybody have any luck trying multiple-electrode spark plugs? I kept trac=
k of
mileage for 3K miles each with Autolite and Splitfires, and got a 9% mpg....


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