FTE 80-96 - Electrical stuff...

80-96-list-digest Tuesday, January 5 1999 Volume 02 : Number 438

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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980-1996 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 80-96 - Electrical stuff...
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hub squeak
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
Re: FTE 80-96 - ADMIN: TruckTough.com
FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-list-Electric fuel pump keeps running
FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-list- Choice of thermostats
FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96- cutting out the computer
FTE 80-96 - One Ford to Another(kinda off topic)
Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures
FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats -- Revisited
Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
RE: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats -- Revisited
FTE 80-96 - Re: F150 Brakes
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
FTE 80-96 - Re: Rear Brake Trouble (92 F-150 2WD)
Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats -- Revisited
RE: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-list-Electric fuel pump keeps running
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: F150 Brakes
FTE 80-96 - FTE 80-96 Re: Choice of thermostats, exhaust and performance chips
FTE 80-96 - T'stats
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
FTE 80-96 - Stuck in Park!
RE: FTE 80-96 - Stuck in Park!
FTE 80-96 - 3g alternator
Re: FTE 80-96 - FTE 80-96 Re: Choice of thermostats, exhaust and performance chips
FTE 80-96 - re: Tailight problem
RE: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Rear Brake Trouble (92 F-150 2WD)
FTE 80-96 - Mile Marker Hubs
FTE 80-96 - EGR Probs & ANTIFREEZE Odor
FTE 80-96 - why now? and hotter temps.
RE: FTE 80-96 - 3g alternator
Re: FTE 80-96 - 1994 Explorer Automatic Hub Problem
FTE 80-96 - Bad Pads
Re: FTE 80-96 - Bad Pads
FTE 80-96 - Spark Plugs... Help!

=======================================================================

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Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 13:55:16 +0100
From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rnar?= Huse"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Electrical stuff...

- -Interesting. I'm new to all this electrical diagnosis, so sorry if I
- -ask too many questions, but are all the bulbs suppost to ground? If
- -so, how can I find out which one isn't grounding? About the only
- -thing I have in the way of electrical equipment is my multimeter.

Every electric gizmo/gadget on the truck has to be grounded to work at
all (also the engine; even the transfer case, if you have el-activated
4WD). Generally on all US cars, black leads should be ground. On
European cars, they may well be brown. Haven't had any japanese, so I
can't wouch for them...

Some components may be grounded through another's connection (all bulbs
in the rear lights may share the same ground connection, for instance).
Or; each single component may have a separate ground (most running light
relays and aftermarket equipment, for instance).

To find out if the ground connection is bad, you could switch your
multimeter to ohms and hold it to the connector to black lead (ground)
in your blinker lamp assembly and onto chassis ground _with the lights
turned off_. The meter should read 0 or close to that. Another way of
checking if the ground lead is bad is to use one probe lead from your
multimeter, hold it between the connector to the black lead in your
blinker lamp and chassis ground _while the lamp is blinking_. If your
rear end changes from "Caddy pimp mode" (all lights blinking) to single
blinker lamp blinking; your problem is found. Fix the old or install a
new ground connection.

- --
Bjornar Huse
Aalesund, Norway
1 1990 Ford E-250 Club Wagon 7.3 diesel, 3.54, E4OD
1 1994 Ford Escort 1.3
1 1986 Ford Escort 1.6 Wagon
Oh, yes, one 1971 wife, too!
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 07:23:55 -0600
From: "Rick Wojciechowski"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hub squeak

Randy wrote:

> Rick,
> I see one small problem with your suggestion. How do I keep the rear tires
> from making the truck drive over the jack stands??? Hehe.

Okay, you caught me too. I was not having a very good day
yesterday after being out of work for the previous 11 days.
Please forgive my idiocracy. Is that that word? :-)

- --
Thanks,
Rick Wojo
'83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
'92 Mstng 5.0L
'95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)

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Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 07:49:16 -0600
From: "Rick Wojciechowski"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

Dave Slotter wrote:

> Rick,
>
> In an EFI engine, doesn't the computer (EEC-IV) control the choke? If so, I
> would bet that the computer *does in fact* factor in to this problem and
> that I should try swapping back in the old (working?) coolant temperature
> sensor and see if that does the trick. That is easy enough.

Yeah I forgot you had EFI. Ummm, I can only say that thecomputer handles it, I
just don't know how. Anyone know
how the EFI handles what the choke's responsibility was ?
Be kinda nice to know, cause it will help me out with my
Mustang's EFI.

- --
Thanks,
Rick Wojo
'83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
'92 Mstng 5.0L
'95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 08:51:41 -0500
From: Mike Sloane
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - ADMIN: TruckTough.com

I tried to take the survey, but all I got back was an "error processing"
message. I think the site needs some work. The questions were a little
strange too.

Ken Payne wrote:

> Dear Ford Truck Enthusiasts list members:
>
> We have a new sponsor on our web site. Since the beginning,
> our practice with web site sponsor has been to make a brief
> announcement for 2 days (this is day 1 of 2).
>
> This sponsor is a little different from the others we've had...
> they're having a $1000 giveaway!!!!!!
>
> TruckTough.com will enter you into their contest simply for
> filling out a truck survey. I already did.... :-)
>
> Their site features:
>
> Surveys, knowledge, contests, trivia games, and information about
> all brands of full size pickup trucks - You could win $1000 dollars!
> Also: other prizes, sweepstakes, etc.
>
> They can be found at:
>
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.trucktough.com/start.cfm
>
> If you enjoy their site, we would like to you to let them know you
> heard about them via Ford Truck Enthusiasts.
>
> Now returning you to our regularly scheduled program...
>
> Ken Payne
> Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts
>
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- --

- ------------
Mike Sloane
Allamuchy NJ
(msloane

att.net)

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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 06:01:19 -0800 (PST)
From: rokkinhorse

webtv.net
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-list-Electric fuel pump keeps running

Mark,that would be me:-) There isn't only the oil pressure interlock
switch on mine,but a fuel pump relay and inertia switch.If the relay is
stuck,it would continue to run after shutoff,but would have to go
through the oil pressure interlock also. If you have an 89 half ton,it's
going to be controlled through the EEC4.My advice would be to get a
schematic wiring diagram and begin tracing the circuit to the fuel pump
starting at the ignition switch.With the key off,the circuit should be
dead.If it isn't,you just found your problem.

Randy Goolsby,LaCenter,WA.94 Bronco EB 85 F-250 4X4"the Second
Amendment guarantees all the others"
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=47

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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 06:22:30 -0800 (PST)
From: rokkinhorse

webtv.net
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-list- Choice of thermostats

Mike, Personally I think you have too cold a thermostat.For EFI'd
engines,the factory thermostat is around 195 degrees.I will be replacing
mine with a 195-205 degree thermostat soon. The problem the lower
thermostats create is a richer exhaust which to some point the EEC will
try to counteract by leaning it out.The newer "lean-burn" engines need
the higher operating temperatures to run right.Besides,your heater will
work better with the hotter thermostat,kind of a fringe benefit:-)

Randy Goolsby,LaCenter,WA.94 Bronco EB 85 F-250 4X4"the Second
Amendment guarantees all the others"
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=47

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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 06:41:07 -0800 (PST)
From: rokkinhorse

webtv.net
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96- cutting out the computer

Casey,why in the world would you want to do this? Do you know how the
thing even operates on your truck,or is it the fact that if its a
computer,it has to be a piece of unreliable crap? Sure,simplicity is
good,but so is efficiency.Simplicity will not pay you back in fuel
dollars saved,OTOH increased fuel efficiency will.That computer on the
EEC4 & 5 trucks monitors your fuel mixture,engine load, temperatures and
other data continuously every second it is in operation.Not
understanding how something works is not a good reason to throw it in
the garbage IMNSHO.

Randy Goolsby,LaCenter,WA.94 Bronco EB 85 F-250 4X4"the Second
Amendment guarantees all the others"
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=47

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Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 09:10:35 -0600
From: "Rick Wojciechowski"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - One Ford to Another(kinda off topic)

Gang(s),
Yesterday morning while backing my Mustang out of my sloped driveway
I backed my Mustang into my Bronco. Crunched by my brushguard. So with
the 17degrees (Yes even in Alabama) yesterday morning the plastic of the

passenger side rear taillight lense shattered all over the place. I need
to get a
new one. Just called Ford($81.00+tax). Can Anyone help me out. Its
a '92 5.0L LX. Oh it was 11 degrees here this morning, but no more
plastic
all over the place. :-) I checked JCWhitney but all they had in the
catalog
was the blackout taillight lenses. Please contact me directely so's I
don't use up valuable bandwidth on the lists. Any help would be great.

- --
Thanks,
Rick Wojo
'83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
'92 Mstng 5.0L
'95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)

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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 10:03:30 -0500
From: "Michael J. Pasznik, Jr."
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures

I'm all ears too. It'll be nice to be able to tell my father something
he doesn't know for a change. ;-)
And of course, thanks for the info you've already offered up.

- -Mike

- -----Original Message-----
From: Radoje Spasojevic
To: 80-96-list

ford-trucks.com
Date: Monday, January 04, 1999 11:39 PM
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures

I agree with Andre, it is nice to hear from someone who is not one of us
"self-educated" shade tree mechanics...tell us everything there is to know
about thermostats, please.

Rade
- -----Original Message-----
From: Andre Roy
To: 80-96-list

ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 2:14 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures

>S Spaulding wrote:
>>
>> Up until recently, I was Product Engineering Manager for
>> Standard-Thomson Corporation. This company is a part of Stant
>> Corporation, which falls under the Gates Rubber umbrella.
>>
>
>[snip some _very_ intersting stuff]
>
>>
>> If you made it this far, thanks for reading...
>>
>Is that all? More!
>
>Thank you.
>
>--
>Andre, Somewhere ...
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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 10:20:17 -0500
From: "Michael J. Pasznik, Jr."
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats -- Revisited

Listarians,

I braved the weather last night and changed the thermostat back to a
higher temp one, on, well, *everybody's* recommendation. All is now fine
and good, but I'm now back to where I was when I first started the job. The
thing that prompted me to believe that the thermostat was on its way out was
that the temperature gauge would fluctuate a good eighth to a quarter of the
dial constantly. It didn't matter if I was idling, cruising around town, or
on the highway, I could sit there and watch it creep up and then drop back
down every 90 seconds or so. Maybe it's normal and I just never noticed it
before, but I never remember that happening on any other vehicle I've owned.
So I changed the t-stat to the lower temp one and had the same problem,
only it was happening at a lower temp. (duh!) Now I'm back to the normal
temp t-stat and am still seeing the same thing.
So, it's obviously not the thermostat. Would this be considered normal
behavior (the truck's, not mine) or is it a sign of something else on the
verge of going bad?

As always, thanks in advance.

- -Mike

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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 11:17:26 EST
From: FLR150

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures

I agree with Andre and Rade. The more info we can get, the better educated we
"jacklegs" get. I feel like the robot from "Short Circuit" when he says"
INPUT, MORE INPUT."
Wayne
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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 11:17:00 -0500
From: Dave Slotter
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

>Dave Slotter wrote:
>
>> Rick,
>>
>> In an EFI engine, doesn't the computer (EEC-IV) control the choke? If so, I
>> would bet that the computer *does in fact* factor in to this problem and
>> that I should try swapping back in the old (working?) coolant temperature
>> sensor and see if that does the trick. That is easy enough.
>
>Yeah I forgot you had EFI. Ummm, I can only say that thecomputer handles it, I
>just don't know how. Anyone know
>how the EFI handles what the choke's responsibility was ?
>Be kinda nice to know, cause it will help me out with my
>Mustang's EFI.

Rick,

I braved the 4 degree F temperature in Pittsburgh this morning before work
and managed to unplug the wiring plug from the coolant temperature sensor
without breaking it. (I was afraid about applying force to a cold, hence
brittle, object.) I connected it to the old (I think good) coolant
temperature sensor and the truck actually started turning over a bit. I
didn't put the new sensor in place - I'm not that crazy to stay out in the
cold that long - I just let it dangle out of the way of any moving parts.

Since the engine actually turned over somewhat after switching the sensor,
I believe that I have either improved or fixed one of the variables causing
my problem.

When we previously ran a Key On Engine Running (KOER) test on the EEC-IV,
we got a code which said that the EGR valve isn't working properly. We
removed it and cleaned it so that it was able to move better, but we still
get that code.

Is the EGR valve used to control/assist the choke on an EFI engine? It
seems relatively easy to replace on the Bronco, so I plan on replacing it
anyway. I just want to know if it is a possible culprit of this problem.

- -Dave
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 10:20:16 -0600
From: "Baldwin, Dave"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats -- Revisited

Mike,

I had a Pontiac that did this too, so I know what you're talking about.
Some comments from the thermostat expert might be good here, but I know that
there is some difference between the temperature where the t-stat starts to
open and when it is wide open. Also, the t-stat only controls the
temperature at the thermostat itself, so if the temp sender is located in a
different place, you are observing the temperature at a different place in
the engine.

I think you would find quite a lot of variance in coolant temperature at
different places in the engine. Since cooled water comes in at the front
and the hot coolant leaves from the front, it seems that the cylinders at
the rear of the block are likely to be running at higher temperatures than
the fronts since the impedance to flow is higher in those rear cylinders
than in the front. I don't think there is much that you can do to change
this, unless you fill the block with concrete like sleddog does!

Ford has played some tricks with instrumentation, which continues to this
day. People don't like to see fluctuation like you're seeing, so they
"adjust" the characteristics of the gauges so that they have a large "flat
spot" where the needle position doesn't change between something like 160F
and 220F. They employed different circuitry to do this in different models
and different years, and in some it is likely that none of this
"conditioning" was done. I don't know when this practice started, but at
least by the early '90s.

By the way, that Pontiac that I had blew a head gasket at 50K miles. Always
wondered if that temperature cycling had something to do with it...but I'll
never know.

Regards,
Dave Baldwin
Dallas, TX

- -----Original Message-----
From: Michael J. Pasznik, Jr. [mailto:mjp

globespan.net]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 9:20 AM
To: 80-96-list

ford-trucks.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats -- Revisited

Listarians,

I braved the weather last night and changed the thermostat back to a
higher temp one, on, well, *everybody's* recommendation. All is now fine
and good, but I'm now back to where I was when I first started the job. The
thing that prompted me to believe that the thermostat was on its way out was
that the temperature gauge would fluctuate a good eighth to a quarter of the
dial constantly. It didn't matter if I was idling, cruising around town, or
on the highway, I could sit there and watch it creep up and then drop back
down every 90 seconds or so. Maybe it's normal and I just never noticed it
before, but I never remember that happening on any other vehicle I've owned.
So I changed the t-stat to the lower temp one and had the same problem,
only it was happening at a lower temp. (duh!) Now I'm back to the normal
temp t-stat and am still seeing the same thing.
So, it's obviously not the thermostat. Would this be considered normal
behavior (the truck's, not mine) or is it a sign of something else on the
verge of going bad?

As always, thanks in advance.

- -Mike

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 11:29:19 -0500
From: EJ
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: F150 Brakes

dave wrote:

The brakes on this truck seem to be very touchy and grab with not alot
of pressure. They lock up with minimum force. This is a real problem
when driving in the rain or snow!

Has anyone found the cure for this. I haven't yet started examining the
brakes but was looking for ideas on what to be looking for.

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------

Had the same problem on my 92 F-250. My rear axle seals were leaking and
saturating the pads, making the brakes real touchy. I know exactly what
you mean about the rain and snow, i got to the point that the truck
became invisible to me whenever it was wet outside, i would jump in one
of the other cars instead.

I would also think that your ABS would help control that. Make sure you
REALLY DO have ABS. I'm supposed to have ABS on mine, but the previous
owner disconnected it. Did a really good job too(*sarcasm*). The light
still comes on at start up, and goes right out, making everything seem
and appear to be 100 % functional. Course if you climb all the way under
the truck and look up under the frame rails, you see that there is now a
totally useless piece of equippment on the left hand frame rail.
Somebody by-passed the ABS system and set things up like a non ABS
truck. It seems that for the amount of work that had to be done to do
this, they should have just tried to fix the ABS.

EJ(who did'nt climb far enough under the truck he now owns)

- --
"EJ" In Hamilton Township, New Jersey, suburb of Trenton
On digest where availabile, not regular mail
E-Mail: oldsluvr

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

The EEC-IV reads off of 5 or 6 different sensors to decide things like choke
and such. I know that it relies on the coolant temp sensor, the Manifold air
pressure sensor, the Massair sensor (if equipped), the Throttle position
sensor, manifold temperature sensor, and one other I cant think of. But if the
coolant temp sensor is bad it will cause the computer to stay in open (or
closed cant remember which) loop mode and stay with a preset default program
which will keep the timing retarded and keep the mixture way rich. I haven't
been following this thread that closely, but when you do get it started have
you checked your initial timing (without SPOUT) and then your timing (with
SPOUT) in place. It sounds like to me that either the TPS sensor is showing
the wrong signal to the 'puter or that the timing is off and its set way too
far retarded.
Just my . 02,
Wayne Foy
'94 F150 Flareside Supercab
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.aol.com/flr150/auto/index.htm
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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 10:37:34 -0600
From: "Dave Harmier"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Rear Brake Trouble (92 F-150 2WD)

Hi all,

My 92 F-150 S/C 5.0L E4OD at approx. 6400 pounds WILL NOT lock rears!!!
It will slide the fronts to cords (fortunately not the BFG tires I have
THIS time!!!!) and I'd have to guess the rears are NOT pulling their share.

No ABS lights or any other indication. For reference, my dads 87 Ranger has
the VERY touchy when cold syndrom (rears lock EASY) but it takes no time to
have good brakes.

I just adjusted them like a week ago (and haven't had a panic stop since)
Incidently, it stops well, except under duress (and that's NOT good for my
shorts!!!!)

Thanks in Advance!

Dave H.
dharmier

gte.net
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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 11:40:41 EST
From: FLR150

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats -- Revisited

Mike,
Sounds like either the sending unit or the actual temperature sensor itself is
going out. Check those out.
Wayne Foy
"94 F150 Flareside Supercab
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.aol.com/flr150/auto/index.htm
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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 10:53:00 -0600
From: "Baldwin, Dave"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-list-Electric fuel pump keeps running

If your fuel pump doesn't shut off, the relay could be stuck, or, if
controled by the EECIV, the EECIV could have an internal short or harness
short to ground, causing the relay to be continuously energised. I can't
remember if the relay coil is terminated to battery or switched ignition.
If it's terminated to the ignition switch, the relay should open when the
key is turned off, even if the EECIV pump transistor is shorted. Check the
voltages on the relay coil terminals with the key off. If there is no
voltage difference between them, then the relay should be off. Check the
resistance across the relay with it removed from the circuit--it should be
open (infinite resistance reading).

If the relay checks out OK, read the voltage between each relay control
terminal and ground (without the relay in the circuit) with the key off. If
there is battery voltage present on one of the control terminals, then the
ignition switch doesn't control it, and the EECIV has total control. With
the key off, the resistance to ground through the other terminal should be
infinite. If you get a low resistance reading, the EECIV either has an
internal shorted element, or there is a short to ground in the harness
somewhere.

By the way, if there is no indication of which terminals are which on the
relay, you can determine what they are like this: Check the resistance
between all relay terminals with the relay removed from the circuit. You
should find one pair of terminals with a finite resistance reading (my guess
would be 100 to 300 ohms). These are the control terminals. The other pair
should read open (infinite if a normally open type--which this should be).
There meter should also read open from either of the control terminals that
you found earlier to either of the relay switched terminals. If there is a
connection between either of the switched terminals, or either of these and
either of the control terminals, get another relay.

Regards,
Dave Baldwin
Dallas, TX

- -----Original Message-----
From: rokkinhorse

webtv.net [mailto:rokkinhorse

webtv.net]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 8:01 AM
To: 80-96-list

ford-trucks.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: 80-96-list-Electric fuel pump keeps running

Mark,that would be me:-) There isn't only the oil pressure interlock
switch on mine,but a fuel pump relay and inertia switch.If the relay is
stuck,it would continue to run after shutoff,but would have to go
through the oil pressure interlock also. If you have an 89 half ton,it's
going to be controlled through the EEC4.My advice would be to get a
schematic wiring diagram and begin tracing the circuit to the fuel pump
starting at the ignition switch.With the key off,the circuit should be
dead.If it isn't,you just found your problem.

Randy Goolsby,LaCenter,WA.94 Bronco EB 85 F-250 4X4"the Second
Amendment guarantees all the others"
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=47

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 11:57:20 EST
From: FLR150

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: F150 Brakes

In a message dated 1/5/99 11:33:51 AM Eastern Standard Time,
oldsluvr

bellatlantic.net writes:

On digest where available, not regular mail
E-mail: oldsluvr

bellatlantic.net
The "Fleet"
1979 Pontiac "Olds organ donor" Trans Am T-tops Rebuilt Olds 6.6L 403
4bbl-TH350 Performer Cam and Intake.....going into the Calais
For Sale.
1984 Olds Cutlass Calais T-Tops 5.0L 307 4bbl-TH350-2.14 gears K+N.....
soon to be 6.6L 403 4bbl, and hopefully some better "rear" gears
1985 Olds Toronado 5.0L 307 4bbl-AOD (newly acquired Sept. 98).
1992 Lincoln Mark VII LSC Moonroof 5.0L 302 EFI HO-AOD-3.27 gears
inner fender baffle removed-K+N.
1992 Ford F-250 Reg-Cab 4WD 7.5L 460 EFI-E4OD Auto-3.55 gears.
3-inch converter-dual outlet flowmasters 3 chamber.
Complete K+N(no more factory air-box)-ADS Super Chip-Spitfires-Accel
Super Coil-Cap-Rotor & 8.8 wires.
1994 Toyota Camry Sedan 4-banger-(Wow we could have had a V6!)-"mili-
liter"-AOD. K+N (why did I even bother, still a slug)!
My SO's rider >>
..............................................................................
.............................................And I thought Rick had a long
Signature set....JEEZ! J/K =)
Wayne Foy
'94 Flareside Supercab
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.aol.com/flr150/auto/index.htm
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 12:11:42 -0500
From: EJ
Subject: FTE 80-96 - FTE 80-96 Re: Choice of thermostats, exhaust and performance chips

"Michael J. Pasznik, Jr." wrote:

I replaced the stock thermostat with a much cooler one (160
degrees).
It's something I've always done on my vehicles, figuring that the cooler
an engine runs the better, as long as the heater still works. I haven't
experienced any problems so far, but was wondering if running the engine
that cool will have any negative effects on performance.

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well i can most certainly say it did for me. I put a "chip" in my truck
and it came with a 160 t-stat. It was recommended to use the 160 for
maximum performance gains. Well, i don't know what other people have
experienced, but it threw my truck into a "check engine" nightmare. I
was thinking the t-stat was the blame. I had some other unrelated work
to be done to the truck(axle seals, 4x4 linkage), so when it was at the
dealership, i mentioned what i thought about the t-stat. They pretty
much confirmed what i said, and found about a half-dozen codes stored in
the computer, all of which they said were probably related to the fact
the engine was'nt geting up to normal operating temp . Now with a 195
t-stat in there, things have been fine. Just to let you know how cool
the truck was running, when the 160 t-stat was in there, it was summer
time. Driving with the air conditioner on, on a sunny day would only
bring the temp gauge up to "n" for "normal". When parked and idling for
extended periods with the air conditioner on, same conditions, the most
it would climb up to was between "o" and "r" on the gauge.

Sidebar..

sorry got to run, need to combine this into one post.......

Did'nt someone with a 92 up F series w/a 460 ask awhile back about
exhaust and performance chips ?

I was meaning to send some sort of reply, but I think i deleted the
original post.

EJ

- --
"EJ" In Hamilton Township, New Jersey, suburb of Trenton
On digest where availabile, not regular mail
E-Mail: oldsluvr

daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - T'stats

John Spaulding writes: >>Up until recently, I was Product Engineering
Manager for
Standard-Thomson Corporation. This company is a part of Stant
Corporation, which falls under the Gates Rubber umbrella.

STC is the largest manufacturer of thermostats in the world. We supply
Original Equipment and OE Service thermostats to Ford, GM, DDC, Mack,
Caterpillar, etc. Our engineers work directly with their engineers. We
also supply Stant, Gates, NAPA, Carquest, and many other aftermarket
labels.

Yo John. I have a question for you and hope I don't Tee off anyone for the
Non-FOMOCO references. I work for DaimlerChrysler and of course drive
Chrysler cars/trucks. My 1st love however is, and will always remain,
Ford trucks of the '73-'79 years. My question to you has to do with the
MOPAR's. Lately I usually buy T'stats from AutoZone - Carport - or
whatever is cheaper, but am having some very serious thoughts about going
another route. The last T'stat I bought was just last week for a '90
Dakota. I purchased a Brass one because the cheap aluminum ones seem to
last only a year or so and usually stick in the open position. They
usually cost only a couple of bucks, and I gave nearly $10 for the Brass
one. Do you have an opinion as to why the cheaper versions as sold by
AutoZone - Carport etc., do not last. Seems like back in the 50's and 60's
the t'stats lasted forever in relation to todays. Are the more expensive
T'stats worth it, and why?? I guess I've rambled enough.

TIA.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 12:30:08 -0500
From: Dave Slotter
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

>The EEC-IV reads off of 5 or 6 different sensors to decide things like choke
>and such. I know that it relies on the coolant temp sensor, the Manifold air
>pressure sensor, the Massair sensor (if equipped), the Throttle position
>sensor, manifold temperature sensor, and one other I cant think of. But if the
>coolant temp sensor is bad it will cause the computer to stay in open (or
>closed cant remember which) loop mode and stay with a preset default program
>which will keep the timing retarded and keep the mixture way rich. I haven't
>been following this thread that closely, but when you do get it started have
>you checked your initial timing (without SPOUT) and then your timing (with
>SPOUT) in place. It sounds like to me that either the TPS sensor is showing
>the wrong signal to the 'puter or that the timing is off and its set way too
>far retarded.
>Just my . 02,
>Wayne Foy
>'94 F150 Flareside Supercab
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.aol.com/flr150/auto/index.htm

Well, coolant temperature sensor was swapped this morning. MAP sensor was
recently replaced and new one is known good. Is the Air Charge Temperature
(ACT) sensor the same as the Massair sensor? Well, our new ACT sensor is
known good. TPS sensor was bad and has been replaced. I also confirmed the
new one is good and the computer agrees.

I recently reset timing with SPOUT disconnected back to 10 degrees BTDC and
found that the base timing was really off - it was about 2-4 degrees ATDC!
That was also causing starting problems. Fixing that got us up to 25 mpg
which was really sweet!

I have not looked at the timing with the SPOUT in place.

I'm going to pick up a new EGR valve tonight and replace it and then pray
that this fixes the problem. But I'm still open for suggestions. I'm going
to have to read up on how the choke works on an EFI engine. I have very
little info on how exactly the carburetor has been replaced on EFI vehicles.

Just a thought - the gas tank is half empty (or half full depending on how
you look at it). Could things be icing up in there if there is water in the
fuel? I recently added fuel injector cleaner in the hopes that this would
clean the injectors - thought that dirty injectors was causing starting
problems - would this cleaner remove water from the fuel?

Thanks again everyone for your help. I hope to have this problem licked soon.

- -Dave
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 10:32:28 -0700
From: "Gerald L. Hinkle Jr. CPA"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Stuck in Park!

Hello list folks, I just returned from a real nice holiday weekend of
camping and off roading at the Buttercup Sand Dunes not to far from my home
in Yuma, AZ. Unfortunately, on the last day I woke up to a pickup that
would not let me pull it out of Park. The truck ran just fine the night
before. When I tried to move it the next day an EBS warning light began
flashing when I started the truck, but then I could not get the truck out
of park, and yes I had my foot pressing down on the brake pedal! Finally,
I was able to fiddle with the key while the truck was not running, and get
the truck into neutral, then I could start the truck and put it in gear and
go, but if I put it back in park, the problem started all over again. Can
anyone tell me what could have happened? It was real sandy at the dunes
with a slight breeze strong enough at times to blow the sand around.
Another thing that might be involved is the fact that my brake booster is
in the process of going bad. I know this because when I hit the brakes I
can hear air leaking (pssst). Had this problem on a 1990 Bronco which was
cured by replacing the booster. Any ideas you guys can come up with will
be appreciated. For starters I plan on replacing the booster. I am a
digest subscriber. My truck is a 1994 F-350 Crew Cab 4x4 with a 351 V8.
Thanks!

Jerry Hinkle Jr. CPA

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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 11:59:44 -0600
From: "Jachim, Jeff"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Stuck in Park!

Check the fuse for the brake lights. My buddies truck had
the same problem after we pulled his boat out of the water.
The trans wanted a signal from the brakes that they were
applied before it was shifted into gear and with that fuse
blown it wasn't getting the signal. He has an F-150 so I don't
know if the trans/electrical system is the same, but the
symptoms sound sound almost identical(ABS light and not
shifting into gear)
Hope this helps!

Jeff

> -----Original Message-----
> From:Gerald L. Hinkle Jr. CPA [SMTP:2hinkles

sprynet.com]
> Sent:Tuesday, January 05, 1999 11:32 AM
> To:Ford Trucks
> Subject:FTE 80-96 - Stuck in Park!
>
> Hello list folks, I just returned from a real nice holiday weekend of
> camping and off roading at the Buttercup Sand Dunes not to far from my
> home
> in Yuma, AZ. Unfortunately, on the last day I woke up to a pickup
> that
> would not let me pull it out of Park. The truck ran just fine the
> night
> before. When I tried to move it the next day an EBS warning light
> began
> flashing when I started the truck, but then I could not get the truck
> out
> of park, and yes I had my foot pressing down on the brake pedal!
> Finally,
> I was able to fiddle with the key while the truck was not running, and
> get
> the truck into neutral, then I could start the truck and put it in
> gear and
> go, but if I put it back in park, the problem started all over again.
> Can
> anyone tell me what could have happened? It was real sandy at the
> dunes
> with a slight breeze strong enough at times to blow the sand around.
> Another thing that might be involved is the fact that my brake booster
> is
> in the process of going bad. I know this because when I hit the
> brakes I
> can hear air leaking (pssst). Had this problem on a 1990 Bronco which
> was
> cured by replacing the booster. Any ideas you guys can come up with
> will
> be appreciated. For starters I plan on replacing the booster. I am a
> digest subscriber. My truck is a 1994 F-350 Crew Cab 4x4 with a 351
> V8.
> Thanks!
>
> Jerry Hinkle Jr. CPA
>
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 13:11:36 -0500
From: "Robert Hackney"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - 3g alternator

Hi folks,
I'm considering swapping out the stock alternator in my 89 f250
and replacing it with a 3g 130 amp unit. The question I have for the =
group
is , has anyone done business with AIS - Alternator Supply and Research
in Van Nuys, CA? They quoted a great price for a new unit, almost to good
to believe.=20
Thanks,
Bob

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 13:22:31 -0500
From: Garr&Pam
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - FTE 80-96 Re: Choice of thermostats, exhaust and performance chips

EJ wrote:
>
> "Michael J. Pasznik, Jr." wrote:
>
> I replaced the stock thermostat with a much cooler one (160
> degrees).
> It's something I've always done on my vehicles, figuring that the cooler
> an engine runs the better, as long as the heater still works. I haven't
> experienced any problems so far, but was wondering if running the engine
> that cool will have any negative effects on performance.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Well i can most certainly say it did for me. I put a "chip" in my truck
> and it came with a 160 t-stat. It was recommended to use the 160 for
> maximum performance gains. Well, i don't know what other people have
> experienced, but it threw my truck into a "check engine" nightmare. I
> was thinking the t-stat was the blame. I had some other unrelated work
> to be done to the truck(axle seals, 4x4 linkage), so when it was at the
> dealership, i mentioned what i thought about the t-stat. They pretty
> much confirmed what i said, and found about a half-dozen codes stored in
> the computer, all of which they said were probably related to the fact
> the engine was'nt geting up to normal operating temp . Now with a 195
> t-stat in there, things have been fine. Just to let you know how cool
> the truck was running, when the 160 t-stat was in there, it was summer
> time. Driving with the air conditioner on, on a sunny day would only
> bring the temp gauge up to "n" for "normal". When parked and idling for
> extended periods with the air conditioner on, same conditions, the most
> it would climb up to was between "o" and "r" on the gauge.
>
> Sidebar..
>
> sorry got to run, need to combine this into one post.......
>
> Did'nt someone with a 92 up F series w/a 460 ask awhile back about
> exhaust and performance chips ?
>
> I was meaning to send some sort of reply, but I think i deleted the
> original post.
>
> EJ
>
> --
> "EJ" In Hamilton Township, New Jersey, suburb of Trenton
> On digest where availabile, not regular mail
> E-Mail: oldsluvr

bellatlantic.net
> The "Fleet"
> 1979 Pontiac "Olds organ donor" Trans Am T-tops Rebuilt Olds 6.6L 403
> 4bbl-TH350 Performer Cam and Intake.....going into the Calais
> For Sale.
> 1984 Olds Cutlass Calais T-Tops 5.0L 307 4bbl-TH350-2.14 gears K+N.....
> soon to be 6.6L 403 4bbl, and hopefully some better "rear" gears
> 1985 Olds Toronado 5.0L 307 4bbl-AOD(newly acquired Sept. 98).
> 1992 Lincoln Mark VII LSC Moonroof 5.0L 302 EFI HO-AOD-3.27 gears
> inner fender baffle removed-K+N.
> 1992 Ford F-250 Reg-Cab 4WD 7.5L 460 EFI-E4OD Auto-3.55 gears.
> 3-inch converter-dual outlet flowmaster 3 chamber.
> Complete K+N(no more factory air-box)-ADS Super Chip-Spitfires-
> Accel Super Coil-Cap-Rotor & 8.8 wires.
> 1994 Toyota Camry Sedan 4-banger-(Wow we could have had a V6!)-"mili
> -liter"-AOD. K+N (why did I even bother, still a slug!)
> My SO's rider
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

The computer chips bump your timing up and one to reduce detonation is
to run a coller thermostat...180 is good...160 is too cool! The extra
perforamnce gain is from the increased timing.
Chris
94 Lightning #381 (for sale)
NLOC #238
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 10:55:10 PST
From: "Casey Vandor"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - re: Tailight problem

When I put my hitch on, I couldn't find a ground on mine either I just
drilled a hole into the frame and cleaned it up good, then put my own
in.

Casey

>>>>>>>>>>
Could anybody give me a pointer as to where the ground for the
tailights is? I tried reading the schematics in my Haynes manual, but
I just cannot follow them. I also tried following the wires, but I do
not find a ground to the frame, the whole wire bundle is tied in
plastic, and goes right into the framerail, joining the rear tank fuel
lines.

______________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 14:19:11 -0600
From: "Baldwin, Dave"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

- -----Original Message-----
From: Dave Slotter [mailto:dave

slotter.org]
Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 11:30 AM
To: 80-96-list

ford-trucks.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

> Is the Air Charge Temperature (ACT) sensor the same as the Massair sensor?

No. It measures the temperature of the incoming air. From this, the
manifold pressure, and engine speed, the controller calculates the mass of
air being taken in, and then provides the appropriate amount of fuel.

This is different than a system with a dedicated mass air sensor. The mass
air sensor provides a signal to the controller that is directly proportional
to the amount of air taken in. Since it is on the upstream side of the
throttle, it is less sensitive to engine modifications (cams with aggressive
timing, etc.) which can disrupt the manifold pressure signal in a
"speed-density" control system.

> I'm going to have to read up on how the choke works on an EFI engine. I
have very
> little info on how exactly the carburetor has been replaced on EFI
vehicles.

Actually, there is no "choke" on an EFI engine. The purpose of the choke on
a carburetor is to allow more vaccuum signal at the venturi to meter more
fuel. On the EFI engine, the fuel is injected under pressure, and therefore
the controller provides a richer mixture until the engine warms up.

Regards,
Dave Baldwin
Dallas, TX
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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 15:25:11 -0500
From: "David Butts"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re: Rear Brake Trouble (92 F-150 2WD)

You can install F250 Cylinders to get a little extra braking power from the
rear. While you are in there, replace the pads, and springs. As longs as
the drums are smooth, you can get away real cheap, and have OK brakes in the
rear, but they never will be great unless you convert to disks.

BTW when was the last time you changed the brake fluid? That can be easily
overlooked, and make a big difference in braking power.

Good Luck.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Dave Harmier
To: 80-96-list

ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 2:19 PM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Rear Brake Trouble (92 F-150 2WD)

>Hi all,
>
>My 92 F-150 S/C 5.0L E4OD at approx. 6400 pounds WILL NOT lock rears!!!
>It will slide the fronts to cords (fortunately not the BFG tires I have
>THIS time!!!!) and I'd have to guess the rears are NOT pulling their share.
>
>No ABS lights or any other indication. For reference, my dads 87 Ranger has
>the VERY touchy when cold syndrom (rears lock EASY) but it takes no time to
>have good brakes.
>
>I just adjusted them like a week ago (and haven't had a panic stop since)
>Incidently, it stops well, except under duress (and that's NOT good for my
>shorts!!!!)
>
>Thanks in Advance!
>
>Dave H.
>dharmier

gte.net
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 14:40:27 -0600
From: "Rick Wojciechowski"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Mile Marker Hubs

Gang(s),
Just to let you know. Over the X-mas holidays I went
over to my Dad's to help him work on his '81 bronco. I repacked
the bearings while he changed his drivers side radius arm bushing.
While I was doing the bearings I noticed his passenger side
hub gears were shot. So's we called around and no junkyards
were open and no parts stores EXCEPT AutoZone. And to our
amazement they sell the MileMarker hubs. I told Dad that was a
pretty descent brand. They sold him the medium duty set. Don't
know if thats what they thought he should use or if thats the only
grade they sell. At any rate we didn't realize this until we got back to

his house. Anyways there is supposed to be three grades Light,
medium, and Heavy duty. Who the hell would use light duty hubs.
Anyways, I put them in and Dad was wheeling that afternoon.
So, I didn't know AutoZone even knew what a hub was. Just thought
I would pass on the info, incase you all ever get in a pinch and
need new hubs on a spare of the moment like Dad did. Oh, these
medium grade hubs at AutoZone costed Dad $67.00. They are a
little different than the warns but not much.
- --
Thanks,
Rick Wojo
'83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
'92 Mstng 5.0L
'95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)

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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 16:47:07 EST
From: JSC721

aol.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - EGR Probs & ANTIFREEZE Odor

Hello Ford Truck Brothers,
I am out of ideas, and need your help. 89 e-250 , 300 6 cyl 4.9 engine.I am
getting a rough starting and idle ,comes and goes and an eye burning exhaust
smell.

When I run the engine in diagnostic mode I get a code 33 ( egr valve opening
undetected) and a code 44 ( thermactor air system inoperative , right side)
I checked the valve lubricated it and it works fine. I replaced the evp sensor
on the valve, due to another code telling me it was bad. Now, I get no vacuum
at all from the
tube that goes to the egr valve.even at operating temp.

There is a egr vacuum solenoid that is part of the vacuum system , can this
part be bad? Also I am getting a bad antifreeze odor. no leaks anywhere.new
heater core also. when I turn off the engine i hear the anifreeze in the fill
bottle bubbling.any ideas guys. Thanks for your help.

p.s. also new 02 sensor, coolant sensor, waterpump,thermostat,full tune
up,fuel filter.radiator 2 years old.

Joe JSC721
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 16:47:38 -0500
From: "PmctBaker"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - why now? and hotter temps.

hey all

first I want to thank mike reddon, for everything he did in getting me the
stock carb. I needed. thanks mike. and earl too. dont know where id be
without this list. and all the fine folk on it.

I drive a 1985 f-150 351 4bbl C-6 4x4
today the temps are single digit, and the engine didn't want to fire. I
guess the new carb I put on out of the box needs tuning, and the battery.
was real low on charge too. so im not to worried about that. ive got a
friend who has a 78 f-250 that owes me a ton of jump starts.
but im more worried about the coolant leaks I spotted while I was under the
hood. one leak is on the top trans. cooling line bung, on the radiator.
is the bung braised on or is it threaded? it dosent leak when the engine
is warm, or its warm out. the other one is the cheap hose clamp I bought,
and have now replaced.
is it cold enough for coolant to leak past the trans. coolant line bung
threads on the radiator? the line connections and bung are different metals
than the radiator. Teflon tape? rebraize?

Re: thermostats

ive learned that a hotter running engine is a more efficient burning engine.
the EGR valve, cat converter, the air diverter valve, etc.. help to burn
the byproducts of the chemical reaction that is left over after combustion.
( the stuff that doesn't.ignite all the way in the combustion chamber after
firing). hotter temps. make the burning off of these byproducts more
efficient. and when fresh air is introduced into the exhaust stream by the
diverter valve, it causes the unburnt byproducts to undergo a chemical
reaction, and change into harmless breathable chemicals. cat converters
help the burning process even more. so what comes out the tail pipe is lsnt
raw chemicals, but harmless. this second burn (if you will )actually lowers
combustion chamber temps. which decreases engine knock and ping under loads.
in theory anyway. and its supposed to keep carbon from building up
inside the engine so fast too. longer engine life is the result. so id
use whatever t-stat the book says, and taking into consideration the
climate, I might go a few degrees one way or the other.
and thats my opinion, right or wrong. and if im wrong, id rather be
right.

mike

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Date: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 14:57:32 -0700
From: "Brian Soderblom"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - 3g alternator

How much are they asking?

> Hi folks,
> I'm considering swapping out the stock alternator in my 89 f250
> and replacing it with a 3g 130 amp unit. The question I have for
> the group
> is , has anyone done business with AIS - Alternator Supply and Research
> in Van Nuys, CA? They quoted a great price for a new unit, almost to good
> to believe.
> Thanks,
> Bob
>
> =FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 16:12:06 -0600
From: "Rick Wojciechowski"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - 1994 Explorer Automatic Hub Problem

Paul Siebert wrote:

> I have a Hayes manual for the vehicle, but it does not go into the
> mechanics of the automatic hubs. I have taken the hub apart but cannot
> figure out the problem, mainly because I don't know how they are suppose to
> work.

Paul, Let me explain from a manual hub perspective first. When you lock the
manual hubs in and put the xfercase in 4low or hi then you are sending
power to front axle via the front driveshaft. what the hubs do is
lock the wheels in to make use of the power of the front driveshaft to the
front axle. If you were to lock the hubs in, but not engage the xfercase
then the front axle would rotate with the front wheels. There simply
would be no power to them until you engaged the xfercase. So when
turning the manual hubs, you engage the rotor to the hub gears to the
axle shaft to the front driveshaft.
Now the auto hubs have to work in some simular manner. They may
engage from the inside out, as opposed to the manuls outside in.
Not sure, I have never taken an automatic hub apart before. In any event
they have to lock the wheels in with the power of the front axle.

Also, let me warn you. It took me 8 months to figure out why I was
getting a loud vibrational popping I could feel through the accelerator.
Well it turned out to be that the Haynes manual had a bad picture.
They were showing me to put in the center hub gear backwards.
So the popping was that only half the tooth was getting contact
so when I would use the 4wd the gear would keep popping off.
What I am trying to say is to watch how things go together. This
is the manual for my Bronco. So maybe your version is corrected.

- --
Thanks,
Rick Wojo
'83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
'92 Mstng 5.0L
'95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 15:53:46 -0700
From: "Brad Shell"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Bad Pads

Greetings all; Just bought a 96 F150 4x4 from a dealer here in AZ. I
had Metal Valve stems put in all four rims. When looking at the front
brake Pads, the pads are concave. Meaning that both ends that should be
in contact with the disk are worn down approximately 1 inch from end to
....

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