80-96-list-digest Tuesday, January 5 1999 Volume 02 : Number 437



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980-1996 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 80-96 - Electronic fuel pump
Re: FTE 80-96 - Straight-six
FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats
FTE 80-96 - RE: 1995 F-150 4x4
FTE 80-96 - RE: Taillight problem
RE: FTE 80-96 - Re: Clutch Hydraulics & Cold Weather
Re: FTE 80-96 - Electronic fuel pump
Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats
Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re:Taillight problem...
Re: FTE 80-96 - Re:Taillight problem...
Re: FTE 80-96 - Taillight problem
Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats
FTE 80-96 - Re: Computer removal
Re: FTE 80-96 - Gauge Cluster Help
Re: FTE 80-96 - Taillight problem
Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats
FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats
FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hub squeak
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
Re: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures
Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures
Re: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hub squeak
FTE 80-96 - ADMIN: TruckTough.com
FTE 80-96 - Re: Computer removal
Re: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes
Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures
Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II
Re: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes

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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 09:08:56 -0500
From: Mark_Halpain ingerrand.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Electronic fuel pump

Is it me or does it appear to be the cold weather that makes
mechanical things go bad? What ever the reason just wanted to let
everyone know how much I appreciate the help. The knowledge that I
gain from all of you adds to my confidence when talking to mechanics
in this area. Some of them actually believe I know what I'm talking
about.
I read in an earlier posting where someone did a top end job and found
an electrical switch on the top back of the engine. This switch was
related to the external fuel pump. I don't know if this switch is part
of my problem or not. When I shut the truck off my external fuel pump
keeps running. I have to pull the positive cable off the battery to
stop it. The truck is an 89 f150 w/302.
If the relay is bad this fuel pump wouldn't run at all right?

Mark Halpain
email: mark_halpain ingerrand.com


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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 10:55:38 -0500
From: "Matt Fitzsimmons"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Straight-six

- -----Original Message-----
From: SpyderLv81 aol.com
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Date: January 4, 1999 3:22 AM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Straight-six


>Has anyone ever cut the computer out of a 80's truck? I was thinking of
>cutting the computer out of my truck. Whats everyone think? Will it still
>pass smog? Will it run better? I plan on putting that 4 barrel carb on so
>none of the sensors hook up. Any thoughts would be appreciated. By the
way
>this is the straight six if you didn't read the title. Thanks.

It's hard to beat the factory intake and fuel metering on the injected 300"
6. There's very little chance the truck will pass a smog test with a carb.
And it will take a lot of tweaking to get it to run better. You're better
off investing you money in a good tune-up and maybe free flowing filters and
exhaust.

Matt
"nothing is impossible, difficult just costs more"

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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 11:01:34 -0500
From: "Michael J. Pasznik, Jr."
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats

In the middle of this cold spell we've been having my thermostat decided
to act up. How convenient of it! I changed it before it had a chance to
cause any problems, so now that it's done, I'll ask what I should have asked
beforehand.
I replaced the stock thermostat with a much cooler one (160 degrees).
It's something I've always done on my vehicles, figuring that the cooler an
engine runs the better, as long as the heater still works. I haven't
experienced any problems so far, but was wondering if running the engine
that cool will have any negative effects on performance.
Back in the days when a car was a car and not a computer it didn't mess
anything up, but I'm not sure if the computer might set something based on
the engine running too cool.
It's a '95 with the 302.

Thanks in advance!

- -Mike


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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 09:06:37 -0700
From: "Smeins, Larry"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - RE: 1995 F-150 4x4

Judging from the prices in my area, Colorado, the price is right. A friend
just bought a 93 XL 6 5 peed with 78K for $13,000. At 95K miles you
probably will need some minor repairs but the truck itself should be good
for another 100K. The most likely high cost problem area is the
transmission. Check out its operation well before putting down your money.
For comparison: I bought a 95 F-150 XL, with 4.9l six and five speed, 4x4 LB
in April, 98, for $10,000. It had 100,000 miles on it. Repairs since
purchase include: serpentine belt and idler, starter, battery, front wheel
bearings, universal joint, and tires. I'd consider this normnal for the
mileage and price I paid.

A F-150 with 351 should be able to handle a two horse, no tack room, horse
trailer with two 15 to 15 1/2 hand horses. Horse trailers tend to tow much
better than travel trailers of comparable weight. For towing a trailer this
size the truck should have the towing package and an additional transmission
cooler. If it doesn't have a towing package You might want to pass on the
truck or plan on considerable modification.

Larry

> -----Original Message-----
> From:owner-80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com
> [SMTP:owner-80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com]
> Sent:Friday, January 01, 1999 4:10 AM
> To:80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com
> Subject:80-96-list-digest V2 #433
>
>
>
> Date: 31 Dec 1998 20:37:23 -0500
> From: Andrew Krein
> Subject: FTE 80-96 - 1995 F150 4x4
>
> I'm new to this list and am in need of some information from those
> with more experience with Ford Trucks than I have.
>
> A small used car lot that mostly deals with pickups has a 1995 F150
> for sale. It's a long bed, regular cab, 4x4 XL (I think it's an XL)
> with a 351 v-8 and 4 speed automatic. It's a very stripped down
> truck, not many frills and they're asking $9995 for it.. It has
> about
> 95k miles and looks to be in good condition. At least cosmetically.
> Well kept interior and it started up quickly and idled smoothly, but
> I
> haven't had time to take it for a test ride or crawl around it yet.
> I'm looking for something to do some medium duty towing someday, the
> wife would like horses. Right now it's main purpose would be for
> some
> hauling and foul weather driving.
>
>
>
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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 09:24:26 -0700
From: "Smeins, Larry"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - RE: Taillight problem

Sounds to me like you lost a ground for the rear lights. Look for a
ground wire, from the bundle you connected the adapter into, that ties to
the frame. I suspect there is one and it broke when you were working with
the bundle.

Larry

> -----Original Message-----
> From:owner-80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com
> [SMTP:owner-80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com]
> Sent:Sunday, January 03, 1999 4:10 AM
> To:80-96-list-digest ford-trucks.com
> Subject:80-96-list-digest V2 #435
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 07:59:57 -0800 (PST)
> From: Brent McNabb
> Subject: FTE 80-96 - Taillight problem...
>
> I have a problem that recently developed with my '96 F-150. I was
> helping a friend move some of his cars, we were going to rent a U-Haul
> full-car trailer, which needed a trailer light connector. Not having
> towed anything with my truck, I went to the local auto parts store and
> purchased a Hoppy trailer adaptor, which you just disconnect the
> vehicle's wiring harness, which sits right underneath the rear edge of
> the truck bed, and connect a T-connector, with a flat, four-pin light
> connector. All went well, disconnected the battery, cleaned and
> greased all the connections, and then
> drilled a hole in the frame for the connector ground. Reconnected the
> battery, and no turn signals or tailights. After a few tries they
> both worked, although quite dim. Never hooked up the trailer, and
> disconnected the T-connector, but the problem still remains, and has
> gotten worse. Now, when the turn signals are used, not only the
> correct tailight flashes, but they all do. For example, push the
> lever down for a left-hand turn, and the left-hand light flashes, but
> so do the right-hand light, and the license plate light. The parking
> lights do not work all the time. All other lights work fine.
> Replaced flasher and fuse, no help. Anybody have any suggestions? I
> called Hoppy, and they said to get it repaired, and send them the
> bill, but I'd rather do this myself, don't really like anybody
> working on my truck, 210,000 miles and still going.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 10:43:04 -0600
From: "Baldwin, Dave"
Subject: RE: FTE 80-96 - Re: Clutch Hydraulics & Cold Weather

Mark,

Does the non-synchro reverse grind when you engage at a stop? Try getting
into any forward gear, and then (without letting the clutch engage) moving
the shifter to reverse. The forward gear synchro will (should) stop the
geartrain, and if the clutch is fully disengaged, it should not start
spinning again. You should have a "crunch"-free transition into reverse.

If you engage any forward gear, and then get crunching going into reverse,
then I'd agree that you have a clutch disengagement problem. If it doesn't,
then it may be a cold weather lube viscosity problem.

I had the clutch disengagement problem (but not on a Ford), and it got worse
in warmer weather.


- -----Original Message-----
From: msalvetti [mailto:msalvetti mediaone.net]
Sent: Sunday, January 03, 1999 6:48 PM
To: Ford Trucks 80-96
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Clutch Hydraulics & Cold Weather


Thanks to those that offered advice about my cold-weather gear engagement
problem. I'm pretty sure this is not transmission related. I have Mobil 1
synthetic in there, and the problem persists even when the transmission is
warm.

I have a hard time engaging first at a stop, and sometimes 3rd crunches a
little. To me the clutch isn't fully disengaging, and I'm just going to
take it as a sign that I have to adjust the linkage again. Just seemed
more than a coincidence that this would only have to be done when the
weather turned very cold.

Thanks again,

Mark Salvetti
1986 F150
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Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 12:17:07 -0500
From: Andre Roy
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Electronic fuel pump

Mark_Halpain ingerrand.com wrote:
>
> Is it me or does it appear to be the cold weather that makes
> mechanical things go bad?
>
It's you. Actually, bad mechanical devices cause cold weather. Before
mechanical devices were invented, there was no such thing as winter ;-)


> .... Some of them actually believe I know what I'm talking
> about.
>
That's the impression I try and make :)

> I read in an earlier posting where someone did a top end job and found
> an electrical switch on the top back of the engine. This switch was
> related to the external fuel pump. I don't know if this switch is part
> of my problem or not. When I shut the truck off my external fuel pump
> keeps running. I have to pull the positive cable off the battery to
> stop it. The truck is an 89 f150 w/302.
> If the relay is bad this fuel pump wouldn't run at all right?
>
Depends if the relay fais open or closed. It's possible, I suppose for a
relay to fail in the "on" mode. Try an ohm meter to see if that's the
case. Could be some moisture got into the can and froze. If that's the
case, replace it, it should be cheap.

- --
Andre
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 12:20:23 -0500
From: Andre Roy
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats

"Michael J. Pasznik, Jr." wrote:
>
> In the middle of this cold spell we've been having my thermostat decided
> to act up. How convenient of it!
>
Of course.

> I replaced the stock thermostat with a much cooler one (160 degrees).
> It's something I've always done on my vehicles, figuring that the cooler an
> engine runs the better,
>
Debatable. A cooler running engine will generally (all things being
equal and all that) use more fuel and produce less power. That's with
hotter and cooler being in the realm of reasonable.

> Back in the days when a car was a car and not a computer it didn't mess
> anything up, but I'm not sure if the computer might set something based on
> the engine running too cool.
>
Depends. The computer will most likely be running in open loop mode for
longer, if not all the time. That will raise emmission and fuel
consumption and reduce power.
If it's cool enough, the computer might think that the engine is never
reachin proper temperature (because it isn't, really) and stay in open
loop all the time.

- --
Andre
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Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 12:31:04 -0500
From: Mike Sloane
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats

Actually, it is just the opposite: the hotter an internal combustion engine can
operate without overheating the coolant or cooking the lubricant, the more
efficient it will run. Modern pressurized systems are usually designed to run at
190 or 195 degrees (F). With a 160 degree thermostat, your engine will never
warm up properly, and your mileage will be poor.

Mike

Michael J. Pasznik, Jr. wrote:

> In the middle of this cold spell we've been having my thermostat decided
> to act up. How convenient of it! I changed it before it had a chance to
> cause any problems, so now that it's done, I'll ask what I should have asked
> beforehand.
> I replaced the stock thermostat with a much cooler one (160 degrees).
> It's something I've always done on my vehicles, figuring that the cooler an
> engine runs the better, as long as the heater still works. I haven't
> experienced any problems so far, but was wondering if running the engine
> that cool will have any negative effects on performance.
> Back in the days when a car was a car and not a computer it didn't mess
> anything up, but I'm not sure if the computer might set something based on
> the engine running too cool.
> It's a '95 with the 302.
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> -Mike
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



- --

- ------------
Mike Sloane
Allamuchy NJ
(msloane att.net)



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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 09:42:57 -0800 (PST)
From: Brent McNabb
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re:Taillight problem...

- ---BFunk33 aol.com wrote:

> This is the classic bad ground scenario. Check the ground very
carefully.

Could anybody give me a pointer as to where the ground for the
tailights is? I tried reading the schematics in my Haynes manual, but
I just cannot follow them. I also tried following the wires, but I do
not find a ground to the frame, the whole wire bundle is tied in
plastic, and goes right into the framerail, joining the rear tank fuel
lines.
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?

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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 09:42:57 -0800 (PST)
From: Brent McNabb
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Re:Taillight problem...

- ---BFunk33 aol.com wrote:

> This is the classic bad ground scenario. Check the ground very
carefully.

Could anybody give me a pointer as to where the ground for the
tailights is? I tried reading the schematics in my Haynes manual, but
I just cannot follow them. I also tried following the wires, but I do
not find a ground to the frame, the whole wire bundle is tied in
plastic, and goes right into the framerail, joining the rear tank fuel
lines.
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?

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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 09:47:25 -0800 (PST)
From: Brent McNabb
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Taillight problem

- ---=?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rnar?= Huse wrote:
>
> Brent wrote:
> -Now, when the turn signals are used, not only the
> -correct tailight flashes, but they all do.
>
> This usually has one of two causes; 1) your grease/paste conducts
> electricity in the plug/harness. Not all greases have zero
conductivity.
> Try removing all the grease, replug and test.
> 2) Your connectors or the ground wire may not be all the way in or
well
> connected. Have had this happen to a couple of my sedans. (Popular
> science mode on): The electricity comes through the blinker lead and
> tries to find ground through all the bulbs in the back.(Popular
science
> mode off). Find the offending non-connecting ground connection (!) and
> use appropriate force, such as a BFH (big french(?) hammer)....

Interesting. I'm new to all this electrical diagnosis, so sorry if I
ask too many questions, but are all the bulbs suppost to ground? If
so, how can I find out which one isn't grounding? About the only
thing I have in the way of electrical equipment is my multimeter.
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?

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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 12:47:59 EST
From: FLR150 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats

Mike wrote: I replaced the stock thermostat with a much cooler one (160
degrees).
It's something I've always done on my vehicles, figuring that the cooler an
engine runs the better, as long as the heater still works.

Mike,
And the heater on your 95 5.0 still works with a 160 t stat in there? Well,
first of all, one of the main readings the EEC-IV makes is of temp. When the
temp is too low it causes the computer to go into an open loop mode which will
make it a back off the timing and richens the mixture, hence poor performance.
With all the mods I have on mine, I elected to go with the 195 degree t stat.
It still runs like its supposed to, lets the computer get its temp, and I
still have my performance gain from running a 30 degree cooler t-stat than
stock.
Just my . 02,
Wayne Foy
'94 F150 Flareside Supercab
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.aol.com/flr150/auto/index.htm
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Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 09:52:25 PST
From: "Casey Vandor"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Computer removal

I though about that too, but there is A LOT of crap that runs into the
computer. I am not sure what would be involved in getting rid of it but
I am interested as well.

Thanks
Casey

>>>>>>>>>
Has anyone ever cut the computer out of a 80's truck? I was thinking of
cutting the computer out of my truck. Whats everyone think? Will it
still
pass smog? Will it run better? I plan on putting that 4 barrel carb on
so
none of the sensors hook up. Any thoughts would be appreciated. By the
way
this is the straight six if you didn't read the title. Thanks.

______________________________________________________
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Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 13:14:52 -0500
From: Garr&Pam
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Gauge Cluster Help

Chris W wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> I am new to the list and already have a question!
>
> I have a '95 F150, and need some help on how to get the gauges out of
> the dashboard. I cannot seem to get the bezel around the dashboard off.
> Is there a trick to getting it off without pulling off the headlight
> switch?
>
> If anyone is familiar with the 92-96 dashboard, could you give me the
> basic steps to remove the gauges? I need to replace one, and just can't
> seem to be able to get the dashboard apart!
>
> Thanks!!
>
> -Chris
> '95 F150
>
> ______________________________________________________
> > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

You have to take the headlight switch off! Pull the switch to the on
position and there should be a slot toward the end of the shaft, use an
awl or something small to reach in a release the keeper then the switch
will slide right off! Then you need to remove the trim pieces(the two
bars one an each side of the steering column) they just pop off, behind
them there are a couple of screws. I removed the lower panel also when I
did mine it just a copule of screws in the bottom edge. Then all that is
holding the fascia on is clips just be careful when trying to remove and
the will also come right off..PULL GENTLY. I think to actually remove
the cluster you have to also remove the plastic piece on top of the
sterring column. I have only gone in to install white face bacgrounds on
my gauges and never had to remove my cluster...I can get into it but as
far as getting out you are on your own. Be careful of the gear selector
if you have an automatic. It also helps to but the tranny in first
gear...for more room!

Chris
94 Lightning #381
NLOC #238
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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 13:08:58 -0500
From: "David Butts"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Taillight problem

You could have a bad bulb, shorting the emergency flasher circuit to the
turn signal circuit.

If you have hooked everything up the was it was before you started, I bet
you have a bad bulb.

Good Luck.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Bjrnar Huse
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Monday, January 04, 1999 3:06 AM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Taillight problem


Brent wrote:
- -Now, when the turn signals are used, not only the
- -correct tailight flashes, but they all do.



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Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 13:19:42 -0500
From: Garr&Pam
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats

Andre Roy wrote:
>
> "Michael J. Pasznik, Jr." wrote:
> >
> > In the middle of this cold spell we've been having my thermostat decided
> > to act up. How convenient of it!
> >
> Of course.
>
> > I replaced the stock thermostat with a much cooler one (160 degrees).
> > It's something I've always done on my vehicles, figuring that the cooler an
> > engine runs the better,
> >
> Debatable. A cooler running engine will generally (all things being
> equal and all that) use more fuel and produce less power. That's with
> hotter and cooler being in the realm of reasonable.
>
> > Back in the days when a car was a car and not a computer it didn't mess
> > anything up, but I'm not sure if the computer might set something based on
> > the engine running too cool.
> >
> Depends. The computer will most likely be running in open loop mode for
> longer, if not all the time. That will raise emmission and fuel
> consumption and reduce power.
> If it's cool enough, the computer might think that the engine is never
> reachin proper temperature (because it isn't, really) and stay in open
> loop all the time.
>
> --
> Andre
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

Andre is absolutely right...coming down from the stock 190 or 195 to a
180 degree thermostat does help performance but coming down to 160 is
too cool! The computer DOES stay in closed loop(I think Andre...you have
open and closed backwards?) anyway its not getting warm enough to
satisfy the computer.
Chris
94 Lightning #381
NLOC #238
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Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 13:15:36 -0500
From: Dave Slotter
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

Hi. I have a 1986 manual Bronco II with 2.9L V6 EFI engine and now that the
weather is much colder - approximately 15 degrees F this morning, the truck
does not want to start. If I crank it on and off for about half an hour I
can get it to start. Obviously this is not a situation I want to be in.

Fuel:

There is sufficient gas in the tank - no detectable leaks - but detecting
fuel leaks is difficult business anyway. After turning over the engine for
a while I do smell gas, so I am flooding it after a point. So I think that
gas is probably getting into the cylinder.

Air:

There are no obstructions in the air pathway to the engine.

Spark/Electric:

All this turning over finally put the nails in the coffin for my old
battery. I bought a new battery with 625 cranking amps and 500+ cold
cranking amps. This is quite sufficient. I have recently put in new spark
plug wires including coil wire, new spark plugs, distributor cap and rotor.
I have not pulled out the #1 plug yet and confirmed spark, but I will be
sure to do this.

More Info:

Since the cylinders don't seem to fire until after I crank it on and off a
while, I doubt this is a computer problem, but in case someone thinks that
might be a problem, I can tell you that during a Key On Engine Off (KOEO)
test I get a code (62?) saying my coolant temperature sensor is bad. Could
this be the culprit keeping my truck from starting?

I have recently replaced the O2 sensor, MAP sensor, ACT sensor and have
confirmed all are operating properly. I also recently replaced the Coolant
Temperature Sensor and believe it is *not* working properly. In fact, I
think the old Coolant Temperature Sensor may be ok. Timing was recently
reset to 10 degrees BTDC and this time the SPOUT was disconnected when it
was done.

The truck starts much better in warm weather.

I welcome all advice on solving this problem. I am not a mechanic type
(yet) although I am learning these things slowly. Computers and electronics
are more my style, so doing computer checks and wiring diagnoses are more
my style.

Thank you.

- -Dave
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 13:22:46 -0500
From: "Michael J. Pasznik, Jr."
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Choice of thermostats

Looks like I'm pulling the truck back into the garage for another quick
swap. Thanks for the info!

- -Mike


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 12:10:44 -0800
From: dave
Subject: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes

I have a question concerning the brakes on my truck. But first let me say
that I am new to the list and also the new owner of a 93 F150 SC 4x4, 6cyl.
5sp, rear ABS.

The brakes on this truck seem to be very touchy and grab with not alot of
pressure. They lock up with minimum force. This is a real problem when
driving in the rain or snow! I visited the web site for NHTSA, National
Highway Transportation Safety Asso. (I think). There where many, many
complaints listed there for this same problem but no recalls or solution
mentioned.

Has anyone found the cure for this. I haven't yet started examining the
brakes but was looking for ideas on what to be looking for.

I hope this subject hasn't been covered lately. Thanks in advance .

Dave Coburn

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 15:11:35 -0600
From: "Rick Wojciechowski"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

Dave Slotter wrote:

> does not want to start. If I crank it on and off for about half an hour I
> can get it to start. Obviously this is not a situation I want to be in.

Dave,
Isolating this to saying that it starts hard in the cold and
fine in the warm weather tells me your choke is not working
properly. The chole must be fully open in the cold, and it will
shut with the temperature as the engine heats up.

- --
Thanks,
Rick Wojo
'83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
'92 Mstng 5.0L
'95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 14:54:45 -0600
From: "Rick Wojciechowski"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hub squeak

Randy wrote:

> accelerating and a little when coasting, not at all when slowing down.
> I have dismissed u-joint (axle) due to no squeaking when hub not locked,
> but that doesn't mean I'm right. Anybody have any suggestions?

Randy,
I would jack up the front end, engage the hubs and xfer-case and
see if you can still create the chirping. If your hubs have not been
taken apart down to the outer axle then I would do so and check
the spindle needle bearing. Once you take off the spindle you
will see it sits in the end of the spindle which rides on the
outer-axle shaft.

- --
Thanks,
Rick Wojo
'83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
'92 Mstng 5.0L
'95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 16:57:02 -0500
From: Dave Slotter
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

At 3:11 PM -0600 1999/01/04, Rick Wojciechowski wrote:
>Dave Slotter wrote:
>
>> does not want to start. If I crank it on and off for about half an hour I
>> can get it to start. Obviously this is not a situation I want to be in.
>
> Dave,
> Isolating this to saying that it starts hard in the cold and
>fine in the warm weather tells me your choke is not working
>properly. The chole must be fully open in the cold, and it will
>shut with the temperature as the engine heats up.
>
>--
>Thanks,
> Rick Wojo
> '83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
> '92 Mstng 5.0L
> '95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)

Rick,

In an EFI engine, doesn't the computer (EEC-IV) control the choke? If so, I
would bet that the computer *does in fact* factor in to this problem and
that I should try swapping back in the old (working?) coolant temperature
sensor and see if that does the trick. That is easy enough.

I was headed in this direction before, but others told me that the computer
didn't factor into the equation this early in the engine's run cycle. Since
they are both knowledgable in engine mechanics, I took them at their word
and dropped this pursuit.

If swapping the sensor does not work, how would you suggest as far as
checking the choke on an EFI engine?

Thanks.

- -Dave
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 17:15:34 EST
From: Bakend aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes

In a message dated 1/4/99 1:17:02 PM Mountain Standard Time,
dcoburn worldaccessnet.com writes:

>
> The brakes on this truck seem to be very touchy and grab with not alot of
> pressure. They lock up with minimum force. This is a real problem when
> driving in the rain or snow!
Many on the list have said that the cheaper brake shoes will cure this
problem! Don't buy the high price-lifetime shoes and it will go away. I always
but the one year shoes and have not had this problem. It is worth a shot.
D Baken
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 17:20:05 EST
From: Bakend aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

In a message dated 1/4/99 2:06:30 PM Mountain Standard Time,
wojciecr nichols.com writes:

>
> Dave,
> Isolating this to saying that it starts hard in the cold and
> fine in the warm weather tells me your choke is not working
> properly. The chole must be fully open in the cold, and it will
> shut with the temperature as the engine heats up.
>
I am thinking you mean to say the choke will be closed when cold and open when
warm. If not I am in need of an explanation on how that works.
Not to be picky or anything-just wondering
D Baken
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 16:42:06 -0600
From: "Rick Wojciechowski"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hard Start Problem with '86 Bronco II

Bakend aol.com wrote:

> I am thinking you mean to say the choke will be closed when cold and open when
> warm. If not I am in need of an explanation on how that works.
> Not to be picky or anything-just wondering

Yes, you have caught me. :-)

- --
Thanks,
Rick Wojo
'83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
'92 Mstng 5.0L
'95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 20:37:30 -0500
From: S Spaulding
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures

Up until recently, I was Product Engineering Manager for
Standard-Thomson Corporation. This company is a part of Stant
Corporation, which falls under the Gates Rubber umbrella.

STC is the largest manufacturer of thermostats in the world. We supply
Original Equipment and OE Service thermostats to Ford, GM, DDC, Mack,
Caterpillar, etc. Our engineers work directly with their engineers. We
also supply Stant, Gates, NAPA, Carquest, and many other aftermarket
labels.

The subject of thermostat temperature always generates debate, including
at the OE Engineering level. You would be amazed at the amount of
effort a company such as Ford or GM puts into determining the coolant
temperature control characteristics for an engine. A simple three
degree (nominal) change requires exhaustive recalibration and validation
testing. The engineers have to balance performance, emissions, economy,
heater performance, and durability. We can also control leakage,
opening characteristics, and flow rate.

In many instances, the higher performance engines will have lower start
to open temperatures, but the temperature difference is not that
dramatic. For example, for the Ford 4.6/5.4/6.8 series truck engines,
there are three different temperature versions of the same thermostat.
The 4.6/5.4 vanilla engines use a 192 start to open (STO). The 6.8
uses a 185 STO, and the upcoming 5.4 HO Lightning will use a 180 STO.
It took many months to settle on those temperatures.

One must remember that the thermostat is only a part of an engine
control system that has to operate together. If the system is designed
to operate within the range of a 192 thermostat, don't confuse it by
going to a 160 thermostat. Chances are, it will never reach
closed-loop operation.

This is especially true with newer vehicles with OBDII systems. You
will get a "Check Engine" indication if the engine does not reach a
specific operating temperature within a specific amount of time.

There are a lot of other considerations as well, but I won't take up
anymore bandwidth!

If you made it this far, thanks for reading...

Steve
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 21:05:36 -0500
From: Andre Roy
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures

S Spaulding wrote:
>
> Up until recently, I was Product Engineering Manager for
> Standard-Thomson Corporation. This company is a part of Stant
> Corporation, which falls under the Gates Rubber umbrella.
>

[snip some _very_ intersting stuff]

>
> If you made it this far, thanks for reading...
>
Is that all? More!

Thank you.

- --
Andre, Somewhere ...
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 21:24:32 -0500
From: Ken Payne
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes

At 12:10 PM 1/4/99 -0800, you wrote:
>I have a question concerning the brakes on my truck. But first let me say
>that I am new to the list and also the new owner of a 93 F150 SC 4x4, 6cyl.
>5sp, rear ABS.
>
>The brakes on this truck seem to be very touchy and grab with not alot of
>pressure. They lock up with minimum force. This is a real problem when
>driving in the rain or snow! I visited the web site for NHTSA, National
>Highway Transportation Safety Asso. (I think). There where many, many
>complaints listed there for this same problem but no recalls or solution
>mentioned.
>
>Has anyone found the cure for this. I haven't yet started examining the
>brakes but was looking for ideas on what to be looking for.
>
>I hope this subject hasn't been covered lately. Thanks in advance .
>
>Dave Coburn
>

If your rear drums are out of round they will lock up very easily.
My truck did this. Anything other than a mild slow down would
lock up the rear end. Put on new drums and the problem went away.

Ken Payne

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 21:53:22 -0500
From: Randy
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Hub squeak

Rick,
I see one small problem with your suggestion. How do I keep the rear tires
from making the truck drive over the jack stands??? Hehe. I did, in fact,
have the rotors turned down last spring and repacked three of the four
bearing, two inner and one outer. The outer bearing on the drivers' side was
bad so I replaced it. I wouldn't think it to be the bearing otherwise
wouldn't it chirp all the time? Anyone ever replaced the axle-shaft U-joints
on the Dana 50 TTB? If so, what is involved w/it after getting down to the
spindles? E-mail me directly if necessary of if lengthy.

Thanks,
Brew

Btw...you STILL haven't sold the wifes' car???? LOL :-)

Rick Wojciechowski wrote:

> Randy,
> I would jack up the front end, engage the hubs and xfer-case and
> see if you can still create the chirping. If your hubs have not been
> taken apart down to the outer axle then I would do so and check
> the spindle needle bearing. Once you take off the spindle you
> will see it sits in the end of the spindle which rides on the
> outer-axle shaft.
>
> --
> Thanks,
> Rick Wojo
> '83 Fsize BRONCO,Stock I-6,"The BROWN BULL",33x12.5x15-Mud Terrains
> '92 Mstng 5.0L
> '95 eclipse-Wife's(For Sale)
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 21:51:05 -0500
From: Ken Payne
Subject: FTE 80-96 - ADMIN: TruckTough.com

Dear Ford Truck Enthusiasts list members:

We have a new sponsor on our web site. Since the beginning,
our practice with web site sponsor has been to make a brief
announcement for 2 days (this is day 1 of 2).

This sponsor is a little different from the others we've had...
they're having a $1000 giveaway!!!!!!

TruckTough.com will enter you into their contest simply for
filling out a truck survey. I already did.... :-)

Their site features:

Surveys, knowledge, contests, trivia games, and information about
all brands of full size pickup trucks - You could win $1000 dollars!
Also: other prizes, sweepstakes, etc.

They can be found at:

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If you enjoy their site, we would like to you to let them know you
heard about them via Ford Truck Enthusiasts.

Now returning you to our regularly scheduled program...

Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 22:20:11 EST
From: SpyderLv81 aol.com
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Computer removal

I really need to know soon if the engine I want to build will pass smog. So
anyone with info e-mail me. If I change the Carb and intake to a 4 barrell
will it pass smog?
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 20:28:13 -0000
From: "Radoje Spasojevic"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes

My '90 Bronco and my father's '91 E-250 van have a similar problem with the
rear brakes. I heard that the rear brake pads will absorb moisture from the
air and swell up (the is alot of moisture in the air here in Washington) and
cause the rear brakes to grab. I notice this more on my fathers van than on
my Bronco and it only occurs when I first drive the vehicle after it has
been sitting for a while. Apparently good quality aftermarket brake pads
will not absorb moisture.

Rade
- -----Original Message-----
From: dave
To: '80-96-list ford-trucks.com'
Date: Monday, January 04, 1999 8:12 PM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - F150 brakes


>I have a question concerning the brakes on my truck. But first let me say
>that I am new to the list and also the new owner of a 93 F150 SC 4x4, 6cyl.
>5sp, rear ABS.
>
>The brakes on this truck seem to be very touchy and grab with not alot of
>pressure. They lock up with minimum force. This is a real problem when
>driving in the rain or snow! I visited the web site for NHTSA, National
>Highway Transportation Safety Asso. (I think). There where many, many
>complaints listed there for this same problem but no recalls or solution
>mentioned.
>
>Has anyone found the cure for this. I haven't yet started examining the
>brakes but was looking for ideas on what to be looking for.
>
>I hope this subject hasn't been covered lately. Thanks in advance .
>
>Dave Coburn
>
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Jan 1999 20:34:05 -0000
From: "Radoje Spasojevic"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures

I agree with Andre, it is nice to hear from someone who is not one of us
"self-educated" shade tree mechanics...tell us everything there is to know
about thermostats, please.

Rade
- -----Original Message-----
From: Andre Roy
To: 80-96-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, January 05, 1999 2:14 AM
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Thermostat temperatures


>S Spaulding wrote:
>>
>> Up until recently, I was Product Engineering Manager for
>> Standard-Thomson Corporation. This company is a part of Stant....


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