FTE 80-96 - Re: Black Death

80-96-list-digest Wednesday, September 30 1998 Volume 02 : Number 337

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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980-1996 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 80-96 - Re: Black Death
FTE 80-96 - Re: Undercoating truck with used motor oil - good or bad?
Re: FTE 80-96 - Horn & cruse control
FTE 80-96 - Trailer hitch questions for '85 F-350
Re: FTE 80-96 - Trailer hitch questions for '85 F-350
Re: FTE 80-96 - Trailer hitch questions for '85 F-350
Re: FTE 80-96 - Rear Diff questions/info
FTE 80-96 - Re: various leaks

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Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 23:00:52 -0300
From: sbest
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: Black Death

>From: Dalton Cross
>Subject: FTE 80-96 - Black Death
>
> I have a 1990 F150 truck with 167,000 miles. I know it's getting
>old but its still a good truck. Recently when my air conditioning
>compressor failed my mechanic told me I had the black death. We went
>through 4 compressors before finally getting one to work for about a
>month and now it has failed. He tells me this is deterioration of the
>system and the small particles from inside the components break loose
>and corrupt the system. I am spending a lot of money to get this fixed
>and so far it not going too well. Does anyone have any info on this? Do
>I just need to replace everything in the system or is there something
>specific I can do to stop this? Thanks for your assistance.
>
>Dalton Cross

I just went through this with my 92 Crown Vic. A/C compressor
shredded filling the system with bits. Had the system flushed with
whatever they use, a new oriface, reciever/dryer and compressor
installed. Working fine. Did you get flushed and install a new
reciever/dryer?

Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest

mitre.org (John DeVincentis)
>Subject: FTE 80-96 - Undercoating truck with used motor oil - good or bad?
>
>Guys,
>Ever heard of spraying used motor oil on the underside of
>the truck to prevent things from rusting?
>I live it the northeast and they use alot of salt on the
>roads in the winter to keep the roads free of ice.
>Can it cause any harm to the things made of rubber: hoses,
>bushing, etc....
>
>Thanks in advance for any feedback,
>
>Regards
>John Dee

Yup, it softens up the bushings, separates the rubber from the metal
on your motor and transmission mounts and softens up the big round and
oval body plugs so that they drop out. Motor oil contains a detergent
so that it can hold a considerable amount of water. The standard advice
is to spray the underbody twice a year and drive it down a dusty road.
Done that, big clumps of oily dust form on the frame and a year
afterward you can knock them off to see fresh rust on the frame.

After several years of trying used and then new motor oil, I don't
like it. Anything else seems better.

Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest

glinx.com
4 wheel drive van page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.glinx.com/users/sbest
Tire chains, camping gear, tools,82 Bronco and some shooting stuff too.

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Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 22:33:08 -0400
From: "Matt Fitzsimmons"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Horn & cruse control

That's a pretty good guess. There are 3 sliding connections under the
steering wheel, one for the horn, one for cruise control and one for
ground. Take the covers off the steering column and check the harness
connections first. If that doesn't do it, you may need to remove the
steering wheel. Check that the spring loaded sliders are properly in their
holders and that isn't any dirt on any of the sliding surfaces. There is a
light grease ( a bit like Vasaline ) on the sliders, leave that there.

- ----------
> From: DeForest Ray Sparks
> To: 80-96-list

ford-trucks.com
> Subject: FTE 80-96 - Horn & cruse control
> Date: Tuesday, September 29, 1998 8:13 PM
>
> Help! anybody know what would or could cause the horn and cruse control
to
> quit working , they quit at the same time, have checked and rechecked all
> the fuses , all are good , checked all wiring harness plugs all hooked up
tight.
> Local Ford dealer said it was something called a " clock spring " in
the
> steering wheel and would cost 200 + to repair , the local parts dealers
said
> they have never heard of this " clock spring " and said to try replacing
the
> horn relay to fix the horn but as for the cruse they would have to take a
> look themselves to track it down.
> My thinking is that I have lost a ground connection somewhere in the
> steering wheel, possiably where the wires go from the wheel to the
coloum.
>
>
> Any ideas and help would be greatfuly appreciated.
>
>
> Thanks .
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 20:09:39 PDT
From: "Bret Luter"
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Trailer hitch questions for '85 F-350

Hey all you digesters.

I'm looking into a frame mounted trailer hitch for my '85 F350 crew cab,
single rear wheel, 6.9l diesel. I'd like to get the most heavy-duty
hitch I can get (within reason). I've seen lots of Class III frame
hitches (at Wal-mart even!!) for less than $100 but I'd like some input
from those of you who've "been there, done that". Most of the Class III
"off-the-shelf" hitches I've seen list lots of different Ford, Ch*vy and
D*dge trucks using the same exact hitch- Are they really the same??

I'll be using the truck to tow an open car trailer with a 2500# car on
it anywhere from 300-600 miles at a time AND I'll be using it to haul a
livestock trailer, loaded + unloaded, shorter distances.

What about the Class IV hitches I've seen? They look basically the same
as the Class III hitches with extra attachment points to the frame. Can
anyone recommend a hitch manufacturer website with specific vehicle
applications on-line??

Thanks to all in advance. Bret Luter, Raleigh, NC..

______________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 23:52:51 -0400
From: Alan Sliski
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Trailer hitch questions for '85 F-350

Bret,
Get a heavy duty class IV or V hitch. It might cost $30-50 more than a
class III, but well worth the money. JC Whitney has a good selection. I
recently bought a gooseneck hitch for my '90 F350 dually from hitchweb.com.
They have the best selection I've forund and good prices. I talked to a lot
of local installers that weren't aware of the reese fold-down gooseneck
hitch I bought.
Alan Sliski

Bret Luter wrote:

> Hey all you digesters.
>
> I'm looking into a frame mounted trailer hitch for my '85 F350 crew cab,
> single rear wheel, 6.9l diesel. I'd like to get the most heavy-duty
> hitch I can get (within reason). I've seen lots of Class III frame
> hitches (at Wal-mart even!!) for less than $100 but I'd like some input
> from those of you who've "been there, done that". Most of the Class III
> "off-the-shelf" hitches I've seen list lots of different Ford, Ch*vy and
> D*dge trucks using the same exact hitch- Are they really the same??
>
> I'll be using the truck to tow an open car trailer with a 2500# car on
> it anywhere from 300-600 miles at a time AND I'll be using it to haul a
> livestock trailer, loaded + unloaded, shorter distances.
>
> What about the Class IV hitches I've seen? They look basically the same
> as the Class III hitches with extra attachment points to the frame. Can
> anyone recommend a hitch manufacturer website with specific vehicle
> applications on-line??
>
> Thanks to all in advance. Bret Luter, Raleigh, NC..
>
> ______________________________________________________
> > == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 23:27:58 -0500
From: "Anthony Trantham"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Trailer hitch questions for '85 F-350

Do you have a Tractor Supply Company in or near your town? If so go there
and ask them to order you a Class IV hitch. It should be under $100.00, if
not let me know and I will order you one and ship it to you. Also, it will
be a specialty hitch just for Ford's like yours.

Hope this helps,
Anthony

- -----Original Message-----
From: Bret Luter
To: 80-96-list

ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, September 29, 1998 10:49 PM
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Trailer hitch questions for '85 F-350

>Hey all you digesters.
>
>I'm looking into a frame mounted trailer hitch for my '85 F350 crew cab,
>single rear wheel, 6.9l diesel. I'd like to get the most heavy-duty
>hitch I can get (within reason). I've seen lots of Class III frame
>hitches (at Wal-mart even!!) for less than $100 but I'd like some input
>from those of you who've "been there, done that". Most of the Class III
>"off-the-shelf" hitches I've seen list lots of different Ford, Ch*vy and
>D*dge trucks using the same exact hitch- Are they really the same??
>
>I'll be using the truck to tow an open car trailer with a 2500# car on
>it anywhere from 300-600 miles at a time AND I'll be using it to haul a
>livestock trailer, loaded + unloaded, shorter distances.
>
>What about the Class IV hitches I've seen? They look basically the same
>as the Class III hitches with extra attachment points to the frame. Can
>anyone recommend a hitch manufacturer website with specific vehicle
>applications on-line??
>
>Thanks to all in advance. Bret Luter, Raleigh, NC..
>
>
>______________________________________________________
> >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 22:26:59 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: Re: FTE 80-96 - Rear Diff questions/info

>From: "Jorge Ramirez"
>Subject: FTE 80-96 - Rear Diff questions/info
>
snip
>
>and both the Haynes manual and the owners manual say to use
>HYPOID oil, with a specific Ford part # (which I don't have in front
>of me). I looked at the bottles at the auto parts stores and I found
>that the CASTROL HYPOY-C has the Ford part #.
>

Yo Jorge, et al:

First let's clarify what "hypoid" means. Hypoid is a term that refers to
the design of the ring and pinion gears in the differential. It is a
shortened name for "hyperboloidal pitch," which describes a type of bevel
gear with a hyperboloid pitch to the gear teeth, rather than a straight
conical pitch (i.e., a mitre bevel gear). Almost all automotive final
drive gears are one of two types: hypoid bevel or spiral bevel. Spiral
bevel gears have a circular pitch to the gear teeth. Both hypoid and
spiral bevel gears are better suited to transmitting large amounts of
torque than the same size mitre (straight conical) bevel gears.

The main significance of hypoid gears in automotive axles is that hypoid
gears allow the axis of the pinion gear (driven by the driveshaft) to be in
a different plane than the ring gear (which drives the axle shafts).
Spiral bevel gears require the pinion axis to be in the same plane as the
ring gear axis. Hypoid gears are larger than spiral bevel gears of the
same capacity, which also allows the hypoid gear pinion to use a larger
diameter shaft, which is a more efficient design because the torque
capacity of the pinion shaft is more closely matched to the torque capacity
of the gear set.

Now that we know a little more about the mechanics, let's consider
lubricants.

The term "hypoid oil" refers to a lubricant that meets the lubrication
requirements of a hypoid gear set. According to the American Petroleum
Institute (API) there are two factors in considering a lubricant: the SAE
Viscosity Grade (e.g., 80W-90) and the API Service Designation (e.g.,
GL-5).

The SAE Viscosity Grade is a statement of the lubricant's internal
friction, as measured in terms of the kinematic viscosity and dynamic
viscosity according to various ASTM and/or other recognized standard
testing methods. For gear lubricants, the SAE Viscosity Grade ranges from
70W to 250. Single grade gear lubricants are specified by a single SAE
Viscosity Grade, such as 80, 90, or 140. Multi-grade gear lubricants are
specified by a range of SAE Viscosity Grades, such as 80W-90, 85W-140, etc.
SAE Viscosity Grades with the "W" designation refer to low temperature
viscosity characteristics while number-only designations refer to
"standard" viscosity characteristics (actually measured at 40 and 100
degrees Centigrade, per ASTM method D 2270).

The API Service Designation is a set of standards for lubricant properties
based on the intended usage of the lubricant. There are API Service
Designations for gasoline engine oils, diesel engine oils, gear oils,
lubricant greases, and various industrial lubricants. All auto
manufacturers (and component OEMs) refer to an API Service Designation when
specifying a lubricant. Current API Service Designations for gear oils are
GL-1 through GL-5. GL-4 (moderate service) and GL-5 (moderate and severe
service) are the recommended types for hypoid gears.

>I found that none of the synth gear lubes that I looked at have that
>part number, that scares me. I don't know the difference between
>HYPOID oil and XYZ brand of gear lube (can someone please
>clarify this for the list)other than the viscosity factor.

The Ford part number is Ford's catalog number for a lubricant that meets
their specifications (and warranty requirements). If you want to buy your
oil from Ford, that's the part number you'd order.

Along with the Ford part number, you should be able to find a more general
lubricant specification, in terms of SAE Viscosity Grade and API Service
Designation. If this information is not available in your books or
manuals, you should be able to get it from a reasonably cooperative Ford
dealer service technician or parts department. I'm pretty sure that the
original Ford docs (service manuals, owner's manual, etc.) give the
industry-standard specifications for all fluids.

>So, whats the deal, can we SAFELY use a synthetic
>lube or are we married to HYPOID oil???

So, the bottom line is that if you use a gear oil with the correct SAE
Viscosity Grade and API Service Designation, as specified by Ford, you'll
be ok, whether it's synthetic or petroleum based. Personally, I would be
wary of any oil that did not have the specified SAE and API designations,
which apparently some synthetics do not.

OTOH, almost all the major OEM gearbox manufacturers (Spicer/Dana, Eaton,
Rockwell, ZF, etc.) now recommend a synthetic gear lubricant for their
heavy-duty gearboxes. Synthetic gear lubricants are commonly used in both
differentials and transmissions on heavy trucks.

BTW: Keep in mind that for a vehicle more than just a few years old, the
original API Service Designation might be obsolete. Any oil that meets
higher standards in the same API Service Designation class is an acceptable
substitute.

If you want more details about gear designs, check out the following web
site:
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.designinfo.com/RefLibrary/CDS/bevel.htm

If you want more details about lubricants, check out the following web
site:
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.lubrizol.com/referencelibrary/lubtheory/index.htm#theory

Good luck w/ your truck.

Dave R. (M-block devotee)

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Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1998 02:45:02 -0300
From: sbest
Subject: FTE 80-96 - Re: various leaks

>From: "Ralph Ward"
>Subject: FTE 80-96 - various leaks
>
>I have a '85 F-150 King Cab with 351W & C6...has a heavy towing package I
>think. Since I bought it in August I have replaced the timing cover seal,
>the timing gears and chain the water pump, the hoses and the belts, and the
>valve cover gaskets; and done a complete replacement of the brake system.
>It runs great, gets about 7 miles to the gallon! 1st problem: it is
>starting to smell like very hot oil, and the engine is smoking. A little
>poking around showed oil pooling on top of the intake manifold. My guess
>was valve cover (drivers side). Day before yesterday, 2 exhaust hangers
>broke and dropped the tail pipe...fixed it, but now have a large crack in
>the left side exhaust manifold between cylinders 6 & 7. What are the odds
>the oil on top is a similar problem?...I.E. do I need to look for a cracked
>block or head?...getting a little discouraged, I am new at this, and this
>thing seems to be a money sink-hole.
>regards
>Ralph Ward

Hi Ralph, don't get discouraged.
Make a list, prioritize it and hit one item at a time.
Sounds like your halfway done as it is!

Cracked manifold, common problem. My answer was headers.
Oil pooling. Clean the engine off and find where it is coming from.
My engine had pinholes in the timingchain cover, I epoxied them.
Intake manifold front gasket can be another source of oil.
Hot oil smell is oil from the front being blown back on the exhaust manifold.

I doubt it is cracked block or head, not real common on a Ford and overheating
is usually a symptom. Don't lose hope. Normally easier than it looks.

Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest

....

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