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Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:15:10 -0500 (EST)
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------------------------------------
61-79-list Digest Mon, 22 Jan 2001 Volume: 2001  Issue: 020

In This Issue:
checking rear axle
Re: 73-79 F250s
Re: Oxygenators in fuel
Engine placement
Electronic ignition
Re: Electronic ignition
Re: engine placement
Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Whiter Whites article back on line.
Re: Engine placement
Re: 73-79 F250s
Re: Engine placement
Re: checking rear axle
Whiter Whites article back on line.
Engine orientation
Engine backward rake
Engine rake
Cams
Re: Oxygenators in fuel
Re: 73-79 F250s
Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
E4OD
E4OD
Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
T-98
Re: Electronic ignition
Re: Engine rake
Re: Engine rake
Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Re: T-98
Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Re: Oxygenators in fuel
Re: Whiter Whites
Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Re: Cams

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "gene gardner" <genegow hotmail.com>
Subject: checking rear axle
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 06:21:25


I'm out from the shadows to ask for your help again. I've always suspected
my rear axle might be a little bit bent. I know the previous owner
overloaded it hauling equipment in the West Texas oilfields (it's a half-ton
shortbed). The leaf springs were shot, there's a slight leak in one of the
rear axle seals even after replacing it, and the drivetrain has always had
some vibration (including clutch chatter) since I've owned it. I've checked
or replaced everything else in the drivetrain except the differential so my
question is this:

What are the symptoms of a bent axle? Could it cause clutch chatter? What is
invloved in checking the rear axle to see if it's bent? I don't mind giving
my loyal mechanic my money if it solves the problem, but I'd also hate to
waste it if it's a lot of labor for something that is unlikely to be the
cause of the problem. Thanks for listening ...

Texican Teacher, 70 F100 shorty w/300-six


_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.hotmail.com.


------------------------------

From: "Michael" <danger csolutions.net>
Subject: Re: 73-79 F250s
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 02:56:46 -0800


----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Beyer" <bbeyer pacifier.com>
To: <61-79-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2001 3:06 PM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: 73-79 F250s


> No it's not, they added the "oxygenators" to reduce emissions by making
the
> combustion process more efficient. There's no less oxygen in the air now
> than there was 30 years ago or 300 or 3000 or 3,000,000 for that matter. I
> have no idea what made this person think there is but I have a pretty good
> idea which orifice he's talking out of.

   First of all Bill, there is no need to be rude when you disagree with
someone. Some of the more timid members of this list may be discouraged from
posting for fear of replies such as yours.

   I've been with this list for about 3 years and don't usually make
statements that I can't back up with facts. Mankind has had a negitive
effect on the contents of the atmosphere ever since he began using fire
thousands of years ago. The recent industrial era combined with large human
population growth & deforestation DOES have an effect on the oxygen content
of the atmosphere today. Perhaps you should browse the pages at
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://wings.ucdavis.edu/Book/Atmosphere/instructor/deforestation-01.html &
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://wings.ucdavis.edu/Book/Atmosphere/instructor/pollution-01.html. You
can find more information by using the search feature on your favorite
browser.


Michael
69 F250 390 4V, T18, 3.54 LS
69 F250 390 4V, C6, 4.11
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.csolutions.net/myth/ford/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


------------------------------

From: "Michael" <danger csolutions.net>
Subject: Re: Oxygenators in fuel
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 03:17:47 -0800


----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Beyer" <bbeyer pacifier.com>
To: <61-79-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2001 10:00 AM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: Oxygenators in fuel


> Believe me I'm not a big fan of oxygenated fuels
> but I do know they weren't invented because there's "less oxygen in the
air
> than 30 years ago."

   I know very little about oxygenated fuels or photosynthesis, but,...

   Perhaps oxygenated fuels are used in major cities during the winter
months because plants aren't producing as much oxygen as they normally would
during the summer months? It seems like the oxy is used to reduce emissions
by avoiding a rich air/fuel mixture. I may be way off base here, but this
sounds logical to me.

   If anyone could shed more light on the subject of oxygenated fuels, then
please do so.


Michael
69 F250 390 4V, T18, 3.54 LS
69 F250 390 4V, C6, 4.11
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.csolutions.net/myth/ford/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


------------------------------

From: "Gary L. Perry" <glperry fwi.com>
Subject: Engine placement
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:01:31 -0500

I have a book bought from Motorbooks I believe, that is about engine changes and driveline. It's good reading. It does mention that the driveshaft (rear) should have some "bend" at the joints to be flexing the lube or the joints get the little ridges from the rollers and wear out. The pinion angle on rear should be the same as the trans output angle in degrees. They make tools to sit on parts and read these angles. The engine and trans can even be moved over one way or other and doesn't need to be in center of frame and driveshaft is angled too. Personally I have never seen an engine lean forward and would think that is wrong. Slight tilt to rear is "natural" if you look at OEM. I would think a level carb is best, have seen some intakes that allow for the carb to sit level and engine tilt slightly. I can't see where you could have oil problems unless you run low on level. The pick-up is at the lowest part of pan. Not sure if 4x4 has special consideration for front axle, would think pinion angle would be important there too. Keep the angles equal even though they may be steaper than the rear.

G. L. Perry


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:20:13 -0500
From: "Brice Sample" <sampleb state.mi.us>
Subject: Electronic ignition


Does anyone have an thoughts on the electronic ignition converters that fit inside the distributor cap.  Do they work....if so...do you recommend a particular brand?

My re-built 390 motor with re-built carb feels like it misses a beat when at idle.  Tried all the usual adjustments and nothing seems to work.  Since everything else is new....thought this might be a solution.

thanks....
71 custom money pit.


------------------------------

From: "Southerland, Rich" <rsouther alldata.com>
Subject: Re: Electronic ignition
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 06:43:15 -0800


Pertronix.  Love it.  You can even re-install the points in about 5 mins in
the unlikely event the unit fails (comes with a 3yr warranty).  Been running
one in dad's '67 F100 for better part of a year.  Mileage is up slightly,
starts easier (comes off choke quicker).

-----Original Message-----
From: Brice Sample [mailto:sampleb state.mi.us]
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 6:20 AM
To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: [61-79-list] Electronic ignition



Does anyone have an thoughts on the electronic ignition converters that fit
inside the distributor cap.  Do they work....if so...do you recommend a
particular brand?


------------------------------

From: "Michael Ray Jones" <mjones lcc.net>
Subject: Re: engine placement
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:10:51 -0600

I'm thinking that the actual angle of the carb setting at rest is not going to have nearly as much effect as the G-forces would during acceleration, braking and turning.


------------------------------

From: "GaryBBB" <gpeters3 lni.net>
Subject: Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:26:53 -0800


I do agree that rudeness is not appropriate here since it is a "Forum" for
discussion but.....some individuals obviously just like to hear themselves
talk and say things that are not based on any real facts.....they state
their opinion as if it were fact.  We all need to be careful about that
since it is a human tendency we all have to fight.  I sometimes find myself
deleting a post before sending it after proof reading and realizing I don't
really know what I'm talking about :-)  If one does make this mistake then
let's be a little more gentle in correcting him (or simply ignor the
mistake) and, let those who are corrected be a little more manly and accept
correction without getting our feelings hurt, OK?

The fact is that there are as many "Experts" who say there is less oxygen as
there are who say it's more or unchanged just as there are "Experts" who say
we evolved from apes.  Arguing these points is fruitless because there are
too many variables to be sure either way in the former case and simple
"refusal to accept creation so there must be some other explaination" is the
root cause in the second case since reason dictates otherwise. (but that's
only an opinion :-))

Oxygenated fuel will cause an un-adjusted engine to run lean because there
is less fuel in the fuel to mix with the incoming air but the system is
still feeding the same amount of fuel in carbed engines and the computer
will probably make some adjustments in the case of EFI engines equipped with
O2 sensors but not sure about how well the adjustments work.  Apparently not
too well since every one complains about it in the winter which is when it
is used as I understand it?  Of course we all realize that in winter we burn
more fuel naturally as well due to cold starting and running, especially
when the trips are short (even with EFI) so how much is oxygenated fuel and
how much is winter weather????

People argued about the alchohol added fuel too due to alchohol having 1/3
the btu of Petrol but we all survived :-)  Gasoline is not 100% hydrocarbon
molecules in any case so how much dilution is there actually taking place by
adding 10% alchohol or 5% Oxygenator?  Is there anyone on this list who can
Authoritatively say, who has the last word in the scientific world on this
matter?  Then why are we arguing it?  These are just symptoms of the real
problem and human hands can't fix that....

Why not discuss the results of such practices on our vehicles and not the
unknowns, the theories and scientific arguments etc....

--
Happily Retired (but broke)
Michigan Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

> > No it's not, they added the "oxygenators" to reduce emissions by making
>
>     First of all Bill, there is no need to be rude when you disagree with
> someone.


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:26:02 -0500
From: Ken Payne <kpayne ford-trucks.com>
Subject: Whiter Whites article back on line.


The Steve Delanty article "Whiter Whites, Brighter Brights"
has been removed and is now in tech articles.

Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:33:59 -0800
From: Don Grossman <duckdon mac.com>
Subject: Re: Engine placement


Thanks for the help guys

I am going to shoot for a level carb.  Front and read
driveshafts come off the divorced mounted t-case so the only shaft I
need to worry about is from the tranny to t-case.  It just looked
like the enging needs to be tilted about 5-6deg to the rear for the
carb to sit level and keep the transmission out of the Cab ;)  As
soon as the frost is gone, hack, cut, weld ;)
--
Don Grossman
duckdon mac.com

OS X, Why 2001 won't be like 2001

------------------------------

From: "Bill Beyer" <bbeyer pacifier.com>
Subject: Re: 73-79 F250s
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:52:29 -0800

Both of these websites are nothing but junk science designed to, among other
things, scare the uninformed into jumping out of their horrible fossil fuel
powered vehicles and into worthless electric vehicles, bicycles or public
transportation. There's no need for people to be posting this garbage as
fact when it's obviously wrong. Maybe YOU should take a few moments and do
some research and you'll find that the percentage of O2 in the atmosphere
has remained constant at +/- 21% for the last 3 BILLION years or so. Mankind
isn't about to change it any time soon.

/// Friends help you move...Real friends help you move bodies \\

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael" <danger csolutions.net>
To: <61-79-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 2:56 AM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: 73-79 F250s


>
>     First of all Bill, there is no need to be rude when you disagree with
> someone. Some of the more timid members of this list may be discouraged
from
> posting for fear of replies such as yours.
>
>     I've been with this list for about 3 years and don't usually make
> statements that I can't back up with facts. Mankind has had a negitive
> effect on the contents of the atmosphere ever since he began using fire
> thousands of years ago. The recent industrial era combined with large
human
> population growth & deforestation DOES have an effect on the oxygen
content
> of the atmosphere today. Perhaps you should browse the pages at
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://wings.ucdavis.edu/Book/Atmosphere/instructor/deforestation-01.html
&
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://wings.ucdavis.edu/Book/Atmosphere/instructor/pollution-01.html. You
> can find more information by using the search feature on your favorite
> browser.




------------------------------

From: "GaryBBB" <gpeters3 lni.net>
Subject: Re: Engine placement
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:01:22 -0800


I've heard this both ways so have to take it the way my mind reasons on it
which is the way we should take everything we read or hear :-)  From a
purely mechanical stand point the Ujoint is strongest (by what margin?) when
absolutely straight.  When angles are introduced, mechanical advantage is
also introduced, the more angle the more leverage against the joint etc...At
what angle does it become important?  Who knows?  It's all relative,
straighter is better :-)

We've discussed this many times before but quickly, the reason the tranny
and pinion shafts are supposed to be parallel regardless of drive shaft
angle is to reduce speed oscilations between the joints as it turns
(smoother).  Obviously, the closer you get it to straight the better this
concept works.

As to lubing the bearings, I have an opinion but can't back it up with proof
so won't say it's a fact but if you keep fresh grease in it, the
articulation of the suspension will move it off center enough to keep the
bearings moving and thus lubed, IMHO :-)  All of the ones I've seen which
showed signs of wear in the cups were bone dry or caked so that there was no
lubing affect and it's my own opinion that this was due to rust pitting, not
wear.  Does anyone know what angles the NASCAR guys use?  I would be very
surprised to find that there is any angle allowed at all there?

I read an article which prompted the comment about leaving the pinion a few
degrees low so that when torque is applied the pinion naturally moves upward
(primarily with leaf springs, may not move as much with 4 links).  The idea
was to try to get it to the parallel condition with the transmission under
the most common mode the vehicle will see which is the highway cruise for
most of them.  You can't possibly design it to cover all situations so must
try to optimize for the condition under which most miles are put on for
optimum wear life.

--
Happily Retired (but broke)
Michigan Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

> I have a book bought from Motorbooks I believe, that is about
> engine changes and driveline. It's good reading. It does mention
> that the driveshaft (rear) should have some "bend" at the joints
> to be flexing the lube or the joints get the little ridges from
> the rollers and wear out. The pinion angle on rear should be the
> same as the trans output angle in degrees. They make tools to sit
> on parts and read these angles.


------------------------------

From: "GaryBBB" <gpeters3 lni.net>
Subject: Re: checking rear axle
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:13:00 -0800


Clutch chatter is due to any of several things.  It could just be the
linkage or it could be glazed flywheel face or warped flywheel (not too
likely) or warped pressure plate (a lot more likely) or leaking rear main or
transmission input shaft seals etc....  I replaced a chattering clutch
assuming it had a lot of miles on it but it didn't look all that bad.  The
new one chattered too!##$$%^%^$# so looked at the linkage and discovered the
plastic bushings were gone.  Once I repaired the bell crank bushings and
other link parts the clutch is smooth as can be and feels a lot better when
operating the pedal too.

If you have a bent axle you should be able to jack up the suspect side and
rotate the wheel and see some axial movement in the tire.  If so you need to
put an indicator on the axle face and see if it is actually the axle and not
just a bent rim.  A bent rim will cause some vibration too as will an
unbalanced drive shaft or bent drive shaft.  Remember, the drive shaft turns
at engine speed in high gear so it doesn't need to be very much out of
balace to cause trouble.

--
Happily Retired (but broke)
Michigan Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

> some vibration (including clutch chatter) since I've owned it.
> I've checked
> or replaced everything else in the drivetrain except the
> differential so my
> question is this:
>
> What are the symptoms of a bent axle? Could it cause clutch
> chatter?


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:20:26 -0500
From: Ken Payne <kpayne ford-trucks.com>
Subject: Whiter Whites article back on line.


Opps... that should read:

The Steve Delanty article "Whiter Whites, Brighter Brights"
has been recovered and is now in tech articles.
        ^^^^^^^^^

Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:10:04 -0600
Subject: Re: Engine placement
From: "John LaGrone" <jlagrone ford-trucks.com>


> As to lubing the bearings, I have an opinion but can't back it up with proof
> so won't say it's a fact but if you keep fresh grease in it, the
> articulation of the suspension will move it off center enough to keep the
> bearings moving and thus lubed, IMHO :-)  All of the ones I've seen which
> showed signs of wear in the cups were bone dry or caked so that there was no
> lubing affect and it's my own opinion that this was due to rust pitting, not
> wear.

I was thinking along these same lines. My only extra thoughts are that
unless the suspension is totally absolutely done away with, there is
typically a bend in the driveline at the u-joints. Just moving the vehicle
will require the u-joint bearings to move. Try welding up a solid propeller
shaft with no u-joints and see how far you can travel. Not far. BTDT with a
know-it-all little brother. Very dangerous installation.

-- John
jlagrone ford-trucks.com     <]:-) <]:-)<]:-)<]:-)<]:-)<]:-)
1979 F150 Custom, Long Wide Bed, Regular Cab, 351M, C6 (Henry)
http://www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
Dearborn iron rules!!!!

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:14:48 -0600
Subject: Lincoln help
From: "John LaGrone" <jlagrone ford-trucks.com>


Just a note to say thanks to those who replied to my plea for help. FTE
provided information in 30 minutes that I couldn't find in 4 hours of
surfing the web on Sunday afternoon. FTE is the best. The Best Never Rest.

-- John
jlagrone ford-trucks.com     <]:-) <]:-)<]:-)<]:-)<]:-)<]:-)
1979 F150 Custom, Long Wide Bed, Regular Cab, 351M, C6 (Henry)
http://www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
Dearborn iron rules!!!!

------------------------------

From: "Azie L. Magnusson" <maggie11 HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Engine orientation
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:42:30 -0600

Bill B. writes:  >>  The rear of the carb sits higher. <<

Quite normal for most FOMOCO stock engine configurations from
the factory in my experioence...I've dealt mostly with the Y and FE
types, but that has always been my experience.  The intakes usually
compensate for this rearward "rake"..I haven't really paid that much
attention to the 335 and 385 series..

>>Any advise?<<

No, Not really..but the carb being level would be more critical IMHO..


Azie Magnusson
Ardmore, Al.


------------------------------

From: "Azie L. Magnusson" <maggie11 HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Engine backward rake
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:52:01 -0600

John LsG. writes:  >>I'll agree with Gary on the observations and recommendations, but I always
assumed the engine was lower in the back to facilitate oil return to the
sump from the rocker arm areas.<<

I agree with Gary.  It is to align the drive shaft with the centerline of the rear axle..
Can't remember where I saw this all lined out, but I saw it someplace..


Azie Magnusson
Ardmore, Al.


------------------------------

From: "Azie L. Magnusson" <maggie11 HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Engine rake
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:55:37 -0600

Gary writes:  >>and the rest of the engine due to the pump
cavitation so virtually all competition engines have large capacity oil pans
to offset some of this, along with the high rpm which tends to pull all the
oil up to the top so more is needed to start with so you don't run out under
that condition.<<

Really serious racers use dry sump pans and remote oil reserves
containers..    Don't they???


Azie Magnusson
Ardmore, Al.


------------------------------

From: "Azie L. Magnusson" <maggie11 HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Cams
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:12:38 -0600

I'm currently building a 460 from a '77 F350 Supercab and need some
opinions( now does that open the floor up or what)..  I'd like it to build
its max torque in the 1800-3500 rpm range and be fairly flat over that
range  (cruise and passing ranges), but I'd also like it to still be fairly
strong up to the 5000 - 5500 range. (not run completely out of breath
in other words).  I'll keep this truck for many years I hope and I want
to be happy with it..
Cam recommendations anyone??. Sites for info???  Any insight you can
give will be appreciated.  I'd use the CJ cam of the '69-'70 vintage, but
I don't think it is very strong below 3500 or so and I know it doesn't get
any hint of economical gas mileage.  I'd even consider a roller setup if
someone makes it for torque low end..
I plan to run the E4OD with Baumann Engineering shift module/wiring.

Azie Magnusson
Ardmore, Al.


------------------------------

From: "Bill Beyer" <bbeyer pacifier.com>
Subject: Re: Oxygenators in fuel
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:22:48 -0800

If the oxygen content of the atmosphere were truly decreasing then the first
thing that would happen is we wouldn't be able to light fires anymore.
Second life on earth would cease. Period. Please stop spreading this garbage
on the list because it simply is not true.

Oxygenated fuels are designed to reduce emissions by burning more of the
fuel with less of the oxygen in the atmosphere. They also decrease the mpg
by 2%-5%. If you really want to know more then simply type "oxygenated fuel"
into any internet search engine. You'll learn more than you ever wanted to
know about them.

/// Friends help you move...Real friends help you move bodies \\

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael" <danger csolutions.net>
To: <61-79-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 3:17 AM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: Oxygenators in fuel


>
>     I know very little about oxygenated fuels or photosynthesis, but,...
>
>     Perhaps oxygenated fuels are used in major cities during the winter
> months because plants aren't producing as much oxygen as they normally
would
> during the summer months? It seems like the oxy is used to reduce
emissions
> by avoiding a rich air/fuel mixture. I may be way off base here, but this
> sounds logical to me.
>
>     If anyone could shed more light on the subject of oxygenated fuels,
then
> please do so.




------------------------------

From: "Arnie and his F250 G" <arny_f250 hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: 73-79 F250s
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:28:09 -0600


After reading and re-reading the articles.  All that I get from them is that
they have a vivid imagination and unproven hypothesis.  One-sided studies
are worthless.  To have a complete scientific study you have to have both
sides of the subject.

Arny


From: "Michael" <danger csolutions.net>
Reply-To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
To: <61-79-list ford-trucks.com>
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: 73-79 F250s
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 02:56:46 -0800


----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Beyer" <bbeyer pacifier.com>
To: <61-79-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2001 3:06 PM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: 73-79 F250s


> No it's not, they added the "oxygenators" to reduce emissions by making
the
> combustion process more efficient. There's no less oxygen in the air now
> than there was 30 years ago or 300 or 3000 or 3,000,000 for that matter.
I
> have no idea what made this person think there is but I have a pretty
good
> idea which orifice he's talking out of.

    First of all Bill, there is no need to be rude when you disagree with
someone. Some of the more timid members of this list may be discouraged from
posting for fear of replies such as yours.

    I've been with this list for about 3 years and don't usually make
statements that I can't back up with facts. Mankind has had a negitive
effect on the contents of the atmosphere ever since he began using fire
thousands of years ago. The recent industrial era combined with large human
population growth & deforestation DOES have an effect on the oxygen content
of the atmosphere today. Perhaps you should browse the pages at
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://wings.ucdavis.edu/Book/Atmosphere/instructor/deforestation-01.html &
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://wings.ucdavis.edu/Book/Atmosphere/instructor/pollution-01.html. You
can find more information by using the search feature on your favorite
browser.


Michael
69 F250 390 4V, T18, 3.54 LS
69 F250 390 4V, C6, 4.11
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.csolutions.net/myth/ford/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://explorer.msn.com


------------------------------

From: "Bill Beyer" <bbeyer pacifier.com>
Subject: Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:47:06 -0800

I have been on this list continuously for more than 3 years. The people on
this list for the most part are very knowledgeable about Ford trucks and I
have learned a great deal. I have also tried to pass on some of my knowledge
and experience to those who are new to the hobby or to automotive mechanics
in general. As with any group of people we all have our own thoughts and
belief systems outside of our hobby and tolerance should be everyone's
watchword in order to keep the peace.

I draw the line however at patently false information being passed on as
"fact". There are absolutely not as many "experts" out there who say there's
less oxygen in the atmosphere today than there was 30 years ago. If you find
even 1 qualified scientist who says that then I'd be shocked to say the
least. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone who's even tried to measure it
since the number of samples you'd have to take at different altitudes and
different locations is unbelievably large. There are plenty of "chicken
little scientists" who say that we're destroying the rain forest and
therefore we must be reducing the amount of oxygen that is produced but they
have zero proof to back it up.

Meanwhile what they don't tell you is that if the amount of O2 in the
atmosphere were to drop 3%-5% then it would be almost impossible to maintain
combustion short of adding compressed O2 to every fire. Has anyone noticed
it getting more difficult to light a match lately? Likewise if the amount of
O2 were to increase by the same amount then even wetlands would be subject
to spontaneous combustion. I'd say that the evidence presented by our own
senses tells us that we don't have any O2 shortage issues.

Sorry about the rant. Now back to our regularly scheduled discussions...

/// Friends help you move...Real friends help you move bodies \\

----- Original Message -----
From: "GaryBBB" <gpeters3 lni.net>
To: <61-79-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 10:26 AM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness


>
> I do agree that rudeness is not appropriate here since it is a "Forum" for
> discussion but.....some individuals obviously just like to hear themselves
> talk and say things that are not based on any real facts.....they state
> their opinion as if it were fact.  We all need to be careful about that
> since it is a human tendency we all have to fight.  I sometimes find
myself
> deleting a post before sending it after proof reading and realizing I
don't
> really know what I'm talking about :-)  If one does make this mistake then
> let's be a little more gentle in correcting him (or simply ignor the
> mistake) and, let those who are corrected be a little more manly and
accept
> correction without getting our feelings hurt, OK?
>
> The fact is that there are as many "Experts" who say there is less oxygen
as
> there are who say it's more or unchanged just as there are "Experts" who
say
> we evolved from apes.  Arguing these points is fruitless because there are
> too many variables to be sure either way in the former case and simple
> "refusal to accept creation so there must be some other explaination" is
the
> root cause in the second case since reason dictates otherwise. (but that's
> only an opinion :-))




------------------------------

From: "Azie L. Magnusson" <maggie11 HiWAAY.net>
Subject: E4OD
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:55:23 -0600

Anyone with a '96 or later version of E4OD that they want to sell???
Must be within a couple of hundred miles or so from me.
I'm located on the Alabama/Tennessee state line and 2 miles
E of I65..
Send E mail with condition and price to : Maggie11 Hiwaay.net..

Azie Magnusson
Ardmore, Al.


------------------------------

From: "Azie L. Magnusson" <maggie11 HiWAAY.net>
Subject: E4OD
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:57:20 -0600

Oh yeah!!!!  It has to have the 460 bellhousing...
>>
Anyone with a '96 or later version of E4OD that they want to sell???
Must be within a couple of hundred miles or so from me.
I'm located on the Alabama/Tennessee state line and 2 miles
E of I65..
Send E mail with condition and price to : Maggie11 Hiwaay.net..<<


Azie Magnusson
Ardmore, Al.


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:08:49 -0500
From: "Huston, Virgil H." <vhhuston switch.com>
Subject: Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness


Besides being a redneck Ford pick up driver, I also have a graduate degree
in ecological anthropology. I've done a lot of study on the climate change
issues and have found absolutely no credible evidence that there is global
warming, oxygen depletion, etc. The evidence is just not there. The real
question is why do many "scientists" seek to make this an issue. I guess so
that my preemissions trucks will have to be recycled, but why they hate them
I'll never know.

Virgil


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:14:18 -0800
From: Don Grossman <duckdon mac.com>
Subject: T-98


I gots another one for all you drive train wiz kids out there.

On the input shaft are there supposed to be any seals or any gaskets
between the snout and the case of the transmission?

There doesn't seem to be any remains of a seal or gasket or milling
for any but I just wanted to be sure.

Any parts lists or diagrams or place to find them would be great for
future reference.

Don

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:24:12 -0600
Subject: Re: T-98
From: "John LaGrone" <jlagrone ford-trucks.com>


>
> I gots another one for all you drive train wiz kids out there.
>
> On the input shaft are there supposed to be any seals or any gaskets
> between the snout and the case of the transmission?
>
> There doesn't seem to be any remains of a seal or gasket or milling
> for any but I just wanted to be sure.
>
> Any parts lists or diagrams or place to find them would be great for
> future reference.
>
> Don

Automatics have the front transmission seal where the torque converter
inserts into the front pump. The seal mounts in the case and runs on the
torque converter. The rear seal mounts in the case and runs on the drive
shaft. I know that's not exactly what you asked as a T-98 is manual. I would
think it has to have a seal near the pilot bearing.

-- John
jlagrone ford-trucks.com     <]:-) <]:-)<]:-)<]:-)<]:-)<]:-)
1979 F150 Custom, Long Wide Bed, Regular Cab, 351M, C6 (Henry)
http://www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
Dearborn iron rules!!!!


------------------------------

From: "wish" <wish ford-trucks.net>
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 21:55:13 GMT
Subject: Re: Electronic ignition


>My re-built 390 motor with re-built carb feels like it misses a beat when at
idle.  Tried all the usual adjustments and nothing seems to work.  Since everything
else is new....thought this might be a solution.
>
>

I was having this problem too, turned out it was bad wires, but also went with
the larger cap, this did 2 things for me ..

1) larger cap, less chance of crossfire or leakage or whatever you want to call
it

2) the wires actually have 90° boots on the distributor side so they will
point the direction they need to go, not just 90° boots with straight ends,
they're true 90° ends!

The wires I got were for a 400 with the 135° sparkplug end too., they seem
about the right length, maybe a shade long on the back side.

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4   6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: "wish" <wish ford-trucks.net>
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 21:58:46 GMT
Subject: Re: Engine rake


>Really serious racers use dry sump pans and remote oil reserves
>containers..    Don't they???
>

Yes!  It allows the motor to sit lower in the chassis, hence lowering the center
of gravity, it also frees up some of your ability to feed oil in high G situations
because you can put the pump pickup wherever you need it inside the reservoir,
or pressurize the reservoir a bit too ...

Oh yeah and cooling capacity of the oil is improved by using this setup as well,
the entire tank can be put in an air path to help cool it, and a radiator can
be run separately as well.

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4   6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: "Bill Beyer" <bbeyer pacifier.com>
Subject: Re: Engine rake
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:01:19 -0800

It also allows them to carry more than twice the amount of oil of a wet sump
system which aids in the cooling.

/// Friends help you move...Real friends help you move bodies \\

----- Original Message -----
From: "wish" <wish ford-trucks.net>
To: <61-79-list ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 1:58 PM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: Engine rake


>
> >Really serious racers use dry sump pans and remote oil reserves
> >containers..    Don't they???
> >
>
> Yes!  It allows the motor to sit lower in the chassis, hence lowering the
center
> of gravity, it also frees up some of your ability to feed oil in high G
situations
> because you can put the pump pickup wherever you need it inside the
reservoir,
> or pressurize the reservoir a bit too ...
>
> Oh yeah and cooling capacity of the oil is improved by using this setup as
well,
> the entire tank can be put in an air path to help cool it, and a radiator
can
> be run separately as well.




------------------------------

From: "Arnie and his F250 G" <arny_f250 hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:12:12 -0600



>If one does make this mistake then let's be a little more gentle in
>correcting him (or simply ignore the mistake) and, let those who are >
>corrected be a little more manly and accept correction without getting our
>feelings hurt, OK?



I have to draw the line, put my foot down, and every other phrase, and say
NO..NO..NO.  Enough with the kind and gentle approach it doesn’t work.
Statements like that only lead in one direction.  And that direction is the
direction that leads to laws based on junk science and to the restriction
and eventual elimination of our vehicles.  As some of the other posts have
said it only leads credibility to the non-informed.  Junk science has been
pushed on us as long as some of our trucks have been around.  And I for one
have had enough (PERIOD)

_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://explorer.msn.com


------------------------------

From: "Jason Derra" <derrar internetcds.com>
Subject: Re: T-98
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:23:40 -0800




> > There doesn't seem to be any remains of a seal or gasket or milling
> > for any but I just wanted to be sure.

There should be a gasket between the input shaft bearing retainer and the
case.
Not sure on the T98, but some of those gaskets are used as shims for the
input shaft.  You may need to stack a couple of gaskets to make it work.
Some bearing retainers also have seals to keep oil from migrating up the
input shaft to the clutch.

Jason
'69 Bronco 5.0 HO EFI, NP435
'96 F250 Ext Cab 4WD Powerstroke
'77 F150 4WD 429
"As fast as necessary, as slow as possible"



------------------------------

From: "GaryBBB" <gpeters3 lni.net>
Subject: Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:45:19 -0800


I agree with you Bill, I was actually speaking about personal comments of
the list members, not gargage some scientist was able to publish for
personal financial gain.  We could probably write our own book on that
subject alone....:-(

--
Happily Retired (but broke)
Michigan Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

> I draw the line however at patently false information being passed on as
> "fact".


------------------------------

From: "GaryBBB" <gpeters3 lni.net>
Subject: Re: Oxygenators in fuel
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:47:12 -0800


Again, I agree.  I read somewhere that less than 1% change in the oxygen
could cause serious problems for life as we know it....

--
Happily Retired (but broke)
Michigan Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

> Second life on earth would cease. Period. Please stop spreading
> this garbage
> on the list because it simply is not true.


------------------------------

From: "John Webster" <jwebster tnt21.com>
Subject: Re: Whiter Whites
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:55:33 -0500

Thanks Ken, it was one of the best low cost improvments I've made to my truck.

John
'77 F150 4X4 466/C6/4:11's/33's

The Steve Delanty article "Whiter Whites, Brighter Brights"
has been recovered and is now in tech articles.



------------------------------

From: "GaryBBB" <gpeters3 lni.net>
Subject: Re: Oxygenated fuel, rudeness
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:04:16 -0800


The person who brought this phony info to our attention thought he was doing
something good.  My point is that he, that person, should not be run out of
town on a rail because he made a mistake.  The phonies OTOH deserve more
than can be discussed in a family forum.......

Ken often reminds us not to spread Urban legends.  What this all really
means is that we need to really think about such info before foisting it on
the list.  Perhaps asking the list about it would be a better way than
proposing it as fact or using it in an argument for our cause, eh?

--
Happily Retired (but broke)
Michigan Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

> I have to draw the line, put my foot down, and every other
> phrase, and say
> NO..NO..NO.  Enough with the kind and gentle approach it doesn’t work.
> Statements like that only lead in one direction.  And that
> direction is the
> direction that leads to laws based on junk science and to the restriction


------------------------------

From: "John Webster" <jwebster tnt21.com>
Subject: Re: Cams
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:12:16 -0500

I was speaking with the Ford Motorsport Tech about converters and we ended up discussing cams. For a fairly stock: reasonable compression, large chamber heads ect., he recommended a cam with a longer duration exhaust cycle. The 460's need help on the exhaust side of the equation to clear the cylinder. Comp Cams makes a "Dual Energy Cam" which is for the 1500 to 5750 rpm range - the 265DEH. It's intake duration is 265 and exhaust is 275. I run a Comp's Cam but any company that supplies this sort of grind would be good. www.compcams.com & www.cranecams.com have good web sites. A roller set-up is really nice in that you can have steeper ramp up and still maintain a good idle and valve train stability but you pay for the privilege. Try to avoid the solid bumpsticks unless you really enjoy tinkering. Just some food for thought.

John
'77 F150 4X4 466/C6/4:11's/33's ....


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