fordtrucks61-79-digest Thursday, April 9 1998 Volume 02 : Number 206



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks Digest
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In this issue:

Re: Engine ID lost ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
'64 F100 for sale [bobherring juno.com]
Re: '64 F100 for sale [Ractrk002 ]
FW: RE: Aluminum Heads ["Hogan, Tom" ]
A few Dana 60 Questions [BDIJXS ]
FMS Rear Disc brake conversion... ["Sam Weatherby" ]
Re: A few Dana 60 Questions [james oxley ]
Re: converting to electronic ignition [DGholsM ]
Re: converting to electronic ignition [BlueOval77 ]
Tightening order & Torque [Jeff ]
Re: Deacons '76 ["Deacon" ]
RE: Still looking for trim!!!! [DC Beatty ]
ADMIN: EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Provider cost increases, missing digests and more [Ken Payne
Re: ADMIN: EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Provider cost increases, missing digests and more [Keith Srb
Re: A few Dana 60 Questions [danadeb pacbell.net]
Re: Deacons '76 [danadeb pacbell.net]
Re: converting to electronic ignition [Don Grossman ]
Re: Deacons '76 ["Deacon" ]

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 08:59:24 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: Engine ID lost

> From: Ractrk002
> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 16:32:58 EDT
> Subject: Re: Engine ID lost

> 360's were used before 1970 I know a guy from school that has one, I
> belive it is a 69 also'. My 1969 F100 (late 69 August or September)

My brother had a 68 F-250, brand new and it came with a 360 FE
engine. I believe that may have been the first year since I've had
67 and 68 F-100's that still had 352's in them.

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 11:40:24 EDT
From: bobherring juno.com
Subject: '64 F100 for sale

Hello. I am new to this list and am not sure if this post is off-topic or
not.
If so, please let me know.
I have a 64 F100 short/wide that I bought for my son 7 or 8 years ago. It
came with a 292 and 3 on the column. The 292 is in a pile of parts in the
back.
The rest is in fair shape.
I need to sell it and thought this list would be a good place to start.

Thanks, Bobby Herring
Waco, Texas
BobHerring Juno.com

1972 F-100 400 C6(in progress)
1964 F-100

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 15:35:02 EDT
From: Ractrk002
Subject: Re: '64 F100 for sale

How much for the 64 F100?

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:09:56 -0700
From: "Hogan, Tom"
Subject: FW: RE: Aluminum Heads

I'm resending this because I believe it was lost in the mail.


> Keith,
>
> To repeat what I have heard/read:
> Aluminum is cheaper/easier to work with so aftermarket mfgs like it
> better. Aluminum also transfers heat faster than cast. This has
> advantages and disadvantages. The faster heat transfer helps prevent
> detonation and allows about .5 to 1 point higher static compression
> ratio -- good. The faster heat transfer also acts as a huge heat sink
> to suck heat out of the combustion chamber. This leads to less
> efficient transfer of power to the piston -- bad. The thought is that
> with the higher compression and better design, the power gains of the
> new head can offset the losses of the aluminum. These losses could
> also be real but negligable. Cast iron is said to reject heat better
> and keep it in the combustion chamber where it can work on the piston.
>
> Another thing about aluminum is electrolysis. When two dissimilar
> metals (iron block, aluminum heads) are used and heated as in an
> engine the electrolysis process can speed the rusting of the block and
> erosion of metal from the aluminum. This occurs with aluminum intake
> manifolds as well. This is mainly a problem if pure water is used as
> a coolant. Todays antifreezes have additives to prevent this.
>
> Again this is me regurgitating information I have read or heard. If I
> have made any blatant errors I'm sure I can count on the more
> knowledgable members to correct me for the good of the list.
>
> Tom H.
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 11:15:47 -0700
> From: Keith Srb
> Subject: Aluminum Heads
>
> Other then the oblivious savings in weight, are there any other
> advantages
> to using aluminum heads??
>
> Later
>
> Keith Srbherbie netvalue.net
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:31:32 EDT
From: BDIJXS
Subject: A few Dana 60 Questions

For those F-250 Dana 60 (rear axle) experts...

1) What size are the threads on the lug studs, 1/2", or 9/16"? If they are
9/16", can you replace them with 1/2"? (my front axle lugs are 1/2")
2) Are the spring perches and shock mounts the same from say, between 1967 and
1974 or later? Ox, I thought you might have said 77?
3) Are there various spindle/hub setups that are more desirable than others?
For example, isn't there a heavy-duty version (maybe Camper Special or F-350?)
with larger brake drums?
4) Are these spindles/hubs/backplates interchangeble between most of the full
floater housings?
5) I currently have a semi-floater Dana 60 (5 lug axles) and am hoping that
the E-brake cables will work with the new axle....anyone know what the chances
are?????

In short, I am beginning in earnest a search for a Dana 60 and want to know
what to look out for....

Thats all for now...

Thanks!

Colorado Jeff

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 14:10:32 -0700
From: "Sam Weatherby"
Subject: FMS Rear Disc brake conversion...

Looking on page 60 of the April '98 edition of Mustang and Fords I see there
is a new disc brake kit out.

It is made be Ford fits all truck and big car 8.8 and 9" rears.
It is the same setiup that is stock on the explorers...
In theory, it should be east to go to a salvage yard and find some pieces...

Any thoughts?
-srw

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 17:35:28 -0700
From: james oxley
Subject: Re: A few Dana 60 Questions

BDIJXS wrote:
>
> For those F-250 Dana 60 (rear axle) experts...
>
> 1) What size are the threads on the lug studs, 1/2", or 9/16"? If they are
> 9/16", can you replace them with 1/2"? (my front axle lugs are 1/2")

1/2 inch, but we just grabbed one from a 84 and it looked like 9/16.
First one I've seen with 9/16. Also didn't have 60 stamped in webbing,
but cover looked exactly like the one we scarfed the same day from a 77.

> 2) Are the spring perches and shock mounts the same from say, between 1967 and
> 1974 or later?

I heard 77.5 they changed spring pad (maybe springs too) width and perch
width. I got one from 77 marked 2/77 on door tag and it had 3" wide
springs, correct spring perch and correct shock mounts. Not sure about
pre-77, as I only owned a 69 breifly, my dad gave me and I traded it for
body parts for my 78.

> 3) Are there various spindle/hub setups that are more desirable than others?

Don't think so, but don't know for sure. I guess if drums are wider,
spindles must be longer.

> For example, isn't there a heavy-duty version (maybe Camper Special or F-350?)
> with larger brake drums?

Maybe this is what the 84 had. It was a 60, but seemed to be larger
with 3" drums and 9/16 studs. We thought it was a 70 or F-10.25, but diff
cover was the same as other 60's.

> 4) Are these spindles/hubs/backplates interchangeble between most of the full
> floater housings?

No, they are welded on.

>5) I currently have a semi-floater Dana 60 (5 lug axles) and am hoping
>that
>the E-brake cables will work with the new axle....anyone know what the
>chances are?????

Just get cables with it. If you get it at U-pull-it yard, you can get
anything you want. These type yards are my favorite and the cheapest. We
get them to go into Bronc's, so we can't use E-cables, but you could.

OX

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 18:06:05 EDT
From: DGholsM
Subject: Re: converting to electronic ignition

I'm a forklift Mechanic and I converted all of my company's older lifts with
the Petronix Brand because they were so reliable and I hadn't had any problems
with them and as soonas I saw an ad in Kar Krafters magazine I immediately
ordered a kit for my 71 F350. Simple and no problems.



dmg
71 F350 W/360
77 Lincoln W/460

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 18:34:05 EDT
From: BlueOval77
Subject: Re: converting to electronic ignition

Hi. I missed the original letter, but saw this one. Just wanted to let you
know I have a '77 F-150 that I swapped a 351W into and then converted that to
elec. ign. w/a DUI (Davis Unified Ignition) dist. which I am more than pleased
with.

In addition to matching the curve to your cam, they also will match it to the
weight of your truck and may require a few other misc. details. Good luck
w/your swap!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 19:16:19 -0400
From: Jeff
Subject: Tightening order & Torque

Time to dip into the pool of knowledge. I've been told that there is a
specific sequence
that the bolts need to be removed/tightened on 240's and 300's. Could
someone please
tell me what that sequence is and what the torque values are? Thank you
all VERY much.

Sifu Jeff

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:51:37 -0700
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: Deacons '76

- -----Original Message-----
From: sdelanty
> How long has it been unregistered?

When I checked last Oct. it had been just over a year and they
wanted $350 + tax. This isn't all that much considering I got it $1200
and it blue books for $4000. What I wanted was a donor F250 for my '73,
what I got was an F372 (cab & frame as defined by a list member). When a
list member said it had a heavy duty frame I took a look at it and found
it to be a lot more frame than my '73 F100. This started me thinking of
keeping it as is, but the ever evolving "Smog check" laws changed my
mind.

The music world lost Drummer Cozy Powell who had played with Jeff
Beck, Black Sabbath, Rainbow and Whitesnake, in a car crash and Punk
rocker Wendy O. Williams of the Plasmatics commits suicide.

Give me my freedom for as long as I be.
All I ask of living is to have no chains on me,
and all I ask of dying is to go naturally.

Deacon
deconblu gte.net
=========================================================
If you ain't makin' waves, you ain't kickin' hard enough!
=========================================================
Deacon's
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home1.gte.net/deconblu/

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 20:40:39 -0400
From: DC Beatty
Subject: RE: Still looking for trim!!!!

Trim is a tough one. I don't think anybody makes it aftermarket. I've nev=
er
even seen any offered. The only thing I, in my less than professional
opinion, could suggest is scrounge for good pieces in the yards or consul=
t
with a body shop about fixing the trim you have, that is if you have any.=


Best of luck,

Drew Beatty
1967 F100 352
1974 Maverick 302



you wrote>>
I am still looking for some side trim for a 66 F-100 long bed. I have
tried
all the shops and suppliers known to man. If any has some for sale or any=

ideas, please help me, I just painted it this weekend.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 23:04:40 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: ADMIN: EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Provider cost increases, missing digests and more

PLEASE READ THIS POST - THIS DIRECTLY AFFECTS THE LISTS!!!!
It's very long but extremely important.
==================================================================

As many may have noticed, digests for several lists have been
"lost" over the last several weeks and yesterday, the 61-79 list
had 2 digests disappear into the bit bucket. Additionally, some
posts never made it to either list last night. Sorry, but they
aren't recoverable.

We emailed Esosoft (our list server provider) about this and got
this reply:

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
The list service server had some problems with having over 200 zombie
processes running. Normal operation has about 2-3. This has been corrected.
However the list service server is always running high volume which means he
is quite busy. This is because there are some lists on this server where
each list is using about 20-25% of the total capacity of the whole server.
We have brought this to the attention of our management, but until they
make decision it will take its time.

However we see that such things happen quite often and therefore our
management decided that such kind of lists cannot cause problems for all
other lists on our servers. The only possibility to change this is the
change of our pricing structure. Those new things are planned to go
official around June, July....

I see you are currently having 5 lists with us. After the change your lists
will cost at least $50.00 per month. Charged will be according the messages
you send through our servers (number of subscribers X post).

After this date you really should consider switching to a VS type A. First
it will only cost $45.00 per month. Second your are running in your
complete own environment. This means no other customer on this server can
consume your resources. And there is no limit on the number of messages you
are going to send. Also you can create as much lists you want without any
extra cost. Of course you will be limited by the resources, however such a
server can handle around 30-40 lists without any problems.

If for example a 6,000 member mailing list posts to the server where you
are hosted you will notice he will slow down, but on your Virtual Server
such a thing can't happen....

You also have a $7 account with us. This means you can also put this
account onto your server. If you want we can also install our enhanced
Majordomo (includes a little setup program for mailing lists) to your
server which will cost a one-time $25.00 setup fee. Second your lists will
run under own domain name. You probably know the setup fee for a Virtual
Server is $50.00, however if you use our virtual hosting service, the setup
cost will be only $25.00.

Contact sales Esosoft.com for more information about our Virtual Server
Service.

Regards

Andrew Gordon
Esosoft Support
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------

What this means is our costs will more than double. Most likely
they will triple because some of the lists (61-79 and 80-96) are
high volume lists with many members. Current expenses are slightly
over $50/month and will go to $100-$150/month. We cannot justify
the increases. We are going to check into getting a virtual
server, either from Esosoft or another company. This will increase
our costs, but to a lesser extent than what Esosoft is proposing
with their list price increases.

In the meantime, until we find another solution, we're asking list
members to keep traffic down on the 80-96 and 61-79 lists by
not sending "I agree" and "me too" posts. Also, please trim
down long original messages when replying to them. Failure to
do this will only make things worse and cause more lost digests.

To offset costs, we're asking those that can, to buy one (or
more) of our static cling auto window stickers or the Restoration
Resources guide we sell. Info can be found at:

http://www.ford-trucks.com/products/index.shtml

As always, we will not play favorites with those who buy something.
We will not charge for list services, if you're broke, don't
worry about it.

And more bad news....
Free Web Space Notice:

Sorry to tell everyone this after making the web space announcement
just a couple of days ago. We have been made aware that we cannot
allow others to access the web site unless we get a re seller account
with Dezines.com (our web provider). Naturally, this costs more.

Here's what Dezines Acceptable Use Policy States:
"16. Client is allowed to resell the storage and transfer services
provided by DeZines. Client agrees to handle and is responsible
for all third-party customer's content, support, set-up and
maintenance. DeZines agrees to Reseller pricing as described on
the Price and Terms Sheet, provided that client has at least one
other non-resold EXPERT Virtual account with DeZines. Client agrees
to having the necessary additional knowledge and skill level for
the reselling services provided. The Client's clients shall not
contact DeZines under any circumstances."

Although we are not reselling space, we are, in essence, providing
the same service as a reseller and could lose the account because
of it. The only solution to both this problem and the mailing list
problem is a virtual server. Finding another list provider is
out of the question as Esosoft is the cheapest in the industry.
We'll have to provide the lists and web space ourselves with a virtual
server. With this in mind, free web space has been put on hold
until we get a virtual server. Expect to see a transition in
2-3 weeks when we switch providers. We may be down for a day
or two but we hope to overlap services so this won't happen. The
good news is with a virtual server we'll be able to add more lists
without increasing costs on a per/list basis.

A move to a virtual server will happen ASAP. We're not waiting
around until the last minute. We had a feeling this was coming, no
one can afford to provide mailing list services for $5/list per
month and keep their systems from bogging down.

Your help would be appreciated as our startup costs (from a quick
glance on Yahoo.com) aren't going to be cheap. Most want a setup
fee plus several months prepaid.

Please do not send "donations." We're not a charity and we'd rather
have you buy stickers or books. If you send $10 (or more), remember
to specify whether you are buying one sticker for $10 or 3 for $3.33
each!

We're in a jam and we hope to get out of it soon. We'll keep the
members updated as to our progress. Offers for free web hosting,
as has happened in the past, will most likely be declined. Our
mailing lists generate 10,000-20,000+ emails daily, the (very
popular) web site has transfers in excess of 4 gigabytes/month and
our disk usage is increasing each month. This is not a small site
and the burden is too much to pawn off on someone.

If you must reply to this email via the lists, trim it down to
the parts you're replying to. We'd prefer that you send comments
privately to kpayne mindspring.com in order to keep list activity
down.

Regards,
Ken and Peggy Payne
CoAdmins, Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 20:15:53 -0700
From: Keith Srb
Subject: Re: ADMIN: EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Provider cost increases, missing digests and more

At 11:04 PM 4/8/98 -0400, you wrote:
>PLEASE READ THIS POST - THIS DIRECTLY AFFECTS THE LISTS!!!!
>
>http://www.ford-trucks.com/products/index.shtml

Ken and Peggy

Is this page up yet? I tried several time to bring it up in Netscape, with
no luck.

This whole situation BITES! BUMMER! Oh well such is life.

As soon as I can find something to buy from you guys I will. If nothing
else, I will buy one of the stickers for $50.00.

On a brighter note, I am going to try and get all of my Travel arrangements
to go to pigeon forge made tomorrow. :) :) :) YES!

I will try and get something bought from you in a day or two.

Thank you, BOTH OF YOU!, for doing all of this work, having all of these
worries and things so we can enjoy the web site and lists.

Chat with you later.

Keith

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 21:01:25 -0700
From: danadeb pacbell.net
Subject: Re: A few Dana 60 Questions

BDIJXS wrote:
>
> For those F-250 Dana 60 (rear axle) experts...
>
> 1) What size are the threads on the lug studs, 1/2", or 9/16"? If they are
> 9/16", can you replace them with 1/2"? (my front axle lugs are 1/2")

don't know!

> 2) Are the spring perches and shock mounts the same from say, between 1967 and
> 1974 or later? Ox, I thought you might have said 77?

My understanding is that the 73 and up Dana 60 rear is wider from hub to hub
then the 72 and below.



> 3) Are there various spindle/hub setups that are more desirable than others?
> For example, isn't there a heavy-duty version (maybe Camper Special or F-350?)
> with larger brake drums?

Mid 69 there was a change don't know what it is. The 70 to 72 uses the same hub
for standard braking and HD braking the drum is different for the HD, maybe the
backing plate too.


> 4) Are these spindles/hubs/backplates interchangeble between most of the full
> floater housings?

Hard to say!

> 5) I currently have a semi-floater Dana 60 (5 lug axles) and am hoping that
> the E-brake cables will work with the new axle....anyone know what the chances
> are?????


50/50

Good luck
Dana

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 21:10:40 -0700
From: danadeb pacbell.net
Subject: Re: Deacons '76

Deacon wrote:
> but the ever evolving "Smog check" laws changed my
> mind.
>

What are you saying? Are you getting rid of your '73 F352?

I thought you were exempt if it was 73 and older?

Dana

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 21:56:30 -0800
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: converting to electronic ignition

Hey Dana

I missed the Duraspark upgrade for the 292. Is it something Ford kept
a secret until the 70's? ;)

I want some more details. Not that I have an interest in the 292, just
wanted to know.


- --
Don Grossman
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://206.184.7.89
ftp://206.184.7.89/files
The above IP is my home computer address. It is only accessible while I
am online.
I am online some time between the hours of 5-9PM Pacific M-F and on and
off during the weekend.
duckdon pacific.net

63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 22:29:58 -0700....

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