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Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 09:38:22 -0700 (MST)
From: owner-fordtrucks61-79-digest ListService.net (fordtrucks61-79-digest)
To: fordtrucks61-79-digest ListService.net
Subject: fordtrucks61-79-digest V2 #174
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fordtrucks61-79-digest Monday, March 23 1998 Volume 02 : Number 174



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks Digest
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=======================================================================
In this issue:

Re: Question on FE's and Small Blocks [Ken Payne ]
Re: Power Steering Problems [Jim Craig ]
Re: starter problems [sbest ]
Re: HOT STARTS [sbest ]
swaybars [sbest ]
Re: Engine Theory [sbest ]
Re: Those Pesty FE Exhaust Manifold Bolts ["Gary, 78 BBB"
[none] [pickup65 juno.com (Jon E Purut)]
RE: 302 Swap ["Charles" ]
Grass Valley CrewCab Gathering [Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFR]
RE: strokes, or the continueing debate ["Gary, 78 BBB"
Re: HOT STARTS ["Arnold Gladwell" ]
Re: Power Steering Problems ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: [danadeb pacbell.net]
RE: 460 Dual Plug [Sleddog ]
RE: a cold one! was KEN ADMIN. QUESTION [Sleddog ]
RE: 4V Heads and Engine Stroke [Sleddog ]
RE: Message from Deacon [Sleddog ]
Re: Message from Deacon. ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re:Oil Pressure Problem (fixed!) [tfmf211 murphyfarms.com]
Autolite 4100 [John MacNamara ]
Re: Autolite 4100 [Stu Varner ]
Re: HOT STARTS ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: HOT STARTS ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: duraspark timing retard [Mike Schwall ]

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 06:27:36 -0500
From: Ken Payne
Subject: Re: Question on FE's and Small Blocks

At 07:29 PM 3/22/98 -0800, you wrote:
>From: Joe DeLaurentis
>>I am wondering if FE Motors changed the mounting holes on the lower
>>pulley from 3 bolts to 4 bolts in 70 and later motors like the small
>>block Fords did???Thats one easy way to tell if your small block is
>>earlier than 70 it will have only 3 mounting bolts.....Would like
>>to know since my FE motor has 3 bolts
>
>My '76 FE has a three bolt pulley and my '73 302 has a four bolt pulley.
>so I guess they didn't.
>
>Deacon Blues deconblu gte.net

My FE has a 4 bolt pulley. Its from an LTD.

Ken

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 06:42:56 -0600
From: Jim Craig
Subject: Re: Power Steering Problems

The Pulley is the stock press on type off the core. The old pump began to
do this as well as pulsate while turning, that's why I scrapped it. The
lack of power assist at idle is far worse now. While idling in Park, I can
literally hang on the steering wheel w/o it turning. With the engine off,
I'd have better luck trying to kill a bear with a slingshot. I hate the
idea of setting the idle to 1000 RPM because she looses that cool rumble : ).

Jimbo

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 15:32:51 -0400
From: sbest
Subject: Re: starter problems

>From: Casey Vandor
>
>Ok the battery is new last March, a die hard 750 amp, so I will check
>the wires. I did clean the wires about 6 months ago (alot can happen in
>that time i know) And they look fairly clean. I will scrape the posts
>tomorrow and the ends and see what happens. What i don't understand is
>why the first 4 times it just "clicks" and then on the 5 time, it
>starts. I was thinking loose connection to the starter or maybe the
>ground? I will check these again and let you know what I find.
>
>Thanks
>Casey


It looks like your email address is from Alaska, is this right?
Is it much below freezing at this time? It could be you starter is
just froze up. Happens to me in -20c or colder weather.

The current going through coils and windings warms up the starter and
thaws it out enough to start. A permenent fix may be to tear it apart,
clean all the grease, oil and water out of it and replace it with
synthetic stuff but I have never tried that, I just hit the key for
a few secs, wait and then try it again. Done it for years.

This could be compounded by bad connections, weak battery or
other factors, but if it is this cold, this sounds like it.


Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest glinx.com
4 wheel drive van page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.glinx.com/users/sbest
Tire chains, camping gear, tools and first aid stuff too...

Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest glinx.com
6.9 litre diesel Ford van, full-time 4 wheel drive
"Hang on kids, we're going through..."
4 wheel drive van page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.glinx.com/users/sbest
Tire chains, camping gear, tools and first aid stuff too...

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 15:32:55 -0400
From: sbest
Subject: Re: HOT STARTS

>The engine doesn't even need to be all that warmed up.
>
>My theories are as follows;
>
>1) Starter getting too warm causing hard cranking.
>2) Battery on the weak side.
>3) Too many connections in line with the starter motor.(460 starters
> have a starter solenoid / gear throwout mounted on them then if you
> put the engine in a 72-older you usually hook that up to the
> existing solenoid = lots of voltage / amperage loss )
>4) Too much initial advance ( not enough cranking retard for the
> duraspark crowd , there is a module that provides 16 deg retard if
> anyone wants to know I will call the manufacture and get the number)
>
>I think that any one of these theories could cause the problem.
>I have not tried to resolve the problem on my truck since it happens so
>seldom and I usually just work around it.
>
>Dana

I had this problem with a 70 351C 4v and I know exactly what the
problem was. The 11:1 compression engine had a (smaller flywheel)
C4 transmission swapped onto the back of it. This reduction in
cranking power coupled with the high compression and plenty of
ignition advance was "kicking back" as the engine turned over, keeping
it from attaining sufficient RPM to start when hot.

My fix? It was still a "points" system, I wired a "kill" button under
the dash and when the engine got balky, I held down on this button
as it cranked over. When I released the "kill" button (while still
cranking) the engine always started.


Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest glinx.com
4 wheel drive van page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.glinx.com/users/sbest
Tire chains, camping gear, tools and first aid stuff too...

Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest glinx.com
6.9 litre diesel Ford van, full-time 4 wheel drive
"Hang on kids, we're going through..."
4 wheel drive van page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.glinx.com/users/sbest
Tire chains, camping gear, tools and first aid stuff too...

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 15:33:05 -0400
From: sbest
Subject: swaybars

> FTE content, has anyone here had success with sway bars on a
> 67-72 F100? Was it worth it? I've been seriously thinking about
> adding them...
>
> Ken

Besides tightening up body roll, which some of these trucks can
certainly use, swaybars are important for balancing understeer or
oversteer at the traction limit. Just putting a swaybar on the front
can make a vehicle understeer atrociously and actually corner worse
than if not installed at all. This is because of the way the bar
transfers the cornering loads to the outside front tire.

Stiff springs in the rear (or a rear swaybar) have the opposite
effect, causing dangerous oversteer. Since most of us seem to
feel you can never have enough leaves in the rear, a swaybar on
the front can be a real asset to restore the handling balance of
stiffly sprung rear axle. The vehicle will readily carry a load
without protest, handle like a Ferarri (right!) and still ride
nice and soft up front.

Increased bodyroll stiffness alone will not neccessarily improve
cornering traction. Tires and good flat camber (while cornering)
on the outside tires are the most important factors. Although the
improved bodyroll stiffness may keep the camber from changing a
whole bunch.

Stiff springs and swaybars work against you on a 4x4 used off-
road. All the tires want to stay in the same plane and will not
conform to the irregularities of rugged terrain. Soft and sloppy
springing with lots of travel and axle articulation makes a real
stump-jumper.

Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest glinx.com
4 wheel drive van page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.glinx.com/users/sbest
Tire chains, camping gear, tools and first aid stuff too...

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 15:33:13 -0400
From: sbest
Subject: Re: Engine Theory

>From: ballingr ldd.net (WILLIAM L BALLINGER)
>Subject: Engine Theory
>
>My opinions on engine use to purpose.

Great article, enjoyed it and agreed with it.
I feel even stronger about some of the opinions.

289 - Not enough torque for any sort of serious truck work
and not enough displacement for serious performance.
Would be OK in a Ranger, but why bother when a 302 fits as
well? Experience? Lots. 67 Couger 2V auto, 67 Mustang 4v 4sp
78 HP spec 5sp, 74 F350 wrecker 2v

351C - Never put in a PU by Ford but an excellent performance
choice but not a serious worker. Had a 69 PU with 4v 3sp,
70 Torino 4v auto, 74 Maveick 4v 4sp, 72 Torino 2v auto

351W - Excellent mid-sized choice, lightweight, frugal,
torquey, 69 PU, 74 F350, several Mavericks

351M - I really don't understand???
Several very thirsty and under powered "company" trucks.

400 - Feels like a diesel, good working rig for slow speed
duties. Fuel mileage seems better than the 351M.
78 f250 4sp 4x4, Several "company" trucks.

351 FE - as much low end grunt as the 400 with better
highway pep. Rock of Gibralter! 60s family truck.

360 FE - Were the 351M guys messing with this?


Steve Best, Nova Scotia, sbest glinx.com
4 wheel drive van page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.glinx.com/users/sbest
Tire chains, camping gear, tools and first aid stuff too...

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 08:28:44 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: Those Pesty FE Exhaust Manifold Bolts

> From: "PAUL MONTY"
> Subject: Those Pesty FE Exhaust Manifold Bolts
> Date: Sat, 21 Mar 1998 22:35:46 -0800

> Now, do I pull the head or do you guys know of a trick fix. I took
> out my right angle drill chuck, but it looks as if I won't have
> enough clearance to use it. Any tricks of the trade will be greatly
> appreciated.

If the bolt broke off at the head it's because it is rusted in very
solidly. In my experience the only way to fix that is carefully
drill the center of the bolt out to the minor diameter of the threads
and "Pick" the threads out and retap the holes. If you try to use an
easy out it will strip or break and the bolt probably won't budge
anyway. Problem with "trying" the easy out first is that if you break
it off in the bolt you can't drill it after that so you're all done
unless you have a bolt burner (EDM) machine.

In my opinion this will require removing the head and using a drill
press. It can be done by hand and even in the vehicle but you better
have some serious skills or expect problems. It's hard enough to
cleanly drill out a bolt with it properly set up on a good drill
press.

> Also, a friend recommends using stainless bolts upon reassembly.
> Any thoughts?

Use grade 8 bolts with anti-seize on the threads and don't scrimp on
the anti-seize. Also (unless using grahpite gaskets) put a coat on
the manifold side of the gasket when you put it back on and use
progressively less torque on the manifold bolts from center out to
prevent cracking.

Stainless is too soft for automotive applications IMHO. The threads
will not take the same torque as grade 8's and will eventually wear
out (strip).

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 08:35:48 -0500
From: pickup65 juno.com (Jon E Purut)
Subject: [none]

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 01:47:40 EST
From: MIGKiller7
Subject: Re: duraspark timing retard

Dave wrote:

>Hi all,
>I heard mentioned awhile back about the duraspark having a built in
>retard while cranking for easier starting? Is this true? If so does
>anyone know if there is a way to turn this retard on with a switch so
>when I'm towing my engine won't ping. Please help. My 76 F250 Highboy
>tow truck could really use this if it's possible.
>Dave Complete and Total FORDNUT, Highboy Nut, & FE Nut too!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, the Duraspark has a built in timing retard. It should be the
white
wire coming out of the ignition module. On older models it also connects
to
the "I" terminal on the starter solenoid. When the solenoid is engaged
it
supplies battery voltage to the terminal and the starter. Once you are
done
cranking the Duraspark stops retarding the timing. So, all you need to
do is
supply battery voltage to the "I" terminal for the retard to function.


>>>>>Danger, Danger, Danger Will Robinson
Would this also send power to the starter solenoid also? Sure would not
want to engage the starter at 60 mph!

Jon E. Purut
Pickup65 juno.com
JCPurut worldnet.att.net
Web Site Under Construction

1964 F500 (coming this weekend, part 2)
1965 F100 SWB Daily Driver
1965 F100
1977 F150
1970 Mustang Fastback
1993 Escort Wagon (wifes car)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 09:06:36 -0500
From: "Charles"
Subject: RE: 302 Swap

A worn timing chain can give these symptoms. Have you checked compression in all cylinders?

On Sunday, March 22, 1998 7:35 PM, George Schott [SMTP:Schottsweb webtv.net] wrote:

> starter relay. I have fire at the coil wire and at the plugs but when I
> try to crank the motor all I get is fine spray of gas from the carb. and
> an occasional backfire I have done nothing to the distributor other than
> the aforementioned The motor cranks fine but does'nt even try to fire I


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 06:08:35 -0800
From: Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFREY D)
Subject: Grass Valley CrewCab Gathering

Well as fate have it, things didn't work out
quite as planned. Fred (66 Crew) and myself
('64 Crew) had planned to meet Saturday in
Grass Valley to compare each other's crewcabs.

There are few of these old crews and we both
were curious about each other's.

Friday, Fred reported a head gasket leak! and
this forced our meeting to not happen. As we
had sent out an open invitation to this list, I went
ahead and went to the appointed meeting.

I hung out in the parking lot for a half hour, and no
Fords showed up. Bad weather may have softened
the interest (if there had been any!).

I chatted with a couple of guys in a Chevy about
my truck, and later with someone in a 50's truck
about it also, just before getting groceries.

Fred has been stashing parts to do some upgrades
to his '66, and the engine problem set the plan
into action, so he won't be making the journey up to
grass Valley any time soon. It turns out that he lives
only a few mile from my folks, so one of these days,
I'll drop by and check out the progress on his project
and get to check out his rig and vice versa.

Jeff '64 F100 CrewCab

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 09:14:08 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: RE: strokes, or the continueing debate

> From: Sleddog
> Subject: RE: strokes, or the continueing debate
> Date: Sat, 21 Mar 1998 15:17:47 -0500

> any CFD (compressible fluid dynamics) experts out there?
>
> if these posts are not on topic, please tell me and i will not stray
> from FTC as far in the future. thank you.

Maybe we should have a "Ford truck Engine" list? Or just a "Ford
Engine Performance" list? Why do most of us drive old trucks? We
like rust? We like to work our butts off looking for parts? Or is
it because we can play with the combinations of engines and other
things without getting into college degrees and expensive electronic
toys? I say you're right on Mr Dog :-)

BTW, I just picked up my first engine hoist ever at TSC for $249 with
2 ton fully retracted capacity, cast iron wheels and bearings in the
swivels etc.. Really heavy duty outfit for the price. Main reason I
got it was to tie on the back of my PU to move stuff around in the
yard since I got rid of my wrecker :-) Really wierd aint it, I get
within 10 - 15 items from the bottom of my list of projects and I
just have to go out and buy some more stuff to make sure I don't run
out of something to do............

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 08:19:10 -0600
From: "Arnold Gladwell"
Subject: Re: HOT STARTS

- -----Original Message-----
From: Deacon
To: fordtrucks61-79 ListService.net
Date: Sunday, March 22, 1998 5:06 PM
Subject: Re: HOT STARTS


>From: Brian
>>Ok list.
>> Here's one for ya. I know that an old starter or bad one can
>>be hard starting when it gets hot, But, I've got a rebuilt one(which
>>could be bad) that doesn't want to start my 460 when the engine gets
>hot
>>, normal operating temp. 192 degrees. So here's my question, Has anyone
>>tried wrapping the starter with a header type heat wrap ?? And do the
>>heat sheilds really work ??
>

I had a similar problem, with my f250 (400) and when she got hot she
wouldn't start. It turned out to be a combination of a weak starter and a
weak battery. I hope this helps.

Arnold
F250, 400, 4x2

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 09:34:16 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: Power Steering Problems

> Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 23:56:33 -0600
> From: Jim Craig
> Subject: Power Steering Problems

> OK, here's the deal....I replaced the power steering pump, box, and
> all the hoses last weekend on my '77 Supercab 351M. The problem is
> that she won't steer AT ALL at idle, but rev the engine a little (to
> 1000 RPM) and it's fine. The belt is tight. The stop valve is

This system came from another vehicle right? If your engine pulley
is smaller than the original system you need to put a smaller pulley
on the pump to get enough rpm at idle to generate the pressure you
need. I put a smaller pully on mine and it made some difference to
low rpm performance.

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 07:23:25 -0800
From: danadeb pacbell.net
Subject: Re:

> >>>>>Danger, Danger, Danger Will Robinson
> Would this also send power to the starter solenoid also? Sure would not
> want to engage the starter at 60 mph!
>




Gooooooooooooood Point!!!!!!!

Dana

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 09:46:32 -0500
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: 460 Dual Plug

the ignition used was an msd 7, and that is a lot of ignition. so even
without the dual plugs the increase may have been made. but, maybe not.
the 460 does have a large bore, and big bores are hard to get to burn
efficiently. and no, dual plugs are nothing new, except to wedge head
engines.

sleddog

- ----------
From: Harry Jennings[SMTP:hjennings hotmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, March 22, 1998 3:14 AM
To: fordtrucks61-79 ListService.net
Subject: 460 Dual Plug

Well, I just read the article. Dual plugs is nothing new by a long shot.
The first one *I* remember seeing was in a friends '87 Nissan P/U. The
Ford Ranger uses such a set-up in the 4 cyl.

I am sure that a dual plug set-up has advantages. But the claims made in
that article seem, well, optimistic at best. True dual plug set-ups use
more than one coil and such. This engine just split the plug wires. All
that was accomplished was producing 2 sparks rather than one. I doubt
that modification alone would make a big difference.

:o)

Harry.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 10:00:06 -0500
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: a cold one! was KEN ADMIN. QUESTION

and if you come to the poconos, i'll buy you one! and light up my 460 stroker for a quick spin :)

where are you anyway?

sleddog
- ----------
From: Chris Samuel[SMTP:fourmuelz email.msn.com]
Sent: Sunday, March 22, 1998 5:00 AM
To: fordtrucks61-79 ListService.net
Subject: KEN Admin. Question .

Sleddog and I appear to have moved this discussion far beyond the simple fun
of the 400M-VS-460 debate.


Chris
79 Bronco

Hey, Sleddog, if your ever out my way I'll buy ya a cold one!






+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961 thru 1979 --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks61-79 listservice.net, |
| List removal information is on the web site. |
+---------- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ ----------+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 10:21:31 -0500
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: 4V Heads and Engine Stroke

yes, it can, has, and will be done again. from each person i have talked
to it works very well, from high performance pulling engines to a street
engine that really romps the the bowties. it ain't an easy build, and
requires some extra building attention and some special parts but is
basically a relatively simple swap. it requires for one thing, a intake
spacer, and a 4V C intake. i thought there was someone on this list with
this combo.

sleddog

- ----------
From: Harry Jennings[SMTP:hjennings hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, March 23, 1998 3:08 AM
To: fordtrucks61-79 ListService.net
Subject: 4V Heads and Engine Stroke

With all this talk about parts swapping and how longer stroke engines
need more breathing it got me thinking (oh no...;)

Anyway, I was wondering if anyone has ever used 351C 4V (or Boss) heads
on a 400M. They would bolt right up, right? I know the 4V heads are not
the best for the street, but I was thinking that the longer stroke of
the 400 might make these heads more streetable. Not only streetable, but
a real sleeper. Just think, you could tell those Ch*vy guys that it is
just a little old 351M. Like they would be able to tell otherwise. I am
not real familair with the 400M, so forgive me if I have overlooked
something real obvious.

But what cam and intake to use...???

Harry.



Visit me at
HREF="http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/3271/index.html">my web
page.


______________________________________________________






+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961 thru 1979 --------------+
| Send posts to fordtrucks61-79 listservice.net, |
| List removal information is on the web site. |
+---------- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ ----------+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 10:25:08 -0500
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: Message from Deacon

welcome back deacon.

we all get back truckin' on.

sleddog

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 10:32:25 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: Message from Deacon.

> From: "Deacon"
> Subject: Re: Message from Deacon.
> Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 01:05:58 -0800

> Boy, here I thought my first post was going to be comical! :)

This is scarry Deacon! I wouldn't have gone through that much
explaination if my wife caught me in bed with her best friend :-) We
can see you are one sensitive guy with a heart of gold and really,
really, really like this list :-)

Now if we could just all keep everything on
topic.............(ducking)


78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 10:21:58 +0000
From: tfmf211 murphyfarms.com
Subject: Re:Oil Pressure Problem (fixed!)

>If I were you, I would plan for an alternate vehicle. Then I would take=20
the
>engine up (or out entirely), pop the pan, ditch the old oil pump, and then=
=20
I
>would pop a main off near the back and just check it for wear. You could
>pop all the mains off one by one, and you could Plastigage them without
>bothering to remove the crank etc.
>
>Before you do any of this, change out the line on your pressure gauge=20
unless
>you KNOW it isn't plugged or dirty. Also, provided you actually have any
>oil pressure, get a bottle of Marvel Mystery Oil (or some other kind of
>detergent, even 1/2 cup of automatic transmission fluid will do) and run=20
the
>engine in the hopes of unplugging an oil gallery, etc. If nothing else it
>will clean the engine out good before you drain the oil and pop the pan.
>
>If your mains pass the plastigage test, and look reasonably decent (no
>pitting, nice even wear) then put the thing back together with a new oil
>pump and see how that treats you.
>
>Remember, always fix the cheapest thing first. Your engine was only new
>once, and that was before it left the factory. It's all downhill from=20
there.

Well!

What I have to say is THANKS GUYS!!!!!!

I now have OIL PRESSURE!!!

Cold idle is about 70lbs
Cold 2000RPM about 85 lbs

Hot idle out of gear about 25lbs
Hot idle in gear about 15lbs

Hot driving ranges between 35 to 55mph 40lbs to 70lbs.

At some point in my trucks life, someone destroyed a timing gear and didn't
bother to clean out the pan. When we dropped the pan we initially thought=20
the
worst. After cleaning a ton a plastic teeth and a few pieces of metal out=20
of the
pan, we checked each of the mains. They all looked new, with very little=20
wear.
Dropped a few rod bearings just to check. Same thing. No problems found!!
Changed the oil pump, shaft, pickup tube(screen on the old one was severly
clogged) and put it back together (with a new main seal). Fired it up and=20
was
amazed.

While I was in there I checked the pistons and they do have the slipper=20
skirts.
I didn't check the stroke. I should have, but hindsight is 20/20. Did the=
y=20
put
slipper skirts on a 360? If not, I guess my truck is a 390 after all. :-)

I did find a number on the block. It was located under the oil filter=20
stamped
upside down. It had two large numbers WI with smaller number below it
that said 8f17. Mean anything? I know there was some talk about a part
number. Maybe?

Now for the bad news, I still have the tick. People around here said they
think a lifter is sticking and not to worry. I think I'll just live with i=
t=20
till I can
do a complete rebuild. I don't want to pull the manifold and cam and all
just yet, just to go for a tick that only happens when in gear at idle. If
it gets worse I may do something.

Sorry to be so windy, but I'm pshyiced.

Thanks again!

-Ted

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 07:40:49 -0800
From: John MacNamara
Subject: Autolite 4100

Hello: Got a question for anyone on the list that might be running a
4100 Autolite carb on their trucks. I realize they are probably sitting
on an FE, but I plan on putting one on my 460 but after doing some
preliminary checking found that the air cleaner mounting pad on top of
the 4100 is slightly larger than a Holley. Since I have to run a
plastic spacer, that holley makes, to get the air cleaner up high enough
to clear all the peripheral junk, this spacer doesn't fit the
autolite. Makes sense that the air cleaner probably won't work in the
4100 either

Can I enquire as to what kind(s) of air cleaners are any members running
on their 4100's. If anyone is using a spacer would be interested in
that info also.

Thanks

John MacNamara

78 F250 4X4 Supercabl Ranger XLT Lariat

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 10:13:58 -0600 (CST)
From: Stu Varner
Subject: Re: Autolite 4100

At 07:40 AM 3/23/98 -0800, you wrote:
>
>
>Hello: Got a question for anyone on the list that might be running a
>4100 Autolite carb on their trucks. I realize they are probably sitting
>on an FE, but I plan on putting one on my 460 but after doing some
>preliminary checking found that the air cleaner mounting pad on top of
>the 4100 is slightly larger than a Holley. Since I have to run a
>plastic spacer, that holley makes, to get the air cleaner up high enough
>to clear all the peripheral junk, this spacer doesn't fit the
>autolite. Makes sense that the air cleaner probably won't work in the
>4100 either

I don't have it on my engine yet but the stock aluimnum spacer should work
fine.
>
>Can I enquire as to what kind(s) of air cleaners are any members running
>on their 4100's. If anyone is using a spacer would be interested in
>that info also.

The 4100 and 2100 are identical carbs and the aircleaner should be a direct fit.
I am planning on it being this way. I am usinga dual snorkel from mid 80's
mustang/truck and it is just like the stock single snorkel. K&N filter for
good measure.
Hope this helps.
Stu
No longer publically Nuking GM to preserve the list!
I guess I am backing down!

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 11:18:37 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: HOT STARTS

> Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 09:51:40 -0500
> From: Brian
> Subject: HOT STARTS

> could be bad) that doesn't want to start my 460 when the engine gets
> hot , normal operating temp. 192 degrees. So here's my question, Has
> anyone tried wrapping the starter with a header type heat wrap ??
> And do the heat sheilds really work ??

Ok, what exactly is it doing? I suspect you are getting some kicking
when attempting to turn it over hot, right? This may be due to what
is called hot soak and is typical of the 335 and 385 series engines
with carbs. The carb tends to soak up the engine heat when sitting
and percolates fuel into the intake. When you try to start it the
over rich mixture causes your initial timing to be way to advanced
which causes it to "kick" as in trying to run backward. If you leave
the engine sit for, say 5 minutes this is most likely to happen as
opposed to 1 minute or 15 minutes.

At 1 minute the heat has not soaked into the float bowls so no fuel
has percolated yet, at 5 min it has begun percolating but is not yet
fully evaporated out of the system so is at the richest point and at
15 min all the fuel has evaporated and is clear of the intake so is
not influencing things.

The other type of hot soak problem usually only happens with new
engines with tight wrist pins which expand due to heat absorbed from
the crank making them tight in the pistions. When severe enough this
can actually bend the connecting rods but this phenomena is quite
rare and not very likely in a broken in engine.

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 11:24:16 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: HOT STARTS

> From: danadeb pacbell.net
> Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 09:16:56 -0800
> Subject: Re: HOT STARTS

> I have the same problem with my 460 sometimes!!!
>
> The engine doesn't even need to be all that warmed up.
>
> My theories are as follows;
>
> 1) Starter getting too warm causing hard cranking.

This reminds me, there are two starters, well actually 3 now with the
gear drive version that will bolt on to the 460. Most 460
applications we deal with are conversions from a 351M/400 which
typically use the 3 pole or positive engagement starter with the hump
on it. The proper starter for the 460 is the 4 pole with the....

---

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