fordtrucks61-79-digest V2 #173

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Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 03:50:23 -0700 (MST)
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fordtrucks61-79-digest Monday, March 23 1998 Volume 02 : Number 173

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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks Digest
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In this issue:

Re: Steel Braided Lines [Chekerdpst ]
Re: Steel Braided Lines [Chekerdpst ]
Power Steering Problems [Jim Craig ]
Sway bar [Doug Neely ]
Re: Air Bag Suspensions [Marv Miller ]
Re: Pinto 2000 cc's [Marv Miller ]
Re: Power Steering Problems ["Deacon" ]
Re: Power Steering Problems [Doug Neely ]
duraspark timing retard ["Dave Walbeck" ]
Re: duraspark timing retard ["Deacon" ]
Re: duraspark timing retard [MIGKiller7 ]
Re: sway bars and air bag suspension [danadeb

pacbell.net]
Re: Power Steering Problems [danadeb

pacbell.net]
Re: duraspark timing retard [danadeb

pacbell.net]
4V Heads and Engine Stroke ["Harry Jennings" ]
302 update ["Harry Jennings" ]
Re: Air Bag Suspensions ["Deacon" ]
Re: sway bars and air bag suspension ["Deacon" ]
Re: Engine Theory [sdelanty ]
Re: Message from Deacon [sdelanty ]
Re: Question on FE's and Small Blocks [sdelanty ]

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 23:32:10 EST
From: Chekerdpst
Subject: Re: Steel Braided Lines

On vehicles with spongy rubber lines, braking feel is improved-ie threshold
braking just before lockup is easier to do. Not much use in my F-250, but
they do look nice. Be careful if you plan to do this, the braiding is very
abrasive and can literally saw through stuff.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 23:33:57 EST
From: Chekerdpst
Subject: Re: Steel Braided Lines

I have had braided lines made up by my local hydralic hose industrial
supplier. Cost was similar to mail order, and custom lengths were easy to
specify.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 23:56:33 -0600
From: Jim Craig
Subject: Power Steering Problems

I am determined to stump you guys yet!!!

OK, here's the deal....I replaced the power steering pump, box, and all the
hoses last weekend on my '77 Supercab 351M. The problem is that she won't
steer AT ALL at idle, but rev the engine a little (to 1000 RPM) and it's
fine. The belt is tight. The stop valve is fine(the pump squeals when the
pressure hose is squeezed). The pump rotates and pumps fine (sorry, no
pressure figures though). The box is fine because it is just as hard in
both directions. The bearing preload has been experimented with extensively.
My buddies around here have no clue and the technical assistance guy doesn't
seem to be able to find his rear with either hand. I'm sure someone has had
the same problem, right? Right??

Jimbo
'77 Supercab
The 351M Is Fixing To Leave
I HATE CRACKED BLOCKS!!!!

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 21:26:38 -0800
From: Doug Neely
Subject: Sway bar

Ken,
I put a sway bar on the front of my 71 F250 a few years back, it came
off a 75
and required some custom brackets but it was well worth the effort. I
used to carry
a camper and going down winding roads the thing felt like it would fall
over, but after
I put the sway bar on it drove like a dream with no more scary corner
rolls. I didn't
put the rear one on as it required moving the brake lines and quite
frankly the rear
suspension was/is stiff enough with 2 extra leafs and overload shocks.

Cheers,

Doug

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 21:27:56 -0800
From: Marv Miller
Subject: Re: Air Bag Suspensions

The Deekster wrote, in part:
> I picked up the May issue of Truckin' and was checking out the air
> bag suspension with rear ladder bars replacing the leaf springs. I know
> one member that has them on his truck and when he was showing me I
> didn't even think of asking him the price, thinking it was way out of
> my price range. If I'm reading the add correctly the front Hot Air
> system is $300 for Ford I-beam and $800 for the ladder bar rear
> suspension. It's in-cab adjustable with 0"- 8" vertical travel and
> has a payload of 5000#. If $1100 is baseline cost, it could be
> worthwhile looking into.
> The site is http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.aimind.com but doesn't show the ladder bar
> rear suspension. Any thoughts on air suspension?

First of all, let me be the umteenth to welcome the prodigal trucker
back to our fold. It just wasn't the same, knowing we could let a
double entendre slip, and there was no one out there to catch it.

Now for the content. The F-250 on bags in my driveway was the
"experimental model" for "earlier" F-series that was done by Rick of R
Customz in Newhall, CA. He's done a lot of Explorers, etc, including a
bunch of I-beams. He's had his share of magazine credits, as he does
REALLY nice work. He just hadn't done a rear like this before. It's a
single link rear. He also had never body dropped a Ford P/U cab three
inches before. Now for the cost aspect: A lot of this was done on a
trade basis for components and labor that he needed for his new shop.
So the actual costs involved are hard for me to put a finger onto.

As for the AIM stuff, it's reportedly manufactured in Mexico. We looked
into this stuff and thought that the welds weren't up to those of
others. This is only our opinion! In the case of the front bags, the
bags do not sit directly over the I-beams, rather on pads added to the
sides of them, and therefore add a tortional component to the stresses
on the beams, forcing an extra amount of caster into the front
suspension system. We like Rick's design much better, but his is all
custom, not bolt-on production. (Sorta' limits one from ordering a set
"off the shelf".)

Again, welcome back Kott....., err, Deacon.
- -Marv-

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 21:32:47 -0800
From: Marv Miller
Subject: Re: Pinto 2000 cc's

>Steve & Rockette wrote:
> Whats wrong with the 2L Pinto? I agree the 2.3L is a bit of
> an anchor in normally aspirated trim, but the 2L is still one of
> the best engines Ford ever produced.

You'll get no argument from me on that! The Pinto 2000 from the Germans
at Taunus division, was a screamin' high-twister. Agreed, the 2300 was
not nearly the equivalant.

Also remember that the English Cortina 1600 cc was available at the same
time as the 2000, and would certainly contribute to the four-bangers
being dogs.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 21:29:43 -0800
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: Power Steering Problems

From: Jim Craig
>I am determined to stump you guys yet!!!
>
>OK, here's the deal....I replaced the power steering pump, box, and all
the
>hoses last weekend on my '77 Supercab 351M. The problem is that she
won't
>steer AT ALL at idle, but rev the engine a little (to 1000 RPM) and
it's
>fine.

Set the idle at 1000 RPM. Rev the engine a little before turning. Just
other ways of skinning cat's! :)

Deacon Blues deconblu

gte.net
========================================
Truckin' , I'm a goin' home,
Whoa whoa baby, back where I belong,
Back home, sit down and patch my bones
And git back truckin' on.
========================================
Visit The Deacon Blues Homepage
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home1.gte.net/deconblu/

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 21:37:07 -0800
From: Doug Neely
Subject: Re: Power Steering Problems

Jim Craig wrote:

> I am determined to stump you guys yet!!!
>
> OK, here's the deal....I replaced the power steering pump, box, and all the

Is the drive pulley the same diameter?
Cheers,
Doug

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 22:29:03 PST
From: "Dave Walbeck"
Subject: duraspark timing retard

Hi all,
I heard mentioned awhile back about the duraspark having a built in
retard while cranking for easier starting? Is this true? If so does
anyone know if there is a way to turn this retard on with a switch so
when I'm towing my engine won't ping. Please help. My 76 F250 Highboy
tow truck could really use this if it's possible.
Dave Complete and Total FORDNUT, Highboy Nut, & FE Nut too!!!!!!!!!!

______________________________________________________

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 22:41:14 -0800
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: duraspark timing retard

From: Dave Walbeck
>Hi all,
>I heard mentioned awhile back about the duraspark having a built in
>retard while cranking for easier starting? Is this true? If so does
>anyone know if there is a way to turn this retard on with a switch so
>when I'm towing my engine won't ping. Please help. My 76 F250 Highboy
>tow truck could really use this if it's possible.
>Dave Complete and Total FORDNUT, Highboy Nut, & FE Nut too!!!!!!!!!!

Yes it's true! The white wire connects to a 12v keyed start wire.
Connect a switched 12v wire to the white wire coming from the ignition
module. I haven't done this but I don't see a reason it wouldn't work.

Deacon Blues deconblu

gte.net
========================================
Truckin' , I'm a goin' home,
Whoa whoa baby, back where I belong,
Back home, sit down and patch my bones
And git back truckin' on.
========================================
Visit The Deacon Blues Homepage
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home1.gte.net/deconblu/

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 01:47:40 EST
From: MIGKiller7
Subject: Re: duraspark timing retard

Dave wrote:

>Hi all,
>I heard mentioned awhile back about the duraspark having a built in
>retard while cranking for easier starting? Is this true? If so does
>anyone know if there is a way to turn this retard on with a switch so
>when I'm towing my engine won't ping. Please help. My 76 F250 Highboy
>tow truck could really use this if it's possible.
>Dave Complete and Total FORDNUT, Highboy Nut, & FE Nut too!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, the Duraspark has a built in timing retard. It should be the white
wire coming out of the ignition module. On older models it also connects to
the "I" terminal on the starter solenoid. When the solenoid is engaged it
supplies battery voltage to the terminal and the starter. Once you are done
cranking the Duraspark stops retarding the timing. So, all you need to do is
supply battery voltage to the "I" terminal for the retard to function.

Fred
'72 Ford F-100

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 23:41:46 -0800
From: danadeb

pacbell.net
Subject: Re: sway bars and air bag suspension

Deacon wrote:
>

>
> Wet Bars, Sports Bars and Biker Bars, OK! But Sway Bars? Stay away
> from The Blue Oyster (Police Acadamy) places like this are no place for
> Ford trucks!
>

HHHEEESSS BBBAAACCCKKK!!!!!!!!

Dana

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 23:55:39 -0800
From: danadeb

pacbell.net
Subject: Re: Power Steering Problems

Jim Craig wrote:
>
> I am determined to stump you guys yet!!!
>
> OK, here's the deal....I replaced the power steering pump, box, and all the
> hoses last weekend on my '77 Supercab 351M. The problem is that she won't
> steer AT ALL at idle,

When you say "AT ALL" do you mean there is no assist or do you mean it can't be
turned.

If it is simply no assist then the pulley on the pump need to be a bit smaller
or as Deacon said increase the engine RPM while your turning at idle. I can
steer my 70 all day long with one finger ( no not that one Deacon )if the RPMs
are above 1000 under that I have to muscle it a bit.

If it won't turn at all then I have a question, can it be turned with the engine
off?

Dana

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 00:15:33 -0800
From: danadeb

pacbell.net
Subject: Re: duraspark timing retard

Dave Walbeck wrote:
>
> Hi all,
> I heard mentioned awhile back about the duraspark having a built in
> retard while cranking for easier starting? Is this true? If so does
> anyone know if there is a way to turn this retard on with a switch so
> when I'm towing my engine won't ping.

Sorry all!!!

This is from the horses mouth at Auto-somthing-er-other ( AutoTune maybe )the
manufacturer of the aftermarket module that I am using. The cranking retard is
only available ( and gets less as rpm increases ) under 300rpm or so.

I.E. On one particular box the retard would be 16 deg at 100rpm then 8 deg at
200rpm then 0 at 300rpm you get the point.

It won't hurt to try with a Ford box but I tried it with my aftermarket box and
there was no signs of any retard. (except maybe me ! )

The 16 deg box was said to be for 460s, I found this out too late so I have the
standard "blue" box and it provides like 3-4 deg retard. ( Oooooh!! )

There are devices that you can buy that do what you are talking about if you are
still interested.

The white wire needs to be attached to the ignition switch side of the starter
solenoid.

Dana

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 02:08:31 CST
From: "Harry Jennings"
Subject: 4V Heads and Engine Stroke

With all this talk about parts swapping and how longer stroke engines
need more breathing it got me thinking (oh no...;)

Anyway, I was wondering if anyone has ever used 351C 4V (or Boss) heads
on a 400M. They would bolt right up, right? I know the 4V heads are not
the best for the street, but I was thinking that the longer stroke of
the 400 might make these heads more streetable. Not only streetable, but
a real sleeper. Just think, you could tell those Ch*vy guys that it is
just a little old 351M. Like they would be able to tell otherwise. I am
not real familair with the 400M, so forgive me if I have overlooked
something real obvious.

But what cam and intake to use...???

Harry.

Visit me at
HREF="http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/3271/index.html">my web
page.

______________________________________________________

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 02:11:38 CST
From: "Harry Jennings"
Subject: 302 update

Make sure you firing order is correct. I messed up and read the numbers
wrong once (I was in a hurry and read them off of the intake). When it
wouldn't start I looked in my manual. That is when I noticed that two
wires were switched (mistook the 3 for and 8 and vise versa).

Harry.

Visit me at
HREF="http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/3271/index.html">my new
web page.

______________________________________________________

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 00:49:18 -0800
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: Air Bag Suspensions

From: Marv Miller
>First of all, let me be the umteenth to welcome the prodigal trucker
>back to our fold.

Thank you Marv! Luck for me it was only temporary insanity. Like all
prodigals once we see the grass is no greener, we return home.

>It just wasn't the same, knowing we could let a
>double entendre slip, and there was no one out there to catch it.

Well the trick is to take good care of your equipment and try not to get
any on you! :)

>Now for the content. The F-250 on bags in my driveway was the
>"experimental model" for "earlier" F-series that was done by Rick of R
>Customz in Newhall, CA.

I love this truck! We be talkin' low, discs in all 4 corners and just
too sweeet!

>As for the AIM stuff, it's reportedly manufactured in Mexico. We
looked
>into this stuff and thought that the welds weren't up to those of
>others. This is only our opinion!

Thanks now I know something to look for, checking out other
manufactures! There's a place I found that makes a ladder bar type beam
they call airbeam that bolts on. It anchors at the forward leaf spring
mount and "U" bolts to the rear end. The bags are mount on top of the
airbeam and to the lower frame rail. They use a bolt on panhard bar to
control side movement.
Not nearly the best way to go about it but better than stock
suspension and all bolt on installation. They haven't anything for Fords
at this time but some are on the list of coming soon.
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.ridetech.com/AIRBEAM.HTM a system for a 1/2 ton is $950 and
for a 1 ton dually is $1599. This is without an onboard air compressor
so that makes them a little pricey. It looks like $1500 with other
systems would cover front and rear with a 12v onboard air compressor
with tank.

>In the case of the front bags, the
>bags do not sit directly over the I-beams, rather on pads added to the
>sides of them

Yes, I see that. Sort of a generic looking setup. also requires moving
the shock mount.

> We like Rick's design much better, but his is all
>custom, not bolt-on production. (Sorta' limits one from ordering a set
>"off the shelf".)

Nothing beats professional custom components! Then, we do have some
list members just wacko enough to go for home made custom built. Guys
that turn air conditioner compressors into onboard air compressors. Guys
that build trucks able to drag heavily laden sleds for no other reason
than to say "I did it".

They're dirty and their greasy
Mischievous and sleazy
Some things they do are cheesy
the ShadeTree Mechanics on the list! :)

It was quick OK! :)

Later!

Deacon Blues deconblu

ldd.net (WILLIAM L BALLINGER) writes:

>FE SERIES
>The crown-jewel of truck engines. NEVER in the history of trucks has there
>been a better designed engine for truck use. It makes torque, horsepower,
>and good compression braking. It is the most versatile and probably the
>closest that anyone ever came to making an engine that can do it all.

You got that right! Look at all the different vehicles Ford put FE's in!
The FE motivated F-series trucks and 427 Cobras...
It hauled kids and groceries in Country Squire wagons at the same time
it was kickin' serious ass at Le Mans.
Edsels and Mustangs... The FE has proven itself to be powerfull and
durable in every application Ford could throw at it.
Long live the FE!

Steve

Though good may come of practice, this primal truth endures;
The first time anything is done, it's done by amateurs.
-- Art Buck

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 02:13:36 -0800
From: sdelanty
Subject: Re: Message from Deacon

Welcome back Bro!

Steve

Though good may come of practice, this primal truth endures;
The first time anything is done, it's done by amateurs.
-- Art Buck

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 02:13:34 -0800....

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