fordtrucks61-79-digest Friday, April 10 1998 Volume 02 : Number 207



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks Digest
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In this issue:

Re: Tightening order & Torque [George Herpich ]
Re: ADMIN: EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Provider cost increases, missing digests and more [Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER,]
Antique insurance for trucks [james oxley ]
Re: '64 F100 for sale [bobherring juno.com]
Mail server problems ["John Peck" ]
Re: converting to electronic ignition ["Deacon" ]
post newbe [curtis bussey ]
manual to auto conversion [davehall uts.cc.utexas.edu]
Re: A few Dana 60 Questions ["Bill Beyer" ]
Tightening & Torque Specs: Part II [Jeff ]
Re: Tightening & Torque Specs: Part II [Tony Marino ]
Re: converting to electronic ignition [danadeb pacbell.net]
Re: manual to auto conversion [danadeb pacbell.net]
Re: Aluminum Heads ["Harry Jennings" ]

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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 06:53:58 -0400
From: George Herpich
Subject: Re: Tightening order & Torque

Head bolts are most critical. Most other bolts just require common sense,
tighten alternating from side to side and not all at once. Go around a
couple of times each time going a little tighter. Head bolts in any engine
are critical but on a long head like a six it's even more so. You need a
manual. The best way to go is to get a factory shop manual. It will tell you
how to fix almost everything on your truck. You can get one from one of the
vendors advertising in Hemmings for about $35 to $75. Or you can get a
repair manual in any auto parts store that will give you basic information
for $20 or so.
It would be impractical to try to explain the head torque sequence with
print. Basically you start in the middle and work outward torquing in three
steps to (I think) 75# or so. Get the manual. Head gaskets are expensive and
labor intensive to redo. The surfaces must be absolutely clean and free of
any burrs. The bolt holes should have a bottom tap run through them to clean
the threads and bolt threads must be clean and lubricated. If any of the
head bolt holes are not blind you will need sealer on the bolts.
George

Jeff wrote:

> Time to dip into the pool of knowledge. I've been told that there is a
> specific sequence
> that the bolts need to be removed/tightened on 240's and 300's. Could
> someone please
> tell me what that sequence is and what the torque values are? Thank you
> all VERY much.
>
> Sifu Jeff
>
> +-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961 thru 1979 --------------+
> | Send posts to fordtrucks61-79 listservice.net, |
> | List removal information is on the web site. |
> +---------- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ ----------+

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Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 06:22:15 -0700
From: Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFREY D)
Subject: Re: ADMIN: EXTREMELY IMPORTANT! Provider cost increases, missing digests and more

I only hope that Esosoft has a better command of a virtual server
stuff than their demonstrated lack of command of the English
language (well the American version anyway).

Their response to Ken was HORRIBLE, and I don't
mean the content.

Not only can they NOT speak properly, I question their
ability to solve a technical issues. They find a problem with
how the server behaves, and the only solution is to raise prices?
Like a poor repair shop, if they can't determine the problem
charge lots of money, and the customer thinks the problem is
solved!

Yes, I know I'm wasting a little bandwidth here, had to vent.

Jeff '64 F100 CrewCab

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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 11:30:19 -0700
From: james oxley
Subject: Antique insurance for trucks

Anyone know of companies that insure antique trucks. I have called a
couple places, but they only do cars. Also, what other places does a 78
Bronco have VIN numbers besides the door tag.

OX

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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 14:41:06 EDT
From: bobherring juno.com
Subject: Re: '64 F100 for sale

On Wed, 8 Apr 1998 15:35:02 EDT Ractrk002 writes:
>How much for the 64 F100?
I would like to get $500. I paid $750 for it and it ran just long enough
to get it home.

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

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Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 16:42:43 -0400
From: "John Peck"
Subject: Mail server problems

After posting my message on "Engine ID lost" my IP had mail problems and I
missed Vol 202, 203, and 203. Could someone please send me these.

Thanks

John Peck
johnpeck visuallink.com

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Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 14:08:12 -0700
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: converting to electronic ignition

From: Don Grossman
> I missed the Duraspark upgrade for the 292. Is it something Ford
kept
>a secret until the 70's? ;)
>
>I want some more details. Not that I have an interest in the 292, just
>wanted to know.

Dirty little secrets,
Dirty little lies,
We got our fingers in ev'rybody's pies,
We love to cut you down to size,
We love dirty laundry.

Kick 'em when they're up,
Kick 'em when they're down.
Kick 'em where they sit,
Kick 'em all around.

I don't know Don, it sure looks like your saying something in-between
them lines! ;]

We can do the innuendo,
We can dance and sing.
When it's all over we haven't
Told you a thing.
We all know that cra_ is king,
Give us dirty laundry.

Deacon
deconblu gte.net
=========================================================
If you ain't makin' waves, you ain't kickin' hard enough!
=========================================================
Deacon's
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home1.gte.net/deconblu/

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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 16:28:09 -0500
From: curtis bussey
Subject: post newbe

For sale: 1970 swb f-100 no seat minor damage on the
right bedside, not running nice body. Also 1968 F-250
camper special 390,C6,a/c,p/s very nice, complete, motor
has cracked cyld. Both for $650. PH.205)672-9358
Also, 1979 F-150 4x4 351m,C6,9"rear,44 front, needs work
but runs $650.00 These are people that I know but they
are not affiliated with my business (Curt's Customs).

Curtis Bussey
Curt's Customs

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Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 16:04:59 -0500
From: davehall uts.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: manual to auto conversion

Hey folks,

I need help on a manual to auto conversion. I will preface the message by
saying I know absolutely nothing about auto transmissions and only want one
so my truck is more user friendly for my wife. I am planning on putting a
C6 into my 1969 F100 (390). It currently has a three speed with a shifter
on the floor (the slow death of the column shifter is a story in itself).

I need the following help:

1. Where can I get a donor C6? Only from a truck or is a C6 from a car
the same? What years will fit? Is it better to pull the transmission
myself or go to a junk yard where they pull it for you?

2. I would like to get a C6 with overdrive -- any comments? I will be
towing a 3500 lb boat every once in a while, but mostly its a strictly on
road commuting vehicle.

3. What do I need from the donor vehicle? I know I need the linkage to
the carb for the kick-down but am unsure of anything else. Presumably the
fly wheel is replaced with a flex plate? Will there be a transmission
cooler that I need and, if so, where is the pump located? If I can find a
C6 on a shortbed I guess I should snag the drive shaft also.

4. Should I replace the rear main seal while I have the transmission off?
If so, what is involved in doing this? My engine has about 80,000 miles on
it.

5. Should I get the transmission rebuilt before installing it? I have
been told this will be expensive and I'd be better of just throwing it in
and driving it until it dies and then getting another. Is it possible to
rebuild one myself? I have heard this is difficult and since auto
transmissions are a complete mystery to me, I am a little worried about
doing this myself though it does seem like it might be fun.

6. I know that I'll need another shifter. Are there any floor shifters
that I could use from a donor vehicle or will I need to get an aftermarket
shifter?

7. Any other suggestions?

Thanks in advance - this list has been really helpful in the past.

Dave


'69 F100, 390, MSD blaster ignition, 2WD
Front disk brakes (thanks Ken Payne)
'72 Sears AC, retrofitted to R134
3 speed -> C6 soon???

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Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 17:45:19 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: A few Dana 60 Questions

- ----------
> From: james oxley
> To: fordtrucks61-79 ListService.net
> Subject: Re: A few Dana 60 Questions
> Date: Wednesday, April 08, 1998 5:35 PM
>
> BDIJXS wrote:
> >
> > For those F-250 Dana 60 (rear axle) experts...
> >
> > 1) What size are the threads on the lug studs, 1/2", or 9/16"? If they
are
> > 9/16", can you replace them with 1/2"? (my front axle lugs are 1/2")
>
> 1/2 inch, but we just grabbed one from a 84 and it looked like 9/16.
> First one I've seen with 9/16. Also didn't have 60 stamped in webbing,
> but cover looked exactly like the one we scarfed the same day from a 77.
>

Sometime in either 80 or 81 Ford switched to 9/16" lug studs. No you cannot
interchange them with 1/2". Believe me I tried when I had to replace the
front hub on my '79. The lugs require an interference fit and the 9/16" are
too big to fit the 1/2".

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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 21:41:10 -0400
From: Jeff
Subject: Tightening & Torque Specs: Part II

Amazing how simple you get when you have kids. The specs I
was asking about were the tightening order and torque value for
the "Intake/Exhaust manifolds to the head". My appoligies for
being so obtuse. Oh, and thanks George.

Sifu Jeff

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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 23:18:53 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: Tightening & Torque Specs: Part II

Hey Man!

Ok, line up the holes with my little cheesy diagram. Looking on the side
of the motor with the manifold you have: (non proportional space font)

4 2 3 1 11 12 13
3 6 7 8 9 10

My '78 shop manual says to coat the mating surfaces with graphite grease,
and torque down to 33 ftlbs.

Tony
tony pscico.com
www.pscico.com/~tony

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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 21:00:20 -0700
From: danadeb pacbell.net
Subject: Re: converting to electronic ignition

Don Grossman wrote:
>
> Hey Dana
>
> I missed the Duraspark upgrade for the 292. Is it something Ford kept
> a secret until the 70's? ;)

I have no first hand experience but my recollection is that the ford dist is
internally the same well back into the 50's, therefore I figured that the
breaker plate etc. could be swapped in.

Am I wrong?

Dana

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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 21:53:00 -0700
From: danadeb pacbell.net
Subject: Re: manual to auto conversion

davehall uts.cc.utexas.edu wrote:
>
> Hey folks,
>
> It currently has a three speed with a shifter
> on the floor (the slow death of the column shifter is a story in itself).

You could use an after market floor shifter or pull an auto column from a
wrecking yard.


> 1. Where can I get a donor C6? Only from a truck or is a C6 from a car
> the same?

Except for tail shaft I believe they are relatively the same. If you can get a
good one from a truck all the better

> What years will fit?


I believe they are externally the same for many years, From the first year made
to current but 68-74 should be safe.

>Is it better to pull the transmission
> myself or go to a junk yard where they pull it for you?
>
Cheaper to pull it yourself and you can get all the misc. stuff at the same
time.

> 2. I would like to get a C6 with overdrive -- any comments?

If there is an overdrive unit that bolts up to the tail shaft I have no
knowledge of it. there are C6s out there with a "Wide Ratio" gear set.


> 3. What do I need from the donor vehicle? I know I need the linkage to
> the carb for the kick-down but am unsure of anything else.

The manual trans carb might not have the kick down linkage attachment point on
it so you might need the carb as well.


> Presumably the
> fly wheel is replaced with a flex plate?


Absolutely


> Will there be a transmission
> cooler that I need and, if so, where is the pump located?

There is no external pump the line pressure is from the trans itself.


The trans cooler is inside the radiator. It needs to be there to help warm up
the trans faster. (a cold trans is almost as bad as a too hot one!) you could
add an external cooler, but I would recommend that if the radiator is in good
shape you bring it to a radiator shop and have one added.


> If I can find a
> C6 on a shortbed I guess I should snag the drive shaft also.

If you can find a C6 on a short bed snag the works!!!


>
> 4. Should I replace the rear main seal while I have the transmission off?
> If so, what is involved in doing this? My engine has about 80,000 miles on
> it.


If it ain't broke don't fix it!!!


>
> 5. Should I get the transmission rebuilt before installing it? I have
> been told this will be expensive and I'd be better of just throwing it in
> and driving it until it dies and then getting another.

About $400.00 to rebuild, If the fluid is in good shape you might get lucky with
out rebuilding it.

> Is it possible to
> rebuild one myself?

Yes. There are no special tools but I think I would leave it to a shop.

> I have heard this is difficult and since auto
> transmissions are a complete mystery to me, I am a little worried about
> doing this myself though it does seem like it might be fun.


If you are mechanically inclined you should be able to do it with a manual. A
B&M trans rebuild kit I bought once had step by step inst. that made it look
fairly straight forward.( never did it though)

>
> 6. I know that I'll need another shifter. Are there any floor shifters
> that I could use from a donor vehicle or will I need to get an aftermarket
> shifter?

65 mustang is pretty straight forward.


>
> 7. Any other suggestions?
>


Look for a running parts truck with 390 and C6 that way you can test the
transmission. you will have all the parts and when you are done you can part out
the parts truck and maybe even cover the cost of a trans rebuild.


A mechanically sound beat up truck shouldn't be more then $500-$600


Good luck

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Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 00:07:47 CDT
From: "Harry Jennings"....

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