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Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 03:50:30 -0700 (MST)
From: owner-fordtrucks61-79-digest ListService.net (fordtrucks61-79-digest)
To: fordtrucks61-79-digest ListService.net
Subject: fordtrucks61-79-digest V1 #367
Reply-To: fordtrucks61-79 ListService.net
Sender: owner-fordtrucks61-79-digest ListService.net


fordtrucks61-79-digest Wednesday, November 26 1997 Volume 01 : Number 367



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks Digest
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email to the same address with the word "help" in the body of the
message.
=======================================================================
In this issue:

F350 Centurion [Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFREY D)]
AFAIK [Stuart Varner ]
Re: F350 Centurion [danadeb pacbell.net]
Re: 4 bbl on a 302? ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: Speaking of exhaust stuff! [sdelanty sonic.net]
Re: fordtrucks61-79-digest V1 #366 ["Mike Masse" ]
Military green spray paint. [james oxley ]
Re: AFAIK ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
C6 transmission questions [Keith Srb ]
C6 Transmission Questions Part 2 [Keith Srb ]
Re: C6 transmission questions [John MacNamara ]
Re: C6 Transmission Questions Part 2 [John MacNamara ]
Re: C6 transmission questions ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Funny named 4sp OD [am14 chrysler.com]
tubing bender [am14 chrysler.com]
Re: Funny named 4sp OD ["Gary, 78 BBB" ]
Re: Speaking of exhaust stuff! [Brian & Jacque Milbrandt
Re: 4 bbl on a 302? [DBrents105 aol.com]
Re: 4 bbl on a 302? [JVC1968 aol.com]
Exhaust tubing [Schottsweb webtv.net (George Schott)]
Re: F350 Centurion [cdkelly juno.com (Christopher D Kelly)]
Re: 4 bbl on a 302? [Chekerdpst aol.com]
What am I going to do????!! ["MICHAEL FRISCH" ]

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 05:35:43 -0800
From: Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER, JEFFREY D)
Subject: F350 Centurion

Drove by the local Ford dealer and spotted a HUGE truck
in the used lot. Dropped by to check it out. I'd seen one
Centurion previously on the road, so took the opportunity
to check it out in the flesh. Here's the scoop, they are
really interested in unloading it. Could someone cross
post this to the newer truck list please?

'96 F350 Centurion $39,999 will let it go
for close to $35,000. It has (this is NOT a typo)
3600 miles on it. Lots of special order stuff on it.
7.4 Liter engine, 1 ton, 4WD, duallys.

The original purchaser probably paid close to $50K
for this truck, special order.

For those who don't know, a Centurion (from my
observation only, nothing official) is a BIG truck.

It has seatbelts for 8 people. It is a crewcab and a half.
It has double doors, PLUS the half seat behind the
middle seat. The middle seat is a bench that will fold
flat to mate with the rear bench. Buckets in front.

The dealer is located in Folsom California, about a
half hour east of Sacramento.

916-353-2000

Very neat truck. Had to pass this one
onto the list, very rare to find used I
would think.

- - Jeff '64 F100 CrewCab

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 20:45:14 -0800
From: Stuart Varner
Subject: AFAIK

Pardon me for being the Village Idiot, but what the $%# does AFAIK
mean?
I don't get out much! I see it all the time in various posts and
apparently I missed that class in grad school. By the way,.... NUKE GM!
Stu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 07:11:00 -0800
From: danadeb pacbell.net
Subject: Re: F350 Centurion

CARVER, JEFFREY D wrote:

> The dealer is located in Folsom California, about a
> half hour east of Sacramento.
>


Gee I wonder if the original owner lives in Folsom (prison) now!

Dana

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:50:35 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: 4 bbl on a 302?

> From: Crfreed kktv.com
> Date: 24 Nov 1997 20:38:50 -0700
> Subject: 4 bbl on a 302?

> re-ground during rebuild. I found a used 4bbl Edelbrock intake that
> will fit, and am thinking of getting around a 500cfm Edelbrok carb.
> (thats about as small as I've found in a 4bbl)
>
> Will this work with what I've got? I'd like the added hp, but not
> if its just going to drown the motor. Thanks - Conrad

Holley makes a 390 but 500 should work if you tune it right and use
vacuum secondaries. I'm not sure what edelbrock makes as their
smallest version but the consensus is that they are better than
Holley's in trucks, especially 4 wheelers and easier to tune as well.

A good choice for smaller engines (or any engine) is the spread bore
which gives you good low rpm metering but allows for high rpm work as
well. This is my favorite and Carter, edelbrock and rochester all
make good ones but you need a special intake made for them. They are
standard BTW so are interchangeable except for the ford kick down.
If you have an auto you may have to do some fabrication with these
but most have kits available as well for this.

I know where compressors get their air, it gets
sucked out of the NEIGHBOR'S electric lines :-)

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 08:02:08 -0800
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: Re: Speaking of exhaust stuff!

>
>A welder I use to know (R.I.P.) use to weld galvanized. ;)
>
>I thought about the toxic part. I don't know if normal use would be a problem
>but since galvanized muffler pipe is available maybe it is only the people
>behind me who would have a problem! ;)
>
>My exhaust system is pretty simple so I probably could get away without welding
>or at least only one weld where the stock tail pipe comes out of the
manifolds.
>
>My main thought was the tubing bender, which you can rent and use in your
>driveway! The cost of the bender, per day, has to be less then paying a muffler
>shop to kink up a bunch of pipe.
>

Been watching this thread for awhile...
One thing to remember about EMT is that the sizes aren't "real",
A piece of 2" EMT does not have an O.D. of 2"... Actually, the
*I.D.* is about 2.067"
The problem here may be matching it up to the muffler inlet and all that.
Also remember that the bender MUST have genuine EMT heads on it.
If You use a bender for water pipe sizes it wont work and will trash
Your EMT.
If that looks like no problem, then go for it and let us know how it goes!

When I did the exhaust on my F100, I mocked it all up in 3/4" EMT.
Used my benders to make an exhaust system in EMT, then took my 3/4"
EMT "exhaust system" to the muffler shop and said, "Make it like this
in 2-1/2" galv exhaust tubing". Worked good...

Happy motoring,


Steve Delanty



------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:17:36 CST
From: "Mike Masse"
Subject: Re: fordtrucks61-79-digest V1 #366

The information I had for code G in 77-79 was just "Automatic, Ford"
and then for 80 code G was specifically FMX, so I assumed it was also
for the 77-79 years , because K, X, and Z specifically stated C6. A
number of people have stated that they've been getting FMX when they
thought they had a C6, so I'm guessing that it must be C6.

> Hi all, we just used the old VIN decoder there and got an interesting
> result. The transmission type that came up on our '77 F150 (G) was one
> of those FMX's. We always though it was a C6. I know there was a thread
> on the differences between these transmissions, but stupid me didn't pay
> attention; after all, I thought a had a C6.
>
> So the question is, how do I tell if my tranny is a C6 or FMX? Thanks in
> advance for any help.
>

Mike Masse
'78 Bronco Custom
351M / C6 / NP205

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.medicine.wisc.edu/~mrm/bronco
email:mrm medicine.wisc.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 11:23:53 -0800
From: james oxley
Subject: Military green spray paint.

When I get done with the body on my Bronc, it will need to be painted. I
was thinking flat military green using spray cans. I can't seem to find
this color in spray paint. Anyone have any sources.

OX

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 12:21:42 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: AFAIK

> Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 20:45:14 -0800
> From: Stuart Varner
> Subject: AFAIK

> Pardon me for being the Village Idiot, but what the $%# does AFAIK
> mean? I don't get out much! I see it all the time in various posts
> and apparently I missed that class in grad school. By the way,....

That's a title they give registered dogs........or is it quarter
horses??? Actually it means " as far as I know" :-)

I know where compressors get their air, it gets
sucked out of the NEIGHBOR'S electric lines :-)

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:29:41 -0700
From: Keith Srb
Subject: C6 transmission questions

Hi Gang,

First off. Happy Thanksgiving to everyone! Now for the Ford Content.


1. Is there enough clearance between the Pan and Internals of the C6 to
install a Drain Plug in the Pan?

2. What are the Pro's and Con's of installing a shift kit in a C6?. I had
a kit installed in a C4, big mistake. In a one year span, the reverse band
broke 4 times. Right now the Transmission in my 74 shifts so smooth, it
hard to tell if it is shifting at all. I hate that it makes me think
something is wrong with the Transmission every time I drive it.


Keith Srb herbie netvalue.net
Mesa, AZ
1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, Camper Special, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box,
Style Side.
1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Model 1100 1bbl carb, Oil Bath Air
Cleaner, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:34:39 -0700
From: Keith Srb
Subject: C6 Transmission Questions Part 2

I forgot about this question.

When changing Transmission Fluid and Filter in a C6, is there anyway to
change the fluid in the Torque Converter with out taking the Transmission
out of the truck?

Is this something I should even be concerned with?



Keith Srb herbie netvalue.net
Mesa, AZ
1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, Camper Special, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box,
Style Side.
1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Model 1100 1bbl carb, Oil Bath Air
Cleaner, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 09:35:38 -0800
From: John MacNamara
Subject: Re: C6 transmission questions

Keith Srb wrote:

> Hi Gang,
>
> First off. Happy Thanksgiving to everyone! Now for the Ford Content.
>
> 1. Is there enough clearance between the Pan and Internals of the C6 to
> install a Drain Plug in the Pan?

Keith: Absolutely there is enough room, just don't install directly underneath
the pick up tube.

>
>
> 2. What are the Pro's and Con's of installing a shift kit in a C6?. I had
> a kit installed in a C4, big mistake. In a one year span, the reverse band
> broke 4 times. Right now the Transmission in my 74 shifts so smooth, it
> hard to tell if it is shifting at all. I hate that it makes me think
> something is wrong with the Transmission every time I drive it.

I installed a shift kit in my 78 because I tow a big boat and I don't want the
tranny slipping under load. As far as I know there is no downside to a shift
kit. The clutches should last longer because they aren't slipping and the
tranny should drop for the same reason. The shifts are more positive so you
won't experience the smoothness you mentioned. In theory the transmission
should last longer because of the reduced wear on the clutches. As to your
problem with the reverse clutch, I have never heard of this so don't know
whether it is related to the shift kit. But since I have two C6's with shift
kits and a mustang with a shift kit and had no problem, IMHO I don't think they
are related.

Thanks
John MacNamara

78 F250 4X4 Supercab
67 GT500
66 Corvette

>
>
> Keith Srb herbie netvalue.net
> Mesa, AZ
> 1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
> 1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
> 1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, Camper Special, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box,
> Style Side.
> 1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Model 1100 1bbl carb, Oil Bath Air
> Cleaner, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
> My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"
>
> +-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961 thru 1979 --------------+
> | Send posts to fordtrucks61-79 listservice.net, |
> | Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks61-79-request listservice.net|
> +---------- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ ----------+

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:08:20 -0800
From: John MacNamara
Subject: Re: C6 Transmission Questions Part 2

Keith Srb wrote:

> I forgot about this question.
>
> When changing Transmission Fluid and Filter in a C6, is there anyway to
> change the fluid in the Torque Converter with out taking the Transmission
> out of the truck?

Yes, there is a small hex fitting that can be removed so that the fluid can be
drained. You just have to rotate the torque converter till it is accessible.

Thanks
John

>
>
> Is this something I should even be concerned with?
>
> Keith Srb herbie netvalue.net
> Mesa, AZ
> 1986 Ford Bronco II, 2.9L (I HATE LITERS) V-6, Mitsubishi 5-Speed.
> 1980 Harley Davidson, XLH, Rebuilt from the frame up.
> 1974 Ford F250 Ranger XLT, Camper Special, 390ci 4bbl, Automatic, Long Box,
> Style Side.
> 1966 Ford F100, 240 C.I. Straight Six, Model 1100 1bbl carb, Oil Bath Air
> Cleaner, Warner T-18 4-Speed, Short Box.
> My Blood runs "TRUE BLUE FORD on Four Wheels and Pure HARLEY on Two Wheels!"
>
> +-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961 thru 1979 --------------+
> | Send posts to fordtrucks61-79 listservice.net, |
> | Send Unsubscribe requests to fordtrucks61-79-request listservice.net|
> +---------- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/ ----------+

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 13:58:48 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: C6 transmission questions

> Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:29:41 -0700
> From: Keith Srb
> Subject: C6 transmission questions

> 2. What are the Pro's and Con's of installing a shift kit in a C6?.
> I had a kit installed in a C4, big mistake. In a one year span,
> the reverse band broke 4 times. Right now the Transmission in my 74
> shifts so smooth, it hard to tell if it is shifting at all. I hate
> that it makes me think something is wrong with the Transmission
> every time I drive it.

Properly applied and installed shift kits are actually good for RV's
and off road vehicles especially with engine upgrades because it
actually protects the clutches and bands from wearing due to slippage
since they allow quicker, more positive shifts.

Obviously if they are misapplied or misused breakage could result.
Generally hot engines or rough use require stronger parts also be
installed, not just a shift kit and the shift kit alone in this case
could cause trouble as you say. The C-6 is a very strong tranny even
stock so may not require beefing up to work in your application :-)


I know where compressors get their air, it gets
sucked out of the NEIGHBOR'S electric lines :-)

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:33:54 -0500
From: am14 chrysler.com
Subject: Funny named 4sp OD

OK FOMOCO gurus. I recently ran across a 4sp manual that was .8 OD in
4th. He said 1st gear was same approx ratio as most 3sp's.(2.5 or
so). Tremec (pronounced tree meck) was the name. availablity was
'80/'83 I think. Anyone know about this tranny??? Would it stand the
rigors of a '77 4X4 with 460 and only occasional heavy duty use?? No
severe duty. I can purchase it for $600 outright. $450 if I had a
trade of like tranny. (If I had a trade of like tranny, I'd rebuild it
myself). Any help appreciated.

Thanks,

Azie

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:40:32 -0500
From: am14 chrysler.com
Subject: tubing bender

Not only that - No one else can say what you got under there if you do
it yourself!!!!

>>My main thought was the tubing bender, which you can rent and use in
your
driveway! The cost of the bender, per day, has to be less then paying a
muffler
shop to kink up a bunch of pipe.


Azie
....

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:50:33 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: Funny named 4sp OD

> From: am14 chrysler.com
> Subject: Funny named 4sp OD
> Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:33:54 -0500

> OK FOMOCO gurus. I recently ran across a 4sp manual that was .8 OD
> in 4th. He said 1st gear was same approx ratio as most 3sp's.(2.5
> or so). Tremec (pronounced tree meck) was the name. availablity
> was '80/'83 I think. Anyone know about this tranny??? Would it

There may be several types used by ford, don't know how many but I've
heard from owners that the "4 spd O.D." wasn't very strong. Problem
is that sooner or later you will get into it and that may be enough
to do it in?? The one's I'm familair with were in I6's (300 six).

I know where compressors get their air, it gets
sucked out of the NEIGHBOR'S electric lines :-)

- -- Gary --

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 15:36:18 -0500
From: Brian & Jacque Milbrandt
Subject: Re: Speaking of exhaust stuff!

Yeah..they will flow better, but the bends are real long. If ya get a
chance, look at a factory type bend( like where your power comes into
your panel in the basement) and you'll see how long they can be. Might
cause your pipes to be hanging much lower than ya want.

Brian

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 19:07:35 -0500 (EST)
From: DBrents105 aol.com
Subject: Re: 4 bbl on a 302?

It should work fine. In fact I have installed several 600 CFM carbs on 302s
with no problem.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 19:45:45 -0500 (EST)
From: JVC1968 aol.com
Subject: Re: 4 bbl on a 302?

Conrad, The 4bbl carb should work well with the Edlebrock intake on the 302.
I have a 65 Ford with a 289 (which is almost identical to the 302) and an
Edlebrock intake with a Holly 600cfm and this set up gives me plenty of
giddy-up. The only thing is the part where you said that the engine you have
has a 2bbl currently on it. My 289 came stock with a 2bbl carb. and in
order to make the 4bbl work I had to change the 2bbl heads to the 4bbl heads.
You need to check with someone who is familiar with the 302 engine (probably
a performance shop). I hope this info is helpful to you. Good luck.
Joe
jvc1968 aol.com
PS. My 65 Ford is a Mustang if anybody is wondering. And I have a 71 F-100

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 19:09:53 -0500
From: Schottsweb webtv.net (George Schott)
Subject: Exhaust tubing

I weld on this stuff for 10 hours a day with a small ventillation hood
above me. Most of the pipe I weld on is sch. 40 4 inch and bigger the
galvanized coating is rather thick on this pipe but on conduit I would
think that it would not be as heavy. The responses are correct the
galvanized gives off zinc chromate which is a poisonous gas in heavy
closed in spots but IMHO if you installed the conduit and then drove the
vehicle on the highway for any length of time you could heat it up as
well as keep the air flow for ventillation and this would give you the
opprotunity to burn off the majority of the heavy coating. Just my
opinion everybodies got one.

Duke's
Fine 69

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:50:57 -0500
From: cdkelly juno.com (Christopher D Kelly)
Subject: Re: F350 Centurion

I have seen one as a Ford Dealer near me used to have one...It eats
suburbans for breakfast! The price was over 45K. Sounds like a good price
to me!

On Tue, 25 Nov 1997 05:35:43 -0800 Jeffrey.Carver Aerojet.com (CARVER,
JEFFREY D) writes:
>Drove by the local Ford dealer and spotted a HUGE truck
>in the used lot. Dropped by to check it out. I'd seen one
>Centurion previously on the road, so took the opportunity
>to check it out in the flesh. Here's the scoop, they are
>really interested in unloading it. Could someone cross
>post this to the newer truck list please?
>
>'96 F350 Centurion $39,999 will let it go
>for close to $35,000. It has (this is NOT a typo)
>3600 miles on it. Lots of special order stuff on it.
>7.4 Liter engine, 1 ton, 4WD, duallys.
>
>The original purchaser probably paid close to $50K
>for this truck, special order.
>
>For those who don't know, a Centurion (from my
>observation only, nothing official) is a BIG truck.
>
>It has seatbelts for 8 people. It is a crewcab and a half.
>It has double doors, PLUS the half seat behind the
>middle seat. The middle seat is a bench that will fold
>flat to mate with the rear bench. Buckets in front.
>
>The dealer is located in Folsom California, about a
>half hour east of Sacramento.
>
>916-353-2000
>
>Very neat truck. Had to pass this one
>onto the list, very rare to find used I
>would think.
>
>- Jeff '64 F100 CrewCab
>
>+-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961 thru 1979
>--------------+
>| Send posts to fordtrucks61-79 listservice.net,
>|
>| Send Unsubscribe requests to
>fordtrucks61-79-request listservice.net|
>+---------- Visit Our Web Site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/
>----------+
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 22:12:42 -0500 (EST)
From: Chekerdpst aol.com
Subject: Re: 4 bbl on a 302?

Hopefully your intake is a dual plane unit-these make better low end power
than the high rise single plane. I have had good luck with the 625 cfm
edelbrock/carter on a mildly built 302. If I was to do it over, I would go
with the 500 cfm unit, just make sure you get the spring-loaded needle (and
corresponding seat) for your carb. This will go a long ways to helping
prevent stumble when off-roading- although at very steep tilt angles, you can
flood the carb, causing a loss of momentum. Good Luck


Darren
76 Jeep CJ-5 302 w top loader 4 spd
78 F-250 Camper Special 460/c-6
86 Mazda RX-7 (Considering 5.0 power)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 22:23:55 PST
From: "MICHAEL FRISCH"....


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