Re: Time for new glass

fordtrucks61-79-digest Sunday, April 26 1998 Volume 01 : Number 001

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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 98 7:02:13 -0400
From: "SGT WILLIAM A WHITED"
Subject: Re: Time for new glass

Semper Fi Jon

74 F100 RANGER EXTENDED CAB 390
- -------------
Original Text
From "FoMoCoNUT2" , on 4/23/98 11:28 PM:
To: SMTP3

SMTP3

MCB LEJEUNE[]

In a message dated 4/23/98 7:45:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Tom.Hogan

kla-
tencor.com writes:

scratches from the desert sand. I have not verified this myself and
hope I am not perpetuating a myth. Can anyone else out there verify? >>

Well gang, here is my expierience: I am a crew chief / gunner on Super
Stallions, CH53E helicopters in the Marine Corps and I sware by pledge to
keep
the windscreens clean and free from scratches. I don't know about being
"reccomended" by anyone or any company. But I can tell you that on my last
six
month overseas trip which included operating in every environment from salt
spray (operating from USS Ship) to operations in North Africa, all over
Europe
and parts of the Middle East. I mean we operate in some very in-hospitable
landing zones in the dessert and mountains with everything from flying
dirt,sand and animal dung to other "projectiles", that the brand new sets
of
windscreens I installed before the deployment maintained everyday with a
good
cleaning of soap and water then polished with "pledge", of course with
lemon
scent for that extra touch, was the only set of windscreens in my squadron
which came back to the good ole' U.S. looking almost NEW. So there it is
again..... my "more than" two cents worth.. hope this helps someone out ..

John Miller...... FoMoCoNUT2.....
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:16:27 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: motor of choice???

> From: Ractrk002
> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 20:04:00 EDT
> Subject: Re: motor of choice???

> I have a 302 in my truck and have got better mileage than any people
> I know of with FE's, 385 and 335's, my friends 351M gets around
> 14mpg with a 4bbl and a hot cam. And that aint feather footin' it
> either..

In all of my posts on this subject I stated that the truck aspect
evened the engines up quite a bit in the economy catagory. This is a
"generality" and for the most part is accurate from the data I've
collected. if you have a 335 series engine that gets 14 mpg in any
vehicle, even a car you should feel very fortunate because that is
not it's normal level of performance. 14 with a 302 is about par and
if you do better, again, feel lucky and cherish that engine till it
dies.

The simple fact is that most truck owners even up to this day expect
to get in the range of 8 - 12 mpg with almost any engine and are
happily surprised to get more than that, again with any engine
including the new romeo 4.2 EFI, in a truck. Many will do better on
the highway but average commuting and city driving will be in that
range most of the time.

Driving style has a lot to do with it but mostly I think it's luck.
Either you got an exceptional engine from the factory or you didn't.
Most of us didn't so it's still generally accurate to say the 351m
will not get better mileage than the 460 on the average if both are
properly tuned and the windsors which are put in trucks fall right
into the same bracket economy wise since most of them are HO's. The
trade off for economy starts at the 302/300 level where you also give
up a lot of performance. Above that it's anyone's guess so you may
as well have the best IMNSHO :-)

A properly tuned 460 will give you 400# of torque at 2k rpm much more
cheaply than a 351W will in every respect including fuel economy. If
you don't want 400# of torque then it's a differnt matter altogether
isn't it? :-) The 400 can be made to give 400# too but I'm not
convinced that it can be done more cheaply in any respect than with
the 460 since some after market parts will be required to get it done
and then the fuel economy may suffer as well.

There are many variables and it depends and depends and depends but
he bottom line, average across the board is still the same, trucks
don't get good mileage unless you do some work to make it happen so
you may as well have some performance for your hard earned cash :-)

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:24:19 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: C6, C4, AOD, was: Just Picked Up a '72 429...

i have heard, and read, that the C4 was available for a short time with the
bolt pattern for the 460/429. i never seen one but i understand that many
racers with light cars, and 460's use 'em. they are rare to say the least.
i doubt that lincoln used them tho. but like i said, i never seen one.
never seen sasquauch either . . .

on a secondary note, to put an AOD behind the 460, it can be done. you
need an adapter plate, flexplate, crank hub spacer just to mention a few
items, but if you are interested call Art Carr Performance Products
702-677-6610
www.artcarr.com

sleddog

- ----------
From: Gary, 78 BBB[SMTP:gpeters3

ford.com]
Sent: Friday, April 24, 1998 3:22 AM
To: fordtrucks61-79

ListService.net
Subject: Re: Just Picked Up a '72 429...

> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:03:28 -0700
> From: Vogt Family
> Subject: Just Picked Up a '72 429...

> Well, I just got a '72 429 out of a Lincoln for $200 today. Don't
> quite know what I've got. I also have an automatic transmission.
> It is quite large. Did they have an AOD that far back? There is a
> large number S-95 on the bellhousing.

If it has a solid case including the bell housing it's a C-6. I
threw that disclaimer in there just in case but I'm pretty sure the
429 was never hooked to anything but the C-6 or 4 spd manual.

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:07:26 -0500
From: "Dale and Donna Carmine"
Subject: AOD Transmission / E4OD

> George, I didn't know you could get the shift computer on a stand
> alone basis? You mean I could put this tranny in my 78 bronco
> without any EFI or computer stuff?
>
> Who makes it?

I remember reading about this "magic box" at least 3-4 years ago in one of
the car magazines. I looked through my stack but couldn't find the article.
I remember it was about $1,000 at that time, I don't remember who the
manufacturer was. Anyone out there who has actually done this? How much
did the entire swap cost?

later,
dale c

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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:11:28 -0400
From: "Jonathan I. Shapiro"
Subject: roof rust

I am interested in repairing cancerous rust above the door openings on my =
'79 f250. I would be thankful for any insights and advice anybody might =
have. =20

Jonathan
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:45:44 -0700
From: Aaron Jacobson
Subject: 65 box

0.K. all you Ford gurus.I thought the four holes cut out(two on each
side)on the front of the box on my 65 F250 camper special were put there
by the previous owner.The other day I seen another 65,this one a 1/2 ton
with the same holes.They are about four inches in diameter and located
at the upper front of the box. Anybody out there have any ideas what
these were used for? It appears they came like this from the factory.
Jake
65 f250 camper special
351c
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 17:37:19 +0000
From: Garr&Pam
Subject: Re: AOD Transmission

George Herpich wrote:
>
> I just sold my Lightning, black '94 # 1976, a couple of months ago. I was on the
> list until then. I do miss it but I needed the money and garage space for my old
> stuff.
> George
>
> Garr&Pam wrote:
>
> Level 10 does alot with E4OD. I am on the F150 Lightning list and every
> > one on thier swears by level 10. There's guys running some serious
> > horsepower and turning some awesome quarter mile times and most have
> > level 10 upgrades or a complete tranny down by them. I never see any
> > posts about transmission problems!!! Hope this helps
> > Chris

>

Got any extra Lightning parts for sale. Maybe you can purchase a new one
in the future.

Chris
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Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 20:12:56 -0500
From: Bill Adams
Subject: 351W or C or 400????Help with ID

>
>I have the opportunity to purchase a 62 F-250, in general the truck is ready for
>the junk yard. I need a few parts off of it and it has a more modern motor in it.
>That's the question.
>
>
>According to the owner it's either a 351 something or a 400.
>
>Can anyone help me with a quick way to ID it, so I can know what I am getting.
>
>BTW If anyone needs some parts off of a 62 F250 let me know. I'll sell you whatever

>is there that I don't need.
>
>The plan is to pull what I need and drag the rest to a salvage yard, quickly.
>
>Fords rule.
>Bill Adams
>

- --

Bill Adams

The WoodButcher's Shop
"http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/heartland/plains/6640"

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yahoo.com
>From: Daniel Koster
>Subject: Re: 352 or 390?
>
>>Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:04:47 -0700
>>To: fordtrucks61-79

listservice.net
>>From: Daniel Koster
>>Subject: Re: 352 or 390?
>>
>>
>>Jay,
>>
>>Here's what I've been able to collect so far:
>>
>>1. C5AE 9425 C
>>
>> 1965 Ford car intake manifold
>>
>>2. C7ME-A on the engine block
>>
>> 1967 Mercury engine
>> According to my book here, you've got a '67-70 428!
>>
>>3. 29 and 352 on the driver's side of the block
>>
>> Almost all FE engine came with a 352 imprinted on it. All
>> that means is that it is of the FE engine family.
>>
>>4. C5TE 9430 C on the exhaust manifold
>>
>> 1965 Ford Truck standard exhaust manifold
>>
>>5. C4AE 6090 G on the cylinder head
>>
>> 1964-65 Ford car 352/390 standard cylinder head
>>
>>What a turn of events. Most of think we have a 427 or 428, only to find
out it is a 352/390. Today must be your lucky day!
>>
>>I'd suggest trying to measure the bore and stroke of the
>>cylinder. That will be the only true way to tell what the
>>engine is.
>>
>>Here's a chart to help you along:
>>
>> 3.50 3.78 3.98 Stroke
>>Bore 4.00 352
>> 4.05 360 390
>> 4.13 406 428
>> 4.23 427
>>
>>
>>Let me know what you find out.
>>
>>Good luck!
>>
>>Dan
>>
>>
>>p.s. your 428 probably wasn't a Cobra-Jet, nor a Police
>> Interceptor. However, the standard 428 with a 4-valve
>> intake had a compression ratio of 10.5:1 and produced
>> 340 hp

5200 rpm!
>>

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prodigy.com ( DAN LEE)
Subject: Hard Starting

I have a '53 F100 with a 351C-4V. When the engine is cold I pump the
gas once to set the choke, crank the starter a few turns and it
starts up and runs fine. If I stop and shut the engine off and try to
restart in a short time, it is real hard cranking. I have initial
advance at about 8 degrees BDC. After a little cranking even at this
slow speed it will start and run fine.

I remember the Cleveland in my old Mustang did the same. Am I
repeating the same mistake or is this inherent in Cleveland engines?

Dan Lee
'53 F100
351C-4V
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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 11:29:39 EDT
From: Ractrk002
Subject: Re: 351W or C or 400????Help with ID

Easy to tell the 351W it has only 6 bolts on the valve covers the 351C,M and
400 all have 8 thats as much as I can help
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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 09:37:21 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: (Sort of)Re:motor of choice???

L&L (sorry don't have their #) makes mounts to drop a 460 into your truck.
They're guaranteed for life. I believe they can also help with the exhaust
and accessory brackets you'll need to change. I think Gary said it would
set you back about $500 in addition to the motor to swap it in. Don't
believe you'd have to change the rest of the driveline at all.

- ----------
> From: A64F100
> To: fordtrucks61-79

ListService.net
> Subject: (Sort of)Re:motor of choice???
> Date: Wednesday, April 22, 1998 3:43 PM
>
> In a message dated 98-04-22 02:42:10 EDT, you write:
>
>
A
> 429 or 460 would even bolt right to the bellhousing with new motor
mounts >>
>
> I've been wondering about this myself lately.. Although I loved my 400,
I've
> been considering a 460. Ever since my 400 decided to screw up (to use
nice
> words) I've been considering a 429-460 to bolt in. Now, I don't want to
start
> any engine wars again, the fact of the matter is that I loved my 400, but
I'm
> curious about puttin a 460 in and have seen more 460s for sale than 400s
> locally. So, here comes the question. How many modifications need to be
made
> to the motor mounts to put in a 460 where a 400 previoulsly resided? As
far as
> I see it, it's ok as long as I don't move the transmission at all.
Because as
> soon as I move the tranny, I'll need MORE driveshaft modifications, and
> frankly I don't know if I can afford to do that again. Well, thanks
> for the help.
>
> Later,
> Scott L

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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 15:04:04 +0000
From: "Peters"
Subject: 360-460 Swap?

I'm new to this list, so you'll forgive me for asking something
that's been asked probably 400 times already this year. I have a '76
F150 4X4, and am considering getting rid of my boat anchor-360 for
something a little more peppy (i.e. 460). What should I be concerned
with when preparing to do the swap? Motor mounts? Tranny? Also, is
there any particular year of 460 that should be avoided? I have a NP
435 tranny with the granny low. I'm glad I found this list, and hope
to be able to contribute to it a bit!
***********************************************************
Geoff Peters
#885, Route 845
Kingston, N.B.
E5N 1G2
(506) 450-5775 (cell)
(506) 763-3987

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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 13:02:07 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: 360-460 Swap?

Oh my lord! Stand back you have angered the FE gods now! OTOH there are a
few 460 devotees here who may defend you but this thread could get ugly!
Ken, grab your bowtie...(no, not the motor!)... you may want to referee
this one...

[Michael Buffer mode on]

LETS GET READY TO RUMMMBBBLLLEEE...

- ----------
> From: Peters
> To: fordtrucks61-79

ListService.net
> Subject: 360-460 Swap?
> Date: Saturday, April 25, 1998 8:04 AM
>
> I'm new to this list, so you'll forgive me for asking something
> that's been asked probably 400 times already this year. I have a '76
> F150 4X4, and am considering getting rid of my boat anchor-360 for
> something a little more peppy (i.e. 460). What should I be concerned
> with when preparing to do the swap? Motor mounts? Tranny? Also, is
> there any particular year of 460 that should be avoided? I have a NP
> 435 tranny with the granny low. I'm glad I found this list, and hope
> to be able to contribute to it a bit!
> ***********************************************************
> Geoff Peters
> #885, Route 845
> Kingston, N.B.
> E5N 1G2
> (506) 450-5775 (cell)
> (506) 763-3987

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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 05:49:18 -0400
From: "THE PAVIES'"
Subject: Re: Vehicle lift

Gary: What's the minimum ceiling height for one of those lifts? I'm
planning a garage that has a 13' ceiling. The lift would be something
neat to put in years down the road. I think I know how excited you are -
I'm finally gunna have a garage with a nice flat smooth concrete floor
after so many years of working outside on a stone driveway on the side
of a hill. I'll think I died and went to
heaven!!!!!!
PS- are we all invited to your open house party? Jack P.
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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 07:04:28 -0400
From: "THE PAVIES'"
Subject: RE: Time for new glass

Dan- Way back when I was in the Army (almost 30 years ago now -
geeesh!) I used to work on helicopters. To clean the plexiglass, I used
to get a bottle of liquid plastic cleaner and some cheesecloth. The
bottle had to be shaken up a lot to mix up a powder that always settled
in lump on the bottom. Once applied to the plastic, the solution would
dry and leave a coating of powder. More cheesecloth was used to wipe it
off. I dont know what this liquid was but I remember it smelled like
Brasso. Anyway, it would remove light scratches and leave the plexiglass
looking like new. Maybe someone out there knows what it was and where to
get some. The label on the stuff I used only had the usual military
description: Stock Number 1234-567-8910 Cleaner, liquid, plastic.
Jack P>
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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:04:01 EDT
From: FORDTRKNUT
Subject: Re:Hood Emblems...

Well.....I just got back from the Spring Carlisle Swapmeet and boy am I tired.
I walk all over creation and found the Emblems (Ranger....Explorer...and the
red one with the funny squiggles in it "Lariet type") Hold onto your hat
because these guy's know what they got!!! Anywere from $75.00 to $125.00!!!!
Yep...you've read correctly....up to $125.00!!!! They are N.O.S. (New Old
Stock) and in original boxes. I forget who has what emblem....so here's one
of the people who have them. Ed Bennet FORD Parts........9 School
Lane........Labanon, PA 17042.....1-717-272-8762 after 5 pm (answer machine
will pickup all other times) and there FAX number
1-717-272-2959////////////////////////////////////////////another person is
Bruce Foley.......2341 Dug Hill Road......Brownsboro, AL
35741........1-256-852-8268. Hope this helps someone out!!!! I have a
bunch of NOS parts for my 1979 F-350 4x4 that I want to switch tommorrow...I
can't wait till Sunday! Any questions....JUST ASK!!! Wayne Grabley
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sonic.net
Subject: CV vs. U joints

Hi Group,

I've been thinking about driveline angles lately, and the need to keep
tranny output shaft and rear end pinion angles the same so that the
U-joints don't "do that little dance".
Soooo... how come CV joints aren't used on rear axle drivelines?
Wouldn't CV's make driveline angles less critical?
It seems to me like CV's would be better, and You see them on most all front
wheel drive axles but I ain't never seen 'em on a front engine/rear drive
driveshaft... Uhh, why is that?

Someone enlighten me please...
Thanx,

Steve

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
-- Hunter S. Thompson

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Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:53:44 EDT
From: SuperMagot
Subject: Carb Questions

This question is for those who have experience with multiple brands/types of
carbs.

I am looking to replace my current carb (Holley 750) with something else that
allows me to tune it much easier (change Jets, fine degree of tuning, etc)

The reason I want to do this is I plan on taking my truck to the track and
running some 1/4 miles and I want to get the carb as tuned as I can, and be
able to make changes in between runs. I eventually want to go to something
like a projection setup, but that wont happen for a year or so. (Too much
$$$$) In the mean time, any carb recomendations would be helpful.

Here is some info on the truck, if it helps:

460, mildy ported heads, RV cam, Edelbroke Performer intake, Mallory Ignition,
headers. Its a C-6 Auto standard gears and 3.7 rear-end ratio.
The truck is a 70 1/2 Ton SWB 2WD.

Thanks in advance for your help!

- - Mike

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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:57:37 -0700
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: CV vs. U joints

>From Steve
> Soooo... how come CV joints aren't used on rear axle drivelines?
> Wouldn't CV's make driveline angles less critical?

My '70 Bronco did have CV joints. They were the dual spider type
(also called something else that I can't remember, but they were CV
joints non the less). It would be my guess that cost keeps them from
being used. My rear CV joint went out, well damaged when a spider's
bearing cap gave up the ghost. They wanted $300 to weld on a new CV
joint or $25 to cut off the CV joint and weld on a U joint. I opted for
the U joint.
Yes it would make driveline angles less critical. The Bronco was a
short wheel base and the driveline was at a steep angle. The guy at the
driveline shop told me I needed to keep it at stock height or I would
blow spiders like they were going out of style. I never had a problem
with it.

Deacon
deconblu

gte.net
=============================
Nuke the unborn baby whales.
=============================
Deacon's
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home1.gte.net/deconblu/

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Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 03:55:03 -0700
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: Carb Questions

>From Mike
>This question is for those who have experience with
multiplebrands/types of
>carbs.

Well I'm not personally experienced, but I've asked around to help
friends that race. Hope you don't mind my 2 cents.

>I am looking to replace my current carb (Holley 750) with something
else that
>allows me to tune it much easier (change Jets, fine degree of
tuning,etc)

The problem is no manufacturer makes large cfm tunable carbs but Holley.
A friend of mine races a 460 SVO powered Tbird with a Holley 950cfm
sitting on a Victor jr. intake. It works for him!

>I eventually want to go to something
>like a projection setup, but that wont happen for a year or so. (Too
much
>$$$$) In the mean time, any carb recomendations would be helpful.

Same friend tried ProJection on his and had nothing but trouble with it.
I checked the Holley tech page for him and found tons of people having
trouble setting them up. Holley never had and answer but setup a page
for ProJection users to help each other. That worked rather well cuz
everyone knows how racers share setups that work for them with fellow
racers. ;] Without personal experience but through helping Tony, I think
ProJection is too much money for no return.

Where did the name "SuperMagot" come from anyway? Your post are great
once I get past this picture in my head! :)
Later!

Deacon
deconblu

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Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:29:33 -0700
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: Carb Questions

>From Mike
>This question is for those who have experience with multiple
brands/types of
>carbs.

Well I'm not personally experienced, but I've asked around to help
friends that race. Hope you don't mind my 2 cents.

>I am looking to replace my current carb (Holley 750) with something
else that
>allows me to tune it much easier (change Jets, fine degree of tuning,
etc)

The problem is no manufacturer makes large cfm tunable carbs but Holley.
A friend of mine races a 460 SVO powered Tbird with a Holley 950cfm
sitting on a Victor jr. intake. It works for him!

>I eventually want to go to something
>like a projection setup, but that wont happen for a year or so. (Too
much
>$$$$) In the mean time, any carb recomendations would be helpful.

Same friend tried ProJection on his and had nothing but trouble with it.
I checked the Holley tech page for him and found tons of people having
trouble setting them up. Holley never had and answer but setup a page
for ProJection users to help each other. That worked rather well cuz
everyone knows how racers share setups that work for them with fellow
racers. ;] Without personal experience but through helping Tony, I think
ProJection is too much money for no return.

Where did the name "SuperMagot" come from anyway? Your post are great
once I get past this picture in my head! :)
Later!

Deacon
deconblu

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Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 12:02:21 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: Carb Questions

the best setup i have seen for changes between runs, would be to keep your
holley, and get the jet plates that you can change jets while the engine
is running. if it is a vacuum secondary carb, you can get a kit to adjust
that too without removing carb.

and also get a book on holleys. that'll help. the carter and edelbroke
will work well too, but i do not know how easy they are to change between
runs.

let us know what ET/MPH you run!

sleddog

ps- the jet plates are about $100 i think.

- ----------
From: SuperMagot[SMTP:SuperMagot

aol.com]
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 1998 1:53 AM
To: fordtrucks61-79

ListService.net
Subject: Carb Questions

This question is for those who have experience with multiple brands/types....

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