61-79-list Digest V2000 #78

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Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:34:05 -0400 (EDT)
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61-79-list Digest Mon, 24 Apr 2000 Volume: 2000 Issue: 078

In This Issue:
Re: Engine identity
Re: Engine identity
Re: 1979 F-150 TANDEM
Wiring Diagram FOUND & Carlisle
Re: Engine identity
Overdrive recommendations?
Re: Engine identity
460 info
351 W, C, M or 400 ???
root beer truck
351 mufflers for headers?
Fans
Dana 60 stuff
ford steering box parts
Re: 351 mufflers for headers?
Re: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???
Re: Dana 60 stuff
E series steering column swap
Re: Dana 60 stuff
Re: 460 info
Re: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???
Re: 351 mufflers for headers?
Somebody save this one !
Tailgate for sale
Re: 460 info
Re: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???
Re: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???
Re: Dana 60 stuff
Re: Dana 60 stuff
Re: Somebody save this one !
Re: Dana 60 stuff
Re: Tailgate for sale
Re: 4X4 Diesel
9 inch gear swap
Re: 9 inch gear swap
Re: Dana 60 stuff
Kingpins Again!
Paint won't stick to metal.
Re: 351 mufflers for headers?
Re: 9 inch gear swap
Re: Tailgate for sale
Re: Tailgate for sale

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Ross Johansson" alaska.net>
Subject: Re: Engine identity
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 22:04:00 -0800

I have a similar problem identifing my engine....
Would you happen to know what the bore and stroke of a 352 would be?

Thanks
Ross
'67 F100 4x4

----- Original Message -----
From: wish ford-trucks.net>
To: <61-79-list

ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2000 6:00 AM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: Engine identity

> > I bought a 76 F150 4 x 4 about 6 months ago and I was told the
> >engine in the truck was a 390. However recently I have become unsure if
it
>
> >is actually a 390. Where would I look on the block to verify the CU of
the
>
> >engine. I remember they used to place the displacement on the heads, but
it
>
> >has been a long time since I've turned wrenches. If anyone could give me
> >advise I'd appreciate it.
> >
>
> Unfortunately you can't look at the block, someone else's assumption that
they
> used the same bore is correct, they are both a 4.05" bore from the
factory.
> This means the stroke is different. There has been some talk of a dowel
method
> of determining the stroke without pulling the motor ...
>
> pull the #1 plug and put the crank at TDC, put a dowell in the plug hole
until
> it hits the piston and then mark the dowell.
>
> Then rotate the motor 180 degrees, and put the dowell in again, make
another
> mark.
>
> The distance between the marks should be pretty close to the stroke. If
its
> 3.5" or so then its a 360, if its 3.75" or so its a 390 ...
>
> Just my $.02
> wish
>
> 96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
> 73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish
>
> Ford Truck Enthusiasts
> http://www.ford-trucks.com
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> message.
>

------------------------------

From: "Ross Johansson" alaska.net>
Subject: Re: Engine identity
Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 22:08:01 -0800

I have a similar problem identifing my engine....
Would you happen to know what the bore and stroke of a 352 would be?

Thanks
Ross
'67 F100 4x4

----- Original Message -----
From: wish ford-trucks.net>
To: <61-79-list

ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> message.
>

------------------------------

From: "NP 540" hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: 1979 F-150 TANDEM
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 05:09:44 PDT

>From: "Pat" aisl.bc.ca>
>Subject: 1979 F-150 TANDEM
>Date: Sun, 23 Apr 2000 10:23:02 -0700
>
>Consider Tim and Pam's suggestion seconded.
>Pat

>
>From: "Tim and Pam Allgire" williams-net.com>
>Subject: Re: 1979 F-150 TANDEM
>Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 21:46:06 -0400
>
>Hey if you could,get some pictures of it & put them on here for everyone to
>see.Sounds odd &very different.
>
>
Well, I'll try to take pictures, but don't get your hopes too
high on this, as I don't have a camera of mine, will have to
borrow one, and when I'll briefly be around that truck in a few
days, I don't know if the owner is gonna be around; prefer to ask
him permission before taking pictures, and I won't be able to stay
around that place for very long. I'll do my best!

Gerry
Vive le FORD!

________________________________________________________________________

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:15 -0400
From: BECKER-JEFFREY macktrucks.com>
Subject: Wiring Diagram FOUND & Carlisle

--- Received from MACDGA.JB1882H 301-790-5580 00-04-24 08:15

Fordsters,
1) I "FOUND" the wiring diagram to my '77 F100 this weekend -
it resides in the HAYNES service manual for '73 - '79 Ford Trucks.
It is excellent, multiple pages long, complete and easy to read.
Color codes are there as well as a full description of my formerly
rusted-out (used naval jelly on it) fuse block which is not
legible. This is an indispensable item and was well worth the $12.
Better than the owner's manual which I don't have. HAYNES has
manuals for other year trucks as well. Available at most auto
parts and big book stores like Borders. PS: the Chilton manual's
diagram was terrible in comparison. Chilton = Pathetic.

2) Carlisle Pennsylvania (south central PA) hosts the Truck
Nationals the weekend of June 23-25. I was there last year. Truck
show, parts, swap meet, everything!! Something like $5 plus
parking to attend. Info at website: www.carsatcarlisle.com

> Jeff

---- 00-04-24 08:15 ---- Sent to ---------------------------
-> 61-79-list(a)ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: "wish" ford-trucks.net>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:33:11 GMT
Subject: Re: Engine identity

>I have a similar problem identifing my engine....
>Would you happen to know what the bore and stroke of a 352 would be?
>

Hmmm. I'll post this to the list in case my rememory is wrong again ... the
352 though should be a 4.00" bore and 3.5" stroke just like the 351 ...

Somehow that doesn't seem right, anyone got the numbers in front of them to
verify this ?

The problem comes in that a 352 and 360 share a crank, so you have to actually
measure the bore to get the size of the motor ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

Date: 24 Apr 00 09:02:17 MDT
From: Brent Dickerson my.gazette.com>
Subject: Overdrive recommendations?

I have a '79 F350 4x4 that I want to put an overdrive unit on. I'm currently
looking at Advanced Adapters and Gear Vendors.
Does anyone have other recommendations or warning?
thanks, brent

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 08:59:26 -0700
From: Jason Derra internetcds.com>
Subject: Re: Engine identity

Yes, the bore is 4.00 and the stroke is 3.50. You are correct.
Jason

wish wrote:

> >I have a similar problem identifing my engine....
> >Would you happen to know what the bore and stroke of a 352 would be?
> >
>
> Hmmm. I'll post this to the list in case my rememory is wrong again ... the
> 352 though should be a 4.00" bore and 3.5" stroke just like the 351 ...
>
> Somehow that doesn't seem right, anyone got the numbers in front of them to
> verify this ?
>
> The problem comes in that a 352 and 360 share a crank, so you have to actually
> measure the bore to get the size of the motor ...
>
> Just my $.02
> wish
>
> 96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
> 73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish
>
> Ford Truck Enthusiasts
> http://www.ford-trucks.com
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> message.

------------------------------

From: Bob Hickman credential.com>
Subject: 460 info
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 09:06:39 -0700

I guess you can only lurk on a list for so long...

I'm getting my truck on the road after two years of storage and can't find
any of my manuals 'cause, you guessed it, they're in storage too. Can anyone
tell me the firing order and which is the number one cylinder on a 460?
Please e-mail me directly as I receive the digest version of the list.

I've been on the list for the past six months, mainly to keep in touch with
the Ford truck community. With family and work my old truck hasn't had a lot
of attention. It's a 1968 F-250 4x4 with a 460, C6, NP205 combination
transplanted into it. I'd like to take it out into the mountains around my
home town, Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada.

Thanks in advance,
Bob Hickman

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:14 -0400
From: BECKER-JEFFREY macktrucks.com>
Subject: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???

--- Received from MACDGA.JB1882H 301-790-5580 00-04-24 13:14

Hello,
My '77 F100 originally had a 302 as per the "G" in the VIN
number. According to the PO, it now has a 351W. According to the
three finger versus two fingers between water pump housing and
thermostat inlet rule, and the firing order, it is either a 351 or
400 but definitely not a 302. This truck purchase included a bag
of new internal engine parts such as rings, bearings, timing
chain/gear and gasket set that the PO said were not needed (he
traded a car for it and apparently the previous PO thought it
needed a rebuild. But, it runs fine now - good oil pressure, no
smoke, etc. - perhaps a valve seal job was done).

OK, the above are all of the clues.

1) How do I confirm that it is in fact a Windsor 351 and not from
the Cleveland or "M" plant?
2) What city does the "M" signify?
3) External difference between 351 and 400? Or is this just an
internal bore/stroke thing?

> Thanks, Jeff

PS: valve covers and air cleaner are all chrome aftermarket and no
ID decals anywhere.

---- 00-04-24 13:14 ---- Sent to ---------------------------
-> 61-79-list(a)ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:17:02 -0500
From: Bruce Montcombroux BrandonU.CA>
Subject: root beer truck

Here is a nice duo picture taken in my travels this weekend. Turns out that
the �barrel� on the back of the truck on the right was used as a promo
novelty for selling root beer at events and fairs. I was told that it was
painted with a large A&W logo. Seems that it brought out quite a few fond
memories and smiles from people around here. To view the pic proceed to
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://142.13.30.188/shared_downloads/trucks.jpg picture is 114k.

Could someone identify the truck on the right, I am guessing 1951 F5 ?? Like
I said guessing�

Bruce
65 Merc 240 I6 P/U

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:24 -0400
From: BECKER-JEFFREY macktrucks.com>
Subject: 351 mufflers for headers?

--- Received from MACDGA.JB1882H 301-790-5580 00-04-24 13:24

OK, y'all probably think I'm crazy here, but I need to do
something about the noise coming out of the glass-packs behind the
headers on my F100. I don't mind so much, but part of the reason
for sacrificing and getting an automatic instead of manual tranny
was so any of my family members could drive it. The roar would
bother them. I'd like to leave the headers and put dual mufflers
on. Questions:

1) Any recommendation for a particular muffler brand? This is NOT
a race truck - just for work/normal driving. I'm on a budget.

2) Should I install a cross-over "H" pipe? I've heard this
balances out the pressures/exhaust "pulses" and makes the engine
run smoother.

Thanks,

> Jeff ('77 with that I believe is a 351W)

---- 00-04-24 13:24 ---- Sent to ---------------------------
-> 61-79-list(a)ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: "Gary Perry" fwi.com>
Subject: Fans
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:27:42 -0400

I have and FT engine that I'm trying to put in 56 Big Truck. Need a smaller
fan. Problem is: Fan bolt spacing is wider on FT engines. Anyone ever try
to redrill holes in blades to match pump? The pump has a 3/4" center that
my fan doesn't use, it has a large 1-1/4 or so hole. I'm thinking the p/up
fans will have the 3/4" (or so) hole to center it and I need only drill new holes.
Not sure if there is enough flat area on fan to allow this w/out being too thin
at hole edge. The other choice is to drill the pump plate and I don't think
that would be as easy. Are all Ford fans about the same or do I need one
from the earlier FE type engines? Maybe I should get aftermarket flex-fan
to get more blades. Cooling may be a problem with this installation. Do
electrics have enough power to cool w/out help from eng fan?
"G"

------------------------------

From: JUMPINFORD

aol.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:32:11 EDT
Subject: Dana 60 stuff

Hey folks, just a quick question. Does anyone know if the spindles on a dana
60HD from an F-350 and the spindles from a 60 on a 250 are the same? If so,
how bout the spindles from a 44 and a 60? Reason Im askin is the spindles on
my Dads HD dana 60 are messed up. They were ground down so a 15 inch rim
would fit, and after 15 yrs of service, they have spread a little, and arent
holding the calipers tight anymore. In fact, the truck is down because it
allowed the shim and spring to fall out, which let the pads fall out also.
Im trying to avoid having to press these back in, as that isnt exact, and
will also weaken them further, allowing this to happen again more frequently.
Any info would be great, Thanks everyone.

Darrell Duggan
74 F-350 "Tweety"

------------------------------

From: jniolon

uss.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 12:39:22 -0500
Subject: ford steering box parts

I'm searching for the parts to rebuild a manual steering box on a '70 Ford
pickup.
Perferrable in the Southeast but since Ford doesn't stock them anymore I
can't be too choosy.
Please e-mail direct to jniolon

uss.com if you have any leads

thanks

john

------------------------------

From: "Tim and Pam Allgire" williams-net.com>
Subject: Re: 351 mufflers for headers?
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:50:01 -0400

A crossover or H-pipe will definitely help & any style of Turbo-Muffler
should work.
-----Original Message-----
From: BECKER-JEFFREY macktrucks.com>
To: 61-79-list

ford-trucks.com <61-79-list

ford-trucks.com>
Date: Monday, April 24, 2000 1:37 PM
Subject: [61-79-list] 351 mufflers for headers?

>--- Received from MACDGA.JB1882H 301-790-5580 00-04-24 13:24
>
>OK, y'all probably think I'm crazy here, but I need to do
>something about the noise coming out of the glass-packs behind the
>headers on my F100. I don't mind so much, but part of the reason
>for sacrificing and getting an automatic instead of manual tranny
>was so any of my family members could drive it. The roar would
>bother them. I'd like to leave the headers and put dual mufflers
>on. Questions:
>
>1) Any recommendation for a particular muffler brand? This is NOT
>a race truck - just for work/normal driving. I'm on a budget.
>
>2) Should I install a cross-over "H" pipe? I've heard this
>balances out the pressures/exhaust "pulses" and makes the engine
>run smoother.
>
>Thanks,
>
> > Jeff ('77 with that I believe is a 351W)
>
>---- 00-04-24 13:24 ---- Sent to ---------------------------
> -> 61-79-list(a)ford-trucks.com
>==========================================================
>To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
>the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
>message.
>

------------------------------

From: SevnD2

aol.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:17:02 EDT
Subject: Re: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???

In a message dated 04/24/2000 1:16:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
JEFF.BECKER

macktrucks.com writes:

<< 1) How do I confirm that it is in fact a Windsor 351 and not from
the Cleveland or "M" plant?>>

The thermostat housing will bolt to the top of the block if it is a Cleveland
or M block. If it is a 351 Windsor or 302 the thermostat housing bolts to
the front of the intake manifold.

<< 2) What city does the "M" signify?>>

It doesn't signify a city, it means it is a 351 Modified from a 400 block
engine. Not sure what city they cast all of these blocks in. I know some were
cast in Cleveland Ohio

<< 3) External difference between 351 and 400? Or is this just an
internal bore/stroke thing? >>

Which 351?

Hope this helps.
Rollie H. Hunt

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:26:20 -0400
From: James Oxley thecore.com>
Subject: Re: Dana 60 stuff

JUMPINFORD

aol.com wrote:
>
> Hey folks, just a quick question. Does anyone know if the spindles on a dana
> 60HD from an F-350 and the spindles from a 60 on a 250 are the same?

On 78/79 they are. Not sure on older years.

>If so,
> how bout the spindles from a 44 and a 60?

Not on 78/79.

Reason Im askin is the spindles on
> my Dads HD dana 60 are messed up. They were ground down so a 15 inch rim
> would fit,

Are you talking hubs or spindles??

OX

------------------------------

From: "Southerland, Rich" alldata.com>
Subject: E series steering column swap
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 11:33:56 -0700

Our '77 E150's steering column is disintegrating. The upper bearing is
going, the turn signal switch gave up the ghost yesterday and the cruise
control steering wheel switches are falling apart (the cruise does work!).

I can pick up a tilt (bonus for SWMBO) column out of an '87 E150 very
reasonably. I realize the difference in the lock being on the column in the
'87 versus our '77's lock in the dash. I figured I could disable the lock
on the column and keep the existing ignition switch wiring.

What I really want to know:
Has anyone made this swap? Will the newer column physically fit?

------------------------------

From: "wish" ford-trucks.net>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:55:03 GMT
Subject: Re: Dana 60 stuff

>> Hey folks, just a quick question. Does anyone know if the spindles on a dana

>> 60HD from an F-350 and the spindles from a 60 on a 250 are the same?
>

> Reason Im askin is the spindles on
>> my Dads HD dana 60 are messed up. They were ground down so a 15 inch rim

>> would fit,
>

Hey Darrel, maybe I'm way off base here, but did you just grind down the caliper
support ? 'cause on my D44 (76 1/2 ton, so maybe not even applicable) the caliper
mount is sandwiched between the knuckle and the spindle, so you'd just have
to come up with the part that holds the caliper and not have to worry about
what shape the spindle or anything is in since all that does is hold the caliper
and put a little space in there between the spindle and the knuckle ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: "wish" ford-trucks.net>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 17:57:30 GMT
Subject: Re: 460 info

>Can anyone
>tell me the firing order and which is the number one cylinder on a 460?

All the Ford manifolds I've seen list the firing order right in front of the
carb (well some list it behind if they're out of old enough vehicles. Also
they cast the cylinder number into the intake runner so you can find the #1
pretty quickly ... seems like its the right front on the FE and W's that I've
played with.

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: "wish" ford-trucks.net>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:01:19 GMT
Subject: Re: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???

>1) How do I confirm that it is in fact a Windsor 351 and not from
>the Cleveland or "M" plant?

The W has the thermostat housing bolt directly onto the manifold, so the bolts
will be facing forward and back in the truck ... the M/C bolts to the block
in front of the manifold so the bolts will be pointing straight up.

>2) What city does the "M" signify?

the Midland plant that they were made at if I remember right ...

>3) External difference between 351 and 400? Or is this just an
>internal bore/stroke thing?
>

Between the M series 351 and 400 I think its all internal ... the dowel trick
might work as the 351 is a 3.5" stroke and the 400 is a 4" stroke ... so remove
a plug, and put the piston at TDC, put a dowel in til it touches the piston
and make a mark. Rotate the crank 180degrees and repeat, the distance between
the marks is the stroke ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: "wish" ford-trucks.net>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:04:01 GMT
Subject: Re: 351 mufflers for headers?

>1) Any recommendation for a particular muffler brand? This is NOT
>a race truck - just for work/normal driving. I'm on a budget.
>

Just grab some Turbo's from the local muffler shop, the Super Turbo from Dynomax
carries a life time warranty now I think, and I've had mine (from before they
gave them that warranty) for 6 years or so and they're just starting to get
thin ... I expect to blow them out soon, but probably not til after I put the
headers on :)

>2) Should I install a cross-over "H" pipe? I've heard this
>balances out the pressures/exhaust "pulses" and makes the engine
>run smoother.
>

That's debatable as to whether you should or not. Mine on my truck have always
been true duals with no balance tube, but next time I think I'm going to put
an X in just for fun ... can't say it will hurt or help either way, but the
theory holds that you want the H at least ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: pdesanto

Cinergy.com
Subject: Somebody save this one !
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 14:44:39 -0400

I saw this in a regional trader paper. Sure hope somebody finds a home for
it.

65 F-350 4x4, strong V-8 and running gear, restorable bed, solid body, new
tires,
$1500, Fennville, Mich. 616-561-2917

(looks like it has the usual cab & fender rust, but it's pretty cool anyway.
Odd thing is, it has a 64-66 "Styleside" bed?? I thought all the 4x4's of
that vintage had a 57-60 bed?) Maybe it's a "home built"....dunno. Hello
Bill Ballinger ??
Later, Phil (64 F-100 & 63 Galaxie)

------------------------------

From: "Serian" flashmail.com>
Subject: Tailgate for sale
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:25:02 -0400

Saw this in the local paper, and thought someone might
be interested in it.

" '67-'72 Ford pickup tailgate, came from Texas,
very solid, $40. Call (570) 247-2701 "

The phone exchange indicates that the place is in
Bradford County, PA. I have not seen or inquired
about this tailgate; just figured I would pass along
the info.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:24:05 -0700
From: Jason Derra internetcds.com>
Subject: Re: 460 info

Firing order is 15426378 and #1 cylinder is on the pass side
Jason

Bob Hickman wrote:

> I guess you can only lurk on a list for so long...
>
> I'm getting my truck on the road after two years of storage and can't find
> any of my manuals 'cause, you guessed it, they're in storage too. Can anyone
> tell me the firing order and which is the number one cylinder on a 460?
> Please e-mail me directly as I receive the digest version of the list.
>
> I've been on the list for the past six months, mainly to keep in touch with
> the Ford truck community. With family and work my old truck hasn't had a lot
> of attention. It's a 1968 F-250 4x4 with a 460, C6, NP205 combination
> transplanted into it. I'd like to take it out into the mountains around my
> home town, Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Bob Hickman
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> message.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 13:31:42 -0700
From: Jason Derra internetcds.com>
Subject: Re: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???

1) The 351W looks like a large version of the 302. On the 351W, the
thermostat housing is mounted on the front of the intake manifold, where
the 351M is mounted on top of the block.
2) The M doesn't stand for a city. It stands for Modified, as in a
modified 400.
3) There is no external difference between the 351M and the 400. In the
70's after the demise of the 351C, Ford fell behind on production of the
351W. They started putting Windsor cranks with really odd connecting
rod and piston assemblies into 400 blocks to fill the gap. The stroke
on the 351M is 3.50". The stroke on the 400 is 4.00"
Jason

BECKER-JEFFREY wrote:

> --- Received from MACDGA.JB1882H 301-790-5580 00-04-24 13:14
>
> Hello,
> My '77 F100 originally had a 302 as per the "G" in the VIN
> number. According to the PO, it now has a 351W. According to the
> three finger versus two fingers between water pump housing and
> thermostat inlet rule, and the firing order, it is either a 351 or
> 400 but definitely not a 302. This truck purchase included a bag
> of new internal engine parts such as rings, bearings, timing
> chain/gear and gasket set that the PO said were not needed (he
> traded a car for it and apparently the previous PO thought it
> needed a rebuild. But, it runs fine now - good oil pressure, no
> smoke, etc. - perhaps a valve seal job was done).
>
> OK, the above are all of the clues.
>
> 1) How do I confirm that it is in fact a Windsor 351 and not from
> the Cleveland or "M" plant?
> 2) What city does the "M" signify?
> 3) External difference between 351 and 400? Or is this just an
> internal bore/stroke thing?
>
> > Thanks, Jeff
>
> PS: valve covers and air cleaner are all chrome aftermarket and no
> ID decals anywhere.
>
> ---- 00-04-24 13:14 ---- Sent to ---------------------------
> -> 61-79-list(a)ford-trucks.com
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> message.

------------------------------

From: JUMPINFORD

aol.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:28:52 EDT
Subject: Re: 351 W, C, M or 400 ???

In a message dated 4/24/00 11:18:44 AM Pacific Daylight Time, SevnD2

aol.com
writes:

<< It doesn't signify a city, it means it is a 351 Modified from a 400 block
engine. >>

I thought it meant Michigan. Anyone got the answer?

Darrell Duggan
74 F-350 "Tweety"

------------------------------

From: JUMPINFORD

aol.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:30:28 EDT
Subject: Re: Dana 60 stuff

In a message dated 4/24/00 11:27:37 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
luxjo

thecore.com writes:

<< Are you talking hubs or spindles?? >>

Spindles. The mounting arms that come off the spindle for hanging the
caliper have spread apart about an 1/8 to 3/16 of an inch.

Darrell Duggan
74 F-350 "Tweety"

------------------------------

From: JUMPINFORD

aol.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:36:32 EDT
Subject: Re: Dana 60 stuff

In a message dated 4/24/00 12:05:21 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
wish

ford-trucks.net writes:

<< Hey Darrel, maybe I'm way off base here, but did you just grind down the
caliper
support ? 'cause on my D44 (76 1/2 ton, so maybe not even applicable) the
caliper
mount is sandwiched between the knuckle and the spindle, so you'd just have
to come up with the part that holds the caliper >>

You nailed it! But now you got me wondering, I thought the spindle and
caliper mount were all one piece. I wonder now if they arent.... Anyhow if
your right, and the caliper mount is seperate, I wonder if those are the same
on all 3/4 trucks, regardles of dana 44 or dana 60. Sure would be nice to
have sumthin in front of me to look at, but alas, The junkyards here have
been picked CLEAN.

Darrell Duggan
74 F-350 "Tweety"

------------------------------

From: JUMPINFORD

aol.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:38:15 EDT
Subject: Re: Somebody save this one !

In a message dated 4/24/00 12:07:33 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
pdesanto

Cinergy.com writes:

<< Maybe it's a "home built"....dunno. >>
IT would have to be home built, or atleast an aftermarket job. F-350 4x4
didnt exist from Ford till the mid 70's, 75 I think.

Darrell Duggan
74 F-350 "Tweety"

------------------------------

From: "wish" ford-trucks.net>
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 20:58:17 GMT
Subject: Re: Dana 60 stuff

> 'cause on my D44 (76 1/2 ton, so maybe not even applicable) the
>caliper
> mount is sandwiched between the knuckle and the spindle, so you'd just have

> to come up with the part that holds the caliper >>
>
>You nailed it! But now you got me wondering, I thought the spindle and
>caliper mount were all one piece. I wonder now if they arent.... Anyhow if

>your right, and the caliper mount is seperate, I wonder if those are the same

>on all 3/4 trucks, regardles of dana 44 or dana 60. Sure would be nice to

>have sumthin in front of me to look at, but alas, The junkyards here have

>been picked CLEAN.

I've got my parts layin about (well the D44 front end parts) if you want me
to take pics or measurements of any parts of it lemme know ... the caliper mounts
aren't cleaned up yet, but the rest of the knuckle assembly is ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

------------------------------

From: "Keith Kubiak" <55fordf100

home.com>
Subject: Re: Tailgate for sale
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:36:00 -0700

I'll beat that deal...same thing $30 in San Diego Ca. 1 small dent (about
1") and some minor surface rust on the top. No chrome, plain Jane. You pay
shipping.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Serian" flashmail.com>
To: <61-79-list

ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 12:25 PM
Subject: [61-79-list] Tailgate for sale

> Saw this in the local paper, and thought someone might
> be interested in it.
>
> " '67-'72 Ford pickup tailgate, came from Texas,
> very solid, $40. Call (570) 247-2701 "
>
> The phone exchange indicates that the place is in
> Bradford County, PA. I have not seen or inquired
> about this tailgate; just figured I would pass along
> the info.
>
>
>
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> message.
>

------------------------------

From: WhtsUpDoc2

aol.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:43:12 EDT
Subject: Re: 4X4 Diesel

In a message dated 4/23/00 9:05:35 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
listar

ford-trucks.com writes:

<< From: Jason Derra internetcds.com>
Subject: Re: 4x4 Diesel

You can adapt the C-6, a BW T-18 (I believe thats what came in em stock), a
NP435
a ZF (5 speed), E4OD, possibly an Allison and probably a bunch of others.
Jason >>

Thanks a lot! Would anyone happen to know some prices on the applicable
transfer cases and trannys? Its for an '89 F-250 with the 6.9L Diesel. I've
got a great offer on this truck, but the owner has sold the factory tranny
and transfer case. I need to find the parts and the price before I buy it!

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 15:55:25 -0700
From: Clare Waterman-Storer scripps.edu>
Subject: 9 inch gear swap

hi gurus---

how complex is it to do a ring and pinion swap in a 9" with traction loc? i have a
rear with 3.9 gears and want to switch to 3.50 for economy and drivability. never
really worked with rear ends before, but am reasonably mechanically inclined. the
shop wants ~$500 if its out of the car, ~$600 if its in the car. I can get a ring
and pinion and an installation kit including bearings from summit or the like for
~$250. big difference money wise!

anybody know a good source of instructions for doing such a swap? blow up diagrams
of a 9" trac-loc rear? primers on rear ends in general?

tia for all bits of knowledge,

clare

-- Binary/unsupported file stripped by Listar --
-- Type: text/x-vcard
-- File: waterman.vcf
-- Desc: Card for Clare Waterman-Storer

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:17:55 -0700
From: Don Grossman mac.com>
Subject: Re: 9 inch gear swap

>hi gurus---
>
>how complex is it to do a ring and pinion swap in a 9" with traction
>loc? i have a
>rear with 3.9 gears and want to switch to 3.50 for economy and
>drivability. never
>really worked with rear ends before, but am reasonably mechanically
>inclined. the
>shop wants ~$500 if its out of the car, ~$600 if its in the car. I
>can get a ring
>and pinion and an installation kit including bearings from summit or
>the like for
>~$250. big difference money wise!
>
>anybody know a good source of instructions for doing such a swap?
>blow up diagrams
>of a 9" trac-loc rear? primers on rear ends in general?
>
>tia for all bits of knowledge,
>
>clare

not much help in the set up area but you are going to need to find
out if the gears are 3.89 or 3.92 There is a carrier split here. if
I remember right 3.89 and down are one carrier and the 3.92 and up
are a different carrier. I'm a little fuzzy on all the specs but
just something to double check first.
--
Don Grossman
duckdon

mac.com

43 GPW
63 F-100 4x4
77 F250
99 Contour

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 16:21:59 -0700
From: Don Grossman mac.com>
Subject: Re: Dana 60 stuff

>In a message dated 4/24/00 11:27:37 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
>luxjo

thecore.com writes:
>
><< Are you talking hubs or spindles?? >>
>
>Spindles. The mounting arms that come off the spindle for hanging the
>caliper have spread apart about an 1/8 to 3/16 of an inch.
>
>Darrell Duggan
>74 F-350 "Tweety"

The caliper brackets are a piece unto themselves. Not sure which
year D60 you were looking for but 78/9 used the same caliper (twin
piston) as the HD D44 so the caliper mounts might be the same.

Laters
--
Don Grossman
duckdon

mac.com

43 GPW
63 F-100 4x4
77 F250
99 Contour

------------------------------

From: WICoWbOy19

aol.com
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 19:23:40 EDT
Subject: Kingpins Again!

Ok, list, I know a few weeks ago this was a topic and I have them on file but
I am not at home. My great new toy (the '77 Explorer I just put up for sale
yest decided to start throwing fits) decided to desintegrate all of its
fresh grease in the wheel bearings and completely lock up. Spindles trashed
to say the least. I am 350 miles from home without even a shop manual. I
need to get the spindle off and am unsure of how to get the kingpin out. I
have removed the grease fitting cap type deals on both ends and on the side I
removed the nut off the stud. My question is what next? I remembered that
nut being a bolt which acted as a wedge, you remove it and pound the kingpin
out, but this one was just a nut on a stud so i am lost. Is this someones
rigging and I just need to unthread the stud somehow and continue or? There
is a junkyard down the road, if I can get this old spindle assembly off I can
go get a new one and head home. Just gotta figure out how to get it off.
Any responses would be appreciated so I can get home. Once again it is a '77
F-150 4x2. Thanks all.

WiCowboy
WiCowboy19

aol.com if someone wants to forward me any old posts. Thanks again

------------------------------

From: "Steve and Fran" offspringnet.net>
Subject: Paint won't stick to metal.
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 18:08:05 -0600

Recently I told you guys that I bought a '78 F250. Well on either side, just
behind the hood and around where the antenna (on the pass side) is, the
steel looks galvanized, and paint wouldn't stick for years. Any ideas? I'm
thinking about getting the whole truck painted anyway, but I'd hate for the
new paint not to stick too!

Steve S.

------------------------------

From: "G & J Boling" alltel.net>
Subject: Re: 351 mufflers for headers?
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:07:15 -0400

> 1) Any recommendation for a particular muffler brand? This is NOT
> a race truck - just for work/normal driving. I'm on a budget.

>
> Thanks,
>
> > Jeff ('77 with that I believe is a 351W)
> -------------------------------------------------------
HI JEFF
i have a set of turbo mufflers made by thrush that i really like on a 62 t
bird it has a little rumble to them at an idle and is just barely noticeable
while driving down the road on the inside of the car
gordon
69 f 100
79 f 100
62 t bird

------------------------------

From: "G & J Boling" alltel.net>
Subject: Re: 9 inch gear swap
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 22:11:11 -0400

HI CLARE
I will tell ya the gear change over is NOT to be done by someone who has
never done one before FOR SURE the 9 inchers are very durable BUT are rather
touchy to set up and very criticle on tolerances as well try to find a
different garage IF nothing else maybe NAPA has a in house fella who can do
it for you also
gordon

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 21:22:54 -0500
From: "Howard Bottles" austin.ppdi.com>
Subject: Re: Tailgate for sale

Would yours fit a '74? I need a tailgate for my F350.

Howardb

Keith Kubiak wrote:
>
> I'll beat that deal...same thing $30 in San Diego Ca. 1 small dent (about
> 1") and some minor surface rust on the top. No chrome, plain Jane. You pay
> shipping.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Serian" flashmail.com>
> To: <61-79-list

ford-trucks.com>
> Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 12:25 PM
> Subject: [61-79-list] Tailgate for sale
>
> > Saw this in the local paper, and thought someone might
> > be interested in it.
> >
> > " '67-'72 Ford pickup tailgate, came from Texas,
> > very solid, $40. Call (570) 247-2701 "
> >
> > The phone exchange indicates that the place is in
> > Bradford County, PA. I have not seen or inquired
> > about this tailgate; just figured I would pass along
> > the info.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ==========================================================
> > To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> > the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> > message.
> >
>
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> message.

------------------------------

From: "Keith Kubiak" <55fordf100

home.com>
Subject: Re: Tailgate for sale
Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 19:30:50 -0700

I don't think so....maybe someone else on the list knows for sure. 67-72
are the same body style, but in 73 things changed some.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Howard Bottles" austin.ppdi.com>
To: <61-79-list

ford-trucks.com>
Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 7:22 PM
Subject: [61-79-list] Re: Tailgate for sale

> Would yours fit a '74? I need a tailgate for my F350.
>
> Howardb
>
> Keith Kubiak wrote:
> >
> > I'll beat that deal...same thing $30 in San Diego Ca. 1 small dent
(about
> > 1") and some minor surface rust on the top. No chrome, plain Jane. You
pay
> > shipping.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Serian" flashmail.com>
> > To: <61-79-list

ford-trucks.com>
> > Sent: Monday, April 24, 2000 12:25 PM
> > Subject: [61-79-list] Tailgate for sale
> >
> > > Saw this in the local paper, and thought someone might
> > > be interested in it.
> > >
> > > " '67-'72 Ford pickup tailgate, came from Texas,
> > > very solid, $40. Call (570) 247-2701 "
> > >
> > > The phone exchange indicates that the place is in
> > > Bradford County, PA. I have not seen or inquired
> > > about this tailgate; just figured I would pass along
> > > the info.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ==========================================================
> > > To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> > > the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> > > message.
> > >
> >
> > ==========================================================
> > To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> > the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> > message.
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listar

ford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the subject of the
> message.
>
>

------------------------------

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