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61-79-list Digest Mon, 14 Feb 2000 Volume: 2000 Issue: 007

In This Issue:
Re: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Re: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
FW: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Re: FW: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Re: Steering U Joint
Re: needle gun
Re: FW: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Choke Thermostats 101
Re: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
brake pedal return
NP 205 TC cradle/400 motor install update
Windshield gasket/race cars
Types of C6s in a 78 F250
Re: Obsolete Parts
doors
Re: Choke Thermostats 101
73-77 Grill Shell Ordered!
Fw: [Fwd: Fw: Fw: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cu
Re: 73-77' OEM Grille Shell - Urgent!
Re: Obsolete Parts
Re: NP 205 TC cradle/400 motor install update
Re: 73-77' OEM Grille Shell - Urgent!
Differential Gearing.
Mail Problems
Re: Steering U Joint
Re: race cars
Re: race cars
Re: brake pedal return
Re: NP 205 TC cradle/400 motor install update
Re: FW: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 13:38:21 -0600
From: Larry Schmiedekamp angelo.edu>
Subject: Re: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff

I'm just going out on a limb here, but I'm guessing that the WilWood
>valve, as amazing as it may be, can't ADD flow to your system, so the
>absolute most braking you could possibly get would be with the thing plumbed
>straight from the mc to the brake cylinders ... you can include the WilWood
>but you would want it at MINIMUM wouldn't you ? Otherwise it will be
>offering a decrease in your braking abilities wouldn't it ?
>
>Just my $.02
>wish

I don't know if this is the same valve the discussion is about, but
my brother-in-law does dirt track racing and he has a brake valve on his dash
that he can adjust during the race which controls the breaking from one
side of
the car to the other depending on the condition of the track keeping him
from spinning out. Doesn't look like it would word from front to back.

Ford topic - He runs a 351w motor in it.

Larry


------------------------------

From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)" visteon.com>
Subject: Re: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 14:51:59 -0500

Same valve, pretty sure and it will work either way :-) The catalog lists
the same valve for both applications. All you need to know is that one
side will always require more or less than the other to set it up.
Generally you will want more on the right front if you turn left and a
little less on the right rear and, of course less yet on the inside tires
since they will be trying to go to the moon. In conjunction with this they
also control the springs on all 4 wheels separately to ensure proper balance
in a hard turn and back in the old days, on small tracks, they used to put
different size tires on the inside front to aid in this as well. It all
works together :-)

--
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

>that he can adjust during the race which controls the breaking from one
>side of
>the car to the other depending on the condition of the track
>keeping him
>from spinning out. Doesn't look like it would word from front to back.

------------------------------

From: "William S. Hart" iastate.edu>
Subject: FW: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 14:35:11 -0600

For John again ...


Well, there is one thing you have both overlooked by my estimation. The
master cylinder. On a disc/drum set up, the disc reservoir is larger
allowing for more fluid displacement. I can't support this, but it seems
that the mc would have much more effect than the proportioning valve. If you
want more braking, get a bigger master cylinder? Isn't this what Steve
alluded to? The master cylinder has to have a residual or check valve in it
or the lines wouldn't stay full of fluid.

The end of an object traveling in front will need more braking than the end
following. Physics of momentum. That also has something to do with why the
big brake shoe goes to the back.

----------
>In any case it's not "flow" but "pressure" we are dealing with.

Uhoh, Gary. (evil grin) Flow and pressure are related. The more fluid flows
through a pipe, the higher the pressure. If you decrease the size of the
pipe and flow the same volume of fluid, pressure goes up. Following your
line of reasoning, change all of your brake lines from 3/8 to 1/4 and you
will dramatically increase the brake line pressure. But you won't be able to
displace enough fluid to move the slaves and you'll run over whatever is in
the way. Doggone that pedal would be hard, though. (Note: we are talking
non-compressable fluids here, not gaseous fluids.)

P.S. Listar has decided I am a spammer, so this will be my last post to the
list until this issue is resolved.

-- John
jlagroneford-trucks.com <]:-) <]:-)<]:-)<]:-)<]:-)<]:-)
1979 F150 Custom, Long Wide Bed, Regular Cab, 351M, C6 (Henry)
http://www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
Dearborn iron rules!!!!


------------------------------

From: "Hogan, Tom" kla-tencor.com>
Subject: Re: FW: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 12:58:00 -0800


>
> For John again ...
>
>
> Well, there is one thing you have both overlooked by my
> estimation. The
> master cylinder. On a disc/drum set up, the disc reservoir is larger
> allowing for more fluid displacement. I can't support this,
> but it seems
> that the mc would have much more effect than the
> proportioning valve. If you
> want more braking, get a bigger master cylinder? Isn't this what Steve
> alluded to? The master cylinder has to have a residual or
> check valve in it
> or the lines wouldn't stay full of fluid.
>


The reason the resivoir is larger for disk than the drum section is that the
drums have a ratcheting mechanism that takes up the slack as the shoes
wear. Self adjusting they ususally are engaged when the brakes are applied
while the vehicle travels in reverse.

Disk brakes don't have anything like this so as the pads wear the pistons
move farther out and the volume inside increases. The larger resivoir
allows for this to give the user more time before having to service the
fluid level. This happened on my wifes windstar couple of weeks ago. The
ABS light came on and so I took it in to be checked out. I thought sensor
or something. Turned out there's a sensor in the brake resivoir and the
fluid level got low and tripped it. $75 later for a BRAKE FLUID TOP OFF...
:0(

Tom H


------------------------------

From: "Ross Johansson" alaska.net>
Subject: Re: Steering U Joint
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 12:05:49 -0900

this might help.....
i replaced mine a couple months ago
(i have a 1968 F100 4x4)


Upper Steering Colum U-Joint
$17.24
Spicer p/n: 5-92X
(Ford p/n: C6TZ 3815 D)






----- Original Message -----
From: aol.com>
To: <61-79-listford-trucks.com>
Sent: Friday, February 11, 2000 5:55 PM
Subject: [61-79-list] Steering U Joint


> Hey George,
>
> If you don't a response soon on this, send me a message and I'll dig up
the
> Spicer part numbers for you.....I've installed one of these kits and they
are
> NICE!!!!
>
> Makes the stock stuff look Mickey Mouse...
>
> CJ
> ==========================================================
> To unsubscribe, send email to: listarford-trucks.com with
> the words "unsubscribe 61-79-list" in the body of the
> message.
>


------------------------------

From: BanksRVAaol.com
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 16:19:06 EST
Subject: Re: needle gun

I have seen alot of references to a needle gun. What is that?
Joe

------------------------------

From: "William S. Hart" iastate.edu>
Subject: Re: FW: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 15:20:56 -0600


> On a disc/drum set up, the disc reservoir is larger
> allowing for more fluid displacement.

That's just a volume thing though, so you've actually got some reserve after
you press the pedal down ... the drum brakes systems still have the larger
reservoir for the front, probably because the fronts have larger wheel
cylinders so they need more ...

> I can't support this,
> but it seems
> that the mc would have much more effect than the
> proportioning valve. If you
> want more braking, get a bigger master cylinder? Isn't this what Steve
> alluded to?

Yeah, but a mastercylinder isn't sized by the reserve, its sized by the main
piston ... so you don't want to get one just 'cause its got a bigger tank on
it ...

> The master cylinder has to have a residual or
> check valve in it
> or the lines wouldn't stay full of fluid.
>

Hmmm.... I keep comin up with a straw analogy, you plug one end and nothing
leaks out the other ... the wheelcylinders will plug one side of it, so
there won't be any way for the fluid to drain out of the lines ...

> Turned out there's a sensor in the brake resivoir and the
> fluid level got low and tripped it. $75 later for a BRAKE FLUID
> TOP OFF...

Our Tempo has this too, that's how we found the first broken brake line ...
my sister was driving it and said there was a light on, then she noticed the
brakes were spongy ...

Don't ask how we found out about the second broken line a week later.

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 16:57:56 -0500
From: "J. Doss Halsey" isl-inc.com>
Subject: Choke Thermostats 101

Gary,

>Well, I spent the afternoon Sunday monkeying with the stupid choke on the
>stupid Holley on the stupid......

I have the same setup and I'm curious.

>You can also put a volt meter on the terminal with power
>on and watch the voltage change as the element heats up..... interesting :-)

It's a heater element, yes? A light bulb filament will be a dead short when
it is cold. As soon as it heats up, it has some resistance (loss) which is
proportional to the amount of energy it is giving off as heat and light.
I'm not sure how a piezo heater element behaves electrically, but like I
said, I'm curious.

My first crack at installing the carb, I wired the choke power lead to one
of the two smaller terminals sticking out of the starter solenoid. It has
something less than 12 volts available, but it is switched (by the ignition
switch) and conveniently located. It has about 10 volts static and 11.5
with the engine running. I have since changed the choke wiring point to a
switched (full voltage) point I found on the fuse panel. I have noticed
also that the choke does not stay on as long with the full voltage. So, I
inadvertantly stumbled into the same strategy as you which is to turn the
voltage down to make the choke stay on longer. I just found a convenient,
lower voltage point by accident.

> I can also adjust the richness of it by rotating
>the cap quite a bit and the pulloff (integral) still pulls it off far enough
>to run well. It turns out that these units have a heating element in them
>rather than using the spring as I originally thought.

My question is (I haven't taken the choke apart yet) what is inside the
mechanism? I assume it is a bimetalic spring and a heater. Doesn't
loosening the screws and turning it (to the left I think) make it stay on
longer? Are you adjusting the richness or just the time it takes to pull
off? It stands to reason that "all the way hot" (whatever temp on that
little heater element that is) has to be all the way off. And "all the way
cold" should be "choke plate all the way down" (full choke). Anything else
in between should be on the way from one state to the other, yes? It seems
like we should be able to adjust the time that the choke stays on by
rotating it, but maybe not.

>The spring is not
>supposed to be part of the electrical circuit in the system but is affected
>by the heat generated by the metal plate it is attached to which is a "heat
>sink" to the heating element in the cap. On the Holley unit there was a
>ground effect via the sping which shorted the element, possibly by design
>but what ever the case it acted way too fast.

Doss Halsey
'68 F250 390 Holley 600 cfm 4V, vacuum secondaries, emissions legal 4160
derivative



------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 16:48:05 -0500
From: "G.T. Herpich" bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff



"William S. Hart" wrote:

> Okay, I'm just going out on a limb here, but I'm guessing that the WilWood
> valve, as amazing as it may be, can't ADD flow to your system, so the
> absolute most braking you could possibly get would be with the thing plumbed
> straight from the mc to the brake cylinders ... you can include the WilWood
> but you would want it at MINIMUM wouldn't you ? Otherwise it will be
> offering a decrease in your braking abilities wouldn't it ?

You can only have one prop valve in operation. If you use an adjustable,
the stock
one must be eliminated or disabled. I have no experience with these old
systems but on
fox mustangs you have to use an adjustable when you start changing
caliper bore sizes.
The thing that determines if your stock prop valve will work is the
relation between
the M/C bore size and caliper bore. I changed an '86 to the 11" '87
fronts on my Capri
and the first time I had to hit the brakes halfway hard the ass end
started coming around.
That was due to the extra pedal pressure needed to work those bigger
front calipers. By
the time they started to grab the rears were locked up. If you go with a
M/C too big for
your calipers you will have the opposite problem of not getting enough
rear braking.
You would then need to disable the stock type prop to get enough
pressure to the rears which
could then be regulated with the Wildwood valve. Or find the proper size
M/C.

George

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 19:13:26 -0500
From: Becky & Greg sympatico.ca>
Subject: brake pedal return

I bought a 1975 supercab 360/c6 last year and have been working on it as
weather permits. Today I noticed that the brake pedal remained about
half way down after parking it. The brake system (except the Master
cylinder and power booster) is all new. I suspect both of these are
original. Is there any test that I can do to determine is either of
these units need replacing. What exactly controls brake pedal return?
Thanks
Greg
79 f100 300C6 (Lazarus)
75 Supercab 360 C6
51 TEA20 Ferguson (Jefferson Davis)


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 20:02:13 -0500
From: James Oxley thecore.com>
Subject: NP 205 TC cradle/400 motor install update

Hey all!!!

Got tired of struggling with that 800 lb TC, so I made up this cradle
when I removed it a couple months ago. Here it is in action during the
install. Took all of 4 minutes to put it in. Biggest drawback is jack
handles keep slamming into rear diff tubes :-). I'll prob have plans for
it sometime soon. Very easy to make out of 3 flat plates, 3 short
pieces/1 1ong piece of angle iron and a short and long piece of
thickwall pipe.

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thecore.com/~luxjo/BRONC_DETAILS/TCtool1.jpg

Also, I've been puttsing (SP??) around with different motors for the
last 2 months trying to decide which one to use for my monster 78 bronc.
I finally have one I put in yesterday. It is a 400 that was recently
completely rebuilt. The last owner got water in it (from deep puddles
offroad) and fried all the rod bearings. I have since replaced the crank
(had really deep scores from bearings), rod and main bearings. Pins,
pistons and bores seemed fine and the motor never lost power or burned
any oil, it just knocked like a mother. I am a bit concerned about the
main clearance, as it plasticgauged over .002 and spec is .0026 max.
Rods all came in at .0013-.0017.

Just for kicks, I tried a cold leakdown of the #1 cyl after
I buttoned up the bottom. It was only 70/90 (UGH!!) and rushing air out
the exh port. I pulled the rockers off on that cyl figuring maybe the
cam timing was off and it was cracking the exh valve. Well, it was no
better. I pulled the head and even that valve and it all seems perfect.
Looks like it was all just redone. Even had a light bit of head porting.
I have no idea whats up with it, but since I could find no problem, I
slapped the head back on, pulled the other head and checked it and put
the upper end together. I know it has a healthy cam in it, but the only
thing I know is lift (I measured it) is .518 intake. Valve springs were
replaced and have a stripe of yellow on the intake and green on the exh.
Anyone know what brand that might be. So, I hope to have it running by
the end of the week. Should be a nice power increase over the stock 351M
if nothing is majorly screwed up.

OX

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 17:25:22 -0800
From: scott ford-trucks.com>
Subject: Windshield gasket/race cars

>I am not too particular about the looks of my vehicle, but the >windshield is leaking. Most of my window trim is gone. Has anyone had >any experience with the "No Trim" gasket discussed belo

>BTW there are at least 3 different gaskets
>for windshield.No trim.wide trim and narrow trim.

By "no trim" I meant no stainless moulding around the windshield.Just a
rubber gasket.For the truck you describe I would recommend that gasket
and it is also easy to install,compared to the other types.

>Yeah, but real race cars turn both ways ...

The fastest race cars of all don't turn at all:)

------------------------------

From: "Matthew Schwartz" fast.net>
Subject: Types of C6s in a 78 F250
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 21:02:09 -0500

I have a question that I hope is easy. I have a 78 F250 SuperCab Camper
Special. What sub model of C6 came with these? Apparently there were three
types available with corresponding numbers? There is a 460 resting between
the frames.

THANKS!

Matt


------------------------------

From: FORDTRKNUTaol.com
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 22:11:39 EST
Subject: Re: Obsolete Parts

I have some more bad news as far as Obsolete parts are concerned. FORD is
scraping all of the 1973-1979 Front Fenders. My friends works at the
Teterboro New Jersey parts Depot (Entire Tri-State Area) and personally
scraped the fenders. About 5 years ago, Ford Employees were able to by
Obsolete & Damaged parts at the Depot. But that all stopped when the people
started to damage the parts purposely. He gave me the part number, but I
tossed it. I can get the parts way below what it costs the average guy off
the street. My brother works there too, so I got an inside look into what
happens there. You would not believe how many dumpsters are shipped back to
Detroit...only to be CRUSHED. 99.9 Percent of the parts are just retuned, or
damaged boxes. And you cannot take ANYTHING...not even a bolt!!!
Anyway...I'll let you know if I hear anymore bad news. Wayne

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 20:01:20 -0800 (PST)
From: Jayson Spangler yahoo.com>
Subject: doors

I am putting a set of new doors on my 78. I have
noticed there is a large gap between the present doors
and the fenders. The hinge portion that is attached to
the cab needs to be moved forward. Can this be done
w/out taking of the fenders??

Jay
78 white black and 2 tone brown shortbox F100
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://im.yahoo.com

------------------------------

From: GMontgo930aol.com
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 23:07:28 EST
Subject: Re: Choke Thermostats 101

Gary

Nice notes. I'll check and see what mine's up to next time I play with it.
What I've done on my '79 w a holley 600 was a little different. I took the
factory wire that went to the stock choke cap, changed teh end, and hooked it
up to the holley cap (with the other wire on the holley cap going to ground
on the carb body). Tracing teh schematics, this wire comes from teh
alternator, the common between the 3 windings. I measured it once a while ago
and it sends about 3-5 v AC to the choke cap. As it's just a resistave heater
in there, it doesnt care weather it's DC or AC. Plus, the voltage went up as
RPM's increased.

This setup seems towork well for me down here in FL (but then, Im nowhere
near as cold as michigan ;-)). One other tidbit I like is that the choke
doesnt heat up and come off with the key on and engine off.

One good thing about these old beasts - theirs more than one way to make em
work for ya!

George in Fl.


In a message dated 2/14/2000 7:06:55 AM Eastern Standard Time,
gpeters3visteon.com writes:

<< Well, I spent the afternoon Sunday monkeying with the stupid choke on the
stupid Holley on the stupid......anyway I made a mistake in my last post on
this, the thermostat has 12-15 ohms, not Kohms. Hope I didn't mess anyone
up with that little booboo......read the meter wrong, sorry :-( Temp makes
a huge difference in the readings too which explains why I got 10 the first
time and 15 later. You can also put a volt meter on the terminal with power
on and watch the voltage chage as the element heats up..... interesting :-)

Here's what I found.....the Holley unit has 15 ohms depending on how you
hold your little finger.....or 10 or 12 or.....I finally settled on 15 for
that one and the replacement Motorcraft was 20-21 ohms which was a step in
the right direction I figured so for $28 I picked one up along with a
ballast resistor for another $3.98. They had three of these with different
part numbers but they looked identical so I got out my trusty Multimeter and
checked and sure enough they were different resistances: 0.7, 1.6 and 2.0
ohms. I took the .7 one to start with and it made about a 2v change in the
available power to the choke cap, measured at the terminal with power on.
The battery read about 12.7v, the Holley cap read about 11.2v between the
terminal and the neg batt post, and the Motorcraft replacement (not
motorcraft brand) read about 9.7v.

The holley choke was going off in about 1.5-2 minutes which was way too fast
and all the electronic resistors I had were way too high a value and when
used in parallel batches to reduce the ohms they got way too hot so the
ballast resistor is the way to go for this project, absolutely no doubt
there :-) The replacement unit by itself went off in about 4 minutes and
with the ballast resistor the time was increases substantially but I didn't
really measure it.....guessing about 7 minutes for full off position or so.

What all this means is that the choke will now come off in the coldest
weather in about 7 minutes which is just about perfect to keep the bronco
happy at stop lights etc. when cold where before I had to knock it out of
gear, coast up to the car in front of me with one foot on the brake and one
on the gas to keep it from stalling....BUMMERBUMMERBUMMER!!!! This should
translate to about half of that in the summer with no adjustments which
should work well I think. I can also adjust the richness of it by rotating
the cap quite a bit and the pulloff (integral) still pulls it off far enough
to run well. It turns out that these units have a heating element in them
rather than using the spring as I originally thought. The spring is not
supposed to be part of the electrical circuit in the system but is affected
by the heat generated by the metal plate it is attached to which is a "heat
sink" to the heating element in the cap. On the Holley unit there was a
ground effect via the sping which shorted the element, possibly by design
but what ever the case it acted way too fast.

This was an interesting experiment and I learned a lot and wanted to share
my findings with the group(s) in case anyone else was struggling with this
problem. I did have to modify the Holley lever to accomodate the motorcraft
replacement because the replacement fits into a slot and the holley is a
loop that fits over the arm, other than that they are interchangeable. The
holley unit also has two terminals, one for ground and the replacement has
the traditional metal strip on the cap which is grounded to the retainer
ring. Tonight will be the acid test as my first stop light is about 2
minutes from the parking lot and then there are two more about 1 minute
apart which was the perfectly wrong scenerio for the old choke setup, I'll
keep y'all posted :-)

--
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--
>>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 23:10:53 -0500
From: Tony Marino raex.com>
Subject: 73-77 Grill Shell Ordered!

Well, I did it..

I went down to the Ford Dealership today right outside of Akron. My normal
parts guy wasn't there, so I didnt' have a shot at getting a dealer
discount-- but I walked in, had a couple salesmen comment on my '76 and how
I must enjoy driving it in snowy weather like this. I proceeded to walk
into parts, and told the guy I needed to order a 73-77 aluminum grill shell
and gave him the part number. She said I was the THIRD person to come in
today to ask for one.. ;-)

Believe in the power of the FTE list and Dan Herrmann!!!! 8-)

Tony Marino
redneckraex.com


------------------------------

From: "Rick & Debbie Kelso" email.msn.com>
Subject: Fw: [Fwd: Fw: Fw: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cu
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 23:24:01 -0500



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Subject: Fwd: [Fwd: Fw: Fw: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cute]


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Subject: Fw: Fw: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cute
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-----Original Message-----
From: Angeleyes1056aol.com aol.com>
To: greentellico.net tellico.net>
Date: Saturday, February 12, 2000 16:23
Subject: Fwd: Fw: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cute


>
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Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 15:06:42 EST
Subject: Fwd: Fw: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cute
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From: "Sam Brannon" sumter.net>
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Subject: Fw: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cute
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----- Original Message -----
From: ValDrewJil cpis.net>
To: netscape.net>; home.com>; Williams A MSgt 609
CPS/DOXLS SHAW.AF.MIL>; Sam Brannon sumter.net>;
Mike & Tammie Morris ftc-i.net>; Kathy Pace ftc-i.net>;
webtv.net>; B J Wiley cpis.net>
Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 11:49 PM
Subject: Fw: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cute


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Williams A MSgt 609 CPS/DOXLS SHAW.AF.MIL>
> To: cpis.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2000 12:14 PM
> Subject: Taco Bell and McDonalds this is cute
>
>
> >
> >
> > > > > > > >> Subject: FW: Taco Bell and McDonalds
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > >> Subject: TACO BELL AND MCDONALD'S
> > > > > > > >> Send this to 6 people and you will see the Taco Bell
> > > > > > > >> dog run across your screen . If you send this to 8
> > > > > > > >> people, Ronald McDonald comes out and attacks the
> > > > > > > >> Taco Bell dog. It is really funny and it works!! You
> > > > > > > >> have to try it.
> > > > > >
> > > > ------- End of forwarded message -------


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------------------------------

From: JJJJJGRANTaol.com
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 23:42:32 EST
Subject: Re: 73-77' OEM Grille Shell - Urgent!

a friend of mine that works for ford told me that alot of times when someone
orders ford factory parts, ford orders the part from an aftermarket source. i
asked about this when i ordered some mustang parts and i found a sticker on
the part from a mustang supplier, so i could have saved over half the money
by ordering it from the supplier myself. so be aware next time you order oem
parts.
for those of you that are not as concerned for oem parts, there is a
supplier of aftermarket body parts here in atlanta that has the grille shells
for $100.00.

jeff grant

------------------------------

From: JJJJJGRANTaol.com
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 23:55:08 EST
Subject: Re: Obsolete Parts

a friend of mine worked at the pep boys parts distribution center, he said it
made him sick to see the things they scrapped just because of being
overstocked or missing a box etc. he told me about chrome brush guards,
mufflers, tires, radios, tool boxes and about anything else you can think of
thrown in trailers and hauled off to be scrapped. they too were not allowed
to buy anything. just think of how much money these guys throw away every
year. no wonder parts are so expensive.
i heard that ford generaly cleans house after a part is ten years old.

------------------------------

From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)" visteon.com>
Subject: Re: NP 205 TC cradle/400 motor install update
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 07:07:32 -0500

Ox, on the mains you can sand the caps up to about 0.001" or so to get a
little better fit but don't take off any more than that or the round shape
and matchup of the bearing bore will suffer. I have no idea how far you can
take this but I do know that 0.001" will not hurt anything and may be what
you need to fix the clearance. I've done this on several old, worn engines
and restored their oil pressure and performance with an old crank and got
more than 50k miles out of them after that so I know it works just fine.

Use a flat surface with fine sand paper on it and rub the cap on the paper,
carefully keeping it flat and not allowing it to rock as you stroke it and
it will be perfect. Just take your time and mic the surfaces as you go so
you don't take off too much.

Actually 0.002" is pretty good I should think? I think I went for 0.0015"
on my 460 and it allowed almost 0.003 as I recall.

--
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

>any oil, it just knocked like a mother. I am a bit concerned about the
>main clearance, as it plasticgauged over .002 and spec is .0026 max.
>Rods all came in at .0013-.0017.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 07:53:03 -0500
From: Dan Herrmann in-motion.net>
Subject: Re: 73-77' OEM Grille Shell - Urgent!



>a friend of mine that works for ford told me that alot of times when someone
>orders ford factory parts, ford orders the part from an aftermarket source.

there is a
>supplier of aftermarket body parts here in atlanta that has the grille
shells
>for $100.00.
>
>jeff grant

___________________


Jeff, It is no secret that Ford contract's out Many Parts to outside
source's. All the big auto companies do this. It would be physically
impossible for them to build every nut & bolt on a car. We've seen Keller
Brass make Nameplates, Goodyear make Dashpads, Jim Robbins Inc make Seat
Belts, etc., etc. Unlike the foreign made aftermarket parts, those made by
there contractors are made to the factory specs that Ford set up at the
original time of production. These parts are made, placed in a Ford box and
shipped to Fords main warehouse's around the U.S.... This is how Ford
orders them from the aftermarket sources.

As for the $100 Grille Shells, I guess you get what you pay for. I can buy
them all day long here in Indianapolis also. I have seen these before, and
there is no comparison in quality to the Ford part. A person rebuilding a
work truck would usually use this. One who is Restoring a truck to look new
or Show will want an OEM.

Thanks for your input!

Dan Herrmann







------------------------------

From: prozelloaielectronics.com (OAI Electronics: Paul Rozell)
Subject: Differential Gearing.
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 09:10:15 -0600

Guys,
I know this has probably been discussed before but I have a qeustion. My
qeustion concerns rear end gearing and what is acceptable for a 460 motor.
First what is the eqaution for figuring the RPM's an engine will see with
different tire and gear combinations. Secondly what is the acceptable range
for a 460 to see in RPM's . What is the maximum that a person would want the
motor to turn etc.

Thanks,
Paul


------------------------------

From: prozelloaielectronics.com (OAI Electronics: Paul Rozell)
Subject: Mail Problems
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 09:13:25 -0600

I have sent several posts in the last couple of days and I get a
confirmation back but I dont ever see the post again. Is there something
that I am doing incorrectly.

Paul
65 F100 460 C6


------------------------------

From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)" visteon.com>
Subject: Re: Steering U Joint
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 10:14:14 -0500

I got a spicer ujoint but it is just the x part so I guess you change these
the same way you would a drive shaft? I know this seems like a stupid
question for someone such as myself but the steering shaft joint seems to be
"different" and not replaceable but I haven't really looked at it that hard
either??

Somehow I had a picture of the whole yoke and joint assy coming in that
box......??

--
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

>Upper Steering Colum U-Joint
>$17.24
>Spicer p/n: 5-92X
>(Ford p/n: C6TZ 3815 D)

------------------------------

From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)" visteon.com>
Subject: Re: race cars
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 10:16:22 -0500

HAAAAAAA!!!! :-) So there, Bill! :-)

--
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

>>Yeah, but real race cars turn both ways ...
>
>The fastest race cars of all don't turn at all:)

------------------------------

From: "William S. Hart" iastate.edu>
Subject: Re: race cars
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 09:24:56 -0600

> HAAAAAAA!!!! :-) So there, Bill! :-)
>
> >>Yeah, but real race cars turn both ways ...
> >
> >The fastest race cars of all don't turn at all:)

All I can say to the part about the fastest not turning is "they hope"

:)

Just my $.02
wish

You slow down for the turns ?

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

------------------------------

From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)" visteon.com>
Subject: Re: brake pedal return
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 10:41:24 -0500

Pull the booster off and look at the mechanism behind it and I think you
will see what has to be done. On the 78's there is a bell crank back there
with pivots that rust up and seize. The pedal also has a plastic bushing
which can wear out or dry out and cause a little trouble but it's usually
the stuff behind the booster.

When you get it apart and cleaned up lube it with anti-seize or a good water
proof grease.

--
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

>weather permits. Today I noticed that the brake pedal remained about
>half way down after parking it. The brake system (except the Master
>cylinder and power booster) is all new.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 10:54:32 -0500
From: James Oxley thecore.com>
Subject: Re: NP 205 TC cradle/400 motor install update

Thanks gary,

The motor is already together and installed in the truck. Whatever it
is, it is :-).


OX

------------------------------

From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)" visteon.com>
Subject: Re: FW: BRAKES! Proportioning valve stuff
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 11:17:44 -0500

I don't know how you deduce that from my statements but tube size is
irrelevant as long as it it properly rated for the pressure. Since, for all
practical purposes, brake systems are "dead headed" and the flow is very
small we can eliminate such arcane scientific theories from this discussion.
Brake systems rely strictly on pressure to operate and all components are
designed to regulate this, not flow.

I guess I don't really have any more to add to this until I've had time to
do a little more investigating.

--
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
--

>Uhoh, Gary. (evil grin) Flow and pressure are related. The

>Following your
>line of reasoning, change all of your brake lines from 3/8 to
>1/4 and you
>will dramatically increase the brake line pressure. But you

------------------------------

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