From: owner-61-79-list-digest ford-trucks.com (61-79-list-digest)
To: 61-79-list-digest ford-trucks.com
Subject: 61-79-list-digest V3 #468
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61-79-list-digest Tuesday, December 21 1999 Volume 03 : Number 468



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

RE: FTE 61-79 - cool EB project, and a sad ending
RE: FTE 61-79 - Gas and P.cleaner
RE: FTE 61-79 - One more time
Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 250 van parts for 460 swap
FTE 61-79 - Valve body
FTE 61-79 - Porting 460 heads?
RE: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?
RE: FTE 61-79 - Valve body, Brain F*r*s...
RE: FTE 61-79 - Re: Poppong carb
RE: FTE 61-79 - weird sights
RE: FTE 61-79 - ENVY'S FIRST "OWWIE"
RE: FTE 61-79 - Choke heater tube
RE: FTE 61-79 - Toys and stuff....
RE: FTE 61-79 - Choke heater tube
Re: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?
FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter
RE: FTE 61-79 - Porting 460 heads?
Re: FTE 61-79 - Ox runs rings around John
RE: FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter and Parts
> RE: FTE 61-79 - Sick C-6
Re: FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter
RE: FTE 61-79 - Choke heater tube
RE: FTE 61-79 - Toys and stuff....
Re: FTE 61-79 - ENVY'S FIRST "OWWIE"
RE: FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter
Re: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?
Re: FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter
FTE 61-79 - FOR SALE
Re: FTE 61-79 - FOR SALE
Re: FTE 61-79 - PROBLEM: Leaking thermostat housing grrr
Re: FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter
FTE 61-79 - Bumpers
> FTE 61-79 - 1962 4X4
Re: FTE 61-79 - Porting 460 heads?
Re: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?
Re: FTE 61-79 - Toys and stuff....
Re: FTE 61-79 - Sick C-6
FTE 61-79 - Annual AFTE/FTE charity event
Re: FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter and Parts
> Re: FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter
Re: FTE 61-79 - 73-79 Bed Found!!!
Re: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?
Re: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?
Re: FTE 61-79 - Porting 460 heads?
Re: FTE 61-79 - ENVY'S FIRST "OWWIE"

=======================================================================

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Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 07:38:55 -0500
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - cool EB project, and a sad ending

I nearly ran over my wife's $7000 electric wheel chair which I knew was
there even....just forgot....fortunately I alway back up slowly now and felt
the resistance in time to prevent damage...:-) It was plugged into the most
convenient outlet right behind the bronco and next to the garage door.

Interestingly enough, she went shopping last night with her cousin in a
special, very expensive, handicap van and managed to break off the tilt
lever somehow :-) I didn't even scratch it :-)

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> was back at the place, I went to back my Bronco out of the
> garage and backed
> right into my brother's little girlie rice burner. I was only rolling
> backwards, not even in the throttle in the least, I even forgot I was
> rolling, and then wammo....I crunched it! I guess that
> deductible money
> won't get used on my new clutch after all. Bummer-salad.
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 07:47:34 -0500
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Gas and P.cleaner

I'm going to call them this morning for advice on this. I have two 100 gal
tanks.

I did some calling last night and the best price/volume I could find was
locally at TSC....5 gal for $40. Harbor freight had it for 7.99/gal and
local auto parts had it for 9.99/gal. When you guys consider the "discount"
prices offered at places like this don't forget that a gallon can will cost
you about $7 to ship.....each.....bummer :-(

You should always wear rubber gloves when using this stuff. It is very
caustic and will pull every bit of the oil out of your skin and deeply too.
I used to work with tolulene and there is no solvent I know of that is more
dangerous to your skin. No amount of grease or lotion would protect me and
I had to wear gloves religiously or suffer for it. Most of these solvents
are more chemically active than even gasoline so beware...They may not light
but they will burn....your skin :-(

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> Gas heaters are fast, yet require lots of gas for bigger
> ones. They will
> freeze-up small tanks and quit running. I use a 65 gal. tank with my
> open-flame portable. It still freezes, but don't stop. I'ld

> On the Mineral Spirits: My unit uses 20 gallons of this stuff, and you
> can just buy gallons in Hdwe. store for $2.oo or less.One Warning:
> My hands now have a rash which I think was from using this solvent
> and now can't seem to get rid of it. Been to Doc's and such.
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 08:18:40 -0500
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - One more time

The steering box will only handle so much adjustment to the sector but there
is another culprit, the input shaft bearing which had the big castleated
sheet metal nut on the front of the steering box (or rear where the shaft
goes in). If this "axial preload" adjustment gets loose you will have axial
play which has the same effect as a loose sector.

If wander is the real problem then check the king pins for binding. You
should be able to disconnect the tie rods and move each of the wheels from
lock to lock with one finger, if not your wander is most likely due to this.
You can't tell with everything hooked up due to the mechanical advantage of
the box but you will know the instant you try to move it with rod
disconnected.

The proportioning valve "Proportions" the pressure between the front and
rear axles. Even on drum brakes the rear will lock up first if pressure is
applied equally to both so the front must get the lion's share of the
pressure or you will not get full braking power. In a disk brake setup it
also contains a "Residual" valve which maintains a measured amount of
pressure on the caliper pistons at all times to keep them close to the
rotors. If this valve fails you will have to pump the brakes madly to get
it to stop.

Chatter is usually due to contamination on the shoes or drums or a loose
suspension component or seriously bad bearings. I suppose a cracked drum or
seriously warped drum could cause it as well, not sure but typically drum
brakes won't chatter due to uneven wear like disks will but a little grease
on the shoes will do it. Improperly installed or damaged brake hardware
could do it too.

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> questions about
> the 'metering' valve or the 'proportionalizer'- the "pressure
> differential valve". I was under the impression that all this valve
>
> I'm on my second sterring box, and it's getting pretty loose (ALOT
> of play). Definitely an E ticket in a crosswind. The tie
> rod ends are
> still tight. I've been tightening the sector shaft adjuster screw on
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 10:33:08 -0500
From: frenz.6 osu.edu (Dale Frenz)
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 250 van parts for 460 swap

Aaaaah yes... I remember those days of pulling van parts in the
junkyard. As a matter of fact, some of you might remember my whining about
almost dying of heat stroke in the middle of June. God I guess Im just a
big buzzkill. There's nothing more exciting than laying in mud, trying to
jack up a 460 in the dog house with a bumper jack, hoping the whole damn
thing doesnt collapse on you before you can get the oil pan out. But hey, I
guess $15 for the pan, pick-up, main cap bolt, and alt. bracket isnt too
bad. I believe that makes for about 1/10th of what Ford Motorsport charges
for the same set up. Aaaahh... the joy of repowering.

- -Dale
'79 Ruby
'00 Powerstroke


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Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 10:47:44 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Valve body

Gary writes: >>but the one thing it did not cover was the check ball
locations in the control valve module (forgot what we call the dang
thing....old age again :-))

Valve body, maybe. (And I've got you by several years)

Azie
Ardmore, Al.

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 11:11:33 -0500
From: frenz.6 osu.edu (Dale Frenz)
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Porting 460 heads?

My base motor is a about a '77. I sitting here thinking about gasket
matching the exhaust ports on the heads. Is this really going to turn out
to be worth my time and effort or is it going to be a complete zero ROI
(thats Return On Invest for you non-financial types). It's basically going
to be a daily driver with some grunt. Im not looking to move massive
amounts of air at 6500 RPMS or anything.

- -Dale


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 11:04:02 -0500
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?

Ok, I went to their web site and here's a list of trannys....what the heck
are they????


A4LD
ATX
AXOD
AXODE/AX4S
CD4E
AX4N
4R44E/4R55E
4F20E
5R55E

I left out the ones I recognized :-) All the manuals are $18 for non
members which is a really good deal when you figure all the added upgrade,
fixit info in there. I'm ordering some today, someone tell me what I have
in my 94 bird with 3.8l engine??? so I can order the stupid thing? :-)

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> Hey, I found a phone number for you... 800-245-7722.
> This is the number to ATSG, where you will be able to get
> any book for
> foreign or domestic trannys!!
>
> Brad
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 11:06:55 -0500
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Valve body, Brain F*r*s...

You'd have died laughing at us last night Az :-) I couldn't remember a
thing about anything....brain must have been eating beans when I wasn't
looking....:-)

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> Gary writes: >>but the one thing it did not cover was the check ball
> locations in the control valve module (forgot what we call the dang
> thing....old age again :-))
>
> Valve body, maybe. (And I've got you by several years)
>
> Azie
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 10:07:00 -0600
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Re: Poppong carb

> He has
> dropped the tank, and cleaned it, but to na avail, once that
> flaky rust gets
> in a tank, might as well just replace it!
>

We had a tank cleaned at a radiator shop, then bought some stuff from
Hemmings that coats the inside of the tank, you put this stuff in there and
slosh it around really good, then pour the excess out ... its a sealer of
some sort, worked great, even fixed a couple hairline leaks ...

Maybe I can dig the name up when I go home this weekend, or ask Dad, its his
stuff maybe he remembers what its called ..

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 10:23:13 -0600
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - weird sights

All you guys talkin of losing wheels reminds me of when the rim blew off of
the school bus I was riding in ... heck of a boom and swerved across a
couple lanes of traffic and back ... (front right wheel)... fortunately we
had a wheel still so it did roll, but we watched the tire pop out the back
of the bus, then speed into the ditch, up the embankment and back down
through the ditch to land within a foot of the wheel it fell off of ...
pretty weird actually, looked like we had stopped the bus and the tire had
just fallen off, but in reality it just happened to land that way ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 10:26:56 -0600
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - ENVY'S FIRST "OWWIE"

> Hope you have one of those "Auto" (or should I say truck) sized
> band-aids to
> stick over Envy's boo boo.


Like this ?

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Garage/1222/pic00032.jpg

:)

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 10:29:13 -0600
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Choke heater tube

> How hot do you suppose this gets?
>
Pretty warm, here's a thought, go to the local auto parts store and find the
HELP! section ... they should have a coil of the stuff laying there with a
couple fittings and a sleeve, if they don't have it they can probably order
it ... BTDT ...


Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 11:30:52 -0500
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Toys and stuff....

Talked to my gas guy today and he suggested 3/4" black pipe with industrial
dope, green or blue stuff. He said the unit I bough will probably be rated
in pounds (about 10) where the furnace I will install in a few years will
use about 11" of water an is measured in OZ which is the same as my water
heater is setup for.

What we're going to do is run 3/4" pipe from the regulator on the tanks up
the wall to the trusses and across to about where I envision the furnace
burner will be and make that a permanent installation. Then use hose to run
over to the side wall with a quick disconnect to hook to the heater. He
thinks the heater has it's own regulator on it so we may not need to
regulate the line. It will have a ball valve in it at the source for sure
though :-) Won't know till I get the unit and take a look, hopefully by
Wednesday :-)

Ordered a power flanger last night too but it says up to 14 ga??? Hope it's
adjustable :-) Certainly don't want a 14 ga offset in my panels :-(

Know of a distributor who will sell it by the barrel?

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> For pipe use 3/4" because 1/2" is only good up to 80k btu,
> then decreases
>
> When done, code states to pressurize system for minimum of 20 min at
> 40psig, but I go for 1hr (can't compromise safety on their
> part due to
>
> Cheap mineral spirits = Castrol CL1248 not sure of price but
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 10:30:37 -0600
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Choke heater tube

> Right now I don't recall if that is an actual open line to the exhaust or
> just a hot air plenum heated by the exhaust??
>
Plenum on my FE ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish
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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 08:31:55 -0800
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?

OK I can help with a few of them from my dealership days:

A4LD: auto OD used on Aerostars and Rangers beginning in the early 80s.
Notorious for smoking high/reverse clutches

ATX: auto 3 spd FWD used in Tempos and Escorts beginning in mid 80s

AXOD: auto OD FWD used in Taurus

AXODE: auto OD FWD controlled by electronic processor integrated with ECM

Tha's all I recognize. Maybe someone else can fill in the rest and/or
correct me if I'm wrong.

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets"

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Peters, Gary (G.R.)
To:
Sent: Monday, December 20, 1999 8:04 AM
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - C-6 and ATSG, what are these trannys?


> Ok, I went to their web site and here's a list of trannys....what the heck
> are they????
>
>
> A4LD
> ATX
> AXOD
> AXODE/AX4S
> CD4E
> AX4N
> 4R44E/4R55E
> 4F20E
> 5R55E
>
> I left out the ones I recognized :-) All the manuals are $18 for non
> members which is a really good deal when you figure all the added upgrade,
> fixit info in there. I'm ordering some today, someone tell me what I have
> in my 94 bird with 3.8l engine??? so I can order the stupid thing? :-)



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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 09:45:43 -0700
From: "Michael White"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Salvage Yards in Winter

While adding more items to the list of things that need to be done to my
69 F250's (C6 & 4:10, T18 & 3:55 LS), I thought about spending a day at the
local salvage yard. I didn't have to think long before I realized that this
was not something I "wanted" to do. During the summertime it is difficult to
find the right parts because others have gotten there first. I'm working on
a theory that parts should be easier to find in the salvage yards during the
winter because the "casual shopper" will not be present due to weather
conditions. Is this a valid theory?

::: Dreams of finding dealer installed A/C, power steering with auto column,
FE 4bbl intake, and limited slip differentials :::


Danger
danger csolutions.net


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 11:53:01 -0500
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Porting 460 heads?

Well......we just wore this out a few days ago but my view is this:

smooth the thermactor bumps in the ports but just enough to blend them in.
Anything you remove from those bumps will improve the flow so better stop
short rather than go whole hog. There are holes under there and it's
possible to break through if you get carried away. Very difficult to repair
once this happens. If you open up the ports to match the manifolds you will
find that the openings in the manifolds varies quite a bit and if you slap
headers on it one day you may have a situation where the ports are larger
than the openings in the headers which can't be opened up so you have a
"reversion" kind of thing happening then which is not cool.

My opinion is that you should clean up the bumps and "smooth" the rest of
the port a little and leave it at that. Remove any "serious" irregularities
but just enough to make neat lines along the edges of the ports and then
polish it up with some sanding drums etc.. Once you remove the metal you
can't put it back :-( The 460 manifolds flow pretty well for a stock setup
so I wouldn't get all carried away with this myself.

An important point to remember about doing anything to any port is that the
valves are in the bottom of the port so any material you remove from the
floor of the port tends to sharpen the turn the gases have to make to exit.
Smokey says......"you can't make power by lowering the ports" for this
reason, you want to take the material from the top of the port for best
results so in this case, the bumps are on the bottom so you remove just
enough to even out the cross section a little to reduce the turbulance they
cause.


- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> My base motor is a about a '77. I sitting here thinking about gasket
> matching the exhaust ports on the heads. Is this really going
> to turn out
> to be worth my time and effort or is it going to be a
> complete zero ROI
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