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Subject: 61-79-list-digest V3 #414
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61-79-list-digest Friday, November 12 1999 Volume 03 : Number 414



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

RE: FTE 61-79 -Latest developments re clutch
FTE 61-79 - Re- Lubricants and Severe Duty
FTE 61-79 - Re: M block motors
FTE 61-79 - New to List
RE: FTE 61-79 - 170 c.i. hopups?
RE: FTE 61-79 - Fw: transfer case problem?
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 170 c.i. hopups?
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: M block motors
FTE 61-79 - 71 4x4
FTE 61-79 - 69 stepside
FTE 61-79 - 71 4x4/Vets
Re: FTE 61-79 - New to list....
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re- Lubricants and Severe Duty
Re: FTE 61-79 - That clutch fork again
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dana 24 gear popping
FTE 61-79 - Re: 170 c.i. hopups?
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re- Lubricants and Severe Duty
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re- Lubricants and Severe Duty
Re: FTE 61-79 - 170 c.i. hopups?
FTE 61-79 - Re: "electric clutch"

=======================================================================

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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 06:57:04 -0500
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 -Latest developments re clutch

The bell housing is cast iron, you're not going to crack it by drilling and
riviting or it would have cracked at the factory :-) Drill it out being as
carefull as you can to get the drill in the center but if it goes out just
put in larger bolts. The critical thing here is to get button heads or
other low head bolts so there are no interferance points in the linkage when
you are done and use self locking nuts so it won't come loose.

Basically you need something with a shape the spring can grab to hold it on
the fulcrum and something solid enough to take the load of the clutch
springs and leverage etc.. Other than that it's not a complicated thing at
all :-)

Look at the lever and notice how the flat spring is shaped and what shape
part should fit in it for best operation and make your fulcrum to suit, it's
that simple :-)

ABSOLUTELY DO NOT WELD ANYTHING ON IT! This certainly will cause a stress
line and it CERTAINLY will crack, riviting or bolting is the ONLY solution.

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco Loving, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> The mechanic called three different machine shops about
> drilling out the
> old rivets and putting the new fulcrum in place, and all
> three refuse to
> touch the job on the grounds that they might crack the bell
> housing. I'm
> not sure if they mean by drilling out the old rivets or by knocking in
> the new ones.
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Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 18:17:13 -0500
From: Marvin Meyer
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re- Lubricants and Severe Duty

ran 30 miles + in over 100 degrees outside air temperature with no water in
the 1970 429 engine or radiator, and caused absolutely no problems to the
engine.

I agree I had a similar problem/experience my 74 302 the waterpump seal
blew and leaked all the coolant out. A burnt out instrument panel light
(that I never fixed) prevented me from seeing the temp gauge climb. After
50+ miles when I got home I noticed the sound of hot tinkling metal under
the hood.
As it cooled down I pulled the coil wire and cranked it over two or three
revolutions until it was cool enough to start. It ran great and I managed
another 30k out of it.
FYI the oil was Castrol 5W50
Marvin
meyer strat.net


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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:49:52 -0600 (CST)
From: Rubberducky23 webtv.net (Danny Ling)
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: M block motors

I always thought the "M" in 351M and 400M stood for "Modified". I
recently found a Ford web page referring to a "Midland" family of
engines. Is this what the 351M and 400M are actually titled? Is there
another family of motors I'm not aware of? It makes sense to me...
(Cleveland and Windsor are names of places and I suppose Ford could have
a Midland plant somewhere). Seems like "Modified" just dont realy fit as
well.

Just Curious,
Danny Ling

(pre 771/2) 77 F250 Highboy 4X4, 69 429 Thunder Jet

87 Samurai, 231 Buick V6/TH 350, IH Scout (800 series) axles, SOAC,
33X14.00 Boggers

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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 06:06:59 -0800 (PST)
From: Bill Ballinger
Subject: FTE 61-79 - New to List

> *Perk* is HE gonna be on the list at all? *wink* I'd
love to talk to
him!
My
> boyfriend might get jealous though! =)
>

>I thought I was the only one in your eyes Lisa, ;-)

Hey, I thought I was! I know I'm a little old, but hey...

=====

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 08:16:59 -0600
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - 170 c.i. hopups?

> Does anybody know of any hop ups for the 170 c.i. in my 65 Econoline?


Hmmm... you may have to do some research on this, the early Mustangs and
Falcons used the 170, and I can't remember if its the same head and stuff as
the 200 or not ... seems like it might be, but I could be thinking of a
different motor so double check me on that ... if it is similar to the 200,
there are a few parts out there for them, but you will never find the
following that the V8's have behind one of those 170's ... be sure the carb
is tuned good and the timing set (maybe a little advanced over stock) that
might get you a few more ponies ...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 08:20:06 -0600
From: "William S. Hart"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Fw: transfer case problem?

> During hiway driving the transfer case sometimes just goes into
> neutral from
> 2.
> Of course I have to come to a complete stop to shift into 2
> again. Not fun
> on the
> PA turnpike with no shoulders and semi-trailers closing in.
>

When the x-fer case starts to get a little worn out this can happen (my
truck had this problem, which has now been fixed but shown up again as
linkage slop


As for coming to a complete stop, I got lucky a couple times and was able to
match the engine revs with the road speed and slip it back into gear while I
was rolling, but it only happened a few of the times that I had that
problem...

Just my $.02
wish

96 Mustang GT 5spd 4.6L
73ish 1/2ton 4x4 6.4L
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish

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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 08:01:49 PST
From: "H. Lee Purvis"
Subject: Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 170 c.i. hopups?

You may try Cliffords. I've got their catalog and it has a few things for
the 170. Their at www.cliffordperformance.com.


Lee

______________________________________________________
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 09:00:56 -0800
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: M block motors

Well first of all there's no M with the 400, it's just a 400. But no one
I've ever asked about it can tell me for sure exactly what the M stands
for...I've heard Modified, Michigan and now Midland. The bottom line is that
FoMoCo had 3 different 351 c.i.d. engines and needed to use some sort of
designator to distinguish them from one another. There's also a more modern
K designator out there and I have no idea what it stands for. I'd be
interested to see that web page...could you post the address?

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets"

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Danny Ling
To:
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 1999 5:49 AM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: M block motors


> I always thought the "M" in 351M and 400M stood for "Modified". I
> recently found a Ford web page referring to a "Midland" family of
> engines. Is this what the 351M and 400M are actually titled? Is there
> another family of motors I'm not aware of? It makes sense to me...
> (Cleveland and Windsor are names of places and I suppose Ford could have
> a Midland plant somewhere). Seems like "Modified" just dont realy fit as
> well.



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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 09:34:58 -0800
From: "S.Harkema"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 71 4x4

>I recently bought an '71 F250 4x4.
>During hiway driving the transfer case sometimes just goes into neutral >from 2.

Being as the t-case shifter is attached to the trans and the t-case,
bad mounts on either one might cause the t-case to shift itself.
My 76 would shift from 4 low to neutral due to bad t-case mounts.
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 11:47:09 -0600
From: "Michael Miller"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 69 stepside

I just got a hold of a 69 F-100 stepside with original bed and tailgate.
Most other stuff is also original but someone took out the manual trans and
put an automatic(C-4) in it. Looks like it had a three speed on the tree and
the clutch pedal is still there. I havn't found any other 69 stepsides for
sale to see how much this one is worth. It has a 300 streight six and one
barrel carb. This truck is in really nice shape.(I think so!) Can anyone
help on a value and what trans was original for it? Or even where to
research it?
Thanks in advance for the help!
Mike...

__________________________________________
NetZero - Defenders of the Free World
Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 09:42:39 -0800
From: "S.Harkema"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 71 4x4/Vets

Let me add the best way to check this is to put the t-case
in whatever gear it is poppiing out of an disconnect the linkage and
take it for a spin.

To all the veterans on the list
Thank You
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 12:52:27 EST
From: Bad4dFilly aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - New to list....

In a message dated 11/11/1999 5:00:52 AM !!!First Boot!!!,
godzilla lightspeed.net writes:


>boyfriend might get jealous though! =)

I don't know if he'll be on or not. What kind of dowry do you have to
offer? LOL >>

LOL Not much, but I do have a hot lil Ford truck to offer, I think that
speaks for itself! LOL




Hey, I thought I was! I know I'm a little old, but hey...>>

You guys are so cute! LOL =)

*~*~Lisa and Emvy~*~*
*~*~SIlly boys...trucks are for GIRLS!~*~*
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:35:56 EST
From: SHill48337 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re- Lubricants and Severe Duty

In a message dated 11/11/1999 4:52:00 AM Pacific Standard Time,
meyer strat.net writes:


revolutions until it was cool enough to start. It ran great and I managed
another 30k out of it.
FYI the oil was Castrol 5W50 >>
Your oil did an excellent job as there was nothing else to prevent severe
damage. This is good information. I might add that my son ran a Ch*vy 350
45 miles with little or no coolant (the light came on just out of Walla
Walla, thought he could make it home, by the time he got here the paint was
burned off of both heads and there were multiple cracks). He had
conventional oil and a hole in his lower radiator hose, other than frying the
top side of the engine, the crank, rods and pistons were OK. Your engine and
my Ford 429 apparently suffered no damage at all. I am not trying to put
down other oils just trying to offset some of the negativity toward
synthetics. My guess is there are a lot people on this list that use
synthetics very successfully. Likewise there are probably some who have had
some problems. Thanks
Burt Hill Kennewick WA 1972 F-250 4x4 460
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:38:45 EST
From: TBeeee aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - That clutch fork again

In a message dated 11/10/99 10:54:21 PM Eastern Standard Time,
danger csolutions.net writes:

> > The only thing that I cant figure out now is where the little wire thing
> > goes, or what purpose it serves. It's shaped like ^\__/^.
>

That should be the "spring" to hold the clutch fork to the fulcrum.

Stock Man
1967 Galaxie 500 Convertible (HELP!---I need 15 x5 factory rims)
1967 F-250 FE 390 4wd
1966 F-250 I6 240 2wd LWB Flare Side
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.hometown.aol.com/tbeeee
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:41:17 EST
From: TBeeee aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dana 24 gear popping

My experience tells me that this is a sign of worn bearings and most notably
the needle bearings that go between the main input and output shafts. I
replaced my needle bearings in mine and the gear popping problem cleared
right up.

Stock Man
1967 Galaxie 500 Convertible (HELP!---I need 15 x5 factory rims)
1967 F-250 FE 390 4wd
1966 F-250 I6 240 2wd LWB Flare Side
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.hometown.aol.com/tbeeee
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:34:56 -0500
From: "Don Haring, Jr."
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: 170 c.i. hopups?

Mike Sealey said:

>On Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:59 Jerry Godsey wrote:
>>Does anybody know of any hop ups for the 170 c.i. in my 65 Econoline? I
>>love the truck, but if I run over gum on a hot day I'll get stuck!
>>I haven't found any aftermarket manifolds, etc to put a two barrel on this.
>>Is anything available?

> Greetings from San Francisco, Reverend. It's been a loooooong time
> since I messed with a 170 (I had a '62 Falcon Futura for a couple
> months 25 years ago) but it seems to me that was one of the ones where
> the intake manifold was cast into the head. No idea if later ones had
> a separate manifold, or even if my memory is 100% about the cast-in-head
> part, but IIRC this will be somewhat complicated...


Since I also own a Falcon sedan, this sort of hop-up is discussed a lot in
the Falcon circles. I'm a fan of the straight-6, with no apologies. :)

For the Econoline, the engine box grew little in 1966 to accomodate the
taller 240 I-6. It also has a different, beefier, engine support bar.
AFAIK, it's a fairly easy job to swap these items into an older truck to
fit a 240 or 300 engine.

The small sixes (144, 170, 200) have the intake cast into the head, so no
separate intakes are available. However, I know a few people with the trick
tri-power set-up, which involves cutting holes into the original intake to
mount 3 1-bbl carbs with progressive linkage. Supercool, at least if you're
a fan of such things. It's not an easy or cheap alternative, but it's neat.
:) Headers are available from Clifford, and Clifford also has other I-6
goodies. I don't think it's a good idea to mount a 2-bbl carb on the 170
intake. I could be wrong, but my thinking is that it would just dump fuel
into an intake that isn't really set up for such things. The tri-power at
least spaces out the fuel a little better.

These kind of small six hop-ups pop up in the Mustang magazines from time
to time.

Hope this helps,
don


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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 19:35:30 EST
From: GMontgo930 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re- Lubricants and Severe Duty

In a message dated 11/11/1999 7:52:00 AM Eastern Standard Time,
meyer strat.net writes:


in
the 1970 429 engine or radiator, and caused absolutely no problems to the
engine.

I agree I had a similar problem/experience my 74 302 the waterpump seal
blew and leaked all the coolant out. A burnt out instrument panel light
(that I never fixed) prevented me from seeing the temp gauge climb. After
50+ miles when I got home I noticed the sound of hot tinkling metal under
the hood.
As it cooled down I pulled the coil wire and cranked it over two or three
revolutions until it was cool enough to start. It ran great and I managed
another 30k out of it. >>

Ditto the same basic thing. Mine was a 73 F100 w 302 & C4, blown radiator in
the Nevada desert 30 Miles from town. (Ely to be more specific). Made the
blast into town first thing in the AM and got another 3 years and 25k before
I decided to tear it down and do it right. Good thing too cause by then, 5 of
the 8 pistons had cracks in the skirts and the #8 came apart in my hands
after it was pulled! Thank goodness Ive never cooked a motor like that since,
but it's nice to know that it could take it when she had to!

George
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 19:44:15 EST
From: GMontgo930 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re- Lubricants and Severe Duty

In a message dated 11/11/1999 7:38:43 PM Eastern Standard Time,
GMontgo930 aol.com writes:


meyer strat.net writes:


in
the 1970 429 engine or radiator, and caused absolutely no problems to the
engine.

I agree I had a similar problem/experience my 74 302 the waterpump seal
blew and leaked all the coolant out. A burnt out instrument panel light
(that I never fixed) prevented me from seeing the temp gauge climb. After
50+ miles when I got home I noticed the sound of hot tinkling metal under
the hood.
As it cooled down I pulled the coil wire and cranked it over two or three
revolutions until it was cool enough to start. It ran great and I managed
another 30k out of it. >>

Ditto the same basic thing. Mine was a 73 F100 w 302 & C4, blown radiator in
the Nevada desert 30 Miles from town. (Ely to be more specific). Made the
blast into town first thing in the AM and got another 3 years and 25k
before
I decided to tear it down and do it right. Good thing too cause by then, 5
of
the 8 pistons had cracks in the skirts and the #8 came apart in my hands
after it was pulled! Thank goodness Ive never cooked a motor like that
since,
but it's nice to know that it could take it when she had to!

George >>

Also forgot to say, it was filed with plain old Pennzoil 10w30. Kinda sold me
on it. Still run it today (well almost, 10w40 now that Im down south in the
Fl. heat) in the Car (3.0L v6), Bronco (400), & Van (5.0 EFI)

George
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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:54:12 -0800 (PST)
From: canzus seanet.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 170 c.i. hopups?

At 08:52 PM 10:11:99 -0800, Jerry Godsey wrote:
>Does anybody know of any hop ups for the 170 c.i. in my 65 Econoline? I
>love the truck, but if I run over gum on a hot day I'll get stuck!
>I haven't found any aftermarket manifolds, etc to put a two barrel on this.
>Is anything available?

Unfortunately the 144/170/200/250 have the intake manifold cast into the
head. HOWEVER, the nearly as astute hotrodders of Oz have the solution,
it seems the 200cid(3.3L) was offered in Oz as a crossflow head, and is a
bolt on modification for any US 200cid. I seem to remember Clifford offering
these heads with the correct manifolds. Said to increase HP by 75 or there
abouts.....

You could also install a 250ci, but you'll need a trans to go with it, I think
the 250 has the same bolt pattern as the 302.....

Steve & the Rockette
68 F100, 390cid, FMX
63 F100, 292cid, 3speed
72 Capri 2000, hers
73 Capri 2600,tube frame going in.....
73 MGB GT, Our Toy
94 SHO, SWMBO's
97 Contour, Mine

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Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:53:40 -0600
From: Brett L Habben
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: "electric clutch"

Tom,
I've never seen an automotive application of that clutch, only industrial
applications. I've also seen electric brakes that are similiar. Do you
have any more info on who made the one you are referencing?
Brett
Super75cab
>Didn't someone in the 30's or 40's make some sort of "electric clutch"
where
>there was an electro magnet in the flywheel and a metal disk connected
to
....


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