From: owner-61-79-list-digest ford-trucks.com (61-79-list-digest)
To: 61-79-list-digest ford-trucks.com
Subject: 61-79-list-digest V3 #322
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61-79-list-digest Thursday, September 9 1999 Volume 03 : Number 322



=======================================================================
Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
Visit our web site: http://www.ford-trucks.com/
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=======================================================================
In this issue:

Re: FTE 61-79 - overdrive questions
RE: FTE 61-79 - Re: 400 Cams
FTE 61-79 - Mufflers
FTE 61-79 - Re: 400 Cams
FTE 61-79 - Hi-BoyPower Assist ram seal
Re: FTE 61-79 - 1966 F-250 3spd. Manual Transmission (Painted or not?)
Re: FTE 61-79 - Mighty Iron Beast
Re: FTE 61-79 - 1966 F-250 3spd. Manual Transmission (Painted or not?)
FTE 61-79 - Re: Looking for T-18
FTE 61-79 - Re: question about 1966 Ford F100 pickup
Re: FTE 61-79 - Duraspark
Re: FTE 61-79 - flooded hot restarts
RE: FTE 61-79 - Duraspark II for 390??
Re: FTE 61-79 - Diesels
RE: FTE 61-79 - question about 1966 Ford F100 pickup
Re: FTE 61-79 - 1963 F-250
FTE 61-79 - 66 ford pulling power
FTE 61-79 - for sale 390 aluminum intake/valve covers
FTE 61-79 - Still Electrically challenged :-(
Re: FTE 61-79 - Still Electrically challenged :-(
Re: FTE 61-79 - Help with oil pan woes

=======================================================================

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 20:17:58 EDT
From: JUMPINFORD aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - overdrive questions

In a message dated 9/8/99 6:44:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time, wish iastate.edu
writes:


8 has that umph in it :) >>

That straight 8 wasn't called the fireball for nuthin! Dont forget that
crank was huge, so it had a lot of inertia when it was at speed, and during a
shift, the inertia of the crank would overcome the friction between the tire
and road, making the chirp into drive. Not necessarily due to horsepower,
but the engines resistance to quick deceleration. Sort of like when rock
crawlers install a heavier flywheel in a vehicle. It doesn't add anything,
but the extra inertia makes it seem as though the engine has more bottom end.
I think I may have over explained this, but I just thought I would share
what my brain was puttin out when I read the post.

Darrell Duggan
74 F-350 "Tweety"
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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 20:43:47 -0400
From: "Tony"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Re: 400 Cams

Any 460 Duraspark distributor will work with the 400 because all 460, 351M,
400 and 351C share the same distributor. Here is some more good news. Any
351Windsor distributor will also fit all of these engines "but" you have to
change the distributor gear to the 460 Cleveland type. The rest of the
distributor is the same.
Anthony D. Daniels

- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-61-79-list ford-trucks.com
[mailto:owner-61-79-list ford-trucks.com] On Behalf Of Dan Lee
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 1999 8:15 PM
To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: 400 Cams

Chris,

I sent an email to customerservice edelbrock.com about
a manifold for 351C-4V heads on a 400 motor. They sent
me this reply.

>Hi Dan
>Not to pass the buck but we haven't done any R&D in
>this dept.
>We would like you to check with a company that knows
>this very well
>Price Motor Engineering ph 812-546-4220

Price Motor Engineering sells an adapter for $96.XX to
raise a Ford dist 2 1/2".

Next, I replied to Edelbrock that they don't support
the Cleveland/'M' block Market very well and suggested
that they produce some 4V Cleveland heads in aluminum
along with a Manifold for 'M' blocks. I offered to
take my '53 to Torrance for perfomance testing by
their engineering dept. The CS person replied that he
would forward my comments to his management.

I think it would help if a lot of interest in this
proposal showed up in the inbox at
customerservice edelbrock.com.


>My question for the group is what would
>I ask for at the parts store to get a Duraspark Dist.
>for a 400 motor?
________________________________________
>If you are going to modify it like I described even a
>Junkyard unit
>will
>work because you will remachine all of the bearings.

Also what do I look for at the junkyard to get a
Duraspark dist for a 400 motor?

I do list headers, Yes I have a set of Sanderson
Headers.


>I notice that you don't list headers in you specs.
>Without them you
>will be
>disappointed in this cam. I would also recommend
>minimally 2.5" duals
>with a
>balance tube, 3" would be better if you are looking
>for high end power.

I will use 2 1/2" or 3" pipes.

Thanks,

Dan Lee
'53 F100
400C-4V

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 21:14:09 -0500
From: ballingr ldd.net (William L. Ballinger)
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Mufflers

>
> Depending on what you want there are still turbo mufflers out there for
> about $20 and they work very well. That's all I use on my trucks. If you
> have the tubes custom made you can fit virtually any kind of turbo in there.
> I put long ones in my 2wd PU and they are very quiet with the 460. The
> short ones I had on it before were somewhat noisier.
>
> BTW, everyone knows you only use glass packs after filling them with oil and
> marinating the glass for a few days, then drain it out and install them.
> Don't start the engine with the exhaust pointing at anything you need to
> keep clean :-) CHERRY BOMBS forever :-)

We have a set of those old 2 1/2 Thrush round header mufflers that we
put on the '65. They sound the best of any muffler I've ever heard, but
are pretty loud. The pipes end at the back axle, and really seem to
bring out the lope at idle. Like a solid rumble, but you can hear them
swapping from side to side with a little stutter. Of course it you look
through them they are really 2 1/2 straight pipes with little louvers
that feed to the outer casing. I can't seem to figure out why it's so
loud. :-)
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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 19:14:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Dan Lee
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: 400 Cams

Sorry, I think that email address is
edelbrock edelbrock.com.

Dan Lee
'53 F100
400C-4V

>I sent an email to customerservice edelbrock.com
about
>a manifold for 351C-4V heads on a 400 motor. They
sent
>me this reply.

>Next, I replied to Edelbrock that they don't support
>the Cleveland/'M' block Market very well and
suggested
>that they produce some 4V Cleveland heads in aluminum
>along with a Manifold for 'M' blocks. I offered to
>take my '53 to Torrance for perfomance testing by
>their engineering dept. The CS person replied that he
>would forward my comments to his management.

>I think it would help if a lot of interest in this
>proposal showed up in the inbox at
>customerservice edelbrock.com.



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 19:11:54 -0700
From: "J.S.H."
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Hi-BoyPower Assist ram seal

>Hey Kirk,

>If I remember right, I thought you could get just the parts (or have >them rebuild it) at AutoKrafters: 800 228-7346.

I searched every power steering rebuilder I could to locate the seals
for the assist cylinder.The seals are extremly rare and the rebuilders
won't part with them seperatly.I located quite a few places that will be
glad to rebuild the cylinder and/or the control valve.
If anyone is interested in the info I could post info or contact me off
list.
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Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 21:30:58 -0500
From: Stu Varner
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 1966 F-250 3spd. Manual Transmission (Painted or not?)

>> well, my original 3-spd w/od was just black, but when I had my regular
>3-spd
>> put in it was orange... probably didnt help much huh.
>>

Stock Man, Mr. Thom B. wrote:

>Every little bit of input helps. That orange stuff is better left to the
>Chebbies. Sorry Stu...but that's what I think of when I see it.


Thom,

I know exactly what you mean about the "orange tint"......I almost puked
when I saw the color
as I was cleaning the housing up. I believe the correct term for the color
is Thunderbird red,
made by Eastwood Co. I highly recommend their products!!!!!! Good quality
stuff.

Stu
Nuke GM!
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pscico.com/stu
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Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 21:37:56 -0500
From: Stu Varner
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Mighty Iron Beast

At 06:29 AM 9/8/99 -0500, you wrote:
>> I'm not an FE guy but I remember hearing that the stock "manifolds" are
>> really the problem, not the heads? This is one reason all the magazine
>> articles use headers for power discussions.
>>
>> It's obvious that they had no real breathing problems because no FE I've
>> heard of had any trouble hitting some decent revs which is a good sign it's
>> breathing pretty well :-) Now the stock 460 OTOH..........
>
>I have been telling people this for years. A stock 390 (especially the
>early ones) head is one of the best flowing junkyard heads anyone made.
>You have to get into some hi-po stuff to match them. The key to that is
>the good exhaust ports, and the ability to recontour the intake path by
>what kind of manifold you put on it. I have always been impressed by
>how hard they pull especially with a fair sized cam that gets them up in
>the 6000-6500 range.
>
>What has gotten a burr under my saddle is reading magazine article after
>article telling things that have very little base in truth. They are
>usually GM guys writing them, and they've never put one together. They
>are just pushing some new aftermarket part someone has come up with to
>"prop up" the "weaknesses" of this design. Now come on guys repeat
>after me... I WILL FOREVER DEFEND THE HONOR OF THE MIGHTY IRON BEAST...I
>WILL FOREVER DEFEND...

Amen Brother Ballinger!!!!! Preach on!!!!!

Stu
Nuke GM!
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pscico.com/stu
(articles will be on their way saturday!)
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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 22:31:41 EDT
From: TBeeee aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 1966 F-250 3spd. Manual Transmission (Painted or not?)

In a message dated 9/8/99 10:26:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
nukegm ford-trucks.com writes:

> I know exactly what you mean about the "orange tint"......I almost puked
> when I saw the color
> as I was cleaning the housing up. I believe the correct term for the color
> is Thunderbird red,
> made by Eastwood Co. I highly recommend their products!!!!!! Good quality
> stuff.
>
Thanks for the input Stu. I'm pretty sure mine was just plain cast
originally. I decided that am going to go with the "Chassis Black" on the
tranny. Rest assured that the first guy that tells me that its not the
original tranny color is gonna get bounced outta the garage on his ear.

Stock Man
1967 Galaxie 500 Convertible (HELP!---I need 15 x5 factory rims)
1967 F-250 FE 390 4wd
1966 F-250 I6 240 2wd LWB Flare Side
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.hometown.aol.com/tbeeee

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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 23:18:00 -0400
From: "Serian"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: Looking for T-18

> Need year(s) and which Ford truck models for a T-18
> tranny from a 2wd vehicle.

The T-18 is a rather popular transmission ... I dont know
how early they were put into Ford trucks, but according to
the manuals I have for F-series and Bronco of the '76-'86
model years, the T-18 was an option for all of them.


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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 23:26:27 -0400
From: "Serian"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: question about 1966 Ford F100 pickup

> This truck has a 300-cu.-in., straight 6 engine.
> It seems to have plenty of power, and I've pulled
> a pretty heavy U-Haul trailer before that
> was loaded with heavy things like a piano, etc.
>
> I want to buy a 14-ft. or 16-ft. farm/utility trailer that
> I can use to haul a standard-sized farm tractor, or
> maybe a standard-sized car.
>
> I would bet this truck's power is roughly equal to that
> of smaller V-8s and would be OK, marginally perhaps,
> to pull a load like the one I describe.
>
> Can anyone out there shed some light on whether this
> seems reasonable? Could a truck like mine pull a trailer
> with that kind of load? I can't seem to find any kind of
> towing capacity data, horsepower, etc. for the truck on
> the Internet.

I have towed a 1976 LTD up some pretty steep hills with
my '83 F-150 (300cid inline six, NP435 4 spd) ... not a
problem, though it preferred 3rd gear while doing so. I
think your '66 will do well with it as long as you have good
compression and keep it cool. If you have an automatic
transmission, I recommend an add-on oil cooler for the
transmission fluid.



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Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 20:26:23 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Duraspark

Azie wrote:
>No... The FE disappeared from the car lineup long before '76, which I believe
>is the introduction year for FOMOCO's Electronic Ignition. Only FE I'm aware of
>bring offered with the duraspark is the '76 F series trucks.

Don't forget '75...
FE's had D-spark in '75 and '76.

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

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Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 20:26:24 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - flooded hot restarts

Marty wrote:
>I just changed the 390 in my 73 F100 from a 2v over to a used Edelbrock
>600cfm with a stock cast manifold. Now when the motor is hot it seems to
>purculate (sp?) after I shut it off, it's flooded when I go to restart. Not
>too bad, but I do have to hold it to the floor and crank for a few seconds.
>This is very frustrating and not good for the motor.
>
>I do have a 1 inch spacer between manifold and carb, but the only one I
>could find was a solid aluminum one .

Aluminum is a bad choice for the spacer...
You need something that's a decent heat insulator.
I got a 1" plastic one for under the edelbrock carb on my FE390. Works
good, and was under $20.
The other thing that causes problems with flooding during hot-soak is
excessive fuel pressure. When the motor is shut off and things heat
up under the hood, the fuel in the line from the pump to the carb
expands and if the fuel pump pressure is already high then the extra
pressure from expansion will push the float needle open and shove extra
fuel into the carb bowls and overfill them causing flooding.
I had problems with flooding during hot-soak on my FE w/edelbrock,
and adding a pressure regulator set to 5psi and the 1" plastic spacer
under the carb completely eliminated the problem.


Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

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Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 20:26:26 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Duraspark II for 390??

>Nope, cars dropped the 390 in 69 if I remember right (Stangs did anyway),
>and 76 is the last year for the trucks, so you are left with a 76 being the
>only year, and pickups being the only models to choose from ...

D-spark was available in '75 trucks also, so you've got 2 years to
choose from. Even so, anything you find in the wrecking yard is
probably way worn out.
Fortunately, rebuilts are available from the local auto parts store for
under $50.

>You might be able to sweet talk your parts store and get them to take a
>points dist. as a core on a duraspark dist.

Yeah, when I got my rebuilt FE d-spark distributor, the guy took
a worn out 302 points distribuotr for core...
It just kinda depends on who you deal with.

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

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Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 20:26:22 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Diesels

David Henderson wrote:

>diesel combusts fuel by using heated fuel that is directly injected into the
>cylinder as a fine mist and then compressing the fuel until it combusts (I
>cannot remember the name of the law, but energy can be expressed by
pressure and
>volume).

I believe the formula you are refering to is the ideal gas law:

PV= nRT

Basically, it states that if you take a volume of gas and compress
it into a smaller space it gets hotter...

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 23:32:34 -0400
From: "Serian"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - question about 1966 Ford F100 pickup

> Doesn't really matter if you can get it going,
> but can you stop it?

yeah ... it kinda sucks to not be able to keep
your load from running over your truck :-)
from the prior message says, however, (14-16
ft trailer) I would guess that the trailer would be
required to have its own seperate electric brakes
for that size and weight class. If not required, I
still highly recommend that such a thing be installed.

> Don't even think it until you at least convert
> to discs, IMHO.

Aye ... disc brakes are less prone to locking up, and
they seem to dissipate heat faster than drum brakes.



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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 23:51:03 -0400
From: "Phil / Debi"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 1963 F-250

> > I have a 1963 F-250 that has a 223/4speed and I am wondering how
> > difficult it is to put a 1979 302/auto, from a van into it. I don't
know
> > if the 1963 model came with a V-8 option or not and if it did, will the
> > 1979 motor fit into the mounts?
>
> I can't tell you if it did or not, but if it did, likely it was the
Y-block
> as I think the FE was a year or so off yet ...

they had the y-block v8 in 63.

I was looking at a Dennis Carpenter catalog earlier today and I recall them
selling motor mounts to install windsor engines in your year truck.

Phil Beattie
66 F100 390 C6
70 F100 flairside 390 C6
79 F250 4x4 400 C6
91 F150 4x4


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Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 07:18:39 +0300
From: "Greg Schnakenberg"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 66 ford pulling power

I had a roommate in college that had an '80 F250 with that 300. he would
haul cattle every weekend from the local cattle auction with a 24 ft
trailer, big ole cows are a bit heaiver than any camper, boat, or
whatever you want to pull andhe'd get 15-17 mpg to boot!


>Hello all. I am a new list subscriber. I have a question regarding my
>'66 Ford F100 truck, and I'm hoping that someone can shed some
>light.
>
>My question is about horsepower/torque and towing capacity. This
>truck has a 300-cu.-in., straight 6 engine. It seems to have plenty
>of power, and I've pulled a pretty heavy U-Haul trailer before that
>was loaded with heavy things like a piano, etc.
>
>I want to buy a 14-ft. or 16-ft. farm/utility trailer that I can use to
>haul a standard-sized farm tractor, or maybe a standard-sized car.
>I would bet this truck's power is roughly equal to that of smaller V-
>8s and would be OK, marginally perhaps, to pull a load like the one
>I describe.
>
>Can anyone out there shed some light on whether this seems
>reasonable? Could a truck like mine pull a trailer with that kind of
>load? I can't seem to find any kind of towing capacity data,
>horsepower, etc. for the truck on the Internet.
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Tim Venable
>tim.venable conway.com
>
>


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Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 01:01:05 EDT
From: JJJJJGRANT aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - for sale 390 aluminum intake/valve covers

i'm looking into buying a 76 f250 crew cab with a shortbed, i plan on a 302
or 351w swap, it currently has a nice running 390 with an edlebrock aluminum
intake, and aluminum valve covers, the covers look like cobra jets but i
don't think they are originals. would anyone be interested in the intake and
cover for $ 300.00 plus shipping? if the covers turn out to be original of
course the price will be higher.

thanks, jeff grant
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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 22:48:56 -0700
From: "Chris Samuel"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Still Electrically challenged :-(

I have it wired as per-factory, according to FORD, Haynes, Chilton.
I have extra wires per FORD.
I have had the Alt. & Regulator Tested.

Ok, I have returned everything to bone stock.
Thank you's to Pat and Tony!)
Just sitting the battery went dead!
Checked the bloody thing out while I recharged it.
Small voltage draw through the Regulator.
No Problem I have a "Known" good spare!
Install it.
Draw through the regulator!
Disconnect the regulator and the draw disappears!
Ok pin out the regulator.
Yep its Ok.
According to the wiring diagram this can not happen!
Of course this is a Ford!
So go looking. Rig up a temp wiring harness that allows quick disconnects,
get paper and pen. List config. Check each circuit one at a time.
Quadtripple check the wires, Yep it's wired like Ford, Hayens, Chilton, and
everyone I can think of and, there is a draw through the regulator, I'm
going to have a dead battery over night!
Take a deep breath...
That's it, now be calm...
Disconnect the Regulator.
Calmly close the hood and put the tools away.
Come in here and tell you all about it!

I have this 108 AMP GM alternator in the shop on a shelf...
I just informed the truck that I have done it in the past, and would again!

Anyone care to take a stab at this one?
The Ammeter does not move during any of this!
I don't need any more wiring diagrams, they have all been the same and have
not solved the problem.
Is there anything magical about Ford wire? I have unfortunately had to
replace some of it, where it was missing. Maybe that's the problem!-)
I would like to fix it, but I'm about done wasting time on this...

I know that "I" have missed something, or just flat out FUBAR'd this thing
of course it was TARFU when I started!

MUEL
79 Bronco 400, 4spd. AC Delco alternator.
75 F250 460, 4spd. Dead Ford Electrical system!


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Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 22:55:35 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Still Electrically challenged :-(

I know FUBAR but ya got me on TARFU...

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets"

- -----Original Message-----
From: Chris Samuel
To: A 61-79 FORD TRUCKS
Date: Wednesday, September 08, 1999 10:50 PM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Still Electrically challenged :-(



>I know that "I" have missed something, or just flat out FUBAR'd this thing....


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