FTE 61-79 - Re: 460 Valve spring pressure FTD61-79 V3 #75

61-79-list-digest Friday, March 5 1999 Volume 03 : Number 077

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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 61-79 - Re: 460 Valve spring pressure FTD61-79 V3 #75
FTE 61-79 - Emissions labels for valve covers
FTE 61-79 - Electrical shocks at truck body
FTE 61-79 - Where's the Shackle Man?
FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's
FTE 61-79 - Electrical shocks at truck body
FTE 61-79 - glass glue
FTE 61-79 - proportioning valves
Re: FTE 61-79 - glass glue?
RE: FTE 61-79 - 429 Heads
FTE 61-79 - Re: Emisions Label
Re: FTE 61-79 - Electrical shocks at truck body
Re: FTE 61-79 - '74 F-100
Re: FTE 61-79 - glass glue
Re: FTE 61-79 - Where's the Shackle Man?
FTE 61-79 - Re: Emissions Label
FTE 61-79 - Body assembly manuals
FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Electrical shocks at truck body
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Emisions Label
FTE 61-79 - Re: 460 Valve spring pressure/ Exhaust port 460 D3VE castings
Re: FTE 61-79 - Body assembly manuals
FTE 61-79 - Stancions (sp?)
FTE 61-79 - 292 Y-Block
FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's
Re: FTE 61-79 - 292 Y-Block
FTE 61-79 - Going to the "Recycling yards" tomorrow
Re: FTE 61-79 - Going to the "Recycling yards" tomorrow
Re: FTE 61-79 - Body assembly manuals
Re: FTE 61-79 - Going to the "Recycling yards" tomorrow
RE: FTE 61-79 - Going to the "Recycling yards" tomorrow
FTE 61-79 - early parts
FTE 61-79 - C-6 trans end shaft
RE: FTE 61-79 - C-6 trans end shaft
RE: FTE 61-79 - C-6 trans end shaft
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Electrical shocks at truck body
FTE 61-79 - Comments.....
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Knob - Question
RE: FTE 61-79 - Re: Electrical shocks at truck body
Re: FTE 61-79 - Stancions (sp?)
FTE 61-79 - 410 stuff (kinda long)
FTE 61-79 - Questions About "Stock" Wheels.
FTE 61-79 - More M-block answers
FTE 61-79 - 73 - 79 hood insulation pad ??
FTE 61-79 - Blowby (oil pressure)
Re: FTE 61-79 - Stancions (sp?)
Re: FTE 61-79 - 410 stuff (kinda long)

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 12:15:27 GMT
From: cdailey

newsguy.com (Chad Dailey)
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: 460 Valve spring pressure FTD61-79 V3 #75

Brent--

I have been following this thread with some interest. If seat
pressure is acceptable, keep the springs. If I were you, I wouldn't
worry too much about the spring open pressure, I'd worry more about
making sure that your geometry is correct, and that your parts are in
good shape. Make sure the locks are positively mated to the valves.

Why? In a properly set up valvetrain, the only time the valve is
stressed in a tensile load is when the valve is on the seat, or
returning to the seat uncontrolled (valve float). Every other moment
in the valve motion should be in a compressive load between the rocker
arm/valve tip and the valve lock/retainer. How else could the Pro
Stock drag racers keep a little 5mm valve stem from pulling apart with
500+ lbs of spring pressure at 8000+ RPM?

If you are really concerned about pulling through the locks, I'd
update your valves to some decent stainless ones, and keep the
springs. IMHO, from the RPM's you say you would be turning, I
wouldn't worry about dropping a valve, unless the valve/lock/retainer
fit is not positive.

Ultimately, the decision is up to you. Good luck.

Chad

On Thu, 4 Mar 1999 16:30:34 -0500 (EST), you wrote:

>Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 08:29:53 -0500
>From: "Brent_Cole"
>Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 Valve spring pressure
>
>You are correct, I didn't spec the spring correctly. I have located the
>catalog and the valve closed pressure is 138 lbs at a spring height of
>1.85". The open pressure is 377 lbs at a spring height of 1.25. That
>calculates out to 398 lbf/in. The engine builder's concern is not with =
the
>cam but with the valve stem it self. He told me he as seen this type of
>spring pull stock valves apart. I don't know if I believe him or not. =
Any
>new info now that I have the correct specification on my springs?
>
>Thanks for the reply
>
>Brent

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 07:07:25 -0600 (CST)
From: Stu Varner
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Emissions labels for valve covers

>Date: Thu, 04 Mar 1999 22:37:38 PST
>From: "brian vance"
>Subject: FTE 61-79 - Emisions Label
>
>How do you spell emisions? Everything tells me to refer to the label
>under my hood for things such as timing and stuff. Even my ford manual
>tells me to look there for certain things. Well what do you do if your
>label has long since bean washed away? Can you get a replacement label?
>Thanks a bunch for any replys.
>
>Brian
>1977 F250 4X4

Brian -

Jim Osborn Reproductions has every possible automotive decal known to exist
in the world. They are located in Georgia and since I am at work right now,
I do not have the catalog in front of me or I would share part numbers.
They make a replacement sticker or offer OEM stickers for almost any and
every application from old Powermaster Ford tractors to '62 Lincolns, right
up through '96 or even later models. He is not limited to Ford products
either. EVERY make is found in his catalog.

Jim used to be heavily associtaed with the Mustang hobby until his untimely
passing not too long ago. He was a highly respected individual who turned
his hobby into a passionate business for himself. Nothing like making a
living doing what you truly love!

BTW- What engine series did the Lincoln division use in the 1960's?????
Did they use FE's or did they have their own engine to play with?

Stu
Nuke GM!
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pscico.com/stu

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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 09:48:47 EST
From: BDIJXS

aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Electrical shocks at truck body

With all the testimonials on this subject, I went ahead and installed
Electrical Shocks on my F-100.

It not only rides better, but I tingle all over when I drive!

CJ
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 09:48:33 EST
From: BDIJXS

aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Where's the Shackle Man?

This question is for Don Grossman, but anyone else who might know, please
weigh in!

With all the switching/swapping of rear springs/shackles you have done, do you
know if the 69 (approx) rear shackles and frame mounts are the same for the
F-100 and F-250?

CJ
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 07:15:34 -0800 (PST)
From: draco

pacifier.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's

CJ wrote:
> I've contacted a few manufacturers on the web already, the only
> close response was Ford Powertrain in Washington. They said they
> have a set that were designed for a Galaxie, but a few guys are
> trying them in their trucks to see if they fit. They should know
> more in a few weeks.....

wish replied:
> Yeah we were told that too ... I have some contact information
> (sorry I haven't gotten it to you yet mark) of a guy who was
> installing them on his 67 ... I'll try and dig that up and call
> him or pass the info along to you guys ..

Whoa, wait a minute. I would sure hate so see this poor guy with
the '67 get deluged with phone calls. Who wants to volunteer to
call this guy and let us all know what is happening? I vote for
Bill since Stan at FPA gave him the number in the first place.
If no one else wants to I would be happy to.

I e-mailed FPA on Monday to see if he heard anything and haven't
gotten a response.

I was thinking. If there were enough of us on the list that would
actually spend the $500 or so for Ceramic FE Shorty headers maybe
we can talk to Stan as a group and convince him to see our point
of view.

He just needs to be convinced that the demand would be there.
That way even if the Galaxie ones don't work, he might be willing
to make modifications. He has all the pieces already, flanges and
such, just has to make the right bends in the tubing. Maybe
deposits for 10 sets of headers would at least at least get his
attention.

He will also get lots of exposure through us. I guarantee if I
can get these in my truck you will see lots of pictures on my web
page. FPA would also get mentioned on the list a lot more.

The only big hitch I know of is the clutch linkage thing that a
couple of people have mentioned. Mark Campbell (the new guy) is
very familiar with this problem (although his motor is not an FE).

I really want these things because I can't come up with any way to
do my exhaust without having it hang below the chassis. So unless
anyone else has any great ideas. It is either shorty headers or
back to stock manifolds.

By the way just as a reference point, I asked the parts guy at
Ford. 1 pair of new exhaust manifolds costs $540, and one side
has been on backorder forever.

Mark in Southwest Washington
www.pacifier.com/~draco
- --
'74 F-100 4X4
'74 F-250 Supercab
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 09:14:15 -0600
From: John LaGrone
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Electrical shocks at truck body

>>I've been following your thread about your pickups shocking you, and I
have a question for you all. I often get a shock from mine, especially
when I'm getting out and reach to close the door. The door gives me a
big shock. Would that be a shorted wire, like you were saying for
yours? It happens very regular, whether it is wet or dry out, almost
like a big static shock. I only get one and that's it, until the next
time I'm getting out. Any ideas? Thanks.

Marty Colman
73 F100 390

Marty,

Your shock sounds like genuine static. This is a result of the fabric of
your clothes rubbing across the seat. We can't use the driver's door on the
Towncar when it's in the garage. We have to slide across the cloth seats
and get out the passenger door. Sometimes the bolt is so big you can see
it. I guess you could drive naked? SWMBO won't let me try it, I just have
to get shocked.

- -John

jlagrone

ford-trucks.com
1979 F150 Custom 351M C6 (Henry)
http://www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
Dearborn iron rules!!!!!!

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 09:29:08 -0600
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - glass glue?

> on the mustang, when you roll the window down the glass hits on a rubber
>stop, i am going to put hose clamps on the guides for stops, this way the
>clamps act as a stop just before the glass hits the factory stop.
>
Hey that's a great idea ... I think all the 69 Fords, except perhaps the
very early and very late ones, had the stupid glued in windows ... talk
about a pain, our Mustang and Cougars have had them,and I can only remember
my Cougar having them actually glued, that was of course after we replaced
them with some that were still glued ... til I busted that telephone pole,
that was the end of the driver's side ...

Just my 2cents

wish

Links http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/links.html
'73 1/2 ton 4x4 Ford http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/truck.html
'96 Mustang GT http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/mustang.html
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 09:31:48 -0600
From: "John MacNamara"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - 429 Heads

Brad: I compared in intakes on my 429 PI's to the stock 460 heads and found
the width is about 3/16" inch wider and the height is about an 1/8" taller.
The intake and exhaust valves are also larger. I have some pics of these
heads if you want to look at them.

Thanks
John MacNamara

805 577 2536 wk
805 577 2768 fx
805 526 3464 hm
ESN 495-2536
jmacnam

nortelnetworks.com

> -----Original Message-----
> From:Brad Smith [SMTP:rbsmith

unity.ncsu.edu]
> Sent:Thursday, March 04, 1999 3:41 PM
> To:61-79-list

ford-trucks.com
> Subject:FTE 61-79 - 429 Heads
>
> If anyone out there can give me some ideas on heads for my truck I
> would
> be happy. Does anyone know if there is a difference between the dove
> heads
> and the PI heads? What kinda RPMs are the stock springs in these heads
> capable of handling? I am taking my truck to the dyno in April, and I
> surely don't want to float a valve or something worse (like make my clutch
> come apart). I need to know what kinda RPMs I should be looking at
> running
> it up to....
> Thanks
> Brad 78 F-150 4X4 429
>
> The two best times to go fishing are when it is raining, and when it is
> not...
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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 09:42:24 -0600
From: "Jamey Moss"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: Emisions Label

brian vance wrote:

> How do you spell emisions? Everything tells me to refer to the label
> under my hood for things such as timing and stuff. Even my ford manual
> tells me to look there for certain things. Well what do you do if your
> label has long since bean washed away? Can you get a replacement label?
> Thanks a bunch for any replys.
>
> Brian
> 1977 F250 4X4

Someone else may have already beat me to the punch on this, but I think
you can find the decals you need on the FTE website. Try http://www.motorhaven.com/

Jim Osborn Reproductions (http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.osborn-reproduction.com/) also has
the decals if you can't find it on the FTE site. I was under the
impression that Ken has a deal worked out with Jim Osborn's to get us a
discount on the stickers while helping to put money into FTE. I may be
wrong on that, but I'd buy it from FTE if you can (where would we be
without Ken, Peggy, and FTE?)

BTW, to answer your question, it's "emissions." ;-)

Jamey Moss
ra4001

email.sps.mot.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.prismnet.com/~jamey/f100/

- -
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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 09:42:31 -0600
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Electrical shocks at truck body

At 08:48 AM 3/5/99 , you wrote:
>With all the testimonials on this subject, I went ahead and installed
>Electrical Shocks on my F-100.
>
>It not only rides better, but I tingle all over when I drive!
>

Yes, but can you bounce the wheels off the ground with those shocks ?

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 09:43:54 -0600
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - '74 F-100

>Could anyone please tell me what the fair market value would be on a
>1974 F-100 Supercab? The interior is in perfect shape, minor
>imperfections on the exterior, 2WD, V-8 (don't know the ci yet). I've
>located one in the LA/MS area and they are asking $2750. Not sure if
>this a steal, ripoff, or right on the money. Any assistance would be
>appreciated.
>

That sounds like a fair deal to me ... there was a 1owner low mileage
regular cab here at a dealership that sold for 4750 and it was in great
shape for its age, but had some small problems (needed a tune up and some
dork had added Chevy style saddle tanks)

Just my 2cents

wish

Links http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/links.html
'73 1/2 ton 4x4 Ford http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/truck.html
'96 Mustang GT http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/mustang.html
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 10:48:16 -0500 (EST)
From: CLARE WATERMAN
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - glass glue

thanks for the feedback, guys!

Clare M. Waterman-Storer, Ph.D.
Department of Biology
University of North Carolina
Chapel Hill, NC, 27599-3280

T: (919)-962-2354
F: (919)-962-1625

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 08:42:14 -0800
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Where's the Shackle Man?

BDIJXS

aol.com wrote:

> This question is for Don Grossman, but anyone else who might know, please
> weigh in!
>
> With all the switching/swapping of rear springs/shackles you have done, do you
> know if the 69 (approx) rear shackles and frame mounts are the same for the
> F-100 and F-250?
>
> CJ

The hangers should be close to the same design. There is that soft ride
shackle that was used on the F-100 for a number of years which might be a
problem. If the springs are the same width a swap could be done. If you put the
F250 springs on the F-100 you will have to use the F-250 shackle as the spring is
shorter than the soft ride spring. I say should a lot because there might be
differences between a regular and a camper special that I don't know about. I
swapped springs and hangers when I upgraded my springs to a 77 set. A quick
check with a tape measure should tell you all you need to know.

- --
Don Grossman
duckdon

pacific.net

99 Contour SE Sport
63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 08:39:22 PST
From: "MARTY COLMAN"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: Emissions Label

Brian-

Have you checked the products section at the FTE site? There are many
emissions decals for 68-96. And they are only 3 or 4 dollars.

Marty

______________________________________________________
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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 11:49:18 -0500
From: Ted Wnorowski
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Body assembly manuals

I'm gonna send for a catalog from Jim Osborn Reproductions, but in the meantime maybe someone could help.
I'm looking for a Body/Interior assembly manual for '64 trucks. Everywhere I look including FTE, has '61-'63 then '65 on up.
Any help would be appreciated.

Ted
mailto:wnorowski

onebellevue.com

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 10:54:00 -0600
From: William S Hart
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's

>Whoa, wait a minute. I would sure hate so see this poor guy with
>the '67 get deluged with phone calls. Who wants to volunteer to
>call this guy and let us all know what is happening? I vote for
>Bill since Stan at FPA gave him the number in the first place.
>If no one else wants to I would be happy to.
>
No problem I'll try and give him a call this weekend and see if the galaxie
headers fit. A group purchase might be a great idea ... I know several
people have asked me about those headers ...

Stu, whaddya think ? You in ?

>I really want these things because I can't come up with any way to
>do my exhaust without having it hang below the chassis. So unless
>anyone else has any great ideas. It is either shorty headers or
>back to stock manifolds.
>
I was afraid it was just me not findin any headers that would work, glad
someone else has the same point of view.

You mentioned having FPA possibly build some new headers, how far is he
from you ? I think part of the problem is that he doesn't have a donor
truck to work off of, and I'd volunteer, but he's waaay to far away for me
to make that worthwhile ...

I'll try and give the number for the 67 a buzz and see what I can find out
this weekend.

Great idea ...

wish
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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 09:49:56 -0800
From: Dennis Pearson
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Electrical shocks at truck body

Thanks for your message at 01:06 AM 3/5/99 +0000, MARK DAVIES. Your message
was:
>I dont think anyone replied to my message but you sumed it up this is
>exactly whats happening to me along with the tingle shock under the
>hood laying both arms across the metal frame the hood latches onto

It sounds like luv L-U-V to me (Itchy Twitchy Feeling). What do you expect
when you drive a Ford? It's alive...
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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 13:16:41 -0500
From: Ken Payne
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Emisions Label

>
>
>Someone else may have already beat me to the punch on this, but I think
>you can find the decals you need on the FTE website. Try
>http://www.motorhaven.com/
>
>Jim Osborn Reproductions (http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.osborn-reproduction.com/) also has
>the decals if you can't find it on the FTE site. I was under the
>impression that Ken has a deal worked out with Jim Osborn's to get us a
>discount on the stickers while helping to put money into FTE. I may be
>wrong on that, but I'd buy it from FTE if you can (where would we be
>without Ken, Peggy, and FTE?)
>
>BTW, to answer your question, it's "emissions." ;-)
>
>Jamey Moss
>ra4001

email.sps.mot.com
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.prismnet.com/~jamey/f100/

Since Jim passed away we lost the discount because there was
no written contract. Only a verbal between us and him. His
son, while a great guy, understandably could not take our
word for it (can't blame him since he never dealt with us).
We charge the same price as Jim Osborn Reproductions. I
believe our minimum shipping cost is less. Deal with FTE or
Jim's; either way, you win - the Osborns are great people.
I believe Ford Motor Company just gave 1.5 million to the
Mustang Museum to get started. Jim was the founder of the
Mustang Club of American is the primary inspiration for the
Mustang Museum.

Ken Payne

Ken
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 13:18:36 -0500
From: "Brent_Cole"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: 460 Valve spring pressure/ Exhaust port 460 D3VE castings

I have purchased new keepers and locks with these springs I didn't want to
take any chances. My machine shop was recommened to me by a friend and
this is my first time using this guy. I went by and visited his shop
before I sent him my business. He seems to know what he is doing and has a
lot of work and good equipment. It just makes me nervious when he expresses
his concerns (but I'm glad he does). We will find out how it goes. One
thing I did read in my Federal Mogul book about my springs is that the cam
should go through the break-in period with only the outer spring. After x
amount of time running at y rpm install the inners. I have also heard
horror stories about these stiffer springs grinding off the cam lobes
without following the break in procedures.

Another question, about my exhaust ports (they are close to the valves). I
was going to have the exhaust side of the heads ported but in the middle of
the exhaust port on these smog emissions style heads (I think the casting
number is D3VE bla bla ) there was a bump with a hole to scavage exhaust
gas and port it out the back of the head to smog pump. If I grind out that
bump how big will that hole get? My machine shop said they could do it but
the performance gain not be worth the cost of removing that much material
(ie alot of expensive labor). Has anyone ported this style head before and
is there anything to watch out for?

Thanks
Brent

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 13:28:19 -0500
From: Ken Payne
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Body assembly manuals

At 11:49 AM 3/5/99 -0500, you wrote:
> I'm gonna send for a catalog from Jim Osborn Reproductions, but in the
> meantime maybe someone could help.
> I'm looking for a Body/Interior assembly manual for '64 trucks.
> Everywhere I look including FTE, has '61-'63 then '65 on up.
> Any help would be appreciated.
>
> Ted
> mailto:wnorowski

onebellevue.com

Osborn's doesn't have them. We've got their complete truck catalog on
the site. They've been producing new items as the blue-prints are found
in Ford's archives. Unfortunately, Jim told me that Ford used to allow
public access to the archives and many people "walked off" with precious
one-of-a-kind items.
Maybe Osborn's has a used shop manual if that will do the job - they've
got a large collection of used manuals (I was given the grand tour by
Jim).

Ken Payne

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 13:55:45 -0500
From: Tony Marino
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Stancions (sp?)

Could somebody confirm something for me real quick?

73-79 models (possibly including 67 and up)

Are the 300 I-6 motor stancions the same as those used by the 360 FE's in 4
wheel drive trucks? The naked eye tells me no. (the other eye says
maybe) Any difference between the 4x4 models' between 1/2 and 3/4 ton?

Thanks people!

Tony
tony

pscico.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pscico.com/~tony
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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 14:06:30 -0500
From: dci

scican.net
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 292 Y-Block

Hey Dennis,

you wrote:
>I see by your signature that your engine is a transplant V8. Was the '61
truck originally a V8?
>How about the '63? V8 or 6?

Yes, the VIN for my '61 Unibody shows it originally came with a 292ci
Y-block - (not to be too technical with you, but these engines are
referred to as 'Y-blocks' and not a V8 due to the deep-skirted crankcase
which provides for a really rigid block).

I don't know exactly when the engine transplant took place, but as best
I can piece together, my grandpa (who bought it in '71) had it dropped
in in the early '80's. I believe the trucks could come from the factory
with I6 or the Y8 - I would have to check in my factory manual for
sure. And the various Y-blocks really look alike from the outside,
too. To be really sure what year and displacement you have in a
replacement engine (one without direct ties to the appropriate VIN tag)
you have to dismantle the engine. I hate to even admit that I am kinda
assuming my current engine in the truck is a '59 292 'cuz somebody
handwrote: " '59 292ci " under the hood in crayon! ;-)

>By the way, let me know when you're ready to replace that steering wheel
(all I need is the chrome ring for my '66--but then it wouldn't be
original, darn!)

Well, I don't plan to change out my horn ring, but if I were to I sure
wouldn't want your's to be un-original, right?! ;-) I alway keep my
eyes open for various 60s era truck parts at my local "you -pick'em
parts" place as well as the countryside (southern Indiana). I'll keep
you in mind. Parts for these trucks can be tough to find (as I'm sure
you're aware). Everytime I start thinking how bad the aftermarket parts
availability is for my '61 Unibody, I think about the '58, '59 and '60
F100 guys! ;-) Ugh, they've got it even tougher!

Speaking of spare parts, I recently bought a nice '67 F100 aluminum
grill and metal valance, with headlights and all. Great shape. I
haven't posted it formally yet since I haven't had a chance to clean it
up a bit, but give me an email if somebody's interested.

Eric 'Stitch'
"Happy Days"
1961 F100 Unibody w/'59 292ci Y-block
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 11:06:40 -0800 (PST)
From: draco

pacifier.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's

wish wrote:
> You mentioned having FPA possibly build some new headers, how
> far is he from you ? I think part of the problem is that he
> doesn't have a donor truck to work off of, and I'd volunteer,
> but he's waaay to far away for me to make that worthwhile ...

Puyallup is about 2.5 hours from here. I have relatives about
a half hour south of there so I don't mind the drive, but with
no exhaust system, my truck is not driveable. If I bought the
headers from FPA, I was going to drive up there to get them.

If it came to it I could probably tow it up there. At least
if he used my truck, the headers would be guaranteed to fit. :)

I wonder if he has a nice safe place to store it.

Anyway, we are getting ahead of ourselves. First we have to
find out about the Galaxie headers in that '67. I am going to
take a look at my neighbors '69 to see how much the engine
compartments differ.

Mark in Southwest Washington
www.pacifier.com/~draco
- --
'74 F-100 4X4
'74 F-250 Supercab
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 11:07:35 -0800
From: "sam weatherby"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's

I live about 30 minutes from there in low traffic situations...
-srw

Sam Weatherby http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://insert.com/sammy
SWeatherby

UsWest.Net A-SamWe

Microsoft.com
'70 Grabber Sportsroof Mustang
'93 F-150 XLT Lightning
'98 HD FXD Super Glide
'65 F100

- -----Original Message-----
From: draco

pacifier.com
To: 61-79-list

ford-trucks.com
Cc: wish

iastate.edu ; draco

pacifier.com

Date: Friday, March 05, 1999 11:07 AM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: FE Shorty Headers in 4x4's

>wish wrote:
>> You mentioned having FPA possibly build some new headers, how
>> far is he from you ? I think part of the problem is that he
>> doesn't have a donor truck to work off of, and I'd volunteer,
>> but he's waaay to far away for me to make that worthwhile ...
>
>Puyallup is about 2.5 hours from here. I have relatives about
>a half hour south of there so I don't mind the drive, but with
>no exhaust system, my truck is not driveable. If I bought the
>headers from FPA, I was going to drive up there to get them.
>
>If it came to it I could probably tow it up there. At least
>if he used my truck, the headers would be guaranteed to fit. :)
>
>I wonder if he has a nice safe place to store it.
>
>Anyway, we are getting ahead of ourselves. First we have to
>find out about the Galaxie headers in that '67. I am going to
>take a look at my neighbors '69 to see how much the engine
>compartments differ.
>
>Mark in Southwest Washington
>www.pacifier.com/~draco
>--
>'74 F-100 4X4
>'74 F-250 Supercab
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>

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 11:18:09 -0800
From: Dennis Pearson
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 292 Y-Block

Thanks for your message at 02:06 PM 3/5/99 -0500, dci

scican.net. Your
message was:
>Hey Dennis,
>
>you wrote:
>>I see by your signature that your engine is a transplant V8. Was the '61
>truck originally a V8?
>>How about the '63? V8 or 6?
>
>Yes, the VIN for my '61 Unibody shows it originally came with a 292ci
>Y-block - (not to be too technical with you, but these engines are
>referred to as 'Y-blocks' and not a V8 due to the deep-skirted crankcase
>which provides for a really rigid block).

Well, that solves it. If there had been an emblem with something other
than the "gear 'n' bolt," then it would have had a "Y" with an "8" rather
than a "V" with an "8."
Dennis Pearson in Kennewick, WA

1962 Unibody, short box, big window--351C
1966 F250 Custom Cab, 352, 4-speed
1962 short stepside (big empty space under the hood)
I shortened this to only FT's

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home.att.net/~dlpearson/levi.htm
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 11:14:52 -0800
From: "sam weatherby"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Going to the "Recycling yards" tomorrow

Tomorrow I am going to see how many junkyards I can visit.
If any of you Washington area people want me to keep my opened for something
let me know.
-srw

Sam Weatherby http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://insert.com/sammy
SWeatherby

UsWest.Net A-SamWe

Microsoft.com
'70 Grabber Sportsroof Mustang
'93 F-150 XLT Lightning
'98 HD FXD Super Glide
'65 F100

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 11:30:46 -0800
From: Dennis Pearson
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Going to the "Recycling yards" tomorrow

Thanks for your message at 11:14 AM 3/5/99 -0800, sam weatherby. Your
message was:
>Tomorrow I am going to see how many junkyards I can visit.
>If any of you Washington area people want me to keep my opened for something
>let me know.
> -srw

Yes (eternally optimistic) I need a tailgate in perfect shape for A Unibody!

You are talking about Washington State (The Other Washington), right?

Dennis Pearson in Kennewick, WA

1962 Unibody, short box, big window--351C
1966 F250 Custom Cab, 352, 4-speed
1962 short stepside (big empty space under the hood)
I shortened this to only FT's

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home.att.net/~dlpearson/levi.htm
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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 14:29:25 -0500
From: Ted Wnorowski
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Body assembly manuals

Ken Payne wrote:
>
> At 11:49 AM 3/5/99 -0500, you wrote:
> > I'm gonna send for a catalog from Jim Osborn Reproductions, but in the
> > meantime maybe someone could help.
> > I'm looking for a Body/Interior assembly manual for '64 trucks.
> > Everywhere I look including FTE, has '61-'63 then '65 on up.
> > Any help would be appreciated.
> >
> > Ted
> > mailto:wnorowski

onebellevue.com
>
> Osborn's doesn't have them. We've got their complete truck catalog on
> the site. They've been producing new items as the blue-prints are found
> in Ford's archives. Unfortunately, Jim told me that Ford used to allow
> public access to the archives and many people "walked off" with precious
> one-of-a-kind items.
> Maybe Osborn's has a used shop manual if that will do the job - they've
> got a large collection of used manuals (I was given the grand tour by
> Jim).
>
> Ken Payne
>
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

Thanks for the info.I'll give them a call, because used would be fine. I wonder if any of the other years '61-'66 would help at all?

Ted

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 14:28:19 -0500
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Going to the "Recycling yards" tomorrow

I know I'm not in Washinton- but if you could keep an eye out for a 1970
grey plastic mesh grill insert, or two, I would be eternally grateful!!! 8-)

Tony
tony

pscico.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pscico.com/~tony

At 11:14 AM 3/5/99 -0800, you wrote:
>Tomorrow I am going to see how many junkyards I can visit.
>If any of you Washington area people want me to keep my opened for something
>let me know.
> -srw

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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 11:37:39 -0800
From: "Brzezinski, Jeff"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Going to the "Recycling yards" tomorrow

Tomorrow I am going to see how many junkyards I can visit.
If any of you Washington area people want me to keep my opened for something
let me know.
-srw

Great! Now that I know it exists, I'm looking for a horn ring, or button,
with the Gear & Thunderbolt emblem. I'd reimburse you ASAP.

Jeff
1963 F-250 Utility
Riverside, CA
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 12:54:43 -0700
From: "Miska, Richard L (Rick)"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - early parts

I sent this to the later group also because thats where it came up.

Awhile back, I helped somebody who wanted 58- 59 style panel truck parts. I
knew of a yard around here in the Denver Metro area that had three of them.
He also has many many more regular trucks of the same vintage. I took pics
for him and emailed them to him. Heres the info on the place. The note I
snipped from one of the posts this morning that brought this up was:
snip snip
Parts for these trucks can be tough to find (as I'm sure
you're aware). Everytime I start thinking how bad the aftermarket parts
availability is for my '61 Unibody, I think about the '58, '59 and '60
F100 guys! ;-) Ugh, they've got it even tougher!

This place is:

Speedway Auto Wrecking
4394 County Road 12
Erie, CO 80516-8807
Phone: 303-833-0332

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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 15:08:20 -0500
From: "PmctBaker"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - C-6 trans end shaft

hey all,

my 1978 F-250 4x4 351m/400 blew the C-6 tranny out trying to get unstuck.
im going to take the tranny out of a 1978 Lincoln Cont. 351m/400, im sure
the bellhousings are the same, but what about the end shaft? will I have to
swap them? also, which trans. oil cooler line flows toward the rad.? ive
got to flush it all out. any how to's most helpful.

thanks,

mc baker
pmbaker

your-net.com
1978 F-150 4x4 351m/400 c-6
1985 F-150 4x4 351w c-6

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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 14:38:29 -0600
From: "John MacNamara"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - C-6 trans end shaft

> -----Original Message-----
> From:PmctBaker [SMTP:Pmbaker

your-net.com]
> Sent:Friday, March 05, 1999 12:08 PM
> To:61-79-list
> Subject:FTE 61-79 - C-6 trans end shaft
>
> hey all,
>
> my 1978 F-250 4x4 351m/400 blew the C-6 tranny out trying to get unstuck.
> im going to take the tranny out of a 1978 Lincoln Cont. 351m/400, im sure
> the bellhousings are the same, but what about the end shaft? will I have
> to
> swap them?
Yes, the end shafts are a different length . Why not rebuild
existing trans.

> also, which trans. oil cooler line flows toward the rad.?
They both do.
> ive
> got to flush it all out. any how to's most helpful.
>
> thanks,
>
> mc baker
> pmbaker

your-net.com]
> Sent:Friday, March 05, 1999 12:08 PM
> To:61-79-list
> Subject:FTE 61-79 - C-6 trans end shaft
>
> hey all,
also, which trans. oil cooler line flows toward the rad.? ive
> got to flush it all out. Misunderstood your question here. The pump is
> located in the front of the trans so fluid flows out of the front line to
> the radiator.
and returns through the rear line.

> mc baker
> pmbaker

your-net.com
> 1978 F-150 4x4 351m/400 c-6
> 1985 F-150 4x4 351w c-6
>
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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 15:37:33 -0600
From: Larry Schmiedekamp
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Electrical shocks at truck body

Marty

Sounds like static to me. What kind of seat cover do you have. Could be

building from it.

At 05:39 PM 3/4/99 PST, you wrote:
>I've been following your thread about your pickups shocking you, and I
>have a question for you all. I often get a shock from mine, especially
>when I'm getting out and reach to close the door. The door gives me a
>big shock. Would that be a shorted wire, like you were saying for
>yours? It happens very regular, whether it is wet or dry out, almost
>like a big static shock. I only get one and that's it, until the next
>time I'm getting out. Any ideas? Thanks.
>
>Marty Colman
>73 F100 390
>
>______________________________________________________
> >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>

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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:04:44 -0500
From: "Campbell, Mark"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Comments.....

To all....

I have found this list to be one of THE BEST ways to find out "F-Series"
information EVER!!
From the "manual versions" to remedies that "just work", from the many
ways to use WD-40, to the sincere concern when someone in the group has
surgery. In the two weeks I have been a part of the distribution list,
questions I was going to put to the group were answered, or was given a
website in a reply that held the answer. I am thrilled to be a part of
this AWESOME GROUP even if I can only contribute a small amount. The
blood that runs through these veins are BLUE OVALS, instead of red blood
cells, I just thought I was a die hard.

Learning every day...
Be Back Monday, Have a GREAT weekend!!
Hope you're recovering well Bill....

Florida Mark
Yellow 1978 F-150 4x4 Ranger Stepside
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:03:14 -0500
From: "Phil"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Knob - Question

>>
>>Does anyone happen to know what the know on the driver's side vent control
>>for a '67 F100 looks like? I can't seem to find it listed in any of the
>>various catalogs.
>>Thanks,
>>John>

John, if you cant seem to find one anywhere, I have the vent on my 69 parts
truck that is in good shape. Not sure what it is worth but would be willing
to sell it. Let me know.

Phil Beattie
66 F100 390 C6
66 F100 (no drivetrain)
79 F250 4x4 400

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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:16:57 -0500
From: "Campbell, Mark"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Re: Electrical shocks at truck body

Building on Larry's comments...

Electrical shocks CAN be generated by the seat covers themselves, the
material that some are made from is very condusive to static, (think of
the packing styrofoam, some seat covers are made of similar stuff) thus
creating an electrical overload in your body and needing to exit
somewhere, a truck frame is as good a place as any....

c-ya!!
Florida Mark
Yellow 1978 F-150 4x4 Ranger Stepside

- -----Original Message-----
From: Larry Schmiedekamp [mailto:Larry.Schmiedekamp

angelo.edu]
Sent: Friday, March 05, 1999 4:38 PM
To: 61-79-list
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Electrical shocks at truck body

Marty

Sounds like static to me. What kind of seat cover do you have. Could be

building from it.

At 05:39 PM 3/4/99 PST, you wrote:
>I've been following your thread about your pickups shocking you, and I
>have a question for you all. I often get a shock from mine, especially

>when I'm getting out and reach to close the door. The door gives me a
>big shock. Would that be a shorted wire, like you were saying for
>yours? It happens very regular, whether it is wet or dry out, almost
>like a big static shock. I only get one and that's it, until the next
>time I'm getting out. Any ideas? Thanks.
>
>Marty Colman
>73 F100 390
>
>______________________________________________________
> >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info
http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>

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Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 14:53:09 -0800
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Stancions (sp?)

Tony Marino wrote:

> Could somebody confirm something for me real quick?
>
> 73-79 models (possibly including 67 and up)
>
> Are the 300 I-6 motor stancions the same as those used by the 360 FE's in 4
> wheel drive trucks? The naked eye tells me no. (the other eye says
> maybe) Any difference between the 4x4 models' between 1/2 and 3/4 ton?
>
> Thanks people!
>
> Tony

AFAIK they are the same or at least to darn close to tell. I have a set out
of a 77 F-150(4x4) that I am going to use to relocate my 390 in the 63. As
far as the F250, I can't help you there.

- --
Don Grossman
duckdon

pacific.net

99 Contour SE Sport
63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.

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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:52:21 -0500
From: "Ted & Sarah Freeman"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 410 stuff (kinda long)

Well Gang,

I just dropped my crank, rods, pistons, rings, flexplate, balancer snout and
all mounting hardware off at the machine shop today. I'm kind of psyched
about getting that job done. The crank is a 428, with 428 PI rods and 410
pistons from Federal Mogul. I fitted these into my new 30 over FE block
last night just to check the piston to head relationship. The piston at TDC
is almost flush with the block. I was very happy to see this. I can live
with this combination.

While at the machine shop we discussed some options with this crank that I
didn't know was an option. First thing is the Flexplate is weird. Not one
I've seen before. It has no seperate ring gear. the plate bolts on to the
end of the crank with a metal "web" (for lack of a better term) and the
plate is only about 3" high. I assume this was made for a performance
engine to save weight. The balancer that came with this crank was very
small and didn't match up with my pulley's for my accessories. The guy at
the machine shop said that the 410 and 428 were externally balanced (which I
knew), but recommended that we make it internally balanced (which I did not
know) and then I could use a standard 390 flexplate and use my old 360
balancer and pulleys (which are in excellent shape) with out worrying about
any external counter weights. To have this done will cost me an extra $50.
Sounds like a good thing to me, unless some one can tell me why it wouldn't
be a good idea to do this. All other FE's are internally balanced as far as
I know.

I have not selected a cam yet and am not sure which one I want. I want good
low end torque with the ability to pass people as needed on two lane roads.
If you guys have any info I'd like to hear it. I keep hearing about a good
RV grind. What is an RV grind as far a lift, duration and overlap go. I
have an '63 galaxie 4V intake that will be going on this motor topped by a
750cfm Edelbroke and will be using 390GT heads.

Let me know what you think!!

Thanks for reading this and sorry Ken for taking up so much space. Right
now I need the knowledge of this list to help me finish this guy.

- -Ted

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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 14:55:16 -0800
From: "Brzezinski, Jeff"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Questions About "Stock" Wheels.

These first few days in the group have been very interesting. I have some
questions about the wheels for my 1963 F-250 Utility. Right now is has old,
(ugly/sporty) after-market, tubeless, steel wheels with cast-metal centers
and peeling chrome. Eight lugs, and the tire-size is LT235/85R16.

What was Stock? Was it a horrible split-rim? I wouldn't want that. Worked
with a guy with a gimpy arm from a split-rim.

I guess my main question is: Can I get tubeless, plain-steel wheels for my
truck with the orginal dimentions? Wheels I can put a stock hubcap on? I'm
not too concerned about it being stock, as I am about it "looking" stock.

One of the group saw my photos and said my truck would look good with white
steel wheels and hubcaps. I agree! (My few "before" photos are still
available for email...)

What were the hubcaps in 1963, for an F-250? Are there NOS or repros
available?

Thanks for any and all answers.

Jeff
1963 F-250 Utility
Riverside, CA
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Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 16:11:33 -0700
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - More M-block answers

>From: "MARK DAVIES"
>Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - to the m-block devotee (dave)
>
>whats the diff between the 351m-400 besides
>stroke are the cranks diff?

Yo Mark:

The difference between a 351M and a 400 is the stroke. To achieve a different
stroke, the crankshafts have to be different. See my previous post for notes on
how to identify the crankshaft. Both engines use the same connecting rods, so
the pistons are also different and not interchangeable. All other significant
components are the same.

>i just want to wake this thing up the most i wind the
>truck up to is 5000rpm then im at the next set
>of stop lites i thought of headers,cam,carb,intake,
>and a little bit of head work which headers you
>suggest blackjack,hooker,hedman?

I know guys running both Hedman and Summit's house brand headers w/ some
success. I also know a guy running those $450 Thorley tri-Ys.

>are you saying stick with the 2v heads for the low
>end power 2000-5000 rpm

Yes.

>the manifold i have is a eldebrock if memory serves
>me its # is S.P.-2-P.400 whatver that means the top
>of it is split down the middle and open on each side

Both Edelbrock manifolds are dual plane types, which is what I think you're
describing. I don't recognize those numbers. The non-EGR manifold has the
Edelbrock logo on the #5 cylinder intake runner (front left side of the engine).
The EGR manifoold has the logo right in front of the carb flange in the center.

>on the decal on the valve cover it says
>D7TE-9C485-BUB is this #good for any id or is
>just the valve cover part # it also says non egr
> US ford heavy duty engine 1977 standards

I think the number you mentioned is an engine calibration number for a 1977
truck engine. As mentioned before, the valve cover label is not necessarily
reliable for determining the source of the engine. I am not familiar w/
Canadian emissions regulations, but I am guessing that EGR was not required on
trucks until later than it was in the US. I think on light duty trucks (up to
10K lbs GVW), EGR was required starting about 1975 in the US. Seems like I
remember seeing it on the last year or two of FE engines (which would be
1975-76).

Good luck w/ your truck.

Dave R. (M-block devotee)

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 18:05:47 -0600
From: jcarbone
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 73 - 79 hood insulation pad ??

Does anyone with a '73 - '79 F-series pick-up have an insulation pad on
the underside of the hood?

My '78 F-100's hood appears to have the correct holes and hole spacing
for a pad. I would like to install one if possible.

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:13:54 -0600
From: juredd - Justin Reddell
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Blowby (oil pressure)

Ohio Bill,

First of all I apologize for the long delay in getting back to you on this. I have not been at work but 1 full day in the last week do to some job training. I have also had some sewer problems to take care of at the home place. Was not any fun. On to the subject.

I have not tried this yet but I will try to get to it this weekend.

>2. Gas on plugs four and eight? Take the truck for a run, let it
>sit for a while (to cool. Warm plugs burn fingers), and pull each
>plug. What do they look like? If they look good, I wouldn't
>worry. If they're gassy, you're carb may be leaking down when it
>sits. Let us know.

I did a hole load of stuff that you suggested last weekend. I just went all
out and changed the oil pump, filter, and oil. I didn't not change the screen it looked very clean. Actually the whole motor looks very clean inside. How would I check to see if one of the oil drain hole is plugged up? I am by no means a grease monkey. I don't know about the main bearings but the motor was supposed to have had 5000 or less miles on when I got it (yes I know it was supposed to have been a full blown 390 too). After all this the first time I cranked it after the new stuff was put on the oil pressure shot up to around 50 psi and stayed steady. Idling with the choke on at about 1300 rpms. Once the choke kicked off it when down to around 40 psi. I drove the truck for 5 to 10 miles and the oil pressure looked really good. Stopped along the way for gas and the pressure on idle at the point was around 25 psi. On the interstate at around 2000 to 3000 rpms it was around 45 to 50 psi. All that looked good. When I drove it to work a couple of days late!
r and even now when I come off the interstate after about 20 miles of 75 mph of so and come to a stop the oil pressure drops to the bottom. I am talking rock bottom, but if I rev it up to around 1500 rpms it goes back up to around 25 psi. It idles at about 600 rpms Any ideas on this one. That seems to be my only complaint that I want to voice right now.

Thanks for all your help,
Justin

>to not rev up to 3,000 RPM (I know, I sound like a wise-guy). Let me fire
>a bunch of suggestions at ya.
>1. Change the oil and filer. I get better pressure with fresh oil.
>2. Check your oil level. Low oil level affects oil pressure and sometimes
>leads to oil starvation problems (don't ask how I know).
>3. Is your engine clean inside? If you have a lot of gunk inside, maybe
>one of your oil drain holes (on top of the head) is plugged, and oil is
>pooling in the head (thus leading to oil starvation when running at higher
>RPMS, but after a while the oil drains back down and makes you think >you....

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