61-79-list-digest Wednesday, March 3 1999 Volume 03 : Number 072



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 61-79 - Shop manual
Re: FTE 61-79 - 79 4x4 resto
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!
Re: FTE 61-79 - For Sale: '69 4v 351W heads
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!
Re: FTE 61-79 - First Post: My New 1963 F-250 Utility
Re: FTE 61-79 - Shop manual
Re: FTE 61-79 - Shop manual
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!
Re: FTE 61-79 - 79 4x4 resto
FTE 61-79 - Transfer Cases
RE: FTE 61-79 - 390 connecting rods
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!
FTE 61-79 - steering gear box 160.00
Re: FTE 61-79 - For Sale: '69 4v 351W heads
Re: FTE 61-79 - First Post: My New 1963 F-250 Utility
Re: FTE 61-79 - First Post: My New 1963 F-250 Utility
FTE 61-79 - Re: First Post: My New 1963 F-250 Utility
Re: FTE 61-79 - 390 connecting rods
FTE 61-79 - someone on this list is also from T-Bay NWO
RE: FTE 61-79 - more carb.
Re: FTE 61-79 - For Sale: '69 4v 351W heads
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re - DurasparkII into 69F100
Re: FTE 61-79 - someone on this list is also from T-Bay NWO

=======================================================================

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Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 16:07:09 -0800
From: "JM O'Neill"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Shop manual

Hi all,

I'm looking for a factory shop manual for my '78 F250 4WD.
Anyone know of a source?

Joe O'Neill

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 18:45:51 -0600
From: Stu Varner
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 79 4x4 resto

At 04:12 PM 3/2/99 -0500, you wrote:
>At 10:39 AM 3/2/99 -0700, you wrote:
>>I am starting a frame-up restoration on my 79 F150 4x4, since I have not
>>owned this truck very long I have a few questions...
>>
>>1) The front end of the truck sits a few inches lower than the back, and the
>>back has a 3 inch block between the axle and the leafsprings. Is the front
>>end low because of sag in the springs or is it just the way it came from the
>>factory new? Will new springs level the truck or do i need something else
>>
>>2) The truck has the single shock setup on the front, what is the largest
>>size tires that can be put on without any clearance problems. Will those
>>BFG 33x12.5R 15 fit?
>>
>>3) Are the left and right radius arms interchangeable?
>>
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>>
>>
>The front end is lower from the factory. I put a 2" spring lift on the
>front of mine, and now the front end sits probably 1/2" higher than the
>rear. The blocks in the rear are factory equip. too. I also run BFG
>33X12.50 15's and I have enough clearance to stick my head between the tire
>and wheel well. You should be able to run these tires without lifting your
>truck, but if you are going to replace the springs, might as well get a few
>inches out of em!

Brad,

I also put a 2 inch lift in the front of my 71 4x4 and added a 4 inch rear
block instead of the stock 3 inchers.
I will know how it sits when I get it all back together. I was worried the
rear would sit lower than the front after the new 2 inch lift so I bought
the 4 inch blocks. Got both components from Superlift and feel their stuff
is of excellent quality. Some on the list think they are crap but.......
You be the judge.


Stu
Nuke GM!
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pscico.com/stu

>
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Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 20:06:18 EST
From: JUMPINFORD aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!

In a message dated 3/2/99 4:30:53 PM Pacific Standard Time,
cannandale netpointe.com writes:


>>

Not if your runnin synthetic oil

Darrell Duggan74 F-350 "Tweety"
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Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 20:20:35 -0500
From: luxjo thecore.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - For Sale: '69 4v 351W heads

John MacNamara wrote:
>
> The intakes are 1.85 and the exhausts are 1.54 "'s.
>

The 2v valves are the same size. I have a set that I pulled off a 351W
I took out of my 69 Galaxie. It was a 2 bbl motor.

OX
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Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 19:44:24 -0500
From: "Norm or Tracie Tischer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!

There is one thing i dont understand with all of this, why dosent it smoke?
Its just dosent smoke, period, i ran it for hours in the drivway trying to
get it to, reveing and letting off, letting it sit, you could just never
see ANYTHING come out of the tail-pipes. Ive had 3 ppl watch it and they
never saw anything. Wouldnt it be smoking oif it was the rings??

I have been following this thread with interest! I would think that with
the lack of compression in one cylinder that you definatly have a prob!!
Here is my guess!! You say it uses oil quickly and yet ya see very little
or no smoke!! The first thing I would do is perform the compression test
again in that cylinder....then squirt a bunch of oil in the cylinder and
test again...If the reading goes up ya have a ring prob...If it don't I
would start looking at the heads...I have seen Big Blks hat can pull a
quart through the valve guides in 100 miles with very little smoke
evident...but this doesn't explain your compression prob!! I know ya said ya
had the heads rebuilt but I would still look at them carefully....but my
guess is ya have a broken ring land on a piston or maybe a skirt prob....the
oil in the cylinder compression test will tell the story hope this helps!
Norm

ntbdra jvlnet.com

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=231

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Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 17:53:09 -0800
From: Dennis Pearson
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - First Post: My New 1963 F-250 Utility

Thanks for your message at 03:47 PM 3/2/99 -0800, Brzezinski, Jeff. Your
message was:
> . I love the front emblem
>with the thunderbolt going through the gear.

Tell you the truth, the old 292's I've had seemed indestructable. I'd
>be very happy to learn I could mate-up a modern automatic to the existing
>292. I'm not after big power, I just want a little less work when I drive.

This must have had the engine replaced (or the hood emblem replaced). I
think the thunderbolt hood emblem was originally for 6-cylinder trucks. Am
I correct, Anyone ?


Dennis Pearson in Kennewick, WA

1962 Unibody, short box, big window--351C
1966 F250 Custom Cab, 352, 4-speed
1962 short stepside (big empty space under the hood)
I shortened this to only FT's

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home.att.net/~dlpearson/levi.htm
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Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 18:05:21 -0800
From: Tim Bowman
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Shop manual

For a source of manuals, try swap meets, auto literature dealers (do a
web search), or eBay.com.

Hope this helps, it's worked for me.

Tim Bowman
71 F100 Sport Custom
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Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 20:23:01 -0600
From: "Oscar Johnson"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Shop manual

Jim,

Are you familiar with E-Bay? I see shop manuals up for auction on there
very often. The url is: www.ebay.com. Go to miscellaneous/automotive.

Regards,
O.T. Johnson

- -----Original Message-----
From: JM O'Neill
To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Tuesday, March 02, 1999 6:16 PM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Shop manual


>Hi all,
>
>I'm looking for a factory shop manual for my '78 F250 4WD.
>Anyone know of a source?
>
>Joe O'Neill
>
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>

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 22:00:06 -0500
From: Brad Smith
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!

You have definately got something unique here... May not be smoking, or
burning oil until you put a load on it... Have you driven it anymore since
the incident? Do you have Cats? they may be aiding in preventing the
smoke.
This may be completely crazy, but see what you think... Maybe you have an
intake valve not seating completely, and the oil lubricating the top end of
the engine is seeping through it, mixing with enough gas so you don't see
the burning oil, and seating enough to keep it from running bad. Big
blocks are notorious for breaking valve springs, but mine ran like crap
when I broke a valve spring. Maybe you've got a broken spring, or
partially broken spring. If you check for this check carefully, because it
can be hard to see if it is broken if it isn't in real bad shape. Even
when it felt like my truck was about to fall apart, the broken valve spring
wasn't obvious... I hope for your sake this is the prob, and that would
cause a loss of compression too... Pull the valve covers and get to
checking... Good luck!

The two best times to go fishing are when it is raining, and when it is
not...
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 22:03:16 -0500
From: Brad Smith
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 79 4x4 resto

At 06:45 PM 3/2/99 -0600, you wrote:
>At 04:12 PM 3/2/99 -0500, you wrote:
>>At 10:39 AM 3/2/99 -0700, you wrote:
>>>I am starting a frame-up restoration on my 79 F150 4x4, since I have not
>>>owned this truck very long I have a few questions...
>>>
>>>1) The front end of the truck sits a few inches lower than the back, and
the
>>>back has a 3 inch block between the axle and the leafsprings. Is the front
>>>end low because of sag in the springs or is it just the way it came from
the
>>>factory new? Will new springs level the truck or do i need something else
>>>
>>>2) The truck has the single shock setup on the front, what is the largest
>>>size tires that can be put on without any clearance problems. Will those
>>>BFG 33x12.5R 15 fit?
>>>
>>>3) Are the left and right radius arms interchangeable?
>>>
>>>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>>>
>>>
>>The front end is lower from the factory. I put a 2" spring lift on the
>>front of mine, and now the front end sits probably 1/2" higher than the
>>rear. The blocks in the rear are factory equip. too. I also run BFG
>>33X12.50 15's and I have enough clearance to stick my head between the tire
>>and wheel well. You should be able to run these tires without lifting your
>>truck, but if you are going to replace the springs, might as well get a few
>>inches out of em!
>
>Brad,
>
>I also put a 2 inch lift in the front of my 71 4x4 and added a 4 inch rear
>block instead of the stock 3 inchers.
>I will know how it sits when I get it all back together. I was worried the
>rear would sit lower than the front after the new 2 inch lift so I bought
>the 4 inch blocks. Got both components from Superlift and feel their stuff
>is of excellent quality. Some on the list think they are crap but.......
>You be the judge.
>
>
>Stu
>Nuke GM!
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pscico.com/stu
>
>>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>
Yeah, the two inch lift in the front does make the rear sit slightly lower
than the front, but I kinda like it. I actually got my springs off of a
jacked up bronco in the junk yard, so I can't tell ya who makes a better
lift kit. As for the rear, who cares, its just a chunk of metal! You
should be sitting about level or slightly higher in the rear when you get
it back together...
Brad
78 F150 4X4 429
The two best times to go fishing are when it is raining, and when it is
not...
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 22:19:38 -0500
From: Brad Smith
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Transfer Cases

Has anyone ever attempted to rebuild a NP 203 Transfer case? Do they make
a bearing/seal/gasket kit for the rebuild? How long to actually do the
rebuild... I've had the T-case out before so I know how long R&R takes, but
some rebuild info would be nice... Thanks!
Brad - 78 F150 4X4 429
The two best times to go fishing are when it is raining, and when it is
not...
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Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 20:40:37 -0700
From: johnmicki oldwest.net (John Rollf)
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - 390 connecting rods

The crank, rods, and pistons are different between a 360 and a 390. I ran
across this when I was re-building my 360 on a budget and was looking into
what all would have to change to make it a 390.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-61-79-list ford-trucks.com
> [mailto:owner-61-79-list ford-trucks.com]On Behalf Of My427Stang aol.com
> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 1999 3:16 PM
> To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
> Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 390 connecting rods
>
>
> As far as I thought, the 360 rods should be the same, its a pin
> height issue,
> so its the piston thats different. I havent looked at a book, but
> I am pretty
> sure the rods are the same. If you come up short though, fire me
> an email, I
> have a guy interested in a set of 390GT/428 rods, but if doesnt buy them I
> have a used set
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>

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 22:42:55 -0500
From: cannandale netpointe.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!

im not though... just regular oil, was plaining to go synthetic with my
next oil change, but I havent gotton that far...

cannandale


At 08:27 PM 3/2/99 -0500, you wrote:
>
>In a message dated 3/2/99 4:30:53 PM Pacific Standard Time,
>cannandale netpointe.com writes:
>
>
> >>
>
>Not if your runnin synthetic oil
>
>Darrell Duggan74 F-350 "Tweety"
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>


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Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 22:55:12 -0500
From: cannandale netpointe.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 - Big ProBlems!

Well, im going to get a diffrent compression tester tmrow because i noticed
that today just looking at it that the needle was stuck, so i'll find my
mac tester and check it out tmrow. Another question, when I noticed it was
about 3 quarts low, the temp of the engine would never raise above 120, and
yet it seemed like the thermostat opened, because the upper hose was warm.
I know the water was cool and that it just wasnt the guage because i dipped
a rag down in the water and felt it, just lukewarm. After dumping the oil
in, i noticed the temp went up to around 180, after idleing about 15 mins.
Shouldnt it be at the normal temp by then? It usally runs around 195-200
according to the outside temp. My only guess of what it could be is the
thermostat, but that dosent explain the temp going back up after putting
oil in. Its a mystery..

Another thing I noticed today was I pulled off the hose running from the
PCV to the carb base (edlebrock), and the hose had some oil in it. Is this
blow-by? If you pull out the pcv, you see little puffs like smoke, not
much but a little. A friend said that was blow-by, but im not so sure,
even newer cars have a little steam coming out of the engine. And dosent
blow-by usally pop up the dipstick? I dont guess there is any test to
prove if you have blow-by or not? oh well.. :)

cannandale
'78 F250 4x4, 460

At 08:57 PM 3/2/99 -0500, you wrote:
>
>There is one thing i dont understand with all of this, why dosent it smoke?
>Its just dosent smoke, period, i ran it for hours in the drivway trying to
>get it to, reveing and letting off, letting it sit, you could just never
>see ANYTHING come out of the tail-pipes. Ive had 3 ppl watch it and they
>never saw anything. Wouldnt it be smoking oif it was the rings??
>
>I have been following this thread with interest! I would think that with
>the lack of compression in one cylinder that you definatly have a prob!!
>Here is my guess!! You say it uses oil quickly and yet ya see very little
>or no smoke!! The first thing I would do is perform the compression test
>again in that cylinder....then squirt a bunch of oil in the cylinder and
>test again...If the reading goes up ya have a ring prob...If it don't I
>would start looking at the heads...I have seen Big Blks hat can pull a
>quart through the valve guides in 100 miles with very little smoke
>evident...but this doesn't explain your compression prob!! I know ya said ya
>had the heads rebuilt but I would still look at them carefully....but my
>guess is ya have a broken ring land on a piston or maybe a skirt prob....the
>oil in the cylinder compression test will tell the story hope this helps!
>Norm
>
>ntbdra jvlnet.com
>
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=231
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>


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Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 22:38:50 -0600
From: "don"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - steering gear box 160.00

I keep seeing help wanted on steering gearboxes. I went to AutoZone and
bought one for my 79 F-150 for 160.00. It was also even in stock........

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Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 00:26:57 EST
From: JJJJJGRANT aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - For Sale: '69 4v 351W heads

i've always been told there is a difference, but i don't think so i have seen
both 2v and 4v heads for 69, they both have casting #c9oe, and i think the
70's are the same D00E, of course i've never checked valve sizes, port sizes
etc,
maybe someone else has more input.
jeff grant
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Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 00:54:51 -0500
From: Ted Wnorowski
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - First Post: My New 1963 F-250 Utility

Dennis Pearson wrote:
>

I
> think the thunderbolt hood emblem was originally for 6-cylinder trucks. Am
> I correct, Anyone ?
>
I thought the same thing, my '64 250 originally had the 292 in it.
It has the ring gear and lightening bolt on it. I guess the '61-'66 emblem was used on '61-'64 6-cylinders and V-8's. It wasn't until '65 that V-8 trucks actually had a V-8 on the emblem.

Ted Wnorowski
Bellevue,OH
88 1/2 Escort GT
'64 F-250

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Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 01:05:26 -0500
From: Ted Wnorowski
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - First Post: My New 1963 F-250 Utility

>
> What mounts are available? Are there "kits" to help with these conversions?
> What are the usual engine/trans combinations being put into Fords from the
> early 60's? Have articles been written about this? Anything about parts and
> sources would be valuable.
>
Obsolete Ford Parts Company in Nashville ,GA has a few different kits in the back of their catalog. I've never dealt with them yet, so I can't help you with that. Their # is 800-933-6731.

Ted

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Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 23:06:38 -0800
From: Art Verling
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: First Post: My New 1963 F-250 Utility

Jeff,
I would recommend the following company. They have a great catalog for $7.00 and it is
worth every penny. They have motor mount kits in every size and shape. Even to mount a
Ch**y motor in you truck.....Ack
Anyway here is the link to their page.

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.vintage-ford.com/default.htm

Have Fun,
Art Verling
64 F100 in Reno

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Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 23:22:54 -0800
From: Art Verling
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 390 connecting rods

I just finished a 360 rebuild and the nice machinist told me that the rods and the crank
were different for a 390 that was after he told me that I only had a 360 and not a 390...

Art Verling
64 F100 in Reno

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Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 02:38:11 +0000
From: "MARK DAVIES"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - someone on this list is also from T-Bay NWO

I live in T-bay also email me or give me a shout 623 5229 would like
to shoot the s#*t on fords... mdavie flash.lakeheadu.ca
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Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 01:54:52 +0000
From: "MARK DAVIES"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - more carb.

I have a 77 f150 351m400 and run a eldebrock intake and a 4160
holley 600 cfm vac secondaries the truck runs excellent with this
setup. ive played with many other carbs on different vehicles
,eldebrock,autlite,motorcraft,holley i think each carb has its own
plus minus from the next holley makes a goodd carb if you know how to
tune it and that is pretty simple with a little reading and a
trial/error period HP BOOKS has a good book on Holley carbs called
holley carbs,manifolds,and fuel injection for $17 us$22cdn it taught
me alot and is well worth it after a few days of studying i rebuilt 2
holleys and tuned them in three days the biggest thing is to keep
your parts a little organized and rebuild it in a couple sections i
actually had fun rebuilding a holley and i myself dont like
rebuilding carbs. the book # 1052 its by Mike Urich &Bill Fisher hope
this helps...I just painted my truck dark metallic blue man does it
shine i look at it and its FordGasm time...
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Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 01:58:51 +0000
From: "MARK DAVIES"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - For Sale: '69 4v 351W heads

would these heds work on a 351m400 block i know its been talked about
in the last little while but i cant rem what was said
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Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 03:51:52 EST
From: My427Stang aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re - DurasparkII into 69F100

I'll buy that.......more effort than I would have done for a stranger .
Later, I stand corrected - Ross
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Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 04:36:38 -0500
From: "terry love"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - someone on this list is also from T-Bay NWO....


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