RE: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!

61-79-list-digest Wednesday, May 26 1999 Volume 03 : Number 179

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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

RE: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!
RE: FTE 61-79 - '66 F-100 project
Re: FTE 61-79 - cab mounts
Re: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!
Re: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!/Stuck distributor
FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange
FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...
FTE 61-79 - Re:Hot start
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re:Hot start
Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange
RE: FTE 61-79 - '66 F-100 project
FTE 61-79 - Re: What do you think? '77 F-150 I need to sell?
FTE 61-79 - F-100 body style
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re:Hot start
RE: FTE 61-79 - Re:Hot start
Re: FTE 61-79 - 2 in 1: radiator and distributor
Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange
Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange
Re: FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...
FTE 61-79 - body parts...
FTE 61-79 - Stuck Dist
Re: FTE 61-79 - Stuck Dist
FTE 61-79 - RE: Radiator/Fan Question
Re: FTE 61-79 - Trouble lights ...
FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...
Re: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!
FTE 61-79 - Vehicle Appraisal
Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange
Re: FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...
Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange
Re: FTE 61-79 - Stuck Dist
FTE 61-79 - more radiator notes
FTE 61-79 - VIN decoders
Re: FTE 61-79 - VIN decoders
FTE 61-79 -
FTE 61-79 - glass polish
FTE 61-79 - 65 F100 near SLC, Utah
FTE 61-79 - intake runners
Re: FTE 61-79 - more radiator notes
Re: FTE 61-79 - VIN decoders
FTE 61-79 - Advice on king pin installation wanted
Re: FTE 61-79 - RE: Radiator/Fan Question
Re: FTE 61-79 - VIN decoders
Re: FTE 61-79 - What do you think? '77 F-150 I need to sell...
FTE 61-79 - Box interchanges
Re: FTE 61-79 - Hot start
FTE 61-79 - Rebuilding a 9" ...Part 1

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 07:19:13 -0400
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!

Gang, buy a large bottle of ....... Permatex Anti-Seize, grey in color and
put it on everything that you want to be able to take off again or move and
you will never have this problem again as long as you live !!!

Getting it out initially is a whole nuther smoke ##$^%^%$#

. I've broken
several dizzys myself in my haste but generally, if you have the patience
you can work them loose without damage. The housing goes into the block in
a hole with about 1.5" wall depth so there is a lot of aluminum mated to a
lot of iron which is never a good thing. Anti-seize puts a protective
coating between them preventing "electrolisis" which is a chemical reaction
between the two dissimilar metals which is what makes them stick.

Try tapping vertically on the base to jar it loose (not on the shaft) and as
close to the block as you can get a punch. You should use as wide a punch
as you can fit in there to distribute the load. You can also try punching
at a slight angle to force it to turn as you jar it loose etc.. Do not
attempt to use large pliers on the upper part to loosen it because it will
just twist it off at the base.......don't ask :-(

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> i had that problem on my 460, but i just started putting a
> little greese
> where it toches the block and have never had a problem since..
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 07:35:12 -0400
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - '66 F-100 project

Beveling the intake ports is not a good idea, especially if you have good
heads, that is "the" good ones like 68-70 460's etc.. If there is a large
difference you will be better off with smaller runners which match the ports
and smaller runners work much better for truck applications anyway at lower
rpms.

If your plan is to have a real screamer and low end torque is not an issue
then I would wait for a set of Hypo heads and do it right. The large
runners, funneled into small ports will actually be the reverse of what you
want for good economy and performance even if you can exactly match the
ports and manifold.

For best results on the street I recommend:

1..Hot cross over manifold, left open to gain the hot spot in the plenum
2..Hot air intake flapper in the intake snout, hooked up and operating
3..Small runner, dual plane intake manifold matched to the heads
4..Spread bore carb with proper fitting adapter or manifold
5..Large fuel lines with regulator capable of supplying sufficient volume or
run two, parallel regulators to ensure enough volume on big blocks.

If economy and low speed throttle response are not an issue then.......but
don't mismatch the intake and heads :-)

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> Thanx for the info on the manifold and carb. I think I will
> opt to use
> the Q-jet w/ an adaptor, for ecomical reasons if nothing else.
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 04:59:21 -0700
From: John Lord
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - cab mounts

I bought my crew cab and it had one of those sheet metal crappy covers..
I took a 5" wide 1/4" thick bit of plate steel and bent it into an "L"
shape, reinforced the bend and bolted it to my firewall above the
factory seam/lip (i ground out a bit of the lip) and it works great i
offroad all the time with no problem. I covered both sides with a cut
out floor mat to keep the crap off the mounts.

Keep an eye on your steering columb it will wear and snap at the base of
the firewall where it comes out of it's housing and if you have power
steering it will cause the input shaft seals to fail if the mount has
been gone for a while.

"J. Doss Halsey" wrote:
>
> >Anyone have any experience replacing body mounts? The front ones are
> >rusted through and the back ones have no bolts (and are rusty).
>
> I am in the cab mount quandry myself. I have bought after-market cab
> mounts, (the large piece of sheet metal which entombs the whole mess) but I
> do not want to use them. It just seems like a bad idea. I am looking for a
> used set that I can dress to the original flange and weld them to my
> original flange. I'll keep you posted.
>
> >Kinda
> >creepy; I wonder if a minor frontal collison would cause me and the cab
> >to sail forthwith, Warner Bros-like.
>
> Seems to me that the most important parts of an old truck are the brakes
> and all the components which keep you attached to the brakes.
>
> Doss Halsey
> '68 F250 Camper Special
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:24:06 -0400
From: James Oxley
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!

>
> Any suggestions ? I've tried the standard pry it
> with a screwdriver, BIG screwdriver, little pry bar,
> wrecking bar, and little pry bar with a big pipe on it.
> The hold-down that I could find is out and lying loose
> on the intake manifold, so I know thats not what
> wants to keep it in there ... what else can there be ?
>
>
>

I don't know, but I feel your pain. The 79 Bronc I just got is in the
same boat. Can't adjust the timing or get the distr out. Luckily, it
runs, but 4 degrees timing bites.

OX
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:37:29 EDT
From: TBeeee

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!/Stuck distributor

I have had success on this problem by thoroughly cleaning out all of
the crud I could from around the distributor mounting area. I then use
judicious amount of kerosene (or your favorite penatrating lube). I find it
works best if you have the time to allow it to soak down in over the course
of days or weeks. All of the other techniques posted by that
pot-hole-jumping- bronco guy rings true. Patience is the key.

Stock Man
1967 Galaxie 500 Convertible
1967 F-250 FE 390 4wd
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.aol.com/tbeeee/page/index.htm
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:50:46 -0400
From: "HARLEY A PUTNAM"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange

Hi folks, just a quick question...I have a 1973 429 engine, and was
wondering which motors were candidates for getting a duraspark distributor
so that I can convert this critter to electronic ignition. Any help
appreciated!

The Dirtyman

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:54:31 -0400
From: Rob Long
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...

I recently bought a 78 F250 and to my surprise (sarcasm), my front
bearings are loose! I'm not sure if they just need repacked or if they
need replaced. Does anyone have any suggestions whether I should just
replace them or try repacking them? When I do work on them, replaced or
repacked, is there anything else I should do while I have that area torn
apart?? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Rob
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Campus/4249

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:17:06 -0500
From: Don Yerhot
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re:Hot start

Problem as in the engine is hard to turn over? Timing could be advanced
to far. If it cranks easy but takes awhile to fire up, you may have heat
soak problems. The gas boils in the carb and overflows into the intake.
You'll probably be able to smell gas if this is the problem. I cured it
by putting a .5" plastic spacer under the carb. If I remember correctly,
it was made by Felpro and had a Ford PN# on it.
Good Luck!

DonY
65 F250-351W
74 F100-351W

Have had this with GMs amd AMCs in the past but not Fords. Starter or
selenoid,whats your guess?>>

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:34:45 -0500
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re:Hot start

\>Problem as in the engine is hard to turn over? Timing could be advanced
>to far. If it cranks easy but takes awhile to fire up, you may have heat
>soak problems. The gas boils in the carb and overflows into the intake.
>You'll probably be able to smell gas if this is the problem. I cured it
>by putting a .5" plastic spacer under the carb. If I remember correctly,
>it was made by Felpro and had a Ford PN# on it.
>
>
>
>Have had this with GMs amd AMCs in the past but not Fords. Starter or
>selenoid,whats your guess?>>
>

The questions above are valid ... failing that, then a solenoid is $2-$5
while a starter is probably a bit more than that ... where's your solenoid
located at ? Seems like someone sais there were Fords with 2 solenoids,
one on the starter and one on the inner fender ... if you have that
arrangment, I'd start with the one on the starter ... I would think the
starter would sound weakish on cold starts as well if it was really the
problem ...

Just my 2cents

wish

Links http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/links.html
'73 1/2 ton 4x4 Ford http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/truck.html
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:35:30 -0500
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange

>Hi folks, just a quick question...I have a 1973 429 engine, and was
>wondering which motors were candidates for getting a duraspark distributor
>so that I can convert this critter to electronic ignition. Any help
>appreciated!
>

Seems to me that any of the M block series, along with the 460's all use
the same dist. Though there may have been a changeover year where the deck
height was different, I think that was 71 ... Dave ?

Just my 2cents

wish

Links http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/links.html
'73 1/2 ton 4x4 Ford http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/truck.html
'96 Mustang GT http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/mustang.html
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:44:11 -0500
From: William S Hart
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - '66 F-100 project

>Beveling the intake ports is not a good idea, especially if you have good
>heads, that is "the" good ones like 68-70 460's etc..

If we had those we wouldn't have that problem, we'd have the problem of
them not fitting the motor, seems like we're talking about 390's here ...
the heads I would bet are probably D2TE ? That's what mine were ... the
same as all the 360's/390's from 72 thru 76 ... if there was ever a head
that was easy to find around here for that motor, I'm sure that would be it
...

Also my machinist talked about matching the gaskets at least if the
difference was too much ... he seemed to think that would fix things up
pretty well, and he's done this for a couple of years so I have some faith
in him ...

>For best results on the street I recommend:
>
>1..Hot cross over manifold, left open to gain the hot spot in the plenum
>2..Hot air intake flapper in the intake snout, hooked up and operating
>3..Small runner, dual plane intake manifold matched to the heads
>4..Spread bore carb with proper fitting adapter or manifold
>5..Large fuel lines with regulator capable of supplying sufficient volume or
>run two, parallel regulators to ensure enough volume on big blocks.
>

you Michigan people thinkin its cold all year 'round ... :) Just kidding,
but this works well in the winter, unfortunately doesn't do much but
restrict intake charges in the summer ... I think most motors can breathe
better than the 4x3 or whateversize hole it is in the snorkel ... I just
cut over to an open element and man I can't believe the difference, the
carb is so much happier now ... poke the throttle and she just opens up and
goes ... I heard a weird roar the other day when I did that ... first time
I've heard the secondaries on it open!

Also I'm wondering in a previous post you said that the opening to a large
expanse would increase the pressure and decrease the velocity, which of
course is true, but counter intuitive, I always forget that. :) Anyway
isn't it velocity that you want to keep up ? so you get better filling of
the cylinder ?

hmmm....may have to re think those edelbrock heads ...

Just my 2cents

wish

Links http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/links.html
'73 1/2 ton 4x4 Ford http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/truck.html
'96 Mustang GT http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/mustang.html
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 07:22:40 PDT
From: "MARTY COLMAN"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: What do you think? '77 F-150 I need to sell?

Adam -

That is a very nice looking pickup! I wish mine was in that good of shape.
If I didn't already have one, I would gladly drive half way across the
country for that. You just can't get old Fords in that kind of shape around
here (South Dakota). Most are beat up from spending their life in farm
duty. Too bad that you have to sell it. Drive it as much as you can now,
because no one can pass up a pickup like that and not think twice about
owning it!

Marty

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 10:26:38 EDT
From: REvans8341

aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - F-100 body style

My 72 F-100 has a placard on either side of the rear fenders that says
it's an "Explorer" model. In all the literature I've read on this, I've
never seen an Explorer model listed for this year's truck. My question to
the group is this: Do I have a regular Custom body truck, or do I need to be
aware that there may be some parts that won't fit an "Explorer" package, and
if this was a special package, what is different from the regular old
"Custom" model.......Thanks to all in advance.....Bob
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 10:35:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Ford76

webtv.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re:Hot start

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Unplug coil wire and turn engine over if it turns over faster its
advance. If it starts every time leave it alone it will go faster. I
would suspect voltage drop first, clean all the connections after that I
would go for the starter.

Julia

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Problem as in the engine is hard to turn over? Timing could be advanced
to far. If it cranks easy but takes awhile to fire up, you may have heat
soak problems. The gas boils in the carb and overflows into the intake.
You'll probably be able to smell gas if this is the problem. I cured it
by putting a .5" plastic spacer under the carb. If I remember correctly,
it was made by Felpro and had a Ford PN# on it.
Good Luck!

DonY
65 F250-351W
74 F100-351W

Have had this with GMs amd AMCs in the past but not Fords. Starter or
selenoid,whats your guess?>>

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 10:45:23 -0400
From: "Peters, Gary (G.R.)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Re:Hot start

The "4 pole" starter of yesteryear has a selenoid on the starter but the
energize lug is shunted to the main, high current lug so that you can just
run the one big wire to it from the "start relay" which is the selenoid most
think of when fords are mentioned.

There is a distinction in torque output between the "3 pole" and "4 pole"
due to the floating field core (pole) on the 3 pole (which is why it is
called that). They are both positive engagement starters but one is engaged
by pulling down a moveable pole and the other is engaged like Ch**ys by
moving the drive via the selenoid. The latter has 4 solid poles so
tolerances are maintained better and the 4th pole doesn't vibrate in
operation so it is able to make more torque.

You should be using the selenoid type on 460's and even the 351M/400 to
prevent early retirement of the starter due to melt down. They are
interchangeable as long as you get the correct housing bolt pattern (335 and
385 are the same). I understand some FE's have shims to correct the gear
alignement but AFAIK, the newer engine types, 335 and 385 series don't have
this problem.

- --
Michigan, Pot Hole Jumping,
78 Bronco, Gary
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.thewowfactor.com/bigbroncos/detail.cfm?detailid=167
- --

> located at ? Seems like someone sais there were Fords with 2
> solenoids,
> one on the starter and one on the inner fender ...
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 07:59:15 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 2 in 1: radiator and distributor

Don't forget 351Cs, 351Ms, 429s and 460s all take the same dist.

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets"

- -----Original Message-----
From: George W. Selby, III
To: '61-79-list

ford-trucks.com'
Date: Tuesday, May 25, 1999 11:37 PM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 2 in 1: radiator and distributor

>Going to Richmond
>today to my friendly cheap junkyard, and will be taking every 400M type
>distributor and set of locking hubs I see in there. I'll post if get two
>good ones (hell, I'll post if I can get 1 good one for me, I'll be so happy
>to get my truck running again)

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 09:10:36 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange

>Hi folks, just a quick question...I have a
>1973 429 engine, and was wondering which
>motors were candidates for getting a
>duraspark distributor so that I can convert
>this critter to electronic ignition. Any help
>appreciated!

Yo Harley:

You can use a DuraSpark II distributor from any later model 351M, 400, or 460.
They are all the same housing. I think you can just switch the centrifugal
advance springs and weights you have in your existing distributor for the parts
in the DS distributor, and then you'd keep your existing advance curve.

As for deck height, that would have no effect on the distributor, since the
distributor mounts on the top of the block in front of the intake manifold, not
on the deck (which is where the cylinder head sits). There are 3 different
deck heights (that I know of) for the 385 series big blocks, and they all use
the same distributor. The M-block has about 1.1" taller deck height than the
351C, and they use the same distributor. (351C distributors were all
points-type, though.)

Speaking of the trouble removing the distributor from an M-block, the first time
I set timing on my truck, the distributor was frozen solid in the block. I used
liberal amounts of WD40 to penetrate for several days, then I finally got a pipe
wrench on the "tube" part below the base plate and turned it loose. Only
damage was the scars on the tube from the wrench teeth.

The reason this is such a common problem is that the aluminum alloy in the
distributor housing likes to trade electrons w/ the cast iron cylinder block.
Take Gary's advice and use anti-seize (when you finally get it loose).

Dave R (M-block devotee)

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:17:20 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange

335 series (Ms), 385 (429/460) and C(leveland) dist. all interchange. Look
for something from the late 70s or early 80s.

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets"

- -----Original Message-----
From: HARLEY A PUTNAM
To: ford truck list
Date: Wednesday, May 26, 1999 5:52 AM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange

>Hi folks, just a quick question...I have a 1973 429 engine, and was
>wondering which motors were candidates for getting a duraspark distributor
>so that I can convert this critter to electronic ignition. Any help
>appreciated!

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:18:06 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...

2X or 4X?

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets"

- -----Original Message-----
From: Rob Long
To: 61-79-list

ford-trucks.com
Date: Wednesday, May 26, 1999 5:57 AM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...

>I recently bought a 78 F250 and to my surprise (sarcasm), my front
>bearings are loose! I'm not sure if they just need repacked or if they
>need replaced. Does anyone have any suggestions whether I should just
>replace them or try repacking them? When I do work on them, replaced or
>repacked, is there anything else I should do while I have that area torn
>apart?? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 10:28:28 -0500
From: "Corey Johnson"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - body parts...

anyone have the left front fender or left door for a '66 F100 that they
want to part with... Getting ready to get my truck painted and thinking
it might be cheaper to replace body parts than have body work done,

Corey

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 11:58:24 -0400
From: am14

daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Stuck Dist

Serian writes: >>
Ok ... I have a 351M with a bad DuraSpark II,
distributor in it, and I went to change it today ...
no luck, as it won't come out !?!?!

Been there - Done that.

>>I removed the usual little 1/2" bolt and hold
down wedge, but the dirty lil bugger still holds
on to that block like there's no tomorrow.
Is there something else other than the usual
distributor hold-down bolt'n'wedge similar to
that which is found on W-blocks ?

Nope! - salt spray - aluminum housing - cast irom block. All these make for
corrosion and corrosion makes for self welding.

>>No point in tellin me to just change the individual
piece that is bad, as in the process of pulling on
it to get it out, I busted the whole works all to
crap, and so now my original plan of changing out
the whole unit is a must :-P

I understand.

>>Any suggestions ? I've tried the standard pry it
with a screwdriver, BIG screwdriver, little pry bar,
wrecking bar, and little pry bar with a big pipe on it.
The hold-down that I could find is out and lying loose
on the intake manifold, so I know thats not what
wants to keep it in there ... what else can there be ?

I removed one of mine with a cold chisel and hammer around the base. Tried
everything you've mentioned plus lots of penetrating fluids to no avail. The
temper took over, and I broke it to pieces. It finally broke loose. Went into
the trash can immediately.

Good luck.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 10:42:30 -0600
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Stuck Dist

>
>>>Any suggestions ? I've tried the standard pry it
>with a screwdriver, BIG screwdriver, little pry bar,
>wrecking bar, and little pry bar with a big pipe on it.
>The hold-down that I could find is out and lying loose
>on the intake manifold, so I know thats not what
>wants to keep it in there ... what else can there be ?
>
>I removed one of mine with a cold chisel and hammer around the base. Tried
>everything you've mentioned plus lots of penetrating fluids to no avail. The
>temper took over, and I broke it to pieces. It finally broke loose. Went
into
>the trash can immediately.
>
>Good luck.
>
>Azie
>Ardmore, Al.
>

There is, sometimes, another way. Really. It helps to first use some
penetrating oil at the base, and to tap the distributor back and forth
(like you would if you were adjusting the timing) using a good heavy object
like a 5 lb. huey (mini sledge) or the flat part of an axe. Once you get it
turning, you know it's free to pull out, and if it's still being a pain, do
the following:

What you do is hit (i.e. spray, not the kind of hitting Azie suggests!) it
with a fire extinguisher. Just the distributor if you can help it. This
makes the distributor shrink away from the intake as it gets quite cold
from the fire extinguisher spray (use the dry ice kind).

Then, WEARING SOME GLOVES, try to pull it out. Try not to hammer on it too
much when it is cold like this because the aluminum gets quite brittle when
cooled.

marko :^]

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 12:55:00 -0400
From: "Parsons, Raymond"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - RE: Radiator/Fan Question

>>> Have you got an address and phone number for these people?>
> Thanks,
>> -Ted
............
>>The page at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.godan.com/home.html

Go Dan Industries
5000 Clarkson St #C
Denver, CO 80216
303-295-0944

I have dealt with them in the past and have never had a problem.
Ray
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 12:58:19 EDT
From: SHill48337

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Trouble lights ...

Just to add to info. I bought a case of 24 long life bulbs from Harbor
Freight Catalog a couple of years ago for $16.00. Some times they are on
sale for less. I use them in my trouble lights and they do take abuse. My
supply should last a few more years.
Burt Hill Kennewick WA 1972 F-250 4x4 460
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 12:59:14 EDT
From: Lion5859

aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...

Hey Rob,

Through my experience as a mechanic, first of all check the bearing to makle
sure they aren't damaged in any way. 2.) If they aren't, then go ahead and
just repack them, usually they have a long life depending upon driving
conditions and all. But if the bewaring case looks worn or cracke in any
way, then you should replace them without fail....I've done a lot of bearings
front and back during my career while doing brake jobs....if you have anymore
questions on this or anything, please feel free to ask me. Hope this helped
on some way to you, happy motoring buddy.

Maurice
Lion5859

aol.com
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 13:27:19 EDT
From: SHill48337

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - it wont let go of my M-block !!!

My observation and experience with the FE engines is I have found a hard gunk
build up on the distributor housing below the hole in the manifold (good
reason to frequently change oil). I could get them to turn but not pull out.
I have had some that would not rotate and found they had corrosion in upper
part of the bore, penetrating oil helps loosen. Someone mentioned the
Snap-On slide hammer, (got this in the mid 70s) I have used this with great
success (in other words no broken distributors). Prior to the slide hammer I
broke my share of distributor housings.
Burt Hill Kennewick WA 1972 F-250 4x4 460
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 12:27:08 -0500
From: "John LaGrone"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Vehicle Appraisal

>> Several people mentioned getting appraisals on their trucks. My
question is, who do you take it to for an accurate appraisal?
Are there people who do this as a buisness? How much does it
cost?

Mark in Southwest Washington

A reputable used car dealer. Now there is an oxymoron. An insurance company
will pay as the totalled value what a used car dealer can replace the
vehicle for, not what you can replace it for. There are no provisions for
intrinsic value. It is just an old piece of iron as far as they are
concerned. In my case there are lots of 79 F150s similar to mine for $1000
to $1500. It doesn't matter what you have invested, that's all they will
pay. The exception is if you have it Scheduled. This means that you pay an
extra premium and have it listed by VIN in the rider. In this case you would
need a recent certified appraisal from someone knowlegable about the value
of a truck like yours. I would expect to pay at least $100 and possibly as
much as $500 for such an appraisal. In a lot of big cities there are dealers
who specialize in particular cars. We have a dealer in the next town who
specializes in Mustangs. He would be a good source for a reliable appraisal.
In another town down the interstate a bit is a Corvette specialty dealer. I
think you get the picture.

You can get an appraisal from any car dealer at no charge. Make like you are
going to trade on a used car and then tell them you need to talk real money,
not padded figures for the finance company.

Bottom line when you are dealing with insurance companies: as long as you
are paying and they are not, you are a valued customer. When it comes time
to collect on your own policy, they haven't a clue about what planet you are
from.

- -- John
jlagrone

ford-trucks.com
1979 F150 Custom LWB Regular Cab 351M C6 (Henry)
http//www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
Dearborn iron rules!!!!

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 11:49:28 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange

Posted this earlier, but it didn't go through, so I apologize if it hits the
list twice.

>Hi folks, just a quick question...I have a
>1973 429 engine, and was wondering which
>motors were candidates for getting a
>duraspark distributor so that I can convert
>this critter to electronic ignition. Any help
>appreciated!

Yo Harley:

You can use a DuraSpark II distributor from any later model 351M, 400, or 460.
They are all the same housing. I think you can just switch the centrifugal
advance springs and weights you have in your existing distributor for the parts
in the DS distributor, and then you'd keep your existing advance curve.

As for deck height, that would have no effect on the distributor, since the
distributor mounts on the top of the block in front of the intake manifold, not
on the deck (which is where the cylinder head sits). There are 3 different
deck heights (that I know of) for the 385 series big blocks, and they all use
the same distributor. The M-block has about 1.1" taller deck height than the
351C, and they use the same distributor. (351C distributors were all
points-type, though.)

Speaking of the trouble removing the distributor from an M-block, the first time
I set timing on my truck, the distributor was frozen solid in the block. I used
liberal amounts of WD40 to penetrate for several days, then I finally got a pipe
wrench on the "tube" part below the base plate and turned it loose. Only
damage was the scars on the tube from the wrench teeth.

The reason this is such a common problem is that the aluminum alloy in the
distributor housing likes to trade electrons w/ the cast iron cylinder block.
Take Gary's advice and use anti-seize (when you finally get it loose).

Dave R (M-block devotee)

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 13:53:39 EDT
From: SHill48337

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Front bearings...

In a message dated 5/26/99 6:01:53 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
rob_long

bigfoot.com writes:

bearings are loose! I'm not sure if they just need repacked or if they
need replaced. >>
Well, first it is doubtful that the bearings wore to the point of being loose
(your wheels should have fallen off if this much wear is going on). It is
more likely the bearing clearance was not set properly the last time it was
apart. In which case all you should have to do is reset the clearance. This
is especially likely if both sides are loose. However, it would be wise to
inspect the bearings, races, and grease seals, then repack and properly set
the clearance. If the bearings have been loose for some time now, they may
be beat up. But, if they are not making grinding sounds, no pits, nicks, or
flaking they should be reusable.
Burt Hill Kennewick WA 1972 F-250 4x4 460
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 14:04:46 EDT
From: SHill48337

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Ford distributor interchange

In a message dated 5/26/99 6:41:05 AM Pacific Daylight Time, wish

iastate.edu
writes:

Seems to me that any of the M block series, along with the 460's all use
the same dist. Though there may have been a changeover year where the deck
height was different, I think that was 71 ... Dave ?
>>
Yes, the 351M, 400, 429, and 460 all use the same distributor, just pick the
year you want to use. When the "deck" heights were changed it did not affect
the distributor.
Burt Hill Kennewick WA 1972 F-250 4x4 460
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 13:05:27 -0500
From: "Jason & Kathy Kendrick"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Stuck Dist

>
> What you do is hit (i.e. spray, not the kind of hitting Azie suggests!) it
> with a fire extinguisher. Just the distributor if you can help it. This
> makes the distributor shrink away from the intake as it gets quite cold
> from the fire extinguisher spray (use the dry ice kind).
>
> Then, WEARING SOME GLOVES, try to pull it out. Try not to hammer on it too
> much when it is cold like this because the aluminum gets quite brittle when
> cooled.

Use a CO2 extinguisher-DO NOT USE A DRY CHEMICAL- the compounds will
corrode anything they come in contact with.
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 13:23:01 -0500
From: "John LaGrone"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - more radiator notes

>>The other thing that bothered me a little more was the cheesy nylon/plastic
drain plug thing. I think I'd prefer the more traditional rotating-tube
petcock. When I looked at my OEM unit, the outer nut/boss appeared to be
brazed
right into the tank. I talked to a guy at the local NAPA, and he says he
has
metal radiator drain petcocks for $1.50.

Uh, Dave, that cheesy plastic drain thingy is a shipping plug. I don't think
it will reliably hold pressure. Spend the buck fifty for a new petcock. The
old one isn't supposed to be brazed in. Most of them look that way, but if
you get a hold on it with the proper tool, it will screw out. I think some
are threaded backwards (left hand), but you should be able to tell that from
the new rad. Use a little teflon tape or pipe dope when you put the new
petcock in.

- -- John
jlagrone

earthlink.net

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 11:39:49 -0700
From: jefro

netscape.com (Jeffrey Osier-Mixon)
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - VIN decoders

Don't know about the '78, but could you point me toward the one for '67-'72?

Thanks!

John & Iva McKay wrote:

> Does anyone remember where an online VIN decoder for '78 trucks is ?
> I bookmarked the '67-'72 page for me but my brother in laws '78 is in
> need
> of deciphering. Thanks !
>
> --
> John L. McKay
> Mesa, Arizona
>
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home.earthlink.net/~djspaints/ford.htm
> Email: djspaints

earthlink.net
>
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 14:06:52 -0500
From: "John LaGrone"
Subject: FTE 61-79 -

>> Larger volume means lower velocity which also means......Higher pressure not
lower

Sorry, Gary, not in this universe. The same mass of a compressable fluid
will fill any volume it is introduced into. When you go from a small
container to a large container, pressure drops and heat is absorbed by the
fluid, making the container colder. This includes smaller pipe to larger
pipe. Watch the end of your garden hose when it is flowing water. Big volume
increase, big pressure drop when you hit the open atmosphere. This is the
same principal used to make an air conditioner work. Pressurized freon (or
substitute) goes through an expansion device (little tube into big tube,
pressure drop, heat absorbed). If you ran a little intake runner into a big
head port, the pressure would drop in the head port when compared to the
intake runner and the temperature of the fuel mix would become lower.
Whether it is enough to effect performance, I don't know. I believe this
describes the physics of the situation.

- -- John
jlagrone

ford-trucks.com
1979 F150 Custom LWB Regular Cab 351M C6 (Henry)
http//www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
Dearborn iron rules!!!!

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 13:18:51 -0700
From: "Danger"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 65 F100 near SLC, Utah

Since I'm still $140 short of paying the machinist for my new 390 (where
there is a will, there is a way), I walked
over and asked the neighbor if he wanted to buy any parts for his 65 F100.
He replied by asking if I wanted to buy his truck. I didn't have a pencil
and paper, but I think I remember....

1965 F100 4x2 with manual trans
rear axle code "A9" (limited slip?)
tool box in the bed (rusted bottom and door needs hinges and latch)
352 2bbl with C4AE heads
light duty drum brakes all around
needs front and back windows
tires will pass inspection, but needs new park brake cable
engine started right up (sounded good to me), but carbs leaks (acc pump
cover gasket?)
radiator needs repaired or replaced (split seam at top towards the back)
jumper cables behind the seat, and what looked like a good batery (recently
replaced?)
the grill looked pretty good except for right side head light trim and so
did a few pieces of chrome
the steering column and horn looked real good
somebody removed trim to the instrument panel (owner said it was around
somewhere)
the upholstery looked terrible
the front cab mounts were intact

I thought that perhaps somebody near SLC, Utah might be interested in
something like this for $600, If so then please contact the owner Mike at
(801) 966-2575, or me at danger

csolutions.net

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 14:29:29 -0500
From: "John LaGrone"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - intake runners

Sorry about the earlier post with no subject.

Gary is right about smaller into larger being better. Smoothing the change
by grinding out the intake will make it look better and help minimize stream
turbulence, but the volume differential will still be there. Stream
turbulence actually creates little whirlpools with suction in the middle of
each eddy. This is not a good thing as it can cause the condensation of the
fuel that Gary mentioned. Only vaporous gasoline burns. Liquid gasoline does
not burn. (Don't try to stick a lit match in a bowl of gasoline to test
this. Gasoline vaporizes so easily that there is always a layer of highly
flammable vapor above any body of liquid.) Your carb venturi atomizes the
fuel mix. That means it makes tiny droplets. The more droplets, the more
surface area. The more surface area, the easier the mix vapors. The more
vapor you have inside the compression chamber, the bigger the bang. Ideally
the fuel mix doesn't actually vapor until it gets in the cylinder. All of
the gasoline never burns. Ever heard of unburned hydrocarbons? Your
catalytic converter and EGR have. When the charge explodes to drive the
cylinder down, the volume expands, the pressure drops, the burned gases
absorb heat and the fire goes out.

Anyway, the little eddies from the turbulence mess up the balance of the
charge going into the cylinder.

- -- John
jlagrone

ford-trucks.com
1979 F150 Custom LWB Regular Cab 351M C6 (Henry)
http//www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
Dearborn iron rules!!!!

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 14:38:25 -0500
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - more radiator notes

>Uh, Dave, that cheesy plastic drain thingy is a shipping plug. I don't think
>it will reliably hold pressure. Spend the buck fifty for a new petcock.

The radiator I got, its not one of those little push in plugs they use to
keep junk out, it actually threads in and is like 3/4" long or so ...
actually a touch longer than the petcockout of the old one if I remember
right. All attempts to screw in the old petcock have failed because it is
just a millimeter or so too small (the hole), and the next size down won't
even touch the threads, so I'm stuck with that thing ... I guess I assumed
Dave had the same thing in his, but you are correct it could be one of
those plastic push in style keepers too ...

Just my 2cents

wish

Links http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/links.html
'73 1/2 ton 4x4 Ford http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/truck.html
'96 Mustang GT http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.public.iastate.edu/~wish/mustang.html
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 15:03:53 -0500
From: "Michael Masse"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - VIN decoders

I have one that works for 70 through 80. It's at:
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.medicine.wisc.edu/~mrm/bronco
I hope to get it to work from 60 though 89 sometime this summer.

Mike

5/26 1:48p >>>
Don't know about the '78, but could you point me toward the one for =
'67-'72?

Thanks!

John & Iva McKay wrote:

> Does anyone remember where an online VIN decoder for '78 trucks is ?
> I bookmarked the '67-'72 page for me but my brother in laws '78 is in
> need
> of deciphering. Thanks !
>
> --
> John L. McKay
> Mesa, Arizona
>
> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home.earthlink.net/~djspaints/ford.htm
> Email: djspaints

earthlink.net
>
> =3D=3D FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.h=
tml

=3D=3D FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.htm=
l

=20
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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 19:03:36 -0400
From: David Wadson
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Advice on king pin installation wanted

Well, the horrible groaning noise from more truck is the power steering
pump...but not because it's toasted. The king pins (which 6 months ago
where free and loose) have seized up and the groaning is the pump straining
when I'm turning. Good thing I have power steering or I probably wouldn't
be able to turn a corner! :-)

I'm not going to bother trying to unseize them - I went out and got a new
pair and hope to install them in the next week. (Please don't rain this
weekend! Please don't rain this weekend!) But before I immobilize my truck
for 3-4 days, I want to make sure I'm going into this well prepared. I'll
also be using my digital camera to snap some pictures of the process for
all to see. Anyways...the questions:

- - I'm going to get one of those kingpin press things built so I can remove
them myself (can't remember whose website had it). Do I still need to have
an acetylene torch to heat them up before trying to pop them out or can I
get away without the torch or with a propane torch instead? If I really
should have the torch, I'm tempted to take the press and the truck to the
garage - having the press should save mechanic a few hours of pounding and
me a lot of cash.

- - I went with the metal bushings rather than nylon even though it means a
machine shop has to put them in. What exactly do they have to do with the
spindle and the bushings? Do they just hone out the spindle and press the
bushings in?

- - the kit came with four flat metal "washers". Where the heck do they go as
the diagram in my shop manual doesn't show them.

- - is there any kind of special kingpin grease that is better to use or just
regular chassis lube? I don't want to do this again for a long, long time
and if there is something better I'd rather use it.

- - the kingpin itself doesn't slip right into the bushings when I was
checking out all the pieces in the box. I'm assuming it is supposed to fit
tightly and takes some "massaging" to install the pin. How much "massaging"
is necessary/appropriate and should I heat the bushings up before hand?

- - the notch in the kingpin should line up with the locking pin when you
install it. What do you do if it doesn't - can you rotate the kingpin or do
you drive it back out and try again?

I'm reasonably confident that I can change these but I'm trying to cover
all my bases before I have my front end torn apart. It would be a bit of
trouble to get my truck into a mechanic if things get out of control and I
can't finish the job.

One other thing...any suggestions for undoing a tie rod end when loosening
the nut just spins the whole ball joint? I'm replacing my steering linkage
along with the kingpins but one of the nuts won't come off easily. If need
be I'll cut it but if there's an old wives tale solution...

David Wadson - wadsond

air.on.ca
"PS2" - 78 F100/302/C4

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 19:09:16 -0400
From: "Ted & Sarah Freeman"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - RE: Radiator/Fan Question

Thanks for the info. My 2 row just can't hold up with Air Conditioner
going.

- -Ted

- ----------
> From: Parsons, Raymond
> To: '61-79-list

ford-trucks.com'
> Subject: FTE 61-79 - RE: Radiator/Fan Question
> Date: Wednesday, May 26, 1999 12:55 PM
>
> >>> Have you got an address and phone number for these people?>
> > Thanks,
> >> -Ted
> ............
> >>The page at http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.godan.com/home.html
>
>
> Go Dan Industries
> 5000 Clarkson St #C
> Denver, CO 80216
> 303-295-0944
>
> I have dealt with them in the past and have never had a problem.
> Ray
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 16:46:04 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - VIN decoders

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.medicine.wisc.edu/~mrm/bronco/ftvin.cgi

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets"

- -----Original Message-----
From: John & Iva McKay
To: 61-79-list

ford-trucks.com
Date: Wednesday, May 26, 1999 11:27 AM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - VIN decoders

>Does anyone remember where an online VIN decoder for '78 trucks is ?
>I bookmarked the '67-'72 page for me but my brother in laws '78 is in
>need
>of deciphering. Thanks !

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 19:55:59 -0400
From: William A Whited
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - What do you think? '77 F-150 I need to sell...

What's me wish I had $3,000 laying around. Truck looks
awesome. Where did you get the info about the dual
tank converaion kit, most of all we do I thanks?

- --
William A Whited
74 F100 RANGER SUPERCAB 390
77 F100 CUSTOM FLAIRSIDE 302
79 F100 EXPLORER SUPERCAB 302 (PARTS TRUCK)
"IT DON'T GTMO BETTER THEN THIS, SEMPER FI"

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Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 19:04:53 -0500
From: "Brett L. Habben"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Box interchanges

Folks,
The bed on my '75 Supercab is pretty rough and I'm thinking of just
finding a better one and replacing it.
Are all the '73-'75 longbeds interchangeable? Are there any differences
in mounting bolt locations, etc.?
Thanks,
Brett
'75 F100 Supercab Explorer longbed, 390 2v. C6
___________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 20:01:37 -0500 (CDT)
From: loustrk

ix.netcom.com (louis sirio)
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Hot start

I have a 78 F-250 and had a hot start problem for over
a year. It could be 30 below and would start like a champ
but after running for a while, If I shut down, and tried
to start again, It would sound like a dead battery and crank
very slow or not at all. After It cooled it would start right
up again. After burning out three starters and messing around
with the timing and even heat shields, a friend told me to
check the grounding. Sure as hell, the point that the starter
was grounded to the block was rusted. That makes for the battery
sending mega power to try to complete the circuit. After a quick wire
wheel to the surface, my last starter is still gonig after 4 years.
Sometimes the answer is simple.
Live and learn.
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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 18:12:00 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Rebuilding a 9" ...Part 1

FORD 9 INCH REBUILD/GEAR SETUP

NOTE: IF YOU ARE A BEGINNER, THIS IS THE REAR YOU WANT TO START WITH. THE 9"
FORD
REAR IS A MODEL OF SIMPLICITY FOR ADJUSTMENT OF PINION DEPTH AND SETTING
BACKLASH

NOTE: TO PERFORM THIS REBUILD, YOU SHOULD HAVE A SHOP MANUAL THAT LISTS
TORQUE
SPECS, A FULL SIZE FLOOR JACK , TWO (3 TON MIN) JACK STANDS, A DIAL
INDICATOR WITH MAGNETIC/STATIC BASE, A VIERNER CALIPER, GEAR PATTERN GREASE,
"RED" GRADE THREAD LOCKER. INCH-LB TORQUE WRENCH, AND 150+ FT-LB TORQUE
WRENCH

1. REMOVE WHEELS AND PLACE REAR AXLE ON JACKSTANDS. I LIKE JACKING BETWEEN
SHOCK MOUNT AND CENTER SECTION. JACK STANDS SHOULD BE PLACED BETWEEN SETS OF
U-BOLTS, DIRECTLY UNDER LEAF SPRINGS.

2. RELEASE EMERGENCY BRAKE. REMOVE BRAKE DRUMS.

NOTE: BACKING OFF ON INTERNAL SHOE ADJUSTING STAR WHEEL (ACCESSED THROUGH
HOLE
IN BACKING PLATE) AND/OR HITTING BRAKE DRUM WITH HAMMER BETWEEN 2 STUDS IN
AXIAL DIRECTION MAY BE NEEDED TO REMOVE STUBBORN DRUMS. WHEN HAMMERING DRUM,
KEEP WHEEL NUTS ON STUDS TO AVOID THREAD DAMAGE.

3. ROTATE AXLE TO LINE UP HOLE IN AXLE FLANGE WITH ONE AXLE RETAINING BOLT.
REMOVE AXLE RETAINING BOLT. REPEAT THIS 3 MORE TIMES TO REMOVE A TOTAL OF 4
AXLE RETAINING BOLTS. REMOVE AXLE BY PULLING STRAIGHT OUT. AXLE MAY REQUIRE
SUBSTANTIAL FORCE TO BE REMOVED. ENSURE SMALL PAN IS UNDER END OF AXLE ASSY
TO CATCH ANY LEAKING REAR END FLUID. USE MASKING TAPE TO MARK AXLE AS TO
DRIVER OR PASSENGER SIDE.

4. INSPECT AXLE BEARING AND RACE FOR PITTING, CORROSION, OR WEAR. CAREFULLY
INSPECT AXLE SEAL FOR MISSING RUBBER. IF RUBBER IS SHOT, NEW SEALS WILL BE
NEEDED. REINSTALLING AXLE AND LOCATING MISSING PART OF SEAL ON TOP OF TUBE
AND/OR USING GASKET SEALER WILL NOT WORK CORRECTLY. I TRIED THEM BOTH.
REPLACING AXLE SEALS MAY REQUIRE NEW BEARINGS (DEPENDING HOW THEY PRESS OFF)
AND WILL REQUIRE NEW BEARING RETAINER RING. ENSURE BEARING RACES ARE CHANGED
IF NEW BEARINGS ARE INSTALLED.

5. REMOVE 10 NUTS FROM 3RD MEMBER ASSEMBLY. REMOVE 10 BRASS WASHERS FROM
STUDS TAKING CARE TO NOT DESTROY THEM. BENDING THEM SLIGHTLY TO GET THEM OFF
IS OK. PICTURE SHOWS 3RD MEMBER ALL READY OFF STUDS.

[Picture deleted]

6. USING RUBBER HAMMER OR BOTH HANDS, CRACK GASKET, PULLING UPWARD ON 3RD
MEMBER ASSY. ENSURE LARGE PAN IS UNDER 3RD MEMBER TO CATCH OIL. SMALL
SCREWDRIVER CAN BE PLACED AT BOTTOM BETWEEN 3RD MEMBER AND HOUSING TO ALLOW
THOROUGH FLUID DRAINING. DRAIN FOR 1 HOUR MIN TO ENSURE ALL OIL IS OFF 3RD
MEMBER.

7. REMOVE 3RD MEMBER. JERKING UP/DOWN AND SIDE/SIDE MOTIONS MAY BE REQUIRED
TO GET 3RD MEMBER OUT. SOMETIMES STUDS ARE ANGLED SLIGHTLY, MAKING 3RD
MEMBER A TIGHT FIT. PLACE 3RD MEMBER ON CLEAN RAGS/SURFACE. SOP UP REMAINING
FLUID IN BOTTOM OF CASE. CHECK FOR HEAVY/LARGE METAL PARTICLES ON CASING
BOTTOM.

8. SETUP 3RD MEMBER ON BLOCKS AS SHOWN. A 6 X 6 AND 2 -2 X 4S ON EITHER
SIDE WORKS WELL FOR THE CORRECT HEIGHT.

NOTE: IF THIS IS YOUR FIRST GEAR SETUP/INSTALL, YOU MAY WANT TO PERFORM A
REFERENCE CHECK ON BACKLASH AND A PATTERN CHECK ON DRIVE AND COAST. THIS
WILL GIVE YOU A GOOD IDEA OF WHAT BACKLASH YOU WILL NEED AND WHAT THE GEAR
PATTERNS LOOK LIKE UPON RE-ASSEMBLY. SKIP 9, 10 AND 11 IF YOU ARE SEASONED
GEAR INSTALLER.

9. INSTALL DIAL INDICATOR AS SHOWN. MAKE SURE DIAL INDICATOR IS EXTREMELY
RIGID, OR RESULTS WILL BE SKEWED. ENSURE DIAL POINTER IS SET SO IT TOUCHES
THE TOP OF ONE GEAR TOOTH AND IS TANGENT TO THE OUTER ARC OF RING GEAR
TEETH. HOLD PINION FLANGE SOLID AND ROTATE RING GEAR BACK AND FORTH,
ENSURING PINION/FLANGE DOES NOT MOVE. PLAY SHOULD BE EVIDENT AND THE AMOUNT
OF BACK AND FORTH PLAY IS CALLED BACKLASH. IT SHOULD BE AROUND .008 TO .012
INCHES.

10. PAINT ALL RING GEAR TEETH, BOTH SIDES, WITH GEAR MARKING COMPOUND
(USUALLY A WHITE TYPE OF GREASE). PUT FORCE ON RING GEAR IN EITHER DIRECTION
(SMALL RUBBER PAD PRESSED AGAINST RING GEAR TEETH WORKS WELL FOR THIS). SPIN
PINION/FLANGE BACK AND FORTH, 10 OR 20 TIMES, ENSURING 5 OR 6 RING GEAR
TEETH MESH WITH PINION GEAR TEETH. RELEASE FORCE ON RING GEAR AND ROTATE IT
TO A POINT WHERE PREVIOUSLY MESHED TEETH (PATTERN IN GREASE) CAN BE SEEN.
PATTERN SHOULD LOOK LIKE CORRECT MESH PATTERN IN DIAGRAM BELOW.

[Diagram deleted]

11. REPEAT PROCEDURE, FORCING RING GEAR IN OPPOSITE DIRECTION. CHECK PATTERN
AGAIN. BOTH PATTERNS SHOULD BE IN CENTER OF TOOTH AND NOT RUNNING OFF THE
EDGE OF ANY TEETH. PATTERN CAN BE CHECKED AT VARIOUS LOCATIONS ON RING GEAR
TO ENSURE PATTERNS ARE THE SAME OVER ENTIRE RING GEAR. DOING THIS WILL ALSO
ENSURE RING GEAR IS SEATED CORRECTLY ON DIFFERENTIAL AND RUNOUT ON RING GEAR
IS ACCEPTABLE.

12. REMOVE DIAL INDICATOR IF INSTALLED AND LOOSEN 4 CARRIER BEARING CAP
BOLTS. MAKE SURE BEARINGS CAPS ARE MARKED IN SOME WAY SO THEY ARE INSTALLED
AS THEY CAME OUT. THEY ARE NOT INTERCHANGEABLE. REMOVE CARRIER BEARING CAPS.
REMOVE DIFFERENTIAL/RING GEAR, ENSURING BEARING RACES/THREADED SIDE
ADJUSTERS DO NOT FALL ON FLOOR.

13. USING LARGE ADJUSTABLE WRENCH, HOLD PINION FLANGE AND REMOVE PINION NUT.
REMOVE 5 BOLTS HOLDING PINION, PINION BEARINGS AND RETAINER TO MAIN CASING.

14. REMOVE PINION ASSEMBLY. CARE SHOULD BE EXERCISED TO PREVENT DAMAGE TO
RUBBER O-RING ON PINION ASSEMBLY. ENSURE METAL SHIM(S) BETWEEN MAIN CASING
AND PINION RETAINER ARE ACCOUNTED FOR AND NOT DAMAGED. SLIDE PINION OUT OF
RETAINER (MAY NEED TO BE PRESSED OUT) AND PRY OFF PINION SEAL ON END OF
RETAINER.

15. PRESS OFF AND REPLACE REMAINING PINION BEARING. REPLACE BEARING RACES ON
BOTH SIDES OF PINION RETAINER. REINSTALL PINION INTO RETAINER .

16. INSTALL NEW CRUSH COLLAR ON PINION (SEE PICTURE BELOW). INSTALL
REMAINING PINION BEARING, PINION FLANGE, AND NEW PINION NUT. HOLDING PINION
FLANGE WITH VERY LARGE ADJUSTABLE WRENCH, TORQUE NUT TO 175 FT-LBS. ENSURE
ROTATIONAL FORCE OF PINION GEAR DOES NOT EXCEED 5-8 IN-LBS FOR NEW BEARINGS
OR 8 IN-LBS FOR USED BEARINGS. IT IS BEST TO CHECK ROTATIONAL FORCE OFTEN
WHILE TORQUEING, AS THE ROTATIONAL FORCE WILL GIVE YOU A BETTER INDICATION
OF PINION BEARING PRE-LOAD THAN THE PINION NUT TORQUE. TORQUING CLOSE TO,
BUT NOT EXACTLY TO, THE SPECIFIED TORQUE MAY BE REQUIRED IF ROTATIONAL FORCE
LIMIT HAS BEEN REACHED.

16. REMOVE AND REPLACE EXTRA SMALLER PINION BEARING FROM MAIN CASE.
RETAINING RING CAN BE PRIED OUT AND USUALLY REUSED IF NOT DESTROYED. ENSURE
CASING AROUND THIS BEARING IS NOT CRACKED (SEE SECOND PICTURE, LEFT SIDE).....

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