61-79-list-digest Monday, April 26 1999 Volume 03 : Number 141



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 61-79 - 428 crank?
FTE 61-79 - Damage to new radiator
FTE 61-79 - Re: vacuum advance
Re: FTE 61-79 - Carpenter
Re: FTE 61-79 - Damage to new radiator
FTE 61-79 - Re: FTE 61-79 Shrouds etc.
Re: FTE 61-79 - Damage to new radiator
FTE 61-79 - Private e-mail was: FTE 61-79 Shrouds etc.
Re: FTE 61-79 - Clutch throw arm
FTE 61-79 - ADMIN: Your truck photo wanted for the Pigeon Forge show
FTE 61-79 - 61-79-FTE Rusty Coolant
FTE 61-79 - P/S conversion
Re: FTE 61-79 - Disc brake conversion
FTE 61-79 - Vibrtaion ?
FTE 61-79 - '65 (or '66) wiring
FTE 61-79 - '65 (or '66) wiring
Re: FTE 61-79 - Damage to new radiator
Re: FTE 61-79 - 61-79-FTE Rusty Coolant
FTE 61-79 - Damage to radiator
Re: FTE 61-79 - 61-79-FTE Rusty Coolant

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 09:50:39 EDT
From: BDIJXS aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 428 crank?

Hey Jeff,

Figured that one would get your attention....

Well, here's the deal: I dropped off the crank at my machine shop in Denver
and he took it over to his guy that always checks out his cranks. They magged
it and said they thought it was a crack. I trust this machinist, the name of
his shop is "Blue Oval Racing". All he does is build high-performance Ford
motors.

But you are right, it looks like it was welded as well at some point. Either
way, this guy works on these engines day in and day out, so I just deferred
to his good judgement. It wasn't too much trouble, since I had bought it at a
local crankshaft outfit. They said they would take this one back and find
another.....may take awhile, but thats no problem....

CJ
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 08:40:49 -0700
From: "bertolin"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Damage to new radiator

I had a shop install a new R-134 a/c unit in my truck this last week. They
moved the radiator closer to the fan during this process. The fan was
positioned so close to the radiator that it hit the radiator during the
course of driving. The radiator is now damaged to the point of leaking. I
need your advise on what demands I need to make of this shop. The radiator
is a high efficiency, 4 row that I special ordered from U.S. Radiator. It is
only ~ 6 months old. I don't want a jimmy rig situation. Should I insist
that they pay for a replacement (entire radiator) or a new core? or would
there be a less drastic measure that would be just as good in the long run?
Any advise you can give me would be appreciated.
Thanks, Roberta with 1965 F-100, 240 6 cyl. & 3 speed manual.


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Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 18:55:19 -0600
From: Drew Beatty
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: vacuum advance

Drew wrote:

> Uh oh, I thought that was supposed to be 10 degrees initial, and
> around 30 with the vacuum on. Err...do I need to fix mine??

Pat replied:

>No, I should have typed 15-20 degrees ADDTIONAL advance, sorry
>Drew. Now, I wish I had a real service manual with real numbers
>for vac and mech advances . . .

Thanks for clearing that up, Pat. I thought I *really* had a problem because it was so far off and running so good :-)

Drew Beatty
dcbeatty rmi.net

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:38:09 -0400
From: William A Whited
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Carpenter

Marko, How much???

Marko Maryniak wrote:

> BTW if somebody needs a fan shroud there are about 5 straight solid FE fan
> shrouds nearby.
> Anybody want one?
> marko

> William A Whited

74 F100 RANGER SUPERCAB 390
77 F100 CUSTOM FLAIRSIDE 302
79 F100 EXPLORER SUPERCAB 302 (PARTS TRUCK)
"IT DON'T GTMO BETTER THEN THIS, SEMPER FI"


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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 11:11:57 -0600
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Damage to new radiator

At 08:40 AM 25/04/99 -0700, you wrote:
>I had a shop install a new R-134 a/c unit in my truck this last week. They
>moved the radiator closer to the fan during this process. The fan was
>positioned so close to the radiator that it hit the radiator during the
>course of driving. The radiator is now damaged to the point of leaking. I
>need your advise on what demands I need to make of this shop. The radiator
>is a high efficiency, 4 row that I special ordered from U.S. Radiator. It is
>only ~ 6 months old. I don't want a jimmy rig situation. Should I insist
>that they pay for a replacement (entire radiator) or a new core? or would
>there be a less drastic measure that would be just as good in the long run?
>Any advise you can give me would be appreciated.
> Thanks, Roberta with 1965 F-100, 240 6 cyl. & 3 speed manual.
>

My answer is, YES YES YES. Get a new rad.

One of the things in doing a proper job is checking clearances. If these
bozos didn't bother to do that, then it's their problem. You didn't ask for
this to happen, and if it wasn't for them, it wouldn't. I would present
them the bill for your radiator that you bought six months ago, and tell
them to order you a new one. They probly pay jobber rates anyway.

They will try to say "we'll repair it and it'll be just as good" but don't
buy any of that horsesh*t (sorry Ken but this kind of thing really gets me
mad). Tell them if they want to fix it they can, and then they should keep
it and sell it to somebody else when their fan puts a hole in their rad.
What you want is what you had before they messed with it, and that's a new
rad, and all the antifreeze, INSTALLED.

Make sure they never-seez the bolts holding the rad in, grease the hose
ends lightly so they don't rot onto the rad, and align everything properly.

You work hard for your paycheck. You should expect the same from everyone
else. Every good mechanic, or any good worker for that matter, knows that
he has to work just as hard for his money as the people who come in his
door. The best work even harder.


marko

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 11:18:11 -0600
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: FTE 61-79 Shrouds etc.

All right.

All of you who have emailed me about shrouds, let's do it this way.

I'm going to the wreckers to pull some stuff. I'll get a shroud for
myself, and possibly for some others too. But I dunno you live in Florida,
or Norway, or what. This is going to be difficult, cuz I need to know about
shipping, getting paid, etc. I'm not gonna mark them up or anything (not
my style!) but I don't want to lose anything but time, you know. I also
don't want to create too much traffic on the list.

Sooooo....

email me privately. I don't wanna create too much traffic on the list.
Tell me more or less how much you think you're prepared to pay. Tell me
what year your truck is and engine size etc. Give me your mailing address,
snail and e, and how you figure you'll get the thing to wherever you are
from here. I'm happy to go and pull one or two extra, but I'm not an auto
wrecker or anything so it isn't my business to do this stuff. I'm just
adding to the ol' karmic circle here, so help me out.


Thanks,


marko

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:30:18 -0700
From: Pat Brown
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Damage to new radiator

Roberta wrote:
>
> I had a shop install a new R-134 a/c unit in my truck this
> last week. They [ Condensed: Poked a hole in my new radiator!]

> Any advise you can give me would be appreciated.

Well, for starters, I would take your truck and radiator
receipt back to the shop to see what they have in mind. They
moved it, they should buy it. I assume they needed to move
the rad for condenser clearance, is there a spacer on the fan
that could have been shortened? (spacers run from half an inch
to several inches long, are mounted between fan and water pump).
If the tanks aren't damaged, a re-core should work well. I
wouldn't accept a 'patch job' on the old core, it's too thin,
and too risky. Now, with all that typed, make sure that your
motor mounts are in good condition and didn't contribute to
the problem.
- --
Pat Brown
Sebastopol, California

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 11:28:20 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Private e-mail was: FTE 61-79 Shrouds etc.

Just one suggestion about e-mailing people off the list. I know that on MS
Outlook if you hit the "Reply to Author" button on the toolbar it e-mails
back to the list. It helps if you add your e-mail address to the message
like Joeblow isp.com to make it easier to send you the mail directly.
Outlook even makes it a hyperlink so you just have to click on it to send
mail.

"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, riddle them with bullets"

- -----Original Message-----
From: Marko Maryniak
To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Sunday, April 25, 1999 10:18 AM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: FTE 61-79 Shrouds etc.

>email me privately. I don't wanna create too much traffic on the list.
>Tell me more or less how much you think you're prepared to pay. Tell me
>what year your truck is and engine size etc. Give me your mailing address,
>snail and e, and how you figure you'll get the thing to wherever you are
>from here. I'm happy to go and pull one or two extra, but I'm not an auto
>wrecker or anything so it isn't my business to do this stuff. I'm just
>adding to the ol' karmic circle here, so help me out.



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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:31:02 -0600
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Clutch throw arm

At 10:52 PM 24/04/99 EDT, you wrote:
> I just purchase a 1965 F100 shortbed V8 3 speed. The condition is in
rather
>poor shape, but I felt sorry for the little sucker and bought it. I plan to
>take the truck down to the frame and give it a new life. My first question
>is, the clutch throw arm is out of the bell housing. I took the tranny out
>and installed a new throw out bearing. But I can't get the throw arm back
>into place. I am currently trying to install it with the bell housing and
>tranny in place. Is this the wrong way of doing it? Or do I have to install
>the bell housing and tranny on the ground to install the clutch arm?
>
>Thank You in advance
>
>John Patterson
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>

Um, yeah. I'm afraid the easiest way to install the thing is to take the
bell housing off.

The clutch throw arm is clipped onto a fulcrum in the bell housing either
by a wire clip (old system, not all that good, but adequate) or by a steel
clip which is riveted onto the throw arm.

If there's a steel clip on it, you can push the throw arm back into place
with some considerable doing (the clip looks like the ones that hold the
throw bearing on). But, since it's a 65, I fear the design is a wire 'ear
clip' that looks kinda like those (ahem) GM clips that hold window cranks
on, and it clips onto a 'T' inside the housing. These are ignorant to
install.

Also, since you've already installed the throw bearing and the tranny, and
the throw arm isn't clipped into the bell housing but is flopping around,
it's not clipped onto the throw bearing properly (they have a square plate
behind them for the two fingers of the throw arm to clip onto).

Take it apart, do it right, and remember to put never seez on the fulcrum
area and on the fingers where they rub the throw bearing.


good luck!

marko

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:09:47 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: FTE 61-79 - ADMIN: Your truck photo wanted for the Pigeon Forge show

As we did last year, Ford Truck Enthusiasts will be at
the F100 Supernationals in Pigeon Forge, Tennessee from
May 13-16. We plan to have a board featuring trucks
from our members on display.

If you would like your truck featured, send a photograph
to:

Ford Truck Enthusiasts, Inc.
PO Box 422
Lilburn, GA 30048

You must send a photograph. Emailed scans will not be
accepted for the board. Please send them ASAP.

Ken Payne
Admin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts
http://www.ford-trucks.com

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 14:30:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: Josh Twichel
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 61-79-FTE Rusty Coolant

One Question Lots of Description:
My truck is a 74 F-250 360->390 4X4 standard transmission with no
a/c and 226,xxx miles.
My heater core went out of my truck the other day ago and I started
to fix it last night. Upon draining my coolant I noticed that it was
slightly rusty in color.
This wouldn't be a big concern if the engine and cooling system
were old, but they are not. My radiator has only about 2,000 miles on
it. My engine, water pump, and all of the hoses, except the lower
radiator hose, have 700 miles. The lower radiator hose has about 6,000
miles. The only non-new part (soon to be new) of the coolant system is
the heater core.
I had my engine rebuilt, by a reputable engine shop, into a long
block. I put on the non stock intake manifold and all of the trim. I
noticed that there is a little bit of and oil leak comming off of what
appears to be from the left front intake to head seal. other than that
every thing seems to be ok. I have not changed my oil yet to check its
color and I know that I'm about 200 miles overdue.

*Question*: Should my coolant be perfectly greenish-clear or is
the noticable rust discoloration normal under these conditions?
*My rambleings and/or thoughts on the mater*: If not normal color,
any known possible causes? Such as, could a bad intake to head seal
cause this, or bad head gasket? Note: I did not notice any
dicoloration of my exhaust to alarm me of coolant getting into my
combustion chambers. Could compression leak into my coolant system and
not the other way around?

Any help would be apreciated. Thank you.
Josh




_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 15:02:22 -0700
From: "J.S.H."
Subject: FTE 61-79 - P/S conversion

"To anyone interested I completed the power assist to true power
steering
swap on my truck last night. What a difference :^) It wasnt that hard,
the
hardest part was using the cutting torch on my truck. I was so happy I
went
and swapped the 2v Holley for the 4v Holley off of my parts truck.
If anyone wants more info on the power steering swap just drop me an
email."


I think there is enough interest to post to the list any info you would
like to share on the conversion.It seems like quite a few of us have
the power assist set-up.
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 16:49:48 -0700
From: "Sam Weatherby"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Disc brake conversion

Other years will work.
I think you weill find a wide range of years fit.
I suggest measuring tyhe length of the I-beams. Maybe you can swap them out
amking the king pin issue less of a problem.
-srw

Sam Weatherby SWeatherby uswest.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://insert.com/sammy ICQ # 18354914
'70 Mustang Grabber Sportsroof
'93 F-150 XLT Lightning
'65 F100
- -----Original Message-----
From: Richard A, Miller
To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Saturday, April 24, 1999 10:49 PM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Disc brake conversion


>I have a question on the disc brake conversion for 65 to 72 F100. On a
>65 to 66 is it a fact that only 74 spindles will fit, and if so what is
>the difference between the 74s and the 75 to 79s. Thanks for your help
>in advance.
>Rich Miller
>
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>

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 16:52:37 -0700
From: "Sam Weatherby"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Vibrtaion ?

I have a vibration in my car now. gradually started showing up.

Noticeable at highway speeds. Only when I let off the throttle. Still there
in neutral.

Any ideas?
-srw

Sam Weatherby SWeatherby uswest.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://insert.com/sammy ICQ # 18354914
'70 Mustang Grabber Sportsroof
'93 F-150 XLT Lightning
'65 F100

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:24:30 -0700
From: "Sam Weatherby"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - '65 (or '66) wiring

Does anyone have wiring diagrams for a '65 or '66?
Thanks,
-srw

Sam Weatherby SWeatherby uswest.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://insert.com/sammy ICQ # 18354914
'70 Mustang Grabber Sportsroof
'93 F-150 XLT Lightning
'65 F100

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:24:30 -0700
From: "Sam Weatherby"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - '65 (or '66) wiring

Does anyone have wiring diagrams for a '65 or '66?
Thanks,
-srw

Sam Weatherby SWeatherby uswest.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://insert.com/sammy ICQ # 18354914
'70 Mustang Grabber Sportsroof
'93 F-150 XLT Lightning
'65 F100

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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:29:12 -0500
From: cannandale netpointe.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Damage to new radiator

they screwed up, so they should get it replaced, or at least fixed with a
NEW core, dont let them get it fixed...

cannandale
'78 F250 4x4, 460



At 11:43 AM 4/25/99 -0500, you wrote:
>
>I had a shop install a new R-134 a/c unit in my truck this last week. They
>moved the radiator closer to the fan during this process. The fan was
>positioned so close to the radiator that it hit the radiator during the
>course of driving. The radiator is now damaged to the point of leaking. I
>need your advise on what demands I need to make of this shop. The radiator
>is a high efficiency, 4 row that I special ordered from U.S. Radiator. It is
>only ~ 6 months old. I don't want a jimmy rig situation. Should I insist
>that they pay for a replacement (entire radiator) or a new core? or would
>there be a less drastic measure that would be just as good in the long run?
>Any advise you can give me would be appreciated.
> Thanks, Roberta with 1965 F-100, 240 6 cyl. & 3 speed manual.
>
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>


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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 18:28:42 -0700
From: Dennis Dellinger
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 61-79-FTE Rusty Coolant

Josh
When long blocks are rebuilt or remanufactured they are normally hot tanked.
This removes all the grease and oil but won't touch the rust in the water
jacket. Shops that rebuild engines normally don't address this because to
them it is not a problem. If your truck is running in the normal range there
should be no major cause for concern. When you change your coolant the next
time backflush the cooling system to remove the loose rust. this should
allow your coolant to remain it's sickly green until the next change.
Dennis Dellinger

Josh Twichel wrote:

> One Question Lots of Description:
> My truck is a 74 F-250 360->390 4X4 standard transmission with no
> a/c and 226,xxx miles.
> My heater core went out of my truck the other day ago and I started
> to fix it last night. Upon draining my coolant I noticed that it was
> slightly rusty in color.
> This wouldn't be a big concern if the engine and cooling system
> were old, but they are not. My radiator has only about 2,000 miles on
> it. My engine, water pump, and all of the hoses, except the lower
> radiator hose, have 700 miles. The lower radiator hose has about 6,000
> miles. The only non-new part (soon to be new) of the coolant system is
> the heater core.
> I had my engine rebuilt, by a reputable engine shop, into a long
> block. I put on the non stock intake manifold and all of the trim. I
> noticed that there is a little bit of and oil leak comming off of what
> appears to be from the left front intake to head seal. other than that
> every thing seems to be ok. I have not changed my oil yet to check its
> color and I know that I'm about 200 miles overdue.
>
> *Question*: Should my coolant be perfectly greenish-clear or is
> the noticable rust discoloration normal under these conditions?
> *My rambleings and/or thoughts on the mater*: If not normal color,
> any known possible causes? Such as, could a bad intake to head seal
> cause this, or bad head gasket? Note: I did not notice any
> dicoloration of my exhaust to alarm me of coolant getting into my
> combustion chambers. Could compression leak into my coolant system and
> not the other way around?
>
> Any help would be apreciated. Thank you.
> Josh
>
> _________________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> >
> == FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info http://www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html



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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:01:43 -0700
From: Eric
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Damage to radiator

Roberta -
In the event that you show that the shop was negligent and that its
negligence was the sole cause of the event(take heed of Pat's good
advice),the
law will require that you be restored to the position you would enjoy if
the negligent
act had not occurred, and that you be awarded damages for any losses you
suffered as
a result of the act.
This means that you are entitled not to a new radiator but to a perfectly
functioning six months old radiator. If the shop will admit responsibility,
I suggest
that you insist that the repair be carried out by the manufacturer or by
its agent, and
definitely not by the shop or a repairer of its choosing.
We all wish you luck.

Eric
Barrister&Solicitor

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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:48:16 -0700
From: Pat Brown
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 61-79-FTE Rusty Coolant

Dennis Dellinger wrote:
> Josh wrote:
>> [My coolant is sort of rusty, Should I worry?]
>
> Josh
> When long blocks are rebuilt or remanufactured they are
> normally hot tanked. This removes all the grease and oil
> but won't touch the rust in the water jacket. Shops that
> rebuild engines normally don't address this because to
> them it is not a problem. If your truck is running in the
> normal range there should be no major cause for concern.....


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