61-79-list-digest Thursday, December 24 1998 Volume 02 : Number 570



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

Re: FTE 61-79 - 4V intakes for FE
Re: FTE 61-79 - 4V intakes for FE
FTE 61-79 - Deacon's sig
FTE 61-79 - Fuel tank inlet hose
RE: FTE 61-79 - 4V intakes for FE
FTE 61-79 - U-Joint Removal Tip
FTE 61-79 - 410 rebuild
[none]
FTE 61-79 - RE:
FTE 61-79 - Re:- U-Joint Removal Tip/U-joint search
FTE 61-79 - 3X2 intakes
FTE 61-79 - 2v 4v 3x2v 6packs etc
FTE 61-79 - Tri Power
FTE 61-79 - six pack
FTE 61-79 - 360-390
FTE 61-79 - Holidays
FTE 61-79 - Wishing you and your families a Very Merry Christmas!
FTE 61-79 - steering column
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 ID Help needed
FTE 61-79 - F-100 Explorer
Re: FTE 61-79 - F-100 Explorer
Re: FTE 61-79 - 360-390
FTE 61-79 - 460 ID...Is it time to get sick?
FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?
FTE 61-79 - Unibody VIN Numbers
Re: FTE 61-79 - 410 rebuild
Re: FTE 61-79 - 3X2 intakes
FTE 61-79 - RE: 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 ID...Is it time to get sick?
FTE 61-79 - Re: Tri-Power
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 ID...Is it time to get sick?
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?(cont)
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Fuel Inlet Hose
Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Tri-Power
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 ID...Is it time to get sick?
Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?(cont)

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 04:22:29 PST
From: "Tim Neasham"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 4V intakes for FE


>From: JUMPINFORD aol.com
>
>>
>
>Set up for 3 2v carbs. The most popular engine I know of that used
this was the 440 six-pack from Chrysler, but I think thats how the Ford
406 Tri-Power got its name, but I dont know for sure. (Thats your cue
Azie)

Don't forget about the lovely Pontiac GTO 389 Tri-Power. Got one
sitting in my shop as we speak. :)

Tim

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 08:24:21 -0600
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 4V intakes for FE

>this was the 440 six-pack from Chrysler, but I think thats how the Ford
>406 Tri-Power got its name, but I dont know for sure. (Thats your cue
>Azie)
>
>Don't forget about the lovely Pontiac GTO 389 Tri-Power. Got one
>sitting in my shop as we speak. :)
>
Actually quite a few cars came with the tri-power, or whatever they cared
to call it...

Dad's got 2 setups for his 57 Olds
He had a 68 Vette with the 427 and tri-power back in the 70's
Then as we've mentioned the Chrysler's and Fords (of course) had them ...

'Bout the only car I haven't seen multiple carbs on was anything AMC made,
but then finding a good original AMC product around here is like trying to
find hens teeth ... the salt just ate them up ...


Just my 2cents

Bill

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 08:32:39 -0600
From: John Strauss
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Deacon's sig

>==========================================
>I don't lie, cheat or steal unnecessarily.
>==========================================
>
Deacon, did you lift that from President Clinton? :-)
_
_| ~~. John Strauss
\, *_} jstrauss inetport.com
\( Texas Fight!

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 08:32:41 -0600
From: John Strauss
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Fuel tank inlet hose

>
>Colorado Jeff writes: >>
>I'm working on a 78 F-250 4x4. Would like to replace the fuel inlet hose
>(rear tank). Is this a Ford item?
>
>Yep! A FOMOCO item. Don't use radiator hose. It won't last and will
>eventually start to crumble, and guess where the 'crumbles' go!!!
>
I just bought one of these for my '69 Ranger at NAPA. It is pretty pricey,
though. They told me on the phone it was $9/foot, when I got there it was
$25/foot. I should have told them to shove it but they were the only place
in town that had it and I needed it.
_
_| ~~. John Strauss
\, *_} jstrauss inetport.com
\( Texas Fight!

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 08:08:24 -0700
From: "Miska, Richard L (Rick)"
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - 4V intakes for FE

I found one of these "factory high rise?" intakes on a t-bird with a 428.
I dont even have an fe, but I knew what the intake was, and bought it to put
on the shelf with all the other weird stuff I dont ever use , but might
someday. Basically, an early t-bird in a junkyard is a good potential donor
for this intake. Rick

p.s. Anybody got a good deal on a used carter/edelbrock 600 or 625 carb
with ford linkage?

> ----------
> From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com[SMTP:am14 daimlerchrysler.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 22, 1998 12:28 PM
> To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
> Subject: FTE 61-79 - 4V intakes for FE
>
> Ted writes: >>I've always been told to use a pre '65 manifold on a FE.
> I've always been told they flow better than the newer ones.
>
> I disagree with this. I've been wrong before, so I'm not adamant about
> this, but I believe the '67 thru '69 had the better flowing intakes and
> I've owned bunches of these from '61 thru '69. Best pure stock one I had
> came on my '69 428SCJ fastback Stang. The intake 'runners' were visably
> larger and the intake stood higher. Wish I still had it. I might be
> tempted to build another FE.(410 or larger)
>
> Azie
> Ardmore, Al.
>
>
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>
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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 10:21:18 EST
From: BDIJXS aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - U-Joint Removal Tip

Hey Ox,

I have used the socket/vise/big hammer method for getting those U-joints out
of the axle shafts, until a buddy of mine showed me an easier way. Rather than
try to push both caps at once with the small socket through to the big socket,
he put the yoke on top of the vise, with the vise open enough to allow the cap
fall through. Next, he tapped the "opposing" axle shaft near the U-joint,
meaning that he was transferring the force through the two "horizontal" caps
to just the one "vertical" cap, which easily popped out and down between the
grips of the vice. Does this make sense? I've found that you don't really have
to hit it very hard since you are only pushing one cap, rather than two.

I have since used this method several times, and every time, I've cursed
myself for all those times I tried to push both caps at once with the
socket....

Colorado Jeff


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 10:26:07 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 410 rebuild

Ted of the Freeman Family writes: >> I think I've found all the parts I
need including the correct 410 piston. All I can find are .30 over though
and I have a virgin block. I don't really want to take it that far over on
the first rebuild, but it is an FE and should last a long time with good
maintenance.

Surely you mean .030".

I would not hesitate to bore the 'virgin' block .030". It will most likely
take upwards of .080" (I bored a 390 to 4.130", which is .080"), and still
have enough metal in the cyl walls to be considered safe.. However not all
390's will bore out that far. Some models were thicker castings than
others and I've forgot just what models/years are the thick castings, and
I've lost all my information on the FE series (actually I think my wife
destroyed it one of her cleaning/throwing away binges she gets on from time
to time).I do seem to remember that all the 410's fell into the thick wall
casting blocks, but my memory plays tricks on me from time to time, so it
ain't completely reliable. Anyway, you will have 416cuin if you use the
.030" over.

Good luck.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 10:33:26 -0500
From: "Mr. Paul R. Boudreault"
Subject: [none]


I needed to replace the front hose on my 77 F150. Ford no longer stocks
it and the parts guy told me two alternatives. The first is junk yard and
the second is to check a tractor trailer dealership where they deal with
larger tubing.

Not sure about the rad hose.

Jon E. Purut




Hi Jon.

You are RIGHT about the rad hose. I would advise against this also.

I have the same problem for my 79 Bronco. Solution, (as advised by my
favorite local Ford Parts guy), is to call a local "Marine/Boat dealer.
They have had to do this before. I called and got a quote on Fuel hose,
(bulk), 2 and 1/4 inch inside diameter, for about $9.00 per foot,
(Canadian). NAPA wants $ 12.00 per foot apparently at a friends place in
Oregon. Only draw back in my case is that the Marine dealer tells me that
because of low demand he has to sell the whole 15 foot length it comes in.
NAPA said the same thing and BTW they are BOTH made by "GATES".

Guess ya know which I will be getting.

I will be getting mine in January as there is no rush in my case. (Totally
apart for rebuild purposes.)

Hope this helps.

"Paul"

P.S. Rad hose will break down with prolonged use.


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 08:46:35 -0700
From: "Miska, Richard L (Rick)"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - RE:

I could use a piece of this hose too!!! Maybe about 15 of us could all chip
in and buy one length.

>
> I needed to replace the front hose on my 77 F150. Ford no longer stocks
> it and the parts guy told me two alternatives. The first is junk yard and
> the second is to check a tractor trailer dealership where they deal with
> larger tubing.
>
> Not sure about the rad hose.
>
> Jon E. Purut
>
>
>
>
> Hi Jon.
>
> You are RIGHT about the rad hose. I would advise against this also.
>
> I have the same problem for my 79 Bronco. Solution, (as advised by my
> favorite local Ford Parts guy), is to call a local "Marine/Boat dealer.
> They have had to do this before. I called and got a quote on Fuel hose,
> (bulk), 2 and 1/4 inch inside diameter, for about $9.00 per foot,
> (Canadian). NAPA wants $ 12.00 per foot apparently at a friends place in
> Oregon. Only draw back in my case is that the Marine dealer tells me that
> because of low demand he has to sell the whole 15 foot length it comes in.
> NAPA said the same thing and BTW they are BOTH made by "GATES".
>
> Guess ya know which I will be getting.
>
> I will be getting mine in January as there is no rush in my case.
> (Totally
> apart for rebuild purposes.)
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> "Paul"
>
> P.S. Rad hose will break down with prolonged use.
>
>
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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 10:53:45 -0500
From: luxjo thecore.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re:- U-Joint Removal Tip/U-joint search

BDIJXS aol.com wrote:
>
> Hey Ox,
>
> I have used the socket/vise/big hammer method for getting those U-joints out
> of the axle shafts, until a buddy of mine showed me an easier way. Rather than
> try to push both caps at once with the small socket through to the big socket,
> he put the yoke on top of the vise, with the vise open enough to allow the cap
> fall through. Next, he tapped the "opposing" axle shaft near the U-joint,
> meaning that he was transferring the force through the two "horizontal" caps
> to just the one "vertical" cap, which easily popped out and down between the
> grips of the vice. Does this make sense? I've found that you don't really have
> to hit it very hard since you are only pushing one cap, rather than two.
>

Yup, this will work good too and is the only way to get a U out of the
weld joint on a CV. I haven't used this method (on std extractions), as
my original (read; really hard ;-)) replacement was done at a shop and
my U's don't last more than a couple months (or less) anymore :-)

I guess if your caps are really stuck, this method would be even better
as you won't bend yoke/flange (may crush it on extreme extractions)

In other news, I've been looking for stronger U-joints (hell, stronger
evertyhing for CV driveshafts). My ultimate would be a solid body U that
is greasable through the cap on all 4 caps seperately. Haven't found
that yet. I have also heard that 98 or 99 Expeditions are going to have
a 1350 series CV joint setup, but spicer claims to knwo nothing about
it. I have been looking at Spicer, Brute force (made by Nepco) and Alloy
(sold in Summit by L + S automotive).

OX
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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 11:40:21 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 3X2 intakes

Ted of the Freeman Family ask about 3 deuce setups for the FE:
I had a '61 Starliner that came from the factory with 3X2 setup. 401hp
rated. 3 on tree. I kept it until 1988, and wish I had kept it forever.
I ran all kinds of FE engines in it, but I always kept the 3X2's. They
finally wore the bodies out where the rod that operates the butterflies
goes through, and Holley would not refurbish them, so I sold them to
someone else. They had at least 300,000 miles on them and I loved them to
the very last. Make sure you know where you can get the original carbs.
(they are unique to FOMOCO - not ordinary 2bbl's) linkage and air cleaner
before you expect much good use from them. I've heard that since I got rid
of mine that Holly has a refurbishment program for them - not confirmed -
just here say.

Good luck.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 11:37:03 -0800
From: Al Evitts
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 2v 4v 3x2v 6packs etc

Deacon: Wrong, the 440 chryslers were 3 2 barrels called 6 packs.
IMHO


Al
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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 12:51:58 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Tri Power

You write: I think thats how the Ford 406 Tri-Power
got its name, but I dont know for sure. (Thats your cue Azie)

To the best of my knowledge "Tri Power" is a GM name associated with the
'64 and later Pontiacs and I believe with the early 60's (maybe late 50's)
Chevys and possibly the '67-'68 Olds. The 406 of '62 and the 390 of '61
did in fact offer the 3 duce setup but it was referred to in all the
literature I've seen as 6V.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 13:00:50 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - six pack

Deacon writes: >>A six pack has six singles.

Deacon I disagree. MOPAR's literature refers to the 440 and the 340 with
their factory offering of 3 2bbls as "six pack".

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 12:41:09 -0600
From: juredd - Justin Reddell
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 360-390

This is going back a few weeks to the 390- 360 deal I went through. To refresh your memory. I was sold a 390 motor and it turned out to be a 360 and the seller didn't want to pay up. I have been putting this message off for a while but here goes. I finally got a hold of the guy that sold me the motor and he went round and round about how he thought it was a 390 and he bought it as a 390 from a good friend of the family. He had contacted him about the motor and he claimed that it was a 390 block (we all know 390 block or 360 block their the same) and therefore........I could go on forever. Anyway he tried to talk with me about how much he drop the price and that should cover the cost of making it a 390. I told him that, that wasn't the point. You sold me a 390 and I didn't get a 390. The bottom line, I asked him if he felt responsible and of course he said no. I got sick and tired of his excuses so I said forget it. If you don't think you need to make it right than d!
on't weary about it. I have a backbone and I guess I could have made him pay me what I wanted but I don't have time to make people keep their word. If a man or woman aren't as good as their word, than what are they? I don't have time to rebuild the motor I need it running. I had to go out and buy a $700 dollar car to get to work while this problem was being resolved. So I'll do what one list member suggested. Run the beast until it blows and build what I was after in the first place. Thanks to everyone for the support and help with this problem. You requested that I give out the name of the seller so that you can watch out for them. If you disagree than I am sorry but I want you to get what you ask and pay for. Dave Chicoine Sr. and Jr. from Eastport ME. They had some more stuff out on the Classifieds of this web site so be on the look out. Thanks again for you suggestions and support. You really stuck by me.

Happy Holidays,
Justin Reddell
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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 13:43:15 -0500
From: am14 daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Holidays

I will be off the lists for the Holiday season. I will get back on the
list after that time, but I don't want a jillion messages to catch up on
while I am off work, so I'm signing off......

To all of you: Keep safe and a Very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

Be back 01/04/99.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 13:47:27 -0500
From: "Mr. Paul R. Boudreault"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Wishing you and your families a Very Merry Christmas!

Hi everybody.

I just wanted to take a little time and wish all of you a Very Merry
Christmas and a Happy New Year from my family and myself to you and yours.

Merry Christmas.

Your Friends

"Paul", and Lynn, and little Seven



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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 15:42:50 -0500
From: Michael A Knight
Subject: FTE 61-79 - steering column

NEED HELP-I have a 1968 F-250.It has a 360 c.i.,power steering,4 speed
manual trans,2 wheel drive.The steering shaft is broken due to rusted
out cab mounts.I would like to install a tilt wheel column in its
place.Has anyone out there performed this swap?How difficult is the
job?Does it involve major fabrication?Many thanks to anyone who can
help.
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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 13:36:14 PST
From: "Andy D"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 ID Help needed

According to the information I have the 390 2V was the largest engine
offered from 1968 to 1972.

Andy
72 F100
70 F100
56 F600
56 F100

>The 460 in your truck is a 1971 model, lower deck height then the 78
model,
>and I am not sure, but I do not believe it was offered in a truck in
1971,
>so you have a car engine. Different oil pan, so probably different
shaft
>lengths on the oil pump.
>
>--Bud (son of Stoney)
>1979 F-250 429 Police Interceptor, T-18
>1976 F-100 302, 3-speed (For Sale)


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 13:45:13 PST
From: "Andy D"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - F-100 Explorer

I have a 1970 F-100 (Explorer ?). Did Ford offer a Explorer that year
according to my information the Explorer came out in 1971 and offered
car type wheel covers (long gone), chrome bumper guards, (still there),
chrome side rails (still have the holes in the bed), and a Explorer
badge on the glove box (still there). All the signes are there saying
it's an Explorer but my book says it was not introduced then. Can
anyone shed some light on this?

Andy

72 F100
70 F100 (Explorer ?)
56 F600
56 F100

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 16:07:40 -0600
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - F-100 Explorer

>I have a 1970 F-100 (Explorer ?). Did Ford offer a Explorer that year
>according to my information the Explorer came out in 1971 and offered
>car type wheel covers (long gone), chrome bumper guards, (still there),
>chrome side rails (still have the holes in the bed), and a Explorer
>badge on the glove box (still there). All the signes are there saying
>it's an Explorer but my book says it was not introduced then. Can
>anyone shed some light on this?
>

You need to figure out how it was determined to be a 70 ...does the title
say it? did you run the vin numbers ? I would think it would be possible
that the book could be wrong, you could have a late 70 that offered it, it
could have been modified by a previous owner (though that's a lot to change
just for a name plate) or you could have an early 71 that had a title date
of late 70 (august or so) that accidently changed it to a 70 when someone
entered it ...

I'd run the vin through one of the decoders that's available, if it comes
back as a 70, then I'd just think i got a really late 70 and the book was
probably off a little bit ...


Just my 2cents

Bill

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 15:52:34 -0800
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 360-390

Let's mail bomb 'em!

Just kidding Ken! ;-)

Thanks for the warning Justin. Happy Holidays!

- ----------
> From: juredd - Justin Reddell
> To: 'Ford List'
> Subject: FTE 61-79 - 360-390
> Date: Wednesday, December 23, 1998 10:41 AM
>
> Thanks to everyone for the support and help with this problem. You
requested > that I give out the name of the seller so that you can watch
out for them. If you > disagree than I am sorry but I want you to get what
you ask and pay for. Dave > Chicoine Sr. and Jr. from Eastport ME. They
had some more stuff out on the > Classifieds of this web site so be on the
look out.

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 15:13:30 -0500
From: "Matthew Schwartz"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 460 ID...Is it time to get sick?

I had purchased a 1978 PAW kit for a supposed 78 460. I have built the motor
in total when I ran into the problem of priming the oil system.This lead me
to the response below. I have a 71 460 that has a different deck height then
the 1978.PAW kit I installed. Now for the gut wrenching question.

Is my engine build doomed to failure? or is the oil pump my only problem.
How about connecting rods and pistons specs., lifters, cam, bearings etc.
Will the difference in deck height kill my project? I am using the original
block, heads and valve train minus the cam and lifters.

Any comments? Please! My project has stopped dead in it's tracks.

Matt




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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 20:28:31 -0500
From: "Matthew Schwartz"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?

I pulled a 460 from a 78 Ford F250 SuperCab. Ordered a PAW kit for a 78 460
and built the engine. During the engine oil priming step I noticed I had a
problem with the oil pump shaft length. Seems that the new PAW oil pump had
a longer leg then my original pump. I posted a question on this site and got
my answer quickly ( THANK YOU Stoney). I have a 71 460 ( probably out of a
car) and the deck height is different (lower?) then a 78.

Now my 64,000 dollar question. Is my engine build ruined due to mismatched
parts?

I am using the same block, heads, pushrods,valve train and intake manifold
as original. Is there any concerns beyond the oil pump as it relates to the
new PAW 78 kit? ie. pistons, rods,crank, cam and bearings.

Thanks

Matt

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 19:39:14 -0600
From: "Danny Boy"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Unibody VIN Numbers

We have an early 60's model Unibody Ford Truck. We cannot locate the VIN
number. Does anyone know where this number is suppose to be or was it the
original engine serial number.

Thanks,

Dan Ledgerwood

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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 20:39:48 -0500
From: "The Freeman Family"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 410 rebuild

I kinda fat fingered that one. Oops.
>
>Surely you mean .030".
>
>I would not hesitate to bore the 'virgin' block .030". It will most likely
>take upwards of .080" (I bored a 390 to 4.130", which is .080"), and still
>have enough metal in the cyl walls to be considered safe.. However not all
>390's will bore out that far. Some models were thicker castings than
>others and I've forgot just what models/years are the thick castings, and
>I've lost all my information on the FE series (actually I think my wife
>destroyed it one of her cleaning/throwing away binges she gets on from time
>to time).I do seem to remember that all the 410's fell into the thick wall
>casting blocks, but my memory plays tricks on me from time to time, so it
>ain't completely reliable. Anyway, you will have 416cuin if you use the
>.030" over.
>
>Good luck.
>
>Azie
>Ardmore, Al.
>
>
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>


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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 20:43:09 -0500
From: "The Freeman Family"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 3X2 intakes

I figure I can start with the manifold and start looking for the carbs and
linkage. Maybe some one at the Forge will have some this year. As far as
the 410 build up, I have a 4v manifold I'm going to start with and then
convert it to the 3x2 once I find all the necessary parts.

Later (and Thanks),

- -Ted


>Ted of the Freeman Family ask about 3 deuce setups for the FE:
>I had a '61 Starliner that came from the factory with 3X2 setup. 401hp
>rated. 3 on tree. I kept it until 1988, and wish I had kept it forever.
>I ran all kinds of FE engines in it, but I always kept the 3X2's. They
>finally wore the bodies out where the rod that operates the butterflies
>goes through, and Holley would not refurbish them, so I sold them to
>someone else. They had at least 300,000 miles on them and I loved them to
>the very last. Make sure you know where you can get the original carbs.
>(they are unique to FOMOCO - not ordinary 2bbl's) linkage and air cleaner
>before you expect much good use from them. I've heard that since I got rid
>of mine that Holly has a refurbishment program for them - not confirmed -
>just here say.
>
>Good luck.
>
>Azie
>Ardmore, Al.



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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 20:24:33 -0700
From: Randy Collins
Subject: FTE 61-79 - RE: 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?


Now my 64,000 dollar question. Is my engine build ruined due to mismatched
parts?

I am using the same block, heads, pushrods,valve train and intake manifold
as original. Is there any concerns beyond the oil pump as it relates to the
new PAW 78 kit? ie. pistons, rods,crank, cam and bearings.


Matt,
Your rebuild is fine. The different deck height only refers to how far the
pistons are from the top of the deck. All that means to you is variances
in combustion chamber volume and compression ratio. The other factor is
how the manifold matches up to the heads. I think the maximum difference
is between the blocks is 0.022. That isn't much. If you don't have
adjustable valve train I think you will find if you use different model
heads on different blocks you probably will have to locate the correct
length of push rods. I haven't heard of anyone having problems with using
and early intake on a late model block and vice versa.

I read your first post but I didn't understand what you were saying. I
interpreted it as you had the wrong length of oil pump drive shaft. I am
not aware of different lengths.

Other than the differences in oil pumps bolt on and slip on sumps I think
that is about it.

I think somewhere around 1979 Ford 460's went to externally balance
crankshafts but if you still have a matched harmonic balancer, crankshaft
and flywheel you will be fine.

Everyone feel free to make comments if I have missed anything.

Merry Christmas to all!

Randy Collins
Boise, Idaho
rcollins micron.net

1975 Ford F250 4WD Supercab "Muscle Truck"
460 SUPER COBRA JET



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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 22:48:39 EST
From: SHill48337 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 ID...Is it time to get sick?

In a message dated 12/23/98 5:00:30 PM Pacific Standard Time,
mschwartz fast.net writes:

How about connecting rods and pistons specs., lifters, cam, bearings etc.
Will the difference in deck height kill my project? I am using the original
block, heads and valve train minus the cam and lifters.
>>
Mat,
You have no serious problems if you have a 71 block, your deck clearance is
.010" greater than a 70 1/2 and earlier and .012" less than the 72 and up
blocks. You are in the middle. This fact will not make much difference one
way or the other. But, what year are your heads, and which pistons (stock for
what year or are they special such as flat top). The reason I ask is these
two items primarily set the compression ratio making either a runable engine
or one that needs to run on Aviation Gas. If your heads are the same year as
the block and PAW gave you the newer pistons with a 25 to 30 cc dish you are
in good shape, you will have a compression ratio just over 9:1. That would be
the best combo as this higher compression will run on pump gas and give you
around a 50 HP boost over the new 460s. If your heads are 74 or newer and the
pistons are from the same era your compression ratio will be about 8.5:1 and
very runable on regular gas. If PAW gave you flat tops and you have 74 and up
heads then you will have a compression ratio of about 9.7:1 would probably
give you big problems on regular gas. With the timing retarded slightly it
should run on 92 octane. However, the killer is having flat tops with 73 or
earlier heads because your compression ratio will be in the11's or 12's and
not practical for driving. If you have a question about the pistons use an
eye dropper and determine the volume of the their dish.

That said, the other differences are easy, the oil pump for the truck with the
rear pick up is different, it has a bolt on pick up tube and must use a
special main bearing bolt to support the pick up tube. Becareful the stock
numbers on these pumps are the same as the ones used for the front sump
applications with the exception of the addition of a D following the number.
This fools old pro's in the parts departments from time to time. For rear
sump pickup pumps the Melling part number is M-84D. M-84 is the standard
pump. As for getting the oil pan, pickup tube, and special main bolt Ford can
supply these, but the pan is expensive. Your best bet is to call the local
wrecking yards and do not forget to get the dip stick and tube that attaches
to the pan, you will need it even if you get the pan from Ford. If you want
good insurance from oil pump failure I would recommend a new pickup tube.
Something I have learned from this FTE List. Just FYI the parts books show
the rear sump pump for 71 460 truck engines. They were not on F series
puckups, I do not know where they used them, maybe the parts makers realized
there was no other differences and listed these pumps with all 429/460 blocks.
I think you will be very happy with your project. Chances are PAW gave you
the newer pistons and you have a usable combination for compression ratio. If
you should have the killer combo go for the newer pistons rather than changing
the heads. Glad to answer any other questions. Good Luck
Burt Hill Kennewick WA 1972 F-250 4x4 460
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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 20:18:25 -0800
From: Marv Miller
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: Tri-Power

> The Deekster wrote, in part:

> I think that's how the Ford 406 Tri-Power got its name, but I don't know for sure.

First Ford engines that I remember having that manifold were the 401
horsepower 390's in the 1962 Galaxy 500's. Awesome motors. I remember
one four-speed that almost beat a friend's 426 Stage III w/Torqueflite.
I think the fact that the Galaxy was about a thousand pounds heavier
had a lot to do with the outcome.

THAT'S a 390 that could sure make torque.

- -Marv-

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Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 00:33:49 EST
From: A64F100 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?

from my months of 460 research, I have learned many things
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Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 00:34:14 EST
From: A64F100 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?


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Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 00:38:05 EST
From: JJJJJGRANT aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 ID...Is it time to get sick?

the rear sump pans were used on e350 vans w/460. pan,pick up and tube were
about
150.00 from ford.
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Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 00:38:51 EST
From: A64F100 aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 460 Ford ID...Is it time to cry?(cont)

whoops. cut myself short there.... Anyways, as I was saying, I have learned
that the oil pump rod is different, and the cam sprocket is different. 68-71
is somehow different from 72-87. I have found that PAW doesnt make a 71-
earlier double roller, but Edelbrock does, for around 50 bucks. You should be
able to just change the pump rod and cam sprocket, and be ok. Am I forgetting
anything else?(directed to other 460 guys) I think thats about it.


Good luck with the engine.

Later,
Scott L
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Date: Wed, 23 Dec 1998 21:44:02 -0800
From: Tim Bowman
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Fuel Inlet Hose

Rather than replace a long section of what appears to be expensive
hose, why not purchase two very short pieces and put a piece of
exhaust tubing between them? Just a thought, I'm not sure that it is
a factory-authorized replacement technique.

Tim Bowman
'71 F100
"Remember the Reason for the Season"


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Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 00:45:00 EST
From: JJJJJGRANT aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Re: Tri-Power

the 390 fairlanes were pretty quick too, one around here used to blow away all
the fat motor chevy's and some 440 mopars back in the late 60's.
also i had two buddies with two identical trucks, but one had a .060 over
390 and one had a 428, very similar modifications, the 390 outran the 428....


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