FTE 61-79 - Bed liners for a classic.....

61-79-list-digest Friday, December 4 1998 Volume 02 : Number 547

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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 61-79 - Bed liners for a classic.....
Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
FTE 61-79 - Return mail
Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
Re: FTE 61-79 - 360-390 help please
FTE 61-79 - Re: VICTORY DECLARED over FE exhaust manifold bolts!
Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
FTE 61-79 - exhaust leak
FTE 61-79 - List posting discipline
FTE 61-79 - Securing our Loving FOMOCO's
FTE 61-79 - Multiple Post of same lingo
FTE 61-79 - Re: Bed liners for a classic = a sin?
Re: FTE 61-79 - only FE's built in 1967
Re: FTE 61-79 - Idiot Lights/Split
FTE 61-79 - blow by
FTE 61-79 - rare find! 66 f250 4x4 swb, is it possible?
Re: ADMIN: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
Re: FTE 61-79 - F-100 Steering wheels
Re: FTE 61-79 - Theft
Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!
Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!
Re: FTE 61-79 - Detroit Locker
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dishonesty
FTE 61-79 - B/U Lights
Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!
FTE 61-79 - Welding (was: Complete steering failure!)
Re: FTE 61-79 - rare find! 66 f250 4x4 swb, is it possible?
Re: FTE 61-79 - Welding (was: Complete steering failure!)
Re: FTE 61-79 - rare find! 66 f250 4x4 swb, is it possible?
Re: ADMIN: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
FTE 61-79 - Water pump wobble
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dishonesty
Re: FTE 61-79 - List posting discipline
Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dishonesty
Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dishonesty
Re: FTE 61-79 - New member, New Truck, Bunch of Q's
FTE 61-79 - Re: New member, New Truck, Bunch of Q's

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Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 11:28:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: rositch

SLAC.Stanford.EDU
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Bed liners for a classic.....

Hi Guys,
I have found that the available bed liner for later model Ford trucks
('67-'72 I think) will fit the '66 if you cut a new clearance hole for
the center bed stakes. If I were to do it again, I would just get a
rubber bed mat instead (stuff really slides around on the plastic liner).

Good Luck,
Don Rositch
'66 F250
Redwood City, CA
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Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 10:40:16 PST
From: "P.J. Brusa"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help

Bryan, you know, I think I was looking at that thing last night....is it
right at the firewall with two leads on top? Looks like a small
cylinder?

Sorry, but I still do not have a service manual or chiltons yet...This
sucks.

I will check for voltage...I looked at the bulbs and they look
fine....two elements in them, just that the one does not light up,
hence, a bad switch I woudl assume.

Now, where do I find a switch to replace it with...if in fact it is a
switch and not wiring.

- -Peter

>From owner-61-79-list

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>
>Peter,
> Looks like I was close on the brake light info, but not exact.
>The switch on my truck is inside the engine compartment on the front of
>the brake cylinder. Its right there with 2 wires coming off of it and
its not
>hard to find.
>
>With key on, disconnect the wires and hook them to a voltmeter, should
>read about 12 Volts. Then put an ohm meter (or continuity testor) on
the
>switch terminals and see if its 0 or 0.1 when pedal is pushed, and
infinite
>when pedal is not pushed.
>
>The bulb number from the shop manual is 1157, but it will most likely
be
>easier if you just take one or yours down to Napa or HiLo and get one
>the looks the same. It is a double function type, so I guess there are
2
>elements in the bulb?
>
>I'll email you later with some of the other stuff we talked about.
>
>See Ya!
>
>Bryan Kirking
>66 Step Side
>352 4 speed
>Houston, Texas
>
>
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>

______________________________________________________
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Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 10:40:16 PST
From: "P.J. Brusa"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help

Bryan, you know, I think I was looking at that thing last night....is it
right at the firewall with two leads on top? Looks like a small
cylinder?

Sorry, but I still do not have a service manual or chiltons yet...This
sucks.

I will check for voltage...I looked at the bulbs and they look
fine....two elements in them, just that the one does not light up,
hence, a bad switch I woudl assume.

Now, where do I find a switch to replace it with...if in fact it is a
switch and not wiring.

- -Peter

>From owner-61-79-list

ford-trucks.com Thu Dec 3 06:32:33 1998
>Received: (fordtruc

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bcm.tmc.edu
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Return mail

Azie wrote:
The original sender's address is there if you
want to copy/paste it, so for selfish reasons I do not support the idea of
return mail going to the original sender".
Selfish - Selfish - Selfish !!! Yes.

I completely agree. I am on another list that responds to the poster and
not the list and there is hardly ever any discussion. I have learned lots,
and stored lots of emails for future reference even though I'm not
participating directly in the posting.
Bryan Kirking
66 Step Side
352 4 speed
Houston, Texas

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Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 10:40:16 PST
From: "P.J. Brusa"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help

Bryan, you know, I think I was looking at that thing last night....is it
right at the firewall with two leads on top? Looks like a small
cylinder?

Sorry, but I still do not have a service manual or chiltons yet...This
sucks.

I will check for voltage...I looked at the bulbs and they look
fine....two elements in them, just that the one does not light up,
hence, a bad switch I woudl assume.

Now, where do I find a switch to replace it with...if in fact it is a
switch and not wiring.

- -Peter

>From owner-61-79-list

ford-trucks.com Thu Dec 3 06:32:33 1998
>Received: (fordtruc

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Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 360-390 help please

Mark Heidotting [xaenon

one.net] wrote:
Just to have the
option, go check with a local machine shop about what it would cost
to have the rods/pistons/crank swapped out. It never hurts to be
ready for him.

Not a bad idea at all. But I am willing to bet the shop will say the cant
just do a rod piston crank swap without changing bearings, gaskets,
overboring, checking head flatness....I can't imagine all this being less
than the $300+ he paid for the truck.

The guy misrepresented what he sold and should take responsiblity for it.
I would expect him to take the truck back and make a reasonalbe
reimbursement for the cost Justin incurred transporting the truck.

I hope they sellor made an honest mistake and want to see the situation
resovled, but lets not round up the posse just yet...
Bryan Kirking
66 Step Side
352 4 speed
Houston, Texas

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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 11:55:16 -0800 (PST)
From: Pat Brown
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: VICTORY DECLARED over FE exhaust manifold bolts!

> Thanks to all your tips, and I used every one, I have successfully removed
> all the exhaust manifold bolts from my '68 360 without any drilling or
> easy-out. Here's what I did:

[Gory details ommited]

John! Quick! Go Buy A Lotto Ticket!
- --
Pat Brown
Sebastopol, California

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Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 10:40:16 PST
From: "P.J. Brusa"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help

Bryan, you know, I think I was looking at that thing last night....is it
right at the firewall with two leads on top? Looks like a small
cylinder?

Sorry, but I still do not have a service manual or chiltons yet...This
sucks.

I will check for voltage...I looked at the bulbs and they look
fine....two elements in them, just that the one does not light up,
hence, a bad switch I woudl assume.

Now, where do I find a switch to replace it with...if in fact it is a
switch and not wiring.

- -Peter

>From owner-61-79-list

ford-trucks.com Thu Dec 3 06:32:33 1998
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daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - exhaust leak

Rusty writes: >>I've noticed some white residue or marks on my heads where
the exhaust manifold meets up with them, is this casued by an exhaust leak
or simply the heat of the manifold turning the paint white.
The reason I ask is I have an engine noise that I thought was a bad lifter
or somthing,

You sure got the symptoms of a leak between exhaust manifold and head.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.

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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 14:13:29 -0700
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - List posting discipline

>From: Ken Payne
>Subject: ADMIN: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help
>
>This is inexcusable,

Yo FTE Gang:

I feel like I need to comment on what I see as a common self-discipline
problem on (not just) this list. I think a big part of this list's volume
is related to a lack of discipline among those of us who post.

To put it in a nutshell, when you must quote another post (say for a
follow-up or reply), please trim your post carefully.

Quoting a few lines of _relevant_ information is entirely appropriate and
helps maintain a context, but quoting 15+ lines of email routing headers or
HTML tags is a ridiculous waste of bandwidth and server resources. Come on
now! Take a little more time to a) become slightly proficient w/ your
email software so you know how its "reply with history" feature works, and
b) trim any unnecessary quoted material from your postings.

I find it especially disheartening to consider splitting this great list
and breaking up the knowledge base just because a few of us don't have the
sense to not send the same message (and its email routing headers and the
email routing headers of each and every reply to it) back and forth umpteen
times.

It's kind of like littering; it doesn't take that much time for each of us
to be more considerate, and if we all do it, it will make a big difference.

Thanks.

Dave R. (M-block devotee)

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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 16:57:43 -0500
From: am14

daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Securing our Loving FOMOCO's

John writes: >>OK, so lets say I finally get my '71 F-100 short bed
stepside with the wood
deck fully restored.

Do I need to break a sweat worrying about theft? We all know how easy it is
to get into them without a key, and hot-wiring them should also be easy
especially since the space to work in is so accommodating.

If it's a major concern, what do we do about it? It's not like we can
easily get them replaced.

It is a bit of trouble, but wiring the main hot wire to the ignition
through a few toggle switches that must be in certain positions in order
for the "hot " wire to be "hot".. also you could bring the "hot" wire in
through a relay that is operated by a hidden toggle someplace.

Many possibilities, but if they are really pro, you're gonna loose.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.

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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 17:18:01 -0500
From: am14

daimlerchrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Multiple Post of same lingo

Ken writes: >>This is inexcusable, especially with the load this list has
had. 7 identical posts (so far), all with a large quote. This user
has been removed from the s*bscriber list.

Thanks Ken --- I was about to post questioning the validity of this.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.

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Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 17:27:40 -0600
From: "Jamey Moss"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: Bed liners for a classic = a sin?

Peter,

> Ok, need some advice here. Has anyone messed with those spray-in type
> of bed liners on their trucks? Should I stay away from this type with a
> soon-to-be classic '66? I don't even know if they can be removed when
> installed....hmmm.

I have a Line-X bedliner in my 67 F100, and I love it. Sure it's not
original, but then neither is my stereo or engine or seat, etc. If
you're looking for a show winning 100% Genuine Ford original truck, then
by all means do not put a bed liner in your truck. I happen to like a
nice old truck in good condition for a daily
driver/project/hobby/occasional hauler, and I think a good quality
spray-in liner is great.

I can use my truck for hauling dirt, rocks, grass, or truck parts,
including shoveling out the dirt and scraping the shovel against the
bottom of the bed, without a single worry about scratching my paint or
doing any damage. When I'm done, I can sweep out the bed, hose it off,
and it looks great. The main reason I got mine was that I've seen a bed
rust out due to paint scratches allowing moisture to attack the metal,
and I wanted no part of that. Also, I wanted to be able to use my truck
for dirty work without being paranoid about hurting the paint.

The disadvantages of a spray-in bed liner are that they are permanent.
Someone mentioned sandblasting to remove it, but I highly doubt that
would work very effectively on the type of liner I have. Some of the
spray-in liners are softer and might blast off easier, but I think for
the labor costs of sanding or blasting the liner off, one would be
better off buying a used bed.

> On another note, does anyone know of a company who makes a plastic liner
> for older Fords? Can't seem to locate any locally or on the net.

I don't believe anyone makes a plastic liner for that body style (I
never saw one for the 67-72 either but that doesn't mean they don't
exist). I'm leery of drop in bed liners because then can trap moisture
between the plastic and the bed, inducing rust even faster, but some
people love them.

There are people that look down on the bedliner as "ruining" a classic
truck, and if you're planning to sell the truck in the future, keep in
mind that it might hurt the resell value to the purists. The bottom
line is that it's your truck, and you have to decide at some point how
you want to fix it up -- as a perfect restoration, a complete
hodge-podge of parts, or somewhere in between.

For more information on the type of liner I have, see: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.line-x.com/
I have a black liner without the over-the-rail or over-the-tailgate lip,
so you can't tell I have a liner until you get close enough to see
inside the bed. In the next few weeks I'll get a picture of the bed and
put it on my website so you can see what it looks like. If you have any
questions or comments about the bedliner, let me know.

Jamey Moss
ra4001

email.sps.mot.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.prismnet.com/~jamey/f100/

.
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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 18:49:36 -0500
From: Lord_Xaenon
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - only FE's built in 1967

At 09:19 AM 12/2/98 -0600, you wrote:
>>I wouldn't worry too much about that. The part number deciphers to a
>>1967 full-size Ford; the only FEs available that year were 390s, 410s, 427s,
>>and 428s, which all used the same-length con-rods, and only the 427 and
>>428 PI engine had special rods.
>
>I know the 352 (FE)was built in F-series trucks in the year of our Lord,
>1967. Sorry, couldn't resist.
>I have been away too long.

I stand corrected (well, sit, actually...would you believe slump?). I had
actually meant that in passenger cars, the only FEs were 390s, 410s, 427s,
and 428s, having done away with the 352 in 1966. 'Course, what I meant and
what I wrote are two different things. :>

I honestly did not know the 352 was still around in trucks that year, though.
However, I'll have to continue to deny it because God forbid I actually
learn anything! hehehe......

Thanks for the info!

Mark

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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 18:49:34 -0500
From: Lord_Xaenon
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Idiot Lights/Split

At 07:27 PM 12/2/98 EST, you wrote:
>I have both idiot lights AND gauges! The ammeter always shows charge. Will I
>cook the battery? Am I getting feed-back through the bulb filament?

It's normal to show a small amount of charge on a running engine. If it's
way the
hell over on the right for a long period of time, though, it's time to look into
things. Check the charging system voltage, it shouldn't be much above 14v.
Do this
with just the engine running, and again with all the toys turned on. Might
want to
have someone in the car nudging the gas a little to bring it up over idle,
but it
isn't really necessary.

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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 18:05:02 -0700
From: Drew Beatty
Subject: FTE 61-79 - blow by

Hello list:

I have less than 4000 miles on my new 390. I pulled the PCV valve out today
and noticed some blow by smoke coming out of the motor. I haven't had a new
motor in awhile, and I really don't know if anything is wrong or not. Is
this normal? Is expecting 100% sealing expecting too much?

Thanks for any info.

Drew Beatty
dcbeatty

rmi.net

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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 20:23:32 EST
From: JJJJJGRANT

aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - rare find! 66 f250 4x4 swb, is it possible?

today i came across a 66 ford truck four wheel drive, i assumed someone had
put the body on this chassis, but it appears to be factory, i know they made
it, but the strange thing is its all 3/4 ton drive train, front leaves, looks
like military style locking
hubs, it has a divorced t case, engine is a fe with a four speed. i heard that
ford had another co do a conversion on their earlier 4x4 trucks, is this true,
this truck is also a
short wheel base, which i find extremely odd, i can't find any evidence of the
frame being cut, and all the factory type rivets are there, thats why i don't
think its home made. its in fairly good shape, running, driving, etc. the
price is 2800.00, is it worth it? any help will be appreciated.

thanks,
jeff grant
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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 20:31:55 EST
From: CCSSportz

aol.com
Subject: Re: ADMIN: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help

In a message dated 12/3/98 2:18:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, kpayne

ford-
trucks.com writes:

7 identical posts (so far), all with a large quote. This user
has been removed from the s*bscriber list.

Ken Payne >>

Thanks Ken,
That was gettin' kind of annoying.

- -Shawn
& 'ZILLA
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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 17:37:00 -0800
From: sdelanty

sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - F-100 Steering wheels

>
> expensive. >>

Expensive? When I replaced the one in my '71, I got just the "rag"
itself for under $5 at the local parts store... less than the price
of a decent sixpack of suds. (-:

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to
recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- F. P. Jones

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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 17:37:03 -0800
From: sdelanty

sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Theft

At 08:20 AM 12/3/98 -0500, you wrote:
>OK, so lets say I finally get my '71 F-100 short bed stepside with the wood
>deck fully restored.
>
>Do I need to break a sweat worrying about theft? We all know how easy it is
>to get into them without a key, and hot-wiring them should also be easy
>especially since the space to work in is so accommodating.

Yes, worry about theft... )-:
Older trucks are a relatively high theft item. A lot of them around here
end up across the border in mexico. These trucks are durable, easy to
work on, and easy to get parts for, so they seem to be a popular item
across the border...

>If it's a major concern, what do we do about it? It's not like we can
>easily get them replaced.

Get a good alarm system! Preferably one that disables the igition
circuit once the alarm is tripped.
I think that an electronic ignition is a little harder to "hot wire"
since on a regular points ign system you only need to pop the hood
and jumper a wire from the battery to the coil, and jump the starter
solenoid and off down the road you go...
It takes about 5 seconds to get one started once the hood is open.
With electronic ign, it's at least a little harder for *most* people,
since you've got to figure out which of the wires from the spark
box to jump to the battery...
If all the wiring is hidden away in a nice wiring loom, then someone
has to cut open the loom and figure out what wire is what before they
can hotwire it. Anything that slows down the theif is to your advantage.

A hidden "igniton kill" switch somewhere is a good idea.
Someday I'm also going to add a hood release cable to mine, so the
hood can only be opened from inside the cab.

There's not much you can do to keep a really determined and experianced
theif out of your truck, but you can certainly slow them down, and/or
make it discouraging for them. Make it hard enough to steal that they
just go look for something easier...

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to
recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- F. P. Jones

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 17:37:05 -0800
From: sdelanty

sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!

> A few months after replacing the ragjoint on my 69 F250, I had a
>complete steering failure. The bracket that holds the ragjoint to the
>steering gearbox shaft relies on one bolt to fasten it into place, which
>became lose. I was very lucky there was little traffic, and I was not on the
>freeway at the time of the failure.
>
>WARNING: This special 7/16" 12 point bolt can cause serious injury or death
>if not fastened properly!

Hmmm, the bolt usually goes thru a groove cut in the side of the shaft,
so the bolt has to fall *completely* out before you loose steering.
Just being loose shouldn't do it.

>BTW: I have decided to grind a flat spot on the steering gearbox shaft, and
>weld a small piece of metal onto the inside portion of the ragjoint mounting
>bracket.

Or drill a hole thru the head of the bolt and use aircraft "safety wire"
to secure it...

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to
recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- F. P. Jones

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 20:28:52 EST
From: CCSSportz

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!

In a message dated 12/3/98 1:53:21 PM Eastern Standard Time,
danger

csolutions.net writes:

complete steering failure. The bracket that holds the ragjoint to the
steering gearbox shaft relies on one bolt to fasten it into place, which
became lose. I was very lucky there was little traffic, and I was not on the
freeway at the time of the failure.

WARNING: This special 7/16" 12 point bolt can cause serious injury or death
if not fastened properly! >>

Told 'ya so - Told 'ya so. That's watcha' get for not paying attention to me!
No, I'm kidding - glad you're ok. Glad I bought my truck in that condition,
and didn't happen to me going down the road --- Take care, have fun, and good
idea with that welding thing.....

BTW --- Anyone live anywhere near me that does welding? I need a floor welded
into the bottom of my bed.........so I can put in a liner. I took out the
plywood the **jerk** had in there, can you believe he had a !

#$%! GM &*!

#$
Bench seat rigged up in the back of the bed with SEATBELTS TOO!!!!!!! I can't
believe it - to shame to shame, how could someone shame a ford so bad as to
tarnish it with the GM symbol?? :o)

Take care all,

- -Shawn
& GM free 'ZILLA
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 20:38:38 EST
From: JJJJJGRANT

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Detroit Locker

trucks for some reason, especialy 4x4's with larger tires tend to wear out
clutch type differential over a period of time, i know of two people that had
ford 4x4's with trak locks one truck had 65000 miles on it, and it only spun
one tire, the cure was to replace the clutches. the other one had less than
50,000 miles on it, of course it was ahard 50k, pulling a trailer all the
time. that problem was cured by installing a locker.
that one was mine.and i have seen several 9" traction locks bust around the
ring gear bolts, when this happens it is a costly repair, it normaly takes out
the gear and somtimes the case.
lockers are noisy and noticeable in a car, but i never hear mine in the
truck, of course the 33" tires do drag when turning a corner when
accelerating. but no steering problems what so ever.
my 2 cents
jeff grant
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 20:53:50 EST
From: JJJJJGRANT

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dishonesty

everyone should be aware, i know of alot of 427's and 428's that turned out to
be 360's and 390's, many 429 cobra jets turn out to be std 429's, many 351m
and 400's
are thought to be 351c and many boss 302's turn out to be std 302. i've been
on many wild goose chases hoping to find that deal.
my experiences
jeff grant
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 18:03:01 -0800
From: "J.S.H."
Subject: FTE 61-79 - B/U Lights

Anyone know where the back-up light switch is
on a 76 F-250 4x4 w/C-6? On the column or the trans?
Thanks
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 21:06:15 EST
From: CCSSportz

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!

In a message dated 12/3/98 8:40:02 PM Eastern Standard Time,
sdelanty

sonic.net writes:

so the bolt has to fall *completely* out before you loose steering.
Just being loose shouldn't do it. >>

NOPE --- It can happen when it's loose. The metal grip lets loose and all you
get is a whirring (click......click.......click) really fast if you spin the
wheel with it too loose from the teeth grinding and not grabbing one another.
Been there, done that!

- -Shawn
and 'ZILLA
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 18:13:30 -0800
From: sdelanty

sonic.net
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Welding (was: Complete steering failure!)

Shawn writes:

>BTW --- Anyone live anywhere near me that does welding? I need a floor welded
>into the bottom of my bed.........

Ummmm, I dunno. Where do you live?
If you are near sonoma county, Ca, I can do it...

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to
recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- F. P. Jones

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 20:22:30 -0600
From: Jim Henjum
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - rare find! 66 f250 4x4 swb, is it possible?

JJJJJGRANT

aol.com wrote:

> today i came across a 66 ford truck four wheel drive, i assumed someone had
> it has a divorced t case, engine is a fe with a four speed. i heard that
> ford had another co do a conversion on their earlier 4x4 trucks, is this true,

Actually, I think Ford starting making thier own 4wd's in '59. Before them
there were companies such as Coleman and Mormon- Herrington that did aftermarket
4wd conversions (also on trucks other than Fords).

>
> this truck is also a
> short wheel base, which i find extremely odd, i can't find any evidence of the

There was a '65 F250 4x4 for sale around here a while ago. It had a 292, 4 speed,
and divorced t-case. I'm sure it was all factory. I'm not sure what the box
length was, but I do think it looked rather short. By the way, he wanted $2200
for his; it hac some rust, although not much for its age (especially in MN). I
think it "ran good". I wish I'd had the money.

Ross Henjum

'75 F250 4x4 - 460, NP435, NP205

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 21:22:26 EST
From: CCSSportz

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Welding (was: Complete steering failure!)

In a message dated 12/3/98 9:17:39 PM Eastern Standard Time,
sdelanty

sonic.net writes:

>BTW --- Anyone live anywhere near me that does welding? I need a floor
welded
>into the bottom of my bed.........

Ummmm, I dunno. Where do you live?
If you are near sonoma county, Ca, I can do it... >>

Oh wow, I really appreciate the offer Steve, but were a little far
apart......... you see, I live on the EAST COAST ............. :o) hahaha
Seriously though, thanks for the offer.
Anyone else? I live in Upstate NY..........Can bring it to you if you can
help.

- -Shawn
and a 'ZILLA badly needing patches in his **pants** :o)
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 18:42:21 -0800
From: Dennis Pearson
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - rare find! 66 f250 4x4 swb, is it possible?

Thanks for your message at 08:23 PM 12/3/98 EST, JJJJJGRANT

aol.com. Your
message was:
> today i came across a 66 ford truck four wheel drive, i assumed someone had
>put the body on this chassis, but it appears to be factory, i know they made
>it, but the strange thing is its all 3/4 ton drive train, front leaves, looks
>like military style locking
>hubs, it has a divorced t case, engine is a fe with a four speed. i heard
that
>ford had another co do a conversion on their earlier 4x4 trucks, is this
true,
>this truck is also a
>short wheel base, which i find extremely odd, i can't find any evidence of
the
>frame being cut, and all the factory type rivets are there, thats why i don't
>think its home made. its in fairly good shape, running, driving, etc. the
>price is 2800.00, is it worth it? any help will be appreciated.

My God! This sounds like the one I drove in Chu Lai, RVN, 29 years
ago...incredible...
See if my quart of gin is still behind the seat...
Buy it, by all means. But avoid running over anything in the roadway that
looks suspicious...

Dennis Pearson in Kennewick, WA

1962 Unibody, short box, big window--351C
1966 F250 Custom Cab, 352, 4-speed
1962 short stepside (big empty space under the hood)
I shortened this to only FT's

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home.att.net/~dlpearson/levi.htm
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 18:44:40 -0800
From: Dennis Pearson
Subject: Re: ADMIN: Re: FTE 61-79 - New '66 Ford owner...needing advice/help

Thanks for your message at 08:31 PM 12/3/98 EST, CCSSportz

aol.com. Your
message was:
> >
> 7 identical posts (so far), all with a large quote. This user
> has been removed from the s*bscriber list.
>
> Ken Payne >>
>
>Thanks Ken,
> That was gettin' kind of annoying.

Ditto. I almost got tossed off for breaking the "no flaming" guideline.
I'm so proud I controlled myself.

Dennis in Kennewick
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 20:46:55 -0600
From: Don Screen
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Water pump wobble

I recently replaced the water pump on my 1974 F100 390 V8. Has
anybody else had a problem with the pulley assembly wobbling after a
water pump change? Also have a knocking sound but not sure if it is
coming from the water pump or the right side of the engine... hard to
tell even with a mechanic's stethoscope. Would bad water pump bearings
or something similar cause this wobble? There is also about a 3 inch
spacer on the front of the pump before the fan is bolted on.

Thanks,
Don Screen
Allen, Texas

PS. Only the alternator and water pump are belted together for
troubleshooting purposes. The belts for the A/C and power steering have
been temporarily removed.
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 18:55:39 -0800
From: Dennis Pearson
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dishonesty

Thanks for your message at 08:53 PM 12/3/98 EST, JJJJJGRANT

aol.com. Your
message was:
>everyone should be aware, i know of a lot of 427's and 428's that turned
out to
>be 360's and 390's, many 429 cobra jets turn out to be std 429's, many 351m
>and 400's
>are thought to be 351c and many boss 302's turn out to be std 302.

The FE is an especially frustrating animal to identify. My friend Levi got
(what's the opposite of screwed? Unscrewed?) when he bought a truck the
owner said was a 352 (he saw the number on the head, I guess). Turned out
to be a 390! Ignorance is expensive.
At least with most of the others there are ways to identify and
distunguish externally. This might be a good chance to learn...What
external markings are there to distinguish a "cosmetic" 429 from a std 429?

Dennis Pearson in Kennewick, WA

1962 Unibody, short box, big window--351C
1966 F250 Custom Cab, 352, 4-speed
1962 short stepside (big empty space under the hood)
I shortened this to only FT's

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home.att.net/~dlpearson/levi.htm
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 19:06:18 -0800
From: Steve & Rockette Leitch
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - List posting discipline

>Quoting a few lines of _relevant_ information is entirely appropriate and
>helps maintain a context, but quoting 15+ lines of email routing headers or
>HTML tags is a ridiculous waste of bandwidth and server resources. Come on
>now! Take a little more time to a) become slightly proficient w/ your
>email software so you know how its "reply with history" feature works, and
>b) trim any unnecessary quoted material from your postings.
>

And another thing, who the heck is adding attatchments as article bodies??
it really screws with my e-mail software, as it causes problems with
downloading
I just garbage can it, so I don't know what you're asking.......

Just a hint here, try out Eudora, by Quallcom........
If I can figure it out; anyone can.......

Steve & the Rockette

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 19:21:05 -0800
From: sdelanty

sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!

>
>> so the bolt has to fall *completely* out before you loose steering.
>> Just being loose shouldn't do it. >>

>NOPE --- It can happen when it's loose. The metal grip lets loose and all you
>get is a whirring (click......click.......click) really fast if you spin the
>wheel with it too loose from the teeth grinding and not grabbing one another.
>Been there, done that!

Ackkk! Really? Have you got power or manual steering?
The manual steering box in my '71 has the groove cut in it that the bolt
passes thru, so that failure can't happen unless the bolt comes completely
out. Yours must be a different box. Sounds hazardous, I'd probably
try and improve that setup...
I'll bet your eyes got *really* big when that happened!
Glad no one was injured...

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to
recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- F. P. Jones

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 19:59:50 -0800
From: sdelanty

sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dishonesty

>The FE is an especially frustrating animal to identify. My friend Levi got
>(what's the opposite of screwed? Unscrewed?) when he bought a truck the
>owner said was a 352 (he saw the number on the head, I guess). Turned out
>to be a 390! Ignorance is expensive.

Yeah, sometimes you get lucky enough to get a good deal...
When i bought my FE, the guy *said* it was a 360. When I got
it home and opened it up, it turned out to be a 390!
I felt real good to get a worn but still running and still
"standard" bore 390 for $50. (-:

Steve
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

Experience is that marvelous thing that enables you to
recognize a mistake when you make it again.
-- F. P. Jones

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 23:06:27 EST
From: CCSSportz

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Complete steering failure!

In a message dated 12/3/98 10:24:11 PM Eastern Standard Time,
sdelanty

sonic.net writes:

The manual steering box in my '71 has the groove cut in it that the bolt
passes thru, so that failure can't happen unless the bolt comes completely
out. Yours must be a different box. Sounds hazardous, I'd probably
try and improve that setup... >>

Mine is power steering, I can't comment on the other parties' box.......
It is a 79 F-150 4x4 (Bronco) Power box, one bolt does it all, I can't make
sense of your system. I mean there is a thing, lets call it a "C" clamp, that
is below the rag joint on the column, this "C" clamp goes over the little
grooved nipple on the steering box. The interior portion of the "C" clamp is
also grooved. When the "C" clamp is placed over the nipple the grooves fit
together to literally make it one in the same......the bolt is tightened to
ensure these groves stay interlocked and tight together. So if that bolt
loosens up, the "C" clamp has the opportunity to spread out and loosen up,
causing the part to become "divorced" and thus no steering because the teeth
aren't together. and those teeth that aren't gripping each other are slipping
over one another making that click click click whirring type noise. I would
love to modify mine to ensure no separation. I'm going to take it off again,
put on a new rag joint for kicks, and maybe use some "lock tite" or similar
bolt holding stuff. I might go as far as putting a nut on the end of this bolt
(which is only threaded into the "C" clamp no nut now)....Is that a good idea
for added safety? Will it interfere with something I may not be aware of?
Also, can someone tell me how many bolts are into a rag joint?

Thanks alot for reading, I know it was winded - but thought you would like a
better understanding of my steering system, as I would yours if you would be
so kind as to write it up. ....

Thanks,
Shawn
& 'ZILLA
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Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 23:52:41 EST
From: JJJJJGRANT

aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dishonesty

casting numbers for the heads cj # DOOE-R, casting # on the block, i can't
remember what that number is.is the only way i know of without taking parts
off
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 3 Dec 1998 23:18:43 -0800 (PST)
From: draco

pacifier.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - New member, New Truck, Bunch of Q's

William S Hart wrote:
> Mark wrote:
>> Does your '73 have any blocks between the springs and axle?
>
> Yep, sure do. Unfortunately none of my web site pictures actually show
> them. I'm not sure if they're stock or not (the running gear is
actually
> 74, check out the web site for the info on that). But it seems like
mine
> are shaped like a door stop with a block on the back of them. That is
they
> are square where they are mounted to the axle, then have ramp looking
> things facing the front I think ...

> If you would like I can get my roommates digital camera and get some
pics
> in the next day or so ...

Thanks for the offer, but your description of the "doorstops" sounds
exactly like what I have except my ramp things are facing inward
toward the diff. Other trucks I have seen had them facing inward as
well. Can't figure out for the life of me what the purpose of the
"doorstop" part is.

Mark
'74 F-250 Supercab
'74 F-100 4X4

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Dec 1998 23:21:50 -0800
From: Vogt Family
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: New member, New Truck, Bunch of Q's

On Tue, 1 Dec 1998, draco

pacifier.com wrote:
>
> I've had a 1974 F-250 Supercab for a couple of years now.
> The motor is a rebuilt 390 with about 5,000 miles on it. It
> has an RV cam, Edelbrock Performer carb. and intake, and
> Walker/Dynomax headers. It passed it's last smog test (WA)
> with flying colors. It is a workhorse, but I miss having 4WD
> (had a couple of **yotas).
>
> I love the '73-'75 body style and I have just bought my dream
> truck. It is a 1974 F-100 Ranger XLT Longbed 4WD with a 360
> or 390, C6, NP203 w/part time kit. The body is in pretty good
> shape with some minor surface rust and all of the trim present
> except for the pieces around the taillights. The tailgate is
> in bad shape. I went over the body with a magnet and couldn't
> find any bondo to speak of other than a little bit under the
> left taillight. The undersides of the cab and bed have no
> rust at all. The owners manual was in the glove box!
>
> Anything that is better is coming off the F-250 and going on
> the F-100 including the motor. I hope to keep the 250 in
> running condition so I can sell it.
>
> Planning my next move has brought up a number of questions
> that I hope some list members may be able to help me with.
>
> Disk Brakes
>
> A PO put front disks on it but apparently didn't know about
> the need for the proportioning valve. I don't know how long
> he was driving it around like this. Would the damage from
> the brakes dragging be isolated to the pads and rotor or
> could heat have ruined something in the calipers? The truck
> stops really well and the rotors don't seem to be warped.
> What should I look for?

Look for heat checks in the rotors. These are little cracks that tend
to radiate away from the hub about 1/16 to 1/8 long. They will eat
pads. As far as the valve setup, you should be able to get what you
need off a truck at a junk yard although I would be tempted to go
through and by new parts since braking is a vital system. A
knowledgable parts counter guy could probably give you a hand here.

>
> Shift Kit
>
> The PO also installed a shift kit using the "stage II" parts.
> I guess this is street/strip calibration. It shifts really
> hard and does not feel good for the driveline or particularly
> good for slippery conditions like ice. What is the concensus
> on this?

I don't really know what to say but just to wait and see if it eats
U-joints and if the shift might tend to kick it sideways. I wouldn't....

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