61-79-list-digest Saturday, September 19 1998 Volume 02 : Number 452



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

FTE 61-79 - welding stuff
FTE 61-79 - Trans fluid.
Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not for Children
Re: FTE 61-79 - 360's
FTE 61-79 - Dexron
FTE 61-79 - Henry's home page
FTE 61-79 - rings
Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not for Children
FTE 61-79 - Henry's home page
FTE 61-79 - Re: 360's
FTE 61-79 - Rings
Re: FTE 61-79 - 360's
FTE 61-79 - 3rd times the charm
Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not funny
Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not for Children
Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not funny
FTE 61-79 - F-250 Steering
FTE 61-79 - 360
FTE 61-79 - Friend's Truck
Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not funny
FTE 61-79 - Internet Message
Re: FTE 61-79 - 360
FTE 61-79 - Hot running 460....more hot air
Re: FTE 61-79 - Pop Quiz, solution
FTE 61-79 - 76' questions
FTE 61-79 - Re: Transmission Fluid 79 C-6?
FTE 61-79 - Re: Pop Quiz, solution
FTE 61-79 - Rear End Seals Rear End Seals Rear End Seals

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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 07:45:49 EDT
From: NUTCH11 aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - welding stuff

hi

i know this isn't exactly ft stuff , but we're always welding things
together/cutting them on this list. i was wondering if anyone knows of an
AIRCO (airplane) welding outfit for sale. the torches are very small. i'm
interested in buying such a set.
not the tanks necessarily, just the torches . nutch11 aol.com
thanks
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:12:58 -0400
From: am14 chrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Trans fluid.

Michael Hannon writes: >>What is the best transmission fluid for a 79
f-150 with a C-6. I can't find dexron II anymore, It is all dexron III.
Help!!

Dexron III is a direct replacement for the earlier versions of Dexron and
dexron II.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:46:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: CLARE WATERMAN
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not for Children

please keep the sexist jokes off the main list



Clare M. Waterman-Storer, Ph.D.
Department of Biology
University of North Carolina
Chapel Hill, NC, 27599-3280

T: (919)-962-2354
F: (919)-962-1625


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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:12:19 -0500
From: William S Hart
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 360's

>I'm thinking of buying around a 70' F250 Camper Special. Most of these in
>good condition are Camper Specials and were only used for camping once in a
>while. Hence most of them have the 360 for towing, I was wondering how many
>of you have 70's F250's with the 360 and what kind of gas mileage you get.?
>
I actually have an F150 4x4 w/360, I was getting about 12 with the 2V on
it, I have a hunch with a 4V (that I have now) and lower gears that I
assume the camper special has that you'll be getting around 8 or 9, that's
just a guess though ...

Just my 2cents

Bill

Auto Links http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://ranger3.cc.iastate.edu/cars.html
'73 1/2 ton 4x4 Ford http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://ranger3.cc.iastate.edu/Trucks/truck.html
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:15:28 -0500
From: John LaGrone
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Dexron

The question was:
What is the best transmission fluid for a 79 f-150 with a C-6. I can't find
dexron II anymore, It is all dexron III. Help!!

Michael Hannon
mhannon mci2000.com

Michael,
I have a 79 C6 also. I believe that the Dexron III will probably work OK. I
have added it to my truck with no ill effects. I have NOT changed the fluid
totally and I can still find Dexron II. I do have to go to an auto parts
store to get it, though. The discount chains like Walmart and KMart are
usually out or quit carrying it. Hope this helps.


- -John

jlagrone ford-trucks.com
1979 F150 Custom 351M C6, only one dent left from the crash
http://www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
1988 Towncar 5.0 EFI E4OD
1979 MC under restoration (my son loves old cars, too!!!)

Dearborn iron rules!!!!!!


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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 08:19:28 -0500
From: John LaGrone
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Henry's home page

If you follow the link in my by-line, you can see Henry. All of the links
don't work yet as I am still learning my HTML editor and which file formats
work. The link to the front view works and you shouldn't get the directory
list anymore. I will continue to build my site. Thanks to those of you who
e-mailed me with your results.


- -John

jlagrone ford-trucks.com
1979 F150 Custom 351M C6, only one dent left from the crash
http://www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
1988 Towncar 5.0 EFI E4OD
1979 MC under restoration (my son loves old cars, too!!!)

Dearborn iron rules!!!!!!


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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 10:41:25 -0500
From: John LaGrone
Subject: FTE 61-79 - rings

Bryan,

If you are going to have to pull the heads, which I believe you will, and
you are going to have to re-ring one cylinder, if you can afford the
down-time, you should go ahead and rebuild the engine. You won't have to
take much more apart than what you will already have done to fix that one
cylinder. Before you buy any parts, look in the cylinder that you know is
bad. If a ring broke, it could have lodged in the side of the piston and
scored the cylinder wall to such an extent that it cannot be bored out
enough. If on the other hand the rings are just worn out and it was the
first to start leaking, the others aren't far behind. Also, I don't
remember the history of your truck, but someone may have already bored it
out and it may not be rebuildable at all.

I guess this seems a little gloomy, but replacing internal components is
not the same as say, a water pump. Even on an engine that you know what has
been repaired before, you can't tell the damage until you get it apart.

As far as the distributor is concerned, roll your engine to TDC on the
timing marks. Remove the distributor cap and mark where the rotor is
pointing. Also mark the #1 spark plug wire on the cap. You need to know
which way the distributor rotates. Note the relative location of the vacuum
advance unit to the rest of the engine. During the course of working on the
engine, you will wind up rotating the crank because the throws are going to
be in the wrong place, etc. When you put it all back togehter, your marks
and observations will let you put the distributor back in either very close
to correct or exactly backwards. If it is backwards, move all spark plug
wires around the cap towers half your number of cylinders (6 moves 3, 8
moves 4). It should run well enough to time with a light. Someone else had
a more foolproof method, but I don't remember it and this has always worked
for me.

Even if you don't replace any valves, grind them while you have the heads
off. Check your timing chain and other valve train components.

Good luck on this project.

- -John


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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 09:21:46 -0700
From: "Bill Beyer"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not for Children

Oh puh-leeze! Is there a sexist FTE list? Maybe one you can only join if
there's no hyphen in your name?

- ----------
> From: CLARE WATERMAN
>
> please keep the sexist jokes off the main list
>
>
>
> Clare M. Waterman-Storer, Ph.D.
> Department of Biology
> University of North Carolina
> Chapel Hill, NC, 27599-3280

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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 11:29:29 -0500
From: John LaGrone
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Henry's home page

OK, I'll shutup. After this. I think all of the links work. It's not fancy,
but it's a start. BTW, I used a Sony Mavica FD51 for the pictures and
ClarisWorks 5.0 on a Mac G3 for the HTML editor.


- -John

jlagrone ford-trucks.com
1979 F150 Custom 351M C6, only one dent left from the crash
http://www.ford-trucks.com/jlagrone/henry.home.htm
1988 Towncar 5.0 EFI E4OD
1979 MC under restoration (my son loves old cars, too!!!)

Dearborn iron rules!!!!!!


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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 09:41:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Pat Brown
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: 360's

>
> I'm thinking of buying around a 70' F250 Camper Special. Most of these in
> good condition are Camper Specials and were only used for camping once in a
> while. Hence most of them have the 360 for towing, I was wondering how many
> of you have 70's F250's with the 360 and what kind of gas mileage you get.?
>

I have a 70 F250 / 360 2V / T-18 / Crew cab. I average 12-13 around town,
which drops to 10-11 while towing boat (~3000 lbs) plus camping gear.
When my (17 yo) son drives it, about 9 mpg.

Pat Brown
Sebastopol, California

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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 12:41:13 -0500 (CDT)
From: bkirking bcm.tmc.edu
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Rings

John wrote:

If you are going to have to pull the heads, which I believe you will, and
you are going to have to re-ring one cylinder, if you can afford the
down-time, you should go ahead and rebuild the engine. You won't have to
take much more apart than what you will already have done to fix that one
cylinder. Before you buy any parts, look in the cylinder that you know is
bad. If a ring broke, it could have lodged in the side of the piston and
scored the cylinder wall to such an extent that it cannot be bored out
enough. If on the other hand the rings are just worn out and it was the
first to start leaking, the others aren't far behind. Also, I don't
remember the history of your truck, but someone may have already bored it
out and it may not be rebuildable at all.

Ahhh, good advice, thanks alot. You are probably correct about going ahead a rebuilding the whole engine.
I was kinda hoping to do a "minimally invasive" procedure as this is my first attempt at such repairs.
However, you have a good point about the engine being rebuilt. I believe that it has. Does this mean that
the head probably will need to be replaced? I would prefer to stay away from overboring because then I
would have to get the larger pistons ... and now things are getting even more complicated. I guess the
engineer in me likes to do things in little increments so as to minimize the likely hood of making a fatal
mistake. I will check the cylinder the best I can to determine if the head has been damaged. Hmmmm,,,
this is getting more scary!!! Much better to know in advance and be ready for the worst than to get a nasty
suprise in the middle!!
Bryan Kirking
66 Step Side
352 4 speed
Houston, Texas


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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 13:39:20 -0500
From: "Oscar Johnson"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 360's

Robert,

I've got a 71 F250 Camper Special with C6 Automatic; it gets 10 MPG on a
good day. That seems to be about average.

O.T. Johnson

- -----Original Message-----
From: Robert Houlne
To: Ford Trucks
Date: Thursday, September 17, 1998 9:04 PM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 360's


>
>I'm thinking of buying around a 70' F250 Camper Special. Most of these in
>good condition are Camper Specials and were only used for camping once in a
>while. Hence most of them have the 360 for towing, I was wondering how
many
>of you have 70's F250's with the 360 and what kind of gas mileage you get.?
>
>Thanks
>Robert Houlne
>
>
>
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>

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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 15:58:16 -0500
From: "Smith, Brian"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 3rd times the charm

If you have seen this message 3 times...please forgive me.

Brian H. Smith
1959 TR3
1972 Spitfire IV
1977 TR7
Lake Charles, LA

- -----Original Message-----
From:Smith, Brian
Sent:Wednesday, September 16, 1998 9:08 AM
To:'ford trucks list'
Subject:delurk....and a couple of questions

Dear list:

I have acouple of questions concerning my 1967 F-100. 1) whats the
differance between the '67-'72 bench seat and the "73-79 seat. I have a
chance to get a seat cover real cheap. 2) My truck has a '83 351W
installed. I don't like the way the acellerator is set up. Can I go with
an aftermarket throttle cable with the stock pedal? 3) I currently have the
heads off due to a blown head gasket (I bought the truck like that...I
didn't do it). The specs say that .003 in 6 inches of warp is acceptable.
I have what I would call a "sloppy .003" between the rear most cylinders on
the right bank (sorry, I'm not sure of the cynd.#'s). I really can't afford
to get the heads reworked right now...should I go ahead and replace the
gaskets or bite the bullet and rework the head. This is where the gasket
blew..I think. I'm going to replace the radiatorwith a new on...the DPO
only had about 5 tubes left in the Rad. (I'm guessing that's the reason for
the blown head gasket. Now I'll shut-up and rerturn to lurk mode.

Brian H. Smith
1959 TR3
1972 Spitfire IV
1977 TR7
Lake Charles, LA
and a 1967 F-100 SWB 351W and "3 on the tree"




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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 14:27:36 -0700
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not funny

>please keep the sexist jokes off the main list

It was very polite of you to say please Clare. Those suffering from
inferiority complexes and feel it will increase their self esteem
posting discriminating jokes, please find an appropriate list and keep
them off this one. The targets of your discriminating remarks are not
the only ones that find them offensive.

Deacon
deconblu gte.net http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home1.gte.net/deconblu/
==============================================
Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm
==============================================




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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 18:10:59 EDT
From: JJJJJGRANT aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not for Children

aw come on,everyone needs a little humor, at least it wasn't a red neck joke
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 18:14:29 EDT
From: JJJJJGRANT aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not funny

ok lets have a vote,who liked the joke?
i did
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 15:16:41 -0700
From: "J.S.H."
Subject: FTE 61-79 - F-250 Steering

Burt,
When I redid my '75 F250 4x4 I used the axle off a late-'77 F250 4x4
that had the
integral power steering (like the '78's and 79's). For a steering gear
I ended up
using one off a late 70's D*dge 1/2 ton 4x4. This mounts on the outside
of the
frame and the steering arm moves foward and back. I also used the
draglink off
the d*dge which had to be lengthened to keep the wheel on center. I
think you
might be able to use your front axle if you remove the power-assistor
(if it had
power steering). If you want more info just let me know.
I would be interested in more info on this, too. Did you use Ford pump
? what lines?
frame mods?what steering shaft?Etc. TIA

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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 15:20:03 -0700
From: "Robert Houlne"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 360

>I have a 70 F250 / 360 2V / T-18 / Crew cab. I average 12-13 around town,
>which drops to 10-11 while towing boat (~3000 lbs) plus camping gear.
>When my (17 yo) son drives it, about 9 mpg.

I'm a teenager myself, I know the tried and true 300six is good and my
father wants me to get that for gas milege, but they are hard to find
because they are usually the ones used to drive everyday.

So my next question is does anyone in here have a 70-75 F100/F250 with the
300 six and what is you milege? If there is a big differnce?



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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 19:16:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: FORD-TRUCK-70 webtv.net (RANDY D)
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Friend's Truck

Hello all . My best friend has a 1979 F250
4x4 totally restored ground up very nice truck . He wanted me to ask you
guys what would be a good Cam,Intake,Carb
combo for his truck . It has a 351m . This truck never goes off the
pavement . In fact it don't go out of the garage unless the sun is
shining :-) I think he is looking for more power and performance . Any
suggestions would be greatly appreciated .

RANDY
1970 F100 351W ( KNOCKING) :-(
1978 F150 351M ( DONOR TRUCK ) :-)
1960 FAIRLANE ( FOR SALE )

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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 16:10:10 -0700
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Henry Ford Joke / Not funny

>ok lets have a vote,who liked the joke?
>i did

I don't care who liked the joke, it's offensive and inappropriate.
Discussing it, I also find offensive and inappropriate. We have rated
our list as safe for children so the subject saying "Not for children"
alone makes it inappropriate for our list. Lets just drop it before
tempers flair and this get out of hand.

Deacon
deconblu gte.net http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home1.gte.net/deconblu/
==============================================
Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm
==============================================




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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 20:24:29, -0500
From: BBMZ31A prodigy.com ( MICHAEL N BIGBY)
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Internet Message

I did not read the joke, but if it is not appropiate for all
subscribers' it should not have been sent.

MIke.

____
Mike Bigby.
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 21:38:36 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 360

Well, I'm close to a teenager by the manner in which I drive! 8-) So I
can relate.. I also have a few sixes:

'93 F-150 4x4 33x12.5's 3.55 ratio 5spd- 11mpg
'78 F-150 4x4 33x12.5's 3.50 ratio 4spd 4bbl 600 carter, dual exhaust-
16mpg!
'70 F-100 4x4 235x75 4.10 ratio 4spd stock- 14mpg
'85 F-150 2x4 235x75 2.75 ratio 4spd (overdrive) 19mpg.

There's a good reference!

Tony
tony pscico.com
www.pscico.com/~tony

> So my next question is does anyone in here have a 70-75 F100/F250 with the
> 300 six and what is you milege? If there is a big differnce?
>
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 22:27:17 -0400
From: pdesanto Cinergy.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Hot running 460....more hot air

> Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 10:27:23 PDT
> From: "Don Jones"
> Subject: FTE 61-79 - Hot Running 460
>
>
> Are you using a thermostat ? If not get one in there. At that engine
> speed (3200) the water may be going through the radiatorTOO fast;not
> allowing it to cool enough. It needs that resriction to keep the flow at
> the proper rate.
>
>
>
> >> No offense, but this is a complete and total myth.





> I have seen this happen twice.
> It was my Automotive shop teacher who pointed this out to me at the
> time.IN both cases there was something else wrong with the cooling system
> (why else would you pull the t-stat?) but it can happen.
>
>
Thanx Don and others, It's true that coolant going through the radiator
TOO fast will not have time to transfer heat to the radiator fins. It's not
that big a deal usually. But if you look at the conditions the original
poster stated, he was running better than 3200 rpm in 100 degree heat for
hours at a time and carrying a load. The cooling system is designed to work
with the restriction of a thermostat. They even make orifices to put in race
car T-stat housings when not running one; so as to regulate coolant flow
for the best temp.
I too agree with "High Plains Richard" that NO thermostat is better than
one that's stuck. So I've run without em too.(till I could fix it right) But
Newton's theory of gravity plays no part in thermal efficiency. We've
replaced too many "missing" thermostats here in 25 years to think, it
doesn't happen. Phil


P.S.- Ya know what's funny? I don't think the original poster ever even
said whether he was or wasn't running a thermostat?
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 23:39:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: hurdj VAX.CS.HSCSYR.EDU
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Pop Quiz, solution

On Thu, 17 Sep 1998, Jim Cron wrote:
> >Gary....I don't *think* the coil needs to be grounded, as the current
> > travels in the "BAT" terminal of the coil, through the primary windings,
> >and out the "tach" terminal to the DuraSpark II ignition module (via
> > the green wire). No need for the coil to be grounded.
> >
> >Jim in Central NY
>
> That accounts for the primary circuit, but the high voltage circuit out
> through the coil hv terminal, distributor, plug wire, plug, block, has to
> return to the coil through the coil ground. No coil ground, no hv circuit,
> no spark. Right?
>
> Jim
> somewhere near Seattle
>
Well, not being an EE type, I really don't know. I don't think my coil
is grounded, as when I installed the Jacobs coil, it was too small for
the stock bracket, so I put a wrap of foam tape around the coil and slid
the braket over the foam tape. It runs pretty good, and I don't *think*
the coil is grounded, what with that foam tape between it and the bracket.
Can anyone shed some light on the need to ground the coil for the
secondary circut?

Jim in Central NY
'79 F-150 (302!)
'92 Topaz (3.0l)
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 21:35:30 -0700
From: "Robert Houlne"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - 76' questions

I'm reading this add:

1976 Ford Cutom F100, 300 6-cyl, 3-sp, PS, good brakes & tires, am/fm
cassette, 8' bed with bedliner, clean and straight, $1495..

This brings a couple questions up that I have.

First by 76' does Custom mean cheap or upgraded? I know like in 65' Custom
Cab was a luxury thing, is it still in 76'?

Second, on the three speed is it on the ground by 76' or is it still
3-on-the-tree?

Thanks



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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 21:45:53 -0700
From: Vogt Family
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: Transmission Fluid 79 C-6?

On Thu, 17 Sep 1998, mhannon wrote:
>
> What is the best transmission fluid for a 79 f-150 with a C-6. I can't find
> dexron II anymore, It is all dexron III. Help!!

If you read the bottle closely you will find that Dexron III supercedes
(sp?) Dexron II and Mercon. Some people even say Type F, but I don't
know about that one.

Birken
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Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 21:52:21 -0700
From: Vogt Family
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: Pop Quiz, solution

On Thu, 17 Sep 1998, "Jim Cron" wrote:
>
> On Wed, 16 Sep 1998 15:08:11 -0400 (EDT)
> hurdj VAX.CS.HSCSYR.EDU wrote:
>
> > >
> >> First thing I checked was coil mount bolt (coil has to be grounded) then
> coil
>
> >Gary....I don't *think* the coil needs to be grounded, as the current
> > travels in the "BAT" terminal of the coil, through the primary windings,
> >and out the "tach" terminal to the DuraSpark II ignition module (via
> > the green wire). No need for the coil to be grounded.
> >
> >Jim in Central NY
>
> That accounts for the primary circuit, but the high voltage circuit out
> through the coil hv terminal, distributor, plug wire, plug, block, has to
> return to the coil through the coil ground. No coil ground, no hv circuit,
> no spark. Right?

Jim from NY is right, the other end of the coil secondary is connected
to the "bat" or "+" post, so the spark is in series with the battery.
I'm not sure why this is but all the schematics I have ever seen of
coils say so.

Birken
== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 18 Sep 1998 23:59:39 -0500
From: jedolson juno.com (JOHN E DOLSON)
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Rear End Seals Rear End Seals Rear End Seals

IM have no idea what is going on. I have a '78 F250 with a Dana 60 in
the rear, and the seals will not hold, both hub, and the pinion. I can
put them in, and in a few days they will start leaking. I know im
putting them in right, had my uncle (one of theose ASE guys) check out
the surfaces on the pinion and the axle housing, and he said they were
fine, he couldnt figure why they would leak. They only leak round the....


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