61-79-list-digest Thursday, September 10 1998 Volume 02 : Number 441



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

Re: FTE 61-79 - Spray Painting
FTE 61-79 - remanufactured engines-sorry so long
FTE 61-79 - Vacuum for Booster
FTE 61-79 - painting
FTE 61-79 - painting
Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 question
Re: FTE 61-79 - Paint Spray Guns
FTE 61-79 - Sunday 13th
FTE 61-79 - More Ignition Questions
Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 question, VER or what ever it's caled :-)
Re: FTE 61-79 - RE: 300 straight six revisited
Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 question
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dura-Spark
FTE 61-79 - bouncing
FTE 61-79 - A/C brackets
FTE 61-79 - Traffic school online
Re: FTE 61-79 - bouncing
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dura-Spark
FTE 61-79 - A/C brackets
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dura-Spark
Re: FTE 61-79 - Paint Spray Guns
Re: FTE 61-79 - A/C brackets
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE PB vacum \ Dura Spark
FTE 61-79 - Different balancers on FE's????
Re: FTE 61-79 - responses

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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 08:26:24 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Spray Painting

Date sent: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 20:42:04 -0700
From: Doug Neely
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Spray Painting

> recommends. I was going to take a MIG welding course
> and after talking to the instructor found out I would be
> 350 dollars richer if I bought the book and used my own
> welder to learn at home.

This is absolutely true! I took a Tig class and all you do is practice,
practice, practice. There are good books for this but once you read it you
turn on the welder and PRACTICE! The instructor talks you through each
chapter before class and you go out to the shop and PRACTICE! I'm
looking forward to my body work for restoring my trucks. I'll start on the 78
Pickup which won't complain too much if I screw it up a few times (I can
always re-do it :-))

Of course if you don't have a welder available...........:-(

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's "The Ex-Black Hole"
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's "The Black Hole"
78 LIncoln Continental, 460, C-6, 19.5' long! "The Future.." :-)
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hoooo!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 16:22:49 -0400
From: pickup65 juno.com (Jon E Purut)
Subject: FTE 61-79 - remanufactured engines-sorry so long

This is my experience with remanufactured engines:

A friend of mine bought a remanufactured long block 302 for his 1972
Mustang from Pep Boys. It came with a one year warranty. He had to use
his existing intake, flex plate and harmonic balancer since
remanufactured V8s do not come with them. Since this was a long term
project over a year passed before he finally "fired it up." The engine
ran well but had a noticeable vibration in it. So noticeable you could
feel it while driving it and definitely bad for the engine. Well as you
would imagine the warranty was from the time of purchase not when the
engine is first fired which makes sense.

He was at his whits end and came to me for help. I went to my Machinist
and told him about the vibration and asked his opinion on a course of
action. After he stopped laughing he said that it could be a later model
crank was used which is balanced differently than the early model crank.
My friend used his early model flex plate and harmonic balancer so that
could be the problem. We had to be sure about the crank so the engine had
to come out. We pulled the engine took off the pan and loaded it up in
the back of my F100 (FTE content.)

We took the engine to my Machinist and he determined everything was the
correct year. His solution then was to match the balance of the crank,
fly wheel and harmonic balancer to one of pistons. We took the engine
back home, put it on a stand, removed what was needed and returned it
back to be balanced. The Machinist worked his magic and I picked up the
parts the next day.

In order to balance everything the Machinist had to weld a 3/8 X 1 1/2
inch round stock to the counterweight on the flex plate. We reinstalled
the parts, put the engine back in and fired it up. The engine ran smooth,
problem solved. The only thing now was the added weight on the flex plate
scraped the spacer plate between the engine and bell housing. After all
this we were not about to pull the engine again so we pulled the starter
and ground what we could and let the rest rub off naturally.

Would I buy a remanufactured engine? Even though this may be and isolated
incident I don't think so.

Jon E. Purut
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://members.xoom.com/Chelley


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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 09:35:59 -0400
From: am14 chrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Vacuum for Booster

Jim Elliott writes: >>I do have a question - can anyone with a '73-'79
with an FE, preferably with 4-barrel tell me where the vacuum line on your
brake booster connects on your engine? Actually, any FE-4barrel should be
valid, regardless of year or vehicle. I have two choices. The best looking
one is a fitting in the manifold, behind and to the right (passenger) side
of the carb.

That is the correct location.

Azie Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 08:35:09 -0500
From: John LaGrone
Subject: FTE 61-79 - painting

I've mulled over this for quite some time. The painting discussion has
encouraged me to come out of the closet. I do not recommend trying this
unless you know how to paint and paint well.

I painted Henry with Krylon in a can. It took a bunch and I didn't count
them. It was probaly not cheaper than buying paint. I already own a gun and
compressor, etc. Here is why I did it. Henry is not a show truck and never
will be. He sits outside all of the time, never garaged. I hate cleaning up
the paint gun etc. after using it. I wanted to paint one section at a time.
I couldn't afford the down time to paint everything at once. I wanted to
easily match the color later when I needed to fix a scratch. As it turns
out, I had a big scratch to fix. I was going from silver to white. White is
the most forgiving color. Black is the most unforgiving. I painted the
inside of the bed flat black. A cheaper bedliner you will not find. I
sanded everything very well, first with 240, then with 400, part with a
sander, most by hand. All panels received full primer, then the finish
coats. I never painted below 70 degrees.

The paint job looks good when you pass by. When you get up close, it is
obviously not a good professional piece of work. I have been asked to paint
several other vehicles unsolicited, which I turned down. I have seen lots
of professional jobs that I would not pay for. I used the automotive
general purpose paint originally and the regular glossy white on the door
and fender. It has been almost two years since I did the original work. I
do keep it waxed. The paint has held up very well everywhere except the
tailgate. The tailgate faces south where I park at work and catches the
hottest sun everyday. Also, the tailgate must be constructed out of
different steel than the rest of the body. I am going to repaint the
tailgate within the next 12 months.

Again, I don't recommend this at all, in fact I suggest that you do not try
it. I was prepared to repaint the whole truck if it didn't work out.
Sometimes I get lucky. I wanted something that would look reasonably good,
but that I could do as piece work.


- -John

jlagrone ford-trucks.com
1979 F150 Custom 351M C6, freshly painted, straight door; no trim yet, but
it locks and keeps the cool air in !!!!
1988 Towncar 5.0 EFI E4OD
1979 MC under restoration (my son loves old cars, too!!!)

Dearborn iron rules!!!!!!


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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 09:02:52 -0500 (CDT)
From: bkirking bcm.tmc.edu
Subject: FTE 61-79 - painting

John LaGrone [jlagrone ford-trucks.com] wrote:
>The paint job looks good when you pass by. When you get up close, it is
>obviously not a good professional piece of work.

I too did the spray paint (using touch up paint method). When I got my truck there were several places
where the clear coat had flaked off. Dirt would get under it and it looked terrible. There were also lots of
scratches and chips, especially in the bumpers, grill, and bed. I wanted mainly to protect the bear spots to
keep them from rusting. Here in Houston you can literally watch the rust form on bare metal.

I took the approach that as long as I protected the truck then I got what I wanted. If it ended up looking
better than before, I got a bonus. If it looked good then I would be happy and have an extra beer to
celebrate. Now I like to rate my paint jobs in feet. My hood and front grill are about a 3, while the bed is
about an 8. This means the hood and grill look good from about 3 feet or more away, while the bed doesn't
look good till about 8 feet.

>It took a bunch {of cans of pain} and I didn't count
>them. It was probaly not cheaper than buying paint. I already own a gun and
>compressor, etc.

I have used quite a few myself. I wished I had bought a sprayer and gun from the beginning as I could use it
for future jobs on the truck and elsewhere and I think the cost would have worked out. Also, the gun would
give a little more consistancy on the paint pattern, as each can sprays a little differently.

In summary, as long as you are reasonable about what you will get for your time, sweat, and money to put
into the painting, I don't think painting is any different than any other aspect of working on your truck. I
wouldn't expect to be able to perfectly rebuild my engine without investing time and money in tools and
understanding the techniques, and even then I would expect some problems/mistakes as I learned. But
because I enjoy working on my truck and knowing I can fix it again the next time, I do it.

I think the community college paint class route is an excellent idea.

Bryan Kirking
66 Step Side
352 4 speed
Houston, Texas


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Date: Tue, 08 Sep 1998 12:50:51 -0400
From: luxjo thecore.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 question

Gary, 78 BBB wrote:
>
> Date sent: Sat, 5 Sep 1998 08:40:32 -0400
> From: "David L. Reeves"
> Subject: FTE 61-79 - 78 question
>
> > I have a 78 f150 that we bought new in 78. We bought the f150 since in 78
> > only the f100 had smog stuff. Mine has a pcv valve and NOTHING else.
> > F250's should have been similar.
>
> I suspect you also had the EGR valve and volitile emmisions reclaimation
> tank? (or what ever the heck it's called)

My 78 bronc (non-Ca) had EGR, PCV and hot air intake off manifold. If
it had VER (or whatever it's called), wouldn't there be a factory line
back to the gas tank. I have no such line, no such fitting on the gas
tank, and do not even have clips of anything else to suggest a line was
even removed. Where on a 78 Bronco does this line go. My emission
sticker does not say it had VER either.

OX
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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 10:42:47 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Paint Spray Guns

Date sent: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 21:12:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: CLARE WATERMAN
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Paint Spray Guns

Mike, go to virtually any parts or department or hardware store and see what
they have on the shelf. If Binks is considered poor quality or less than
professional quality why are all the mfg's copying the No7 and also the
smaller one? DeVillbis makes a binks copy! Why is that? I'm not a painter
it's just that all my life all I ever heard of for painting cars was Binks this and
binks that so I'm curious? I have two binks copys which work a lot better
than the old hardware grade elcheapo I bought 30 years ago (never did do a
very good job, the copy flew right out of the box, even in my totally
inexperineced hands)

> also I need advice on body welding. I have a buzz box stick welder- can
> such a welder be used for thin sheetmetal body work, or is a wirefeed
> necessary? I have mainly used it for exhaust work and heavier.

Clare, An inexpensive 110v wire welder is all you need for this but you can
do it with the buzz box if you don't mind all the slag mess and have a steady
hand and lots of patience. I wouldn't trade my wire welder for a hundred
buzz boxes........for ANY job except very nasty rusted metal. I've used 6013
in 1/16" rod size to do some pretty thin welding but for sheet metal you want
to spot weld only and space your spots about 1" apart, alternating from one
end to the other of the seam so as not to get too much heat in one place. and
gradually fill in the spaces with more spots. I successfully welded a panel
into my van this way and after grinding the weld had no warpage and a very
small amount of bondo was all I needed to clean it up, just the weld
shrinkage pits etc.. Be carefull power sanding or grinding too, it can warp
metal, permanently and you can't "wish" it back out, darn it #$%%#$##

I don't know how pros do it but this method did the job for me. Get a good
"text" book used in classes for this and it will tell you how to use hot spots
to shrink steel, shrinking hammers and expanding hammers etc. which can
correct warped panels (with practice). Half skins still scare me but soon I'm
going to tackle some agian, hopefully with less warpage!

BTW, get a pneumatic flanger, don't try to do this with manual plier types,
you will be there all day and you won't be able to pick up your coffe cup
tomorrow because you wrist will cramp even at the thought.........I made my
own out of an old pair of linemans pliers and it did the job but oooooooooh
the PAIN!


78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's "The Ex-Black Hole"
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's "The Black Hole"
78 LIncoln Continental, 460, C-6, 19.5' long! "The Future.." :-)
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hoooo!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 07:59:18 +0000
From: Don Grossman
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Sunday 13th

Is anyone planning on going to the Fun Ford Sunday at the Great Mall in
Milpitas? It is supposed to be the second year for this event.


- --
Don Grossman
duckdon pacific.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pacific.net/~duckdon

63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.


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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 11:49:24 -0400
From: Mike and Colleen
Subject: FTE 61-79 - More Ignition Questions

Fellow Enthusiasts,
Since we are on the subject of ignitions, what is the general
consensus of the Pertronix unit and the Crane Cams XR700? I assume
that they are more reliable than points? Are they easier starting?
Depending on what day it is/moon phase, my truck will fire up right
away, or I'll have to crank it a few times. I did the 8mm
cap/rotor/wires conversion, would a new coil help (mine is original,
yellow top). I use my truck for a truck, not a hot rod or anything,
the low rpm/starting info that came up for the "high zoot ign." was
interesting. Any info would be appreciated.

TIA,
Mike


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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 12:24:29 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 question, VER or what ever it's caled :-)

From: luxjo thecore.com
Date sent: Tue, 08 Sep 1998 12:50:51 -0400
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 question

> My 78 bronc (non-Ca) had EGR, PCV and hot air intake off manifold. If it
> had VER (or whatever it's called), wouldn't there be a factory line back
> to the gas tank. I have no such line, no such fitting on the gas tank

Dang! Caught me again! Both of mine have been, shall we say abused and
"fixed" up to get by so some the the stuff is missing. Since I had seen this
on some older cars I made an assumtion but EGR, PCV, hot air intake I'm
absolutely sure of :-) I like the idea though so may add it to mine some day
anyway. Both trucks stink up the garage and this system has no effect on
performance.........amazing as that may be, the OEM's actually had a good
idea there :-)

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's "The Ex-Black Hole"
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's "The Black Hole"
78 LIncoln Continental, 460, C-6, 19.5' long! "The Future.." :-)
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hoooo!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 12:28:28 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - RE: 300 straight six revisited

Just to throw in my .02!

I have a remanufactured 300-I6 in my '78. After the original blew I went
to Western Auto and bought it because at the time I had no engine capable
of rebuilding. This I put it in right away and have been driving on it for
almost 3 years now. I have had a yearly diagnostic run on it for
compression and such and everything is fine and dandy- Keeping in mind that
this is also the engine that I have had running a 4bbl intake on (stock
internals for a long time but eventually got a cam) and have abused the
snot out of it. My 1,100 bucks I don't think could have been spent better
and I'm very pleased with the results 28,000 miles later.

The only fault I have with it is just my own insecurity in knowing it has
nylon timing gears instead of steel. I guess I'm of old rule and don't
trust plastic!

Tony

>> What is the general consensus on remanufactured engines? I'm kind of
>> leery of them

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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 10:16:35 -0700 (PDT)
From: Pat Brown
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 78 question

OX Asked:

> My 78 bronc (non-Ca) had EGR, PCV and hot air intake off manifold. If
> it had VER (or whatever it's called), wouldn't there be a factory line
> back to the gas tank. I have no such line, no such fitting on the gas
> tank, and do not even have clips of anything else to suggest a line was
> even removed. Where on a 78 Bronco does this line go. My emission
> sticker does not say it had VER either.
>

Ummmm, Vapor Recovery Canister comes to mind. I can't figure out if you
do or don't have one, but another place connected to it would be the
carb float bowl vent.

Pat Brown
Sebastopol, California

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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 14:24:47 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dura-Spark

From: sdelanty sonic.net
Date sent: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 14:20:27 -0700
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dura-Spark

> No, I think that's wrong. The red wire is the power lead for the module,
> and needs to get a *good solid 12V* from the ignition switch. Only the
> wire to the "+" side of the coil should have 8 volts (because of the
> ballast resistor).

Steve, we went over this on the bronco list and here too some time ago and I
too remembered the red wire as being the 12v wire but I was corrected by
the manuals. I'm pretty sure it's the white wire to the module that goes to the
start relay and picks up 12v and the red wire goes to the ballast resistor or
fuse link resistor wire thingy. The green coil wire comes from the module
and the red coil wire I believe is 12v also from battery but the red "module"
wire is 8v as I recall? I can bring in the book on it agian if needed?

If I usnderstand correctly the dura spark II has no retard function but the III
does. If it did I wouldn't get a kick at only 12 or so degrees of advance.
The yellow strain relief version may have this too, not sure.

I'll bring in the book tomorrow If I can remember and try to figure this out :-)

I'm going on a weeks vacation next week and will unsubscribe from all but
the perf and core lists so after tomorrow evening you guys are on your own
for a week. I expect your rooms to be clean and the lawn to be mowed and
no broken dishes and................when I get back :-)

When I return I will no longer be a single ......... I mean my daughter will be
hitched :-)

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's "The Ex-Black Hole"
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's "The Black Hole"
78 LIncoln Continental, 460, C-6, 19.5' long! "The Future.." :-)
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hoooo!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 14:45:10 EDT
From: BDIJXS aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - bouncing

I have a 69 F-100 4x4 that has been converted to 70's 3/4 ton running gear.
Along the way, I had new leaf springs made for the rear, arched to make the 3"
lift without blocks. I was hoping to minimize any wrap-up by eliminating the
blocks. In order to make up some of this lift, the guy put quite a few springs
on. I don't mind the rougher ride, but there is a "bounce" that sometimes
seems to occur right around 45 mph. It seems to get into a resonant mode until
I speed up or slow down.

There's more.

I've noticed that one of the leafs seems to be slightly sagging compared to
the other, and the spring place said it would be no problem to re-arc it. I
still need to get down there. I'm wondering if a slight difference in
stiffness between both sides could be contributing to this bounce.

There's more.

I just put on a set of 8"x16" white spokers with BFG 295/75 R-16 Radial All
Terrains. I just figured that they were out of balance, so I took them back
and the people rebalanced them (dynamically) until the machine read "zero". It
seemed to cut down the bounce a little, but not enough. I understand that they
can do a "static" balance, but would this make any difference?

The entire rear axle (Dana 60) has been rebuilt. I'm wondering if one (or
both) of the brake drums could be slightly out of balance....doesn't seem like
it could be enough to make that much difference...

I've never had the driveline balanced, could this be part of the problem? I
would think a driveline problem would be a vibration rather than a bouncing
response.

There's even more.

I also have a 1-1/8" Hellwig sway bar on the rear that contributes to the
stiffness of the system. I'm wondering if any inadvertant "pre-load" on one
side (as adjusted at the frame drop-down bracket) could be a factor as
well....

My current plan is to have the spring place do thier thing first, then follow
up with the recommendations are from this mighty list...

Colorado Jeff




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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 13:54:10 -0600
From: Jamey Moss
Subject: FTE 61-79 - A/C brackets

Bryan posted a week or so ago about A/C brackets for putting a Sanden
compressor on his FE engine that originally had a York compressor. I found
another place that sells the brackets (both the York-to-Sanden adapter and the
whole Sanden bracket). The company is Old Air Products
(http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.oldairproducts.com), and they sent me a catalog. They offer the
adapter for $38.95, and the whole replacement bracket for mounting Sandens on
FE's for somewhere around $80. The catalog lists the whole Sanden bracket as
fitting only '74-'75 FE engines, but I don't know why it wouldn't work on any
FE (anyone else know why?).

They also sell electric fans and the adjustable thermostat switch like Steve
Delanty uses on his dual electric fan setup on his website, as well as entire
A/C systems for '67-'72 Ford trucks. You'll have to ignore the strong Ch*vy
influences of the catalog, however.

Disclaimer: I don't have any connection with Old Air Products (h*ll, I'm not
even a customer of theirs yet), but I thought I'd pass on the information.


Jamey Moss
ra4001 email.sps.mot.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.prismnet.com/~jamey/f100/
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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 11:54:44 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Traffic school online

While doing some browsing, I accidently stumbled on the
"Traffic School Online" web page.

For about $20, You can now take "traffic School" at home and get
that ticket cleared from Your driving record without ever leaving
Your computer.

I'm not affiliated with them in any way, and I haven't taken the
course (haven't had any tickets for a while :-) , but I thought it
was a cool concept...

This one was for Sonoma county, CA, but probably other counties/states
have something similar.
Here's the website address for it if anyone is interested:

http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~tso/



Steve
Homepage: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

All that I needed to know in life, I learned by
killing smart people and eating their brains.


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Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 15:10:13 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - bouncing

From: BDIJXS aol.com
Date sent: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 14:45:10 EDT
Subject: FTE 61-79 - bouncing

> I have a 69 F-100 4x4 that has been converted to 70's 3/4 ton running
> gear. Along the way, I had new leaf springs made for the rear, arched to
> make the 3" lift without blocks. I was hoping to minimize any wrap-up by
> eliminating the blocks. In order to make up some of this lift, the guy put
> quite a few springs on. I don't mind the rougher ride, but there is a
> "bounce" that sometimes seems to occur right around 45 mph. It seems to
> get into a resonant mode until I speed up or slow down.

Jeff, is this a bounce you can measure as to amplitude or just a low
frequency vibration? If it's a low frequency bounce, roughly the speed of the
tire rotation then an out of round tire could be the culprit or a bent axle or a
loose shock mount or bad shock.

If it's a vibration then balance could be the culprit but drum balance is not
going to make a lot of difference unless it's really radical.

You have anti-sway bars on it so the spring imbalance should be nullified by
that but something I noticed when I added leafs to mine was that the stock
length shocks are now way too short, like at rest it's totally stretched out and
this will definitely cause a hop or bounce when unloaded and even screws up
the handling :-( (handles real nice with a load on it though)

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's "The Ex-Black Hole"
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's "The Black Hole"
78 LIncoln Continental, 460, C-6, 19.5' long! "The Future.." :-)
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hoooo!

- -- Gary --
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 12:29:40 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dura-Spark

>> No, I think that's wrong. The red wire is the power lead for the module,
>> and needs to get a *good solid 12V* from the ignition switch. Only the
>> wire to the "+" side of the coil should have 8 volts (because of the
>> ballast resistor).

>Steve, we went over this on the bronco list and here too some time ago and I
>too remembered the red wire as being the 12v wire but I was corrected by
>the manuals. I'm pretty sure it's the white wire to the module that goes
to the
>start relay and picks up 12v and the red wire goes to the ballast resistor or
>fuse link resistor wire thingy. The green coil wire comes from the module
>and the red coil wire I believe is 12v also from battery but the red "module"
>wire is 8v as I recall?

No, the red must go to 12v. The only thing that gets 8volts is the coil.
It *may* work with the red wire to 8v, but the circuitry probably wont be
able to provide enough base drive to the output transistor. That causes
sluggish rise times and may not drive the transistor to saturation.
The sluggish rise times will show up worst at high RPM, and cause weak
spark or misfire.

You seemed to think that You were having trouble with the D-spark above
4000 RPM on one of Your vehicles, right? Is the red wire on Yours
connected to 12v or 8v? Maybe You've just found the cause of that problem?
I really think the D-spark should work fine well above 4K... I've ridden
with several that showed no sign of distress up past 5K.

>I can bring in the book on it agian if needed?

Or goto: www.wrljet.com/engines/duraspark.html

That sight has a correct schematic, and good explaination of D-spark
and how to hook it up. It's a good read.

>If I usnderstand correctly the dura spark II has no retard function but the
III
>does. If it did I wouldn't get a kick at only 12 or so degrees of advance.
>The yellow strain relief version may have this too, not sure.

Yeah, D-spark II blue strain relief box has the retard. That's the white wire.
It's allegedly about 6-8 degrees at cranking speed.

Bring the book tomorrow, or goto the wrljet site.


Steve
Homepage: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

All that I needed to know in life, I learned by
killing smart people and eating their brains.


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 14:37:50 -0500 (CDT)
From: bkirking bcm.tmc.edu
Subject: FTE 61-79 - A/C brackets

Jamey Moss [ra4001 email.sps.mot.com] wrote:

>Bryan posted a week or so ago about A/C brackets for putting a Sanden
>compressor on his FE engine that originally had a York compressor. I found
>another place that sells the brackets (both the York-to-Sanden adapter and the
>whole Sanden bracket). The company is Old Air Products
>(http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.oldairproducts.com), and they sent me a catalog.

Jamey, I appreciate you passing this on, but.... Old Air is the company that I bought the AC (with Sanden
Compressor) from and they told me that I needed to find my own bracket! I dont remeber seeing
brackets for the 74 - 75 FE, what page is it on?

As you mentioned, their cataloge has lots of adapters for chevys but not so much for Fords.

The people at Old Air have been very nice and helpful. The kit seems well built and the instructions seem
straight forward but I haven't actually got to install anything yet. I am a bit disappointed in the bracket
situation but I don't expect them to know everything - and they gave me lots of places to try calling. I am
concerned that they haven't made any mention of actually hooking up the compressor belt to the engine. I
assume that I am on my own to find a double pulley to replace the original on the engine. The other option
would be to redo the engine to alternator belt with an engine to compressor belt and then a compressor to
alternator belt as the compressor has 2 slots on it.

I am planning to carefully document the process and submit it as a tech article, but first I gotta fix this blow
by problem......

Bryan Kirking
66 Step Side
352 4 speed
Houston, Texas


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 15:57:01 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dura-Spark

From: sdelanty sonic.net
Date sent: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 12:29:40 -0700
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dura-Spark

> No, the red must go to 12v. The only thing that gets 8volts is the coil.
> It *may* work with the red wire to 8v, but the circuitry probably wont be
> able to provide enough base drive to the output transistor. That causes
> sluggish rise times and may not drive the transistor to saturation.

Sound pretty good to me Steve. I'll take another look this weekend with my
trusty multimeter and see what is connected to what. The ford service
manual has a schematic but it's not as good as the Haynes one. I'll take a
look at both and see where I made my mistake :-) Could have
sworn........Oh well.........:-)

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's "The Ex-Black Hole"
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's "The Black Hole"
78 LIncoln Continental, 460, C-6, 19.5' long! "The Future.." :-)
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hoooo!

- -- Gary --
== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 16:49:41 -0500
From: Mike Schwall
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Paint Spray Guns

>Mike, go to virtually any parts or department or hardware store and see what
>they have on the shelf. If Binks is considered poor quality or less than
>professional quality why are all the mfg's copying the No7 and also the
>smaller one? DeVillbis makes a binks copy! Why is that? I'm not a painter
>it's just that all my life all I ever heard of for painting cars was Binks
this and
>binks that so I'm curious? I have two binks copys which work a lot better
>than the old hardware grade elcheapo I bought 30 years ago (never did do a
>very good job, the copy flew right out of the box, even in my totally
>inexperineced hands)
>-- Gary --

Most don't buy their spray guns at department, hardware, or auto parts
stores. At least that was the reply I got when I asked the instructor if
the local auto parts chains had spray guns (BTW, Napa does carry Sharpe).
For your good high quality guns I was told to go to auto paint stores and
other places where automotive paints (like Du Pont, PPG, Nason Sherman
Williams, etc.) are sold. Binks was yesturdays gun. Today, Sata is on the
top of the list. Next would be DeVilbiss then Sharpe (depends on the
model). This information is from the instructor who has been painting cars
professionally for over 30 years. The Sata copies go for $400 and the true
Sata guns are a little higher. Take a look at the painting 101 BBS that
was mentioned in earlier postings.

Mike

_____________________________________________

Email: mschwall texas.net or mike fordfan.org
Home Page: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://mschwall.home.texas.net
FORD FAN SITE: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.fordfan.org

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 17:20:24 -0500
From: "Nils Gore"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - A/C brackets

I've seen miscellaneous brackets, pulleys, etc. for sale in the Vintage Air
catalog. They have a web-site at
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.vintageair.com.

Nils Gore

- ----------
>From: bkirking bcm.tmc.edu
>To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com;
>Subject: FTE 61-79 - A/C brackets
>Date: Thu, Sep 10, 1998, 2:37 PM
>

>Jamey Moss [ra4001 email.sps.mot.com] wrote:
>
>>Bryan posted a week or so ago about A/C brackets for putting a Sanden
>>compressor on his FE engine that originally had a York compressor. I
found
>>another place that sells the brackets (both the York-to-Sanden adapter and
the
>>whole Sanden bracket). The company is Old Air Products
>>(http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.oldairproducts.com), and they sent me a catalog.
>
>Jamey, I appreciate you passing this on, but.... Old Air is the company
that I bought the AC (with Sanden
>Compressor) from and they told me that I needed to find my own bracket! I
dont remeber seeing
>brackets for the 74 - 75 FE, what page is it on?
>
>As you mentioned, their cataloge has lots of adapters for chevys but not
so much for Fords.
>
>The people at Old Air have been very nice and helpful. The kit seems well
built and the instructions seem
>straight forward but I haven't actually got to install anything yet. I am
a bit disappointed in the bracket
>situation but I don't expect them to know everything - and they gave me
lots of places to try calling. I am
>concerned that they haven't made any mention of actually hooking up the
compressor belt to the engine. I
>assume that I am on my own to find a double pulley to replace the original
on the engine. The other option
>would be to redo the engine to alternator belt with an engine to compressor
belt and then a compressor to
>alternator belt as the compressor has 2 slots on it.
>
>I am planning to carefully document the process and submit it as a tech
article, but first I gotta fix this blow
>by problem......
>
>Bryan Kirking
>66 Step Side
>352 4 speed
>Houston, Texas
>
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>


== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 18:51:13 -0400
From: "Ted C. Freeman"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE PB vacum \ Dura Spark

What about the Pertronix Ignitor? I've been cotemplating that.
- -----Original Message-----
From: J.S.H.
To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 1998 5:20 AM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - FE PB vacum \ Dura Spark


> I used the fitting behind the carb and to the right for my brakes and
>it works
>fine. Put a T fitting in it and run my heater controls off of it too.
> When I had Dura Spark ignition I always carried a spare control box
>under
>my seat.Had to use it twice too,but given the choice I'd take the Dura
>Spark
>over points ignition.
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 19:16:37 -0400
From: Joe & Jen DeLaurentis
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Different balancers on FE's????....

---

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