61-79-list-digest Friday, July 17 1998 Volume 02 : Number 375



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

Re: FTE 61-79 - FTE vultures descend on Windsor Pick'n'Pull!
Re: FTE 61-79 - oil pressure gauge
Re: FTE 61-79 - 63 F-100 Front Wheel Cylinders
FTE 61-79 - Re: FTE Screen Saver
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage
FTE 61-79 - Rims
FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
FTE 61-79 - Rockers
FTE 61-79 - Frame widths
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Steering column turn signal collar instillat ion problem
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
FTE 61-79 - RE: 460/NP435 into my 62
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage
Re: FTE 61-79 - Rockers
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE Holley Tweaks
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE Holley Tweaks
Re: FTE 61-79 - Rims
Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE Holley Tweaks
FTE 61-79 - Dana 44 question
Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dana 44 question
Re: FTE 61-79 - Dana 44 question
FTE 61-79 - Fun at Pick'n'Pull...
FTE 61-79 - Re: ADDING BELLY TANK

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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 16:48:38 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FTE vultures descend on Windsor Pick'n'Pull!

>[grunting and chanting deleted]

>> Excellent! Is 8:30 friday morning good with You guys?

>See you there . . .
>
>Pat Brown

Cool, I'll be the longhair with glasses driving a '71 flairside...

>Sebastopol, California \\ 84 and dropping at 3:30 pdt ///

84? You bum! It's 4:40 now and just down to 100 in Geyserville!
It made 106 here today! Ackkk!

Steve
Homepage: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 15:58:12 -0700
From: Pat Brown
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - oil pressure gauge

John_Waldeck idx.com wrote:
>
> To: 61-79-list
>
> I have a '77 straight 6 manual transmission...the oil pressure
> gauge doesnot work...
[snip]
> so I don't trust the gauge, etc. So does
> anyone know how to test the sending unit ?

Disconnect the sending unit, short the wire to ground. Turn on the
key, gauge should climb to "H", or higher. If not, check instrument
regulator. If Fuel and temp gauges are OK, then regulator is good.
Check printed wire unit on dash for cracks / open circuit, then
suspect gauge.

Pat Brown
Sebastopol, California


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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 16:14:17 -0700
From: Pat Brown
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 63 F-100 Front Wheel Cylinders

David Thornton wrote:

[snip]

> I'm still curious however to find out if the front cylinders for my
> '63 F-100 were originally single-ended and if so,why? It seems to me
> that the front wheels do most of the braking. If this is the case I
> would think double-ended cylinders on the front would increase braking
> power. If Ford wanted to save money why not put the single-ended
> cylinders on the rear? Also what change was made after SN# 260,001 that
> required a change in front wheel cylinders for a short period of time?

You almost answered your own question. Front axle brakes due supply most
of the stopping power, a single-ended cylinder pushing forward is
self-actuating, that is the rotation of the drum actually pulls the
shoe tighter against the drum, a form of positive feedback. Ever
notice on a double-ended cylinder that the lining is shorter on the
front shoe? The front shoe is self-actuating, the rear shoe is pushed
away from the drum by the rotation (negative feedback). More material
is required to balance the response of the rear shoe to the front. Why
change? Hmmm, just normal engineering. I would guess they thought they
were going to save money, but in reality they had more (warranty=$$)
problems. The more positive feedback the brakes have, the easier they
lock up. That would explain lack of single ended cylinders on the rear
AXLE, as rear brakes on unloaded trucks tend to lock up. Another
explaination may be addition of power brakes to the pick-up line?
When did power brakes appear on smaller trucks?

Pat Brown
Sebastopol, California


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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 21:01:39 EDT
From: BlueOval77 aol.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: FTE Screen Saver

I downloaded the screen saver file only to find out you need Win95 to run it!
If you ever decide to make a 16-bit version for all us diehard 3.x users
Brett, please let me know.

John
91 Mustang GT
77 F-150 Ranger 4x4
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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 22:09:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: hurdj VAX.CS.HSCSYR.EDU
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage

On Thu, 16 Jul 1998 sdelanty sonic.net wrote:

>
> >Ken Schneider wrote:
> >>
> >> Any clues on my gas milage? I have a stock rebuilt 360, 2bbl, C6, and 3.25
> >> gears in the rear of my F-100. I'm getting 9 miles to the gallon if I'm
> >> easy on her.
>
> Pat replies:
> >Let's compare. I have an F-250, crew cab (5000 lbs), 360, 2 bbl, T-18,
> >3.73. I have no p/s (maybe next week:-), no a/c, and I drive 15 miles
> >each way to work. The first mile and the last mile is hilly. About half
> >my drive is country (no lights / stop signs), the other half congested
> >city stop/go.
> >
> >My overall mileage for the last year or so is 12.5, with a few tanks at
> >14, which drops to 10 when heavilly loaded (~3000 lb boat, 2/3 people,
> >60-65 mph). I suppose the bigest difference is the tranny, but your
> >gears should help out at 55-70. Do you drive lots of hills? Use A/C?
>
> Steve adds:
> I've got a '71 F100, 390, Ebrock 4bbl, T-18, 3.50:1. No A/C.
> Uphill, downhill, loaded, empty, city, freeway, lightfoot, leadfoot,
> doesn't seem to matter... always gets 12.0-12.5.
> I think a higher compression ratio would help some. 8:1 sucks...
>
Jim says:
I am almost embarssed to say what I get for mileage, but my truck is
not FE powered :( and is not heavy duty, (2wd) and has an easy life. It is a
'79 F-150 with the little 302, 4-speed O/D tranny, 2.75's and 235/70's,
PS/PB, cap, and weighs in at 4450# (no A/C). Bought it brand new, and
when we rebuilt the engine (at 144k miles, has 180k on it now), we put in
a 204/214 cam, hyperutectic pistons, gapless rings, a little head work to
bring the compression up to 9.0:1, roller-trunnion rockers and headers.

Last year (no winter driving) i averaged 20.2 mpg for the year. (So far
this year I have averaged 20.5) Three weeks ago I had to run down near
Pittsburg to a funeral and got 22.3 mpg (670 miles round trip, nearly all
interstate roads), and two weeks ago had *another* funeral in Dunkirk, NY,
452 miles round trip and got 22.6 mpg. I guess I like my wimpy little 302!

Somebody (was that you, Steve?) gave some good advice regarding fuel
mileage. I found mine in the carb (pull that power valve out and check
it with a vacuum pump! And be sure its opening vacuum is below your
cruise vacuum.) Also found some inside the distributor. Modify the advance
curve to optimize not only your combination, but your climate, terrain and
driving style.) And crank in as much vacuum advance as you can until you
get light pinging on tip-in, then tighten it up about one turn. A lot of
the Ford vacuum advance cans are adjustable. Best thing you can do is get
an old vacuum advance can and cut it open to see how the adjustment works.

And finally, get the tape measure out and tripple check that toe-in. I
run 1/16". And just for kicks, put that tape on the rear axle, just to make
sure it isn't sprung.

IMHO, you can *always* imporve your mpg!

Jim in Central NY
'79 F-150 (302!)
'92 Topaz (3.0l)

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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 19:04:04 -0700
From: Aaron Jacobson
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Rims

Hey Marko where did you by those Marshalls and rims?
Jake in B.C.
65 250 Camper Special(flat black and still going)
351c
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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 23:18:46 -0400
From: Joe & Jen DeLaurentis
Subject: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

Group,
with my 68 haveing a dana 44 upfront and the 76-79 ford dana's
had disc brakes can I swap out the spindles from a 76-79 and bolt them
on my 68..or do i need to swap the whole axle????
- --
Joe
Aka. Fordguy
1968 F-100 4x4 302 Np435 Bone Stock down to the wheel covers
1970 F-250 4x4 390 Np435 The Beast
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://web.p3.net/~shoman
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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 22:23:16 -0500
From: "Michael R. Masse"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage

How do you tell when the opening vacuum is below cruise vacuum?? And
how
do you adjust it if it's not? Different power valve?

> Somebody (was that you, Steve?) gave some good advice regarding fuel
> mileage. I found mine in the carb (pull that power valve out and check
> it with a vacuum pump! And be sure its opening vacuum is below your
> cruise vacuum.)

-Mike
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Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 21:55:00 +0000
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

Joe & Jen DeLaurentis wrote:

> Group,
> with my 68 haveing a dana 44 upfront and the 76-79 ford dana's
> had disc brakes can I swap out the spindles from a 76-79 and bolt them
> on my 68..or do i need to swap the whole axle????
> --
> Joe
> Aka. Fordguy

68 Should be closed knuckle right? If it is you will be better off
swapping out the whole axle. If it is an open knukle you will have to
swap from the knuckle out. The drum and disk spindles are different but
that is not the problem. The caliper support is designed to bolt on with
the disk spindles and knuckles.

Laters
- --
Don Grossman
duckdon pacific.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pacific.net/~duckdon

63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.


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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 00:36:48 -0600
From: "Michael White"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage

>Any clues on my gas milage? I have a stock rebuilt 360, 2bbl, C6, and 3.25
>gears in the rear of my F-100. I'm getting 9 miles to the gallon if I'm
>easy on her. I usually go about 15 miles each way between work, between
>55-70. It seems I recall someone mensioning a distrubutor out of a
>different FE would be better? What about Pertronix electronic conversion?
>
>Ken
>
>68 F100 360, C6
>

.....................

You should be able to get a little better than 9 MPG if everything was
new or rebuilt, but that would probably cost more than it's worth. Maybe a
simple tune-up kit would pay off for you (plugs+wires, distributor+carb
diagnostic). Have you closely inspected the entire fuel system for any signs
of leaks?
Although I do have a 1969 F250 360, C6, 4.10, I have not tested it's MPG
(converting to 4 barrel soon). I have tested my 69 F250 390 4 barrel (std
Autolite distrib, Holley 1850, high energy comp cam, comp hooker headers, 3"
exhaust), T18, Posi 3.55, and I recently got 10.2 MPG during aggresive
(that's my holeshot!) city driving and some towing (only 3,000 miles on
entire drivetrain). My last highway MPG test on the 390 came up around 14
MPG at 70 MPH (after replacing leaky fuel selection valve), but I'm still
not convinced of the results myself, so I will retest the highway MPG very
soon and post the results. When the 390 recently passed state inspection +
emmisions, I was told that the mixture was slightly rich, so I may downjet
the carb before the next highway MPG test.

Michael
SLC Utah

69 F250 360 auto
69 F250 CS 390 T18 Posi 3.55


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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 08:46:58 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

Actually- Wouldn't the 68 have king-pins and the 76-79 have ball joints
making the swap impossible? Also- Disc brakes were used in '73 if I
remember correctly- one of the revisions for the new body style?

Tony
tony pscico.com
www.pscico.com/~tony

At 09:55 PM 7/16/98 +0000, you wrote:
>Joe & Jen DeLaurentis wrote:
>
>> Group,
>> with my 68 haveing a dana 44 upfront and the 76-79 ford dana's
>> had disc brakes can I swap out the spindles from a 76-79 and bolt them
>> on my 68..or do i need to swap the whole axle????
>> --
>> Joe
>> Aka. Fordguy
>
>68 Should be closed knuckle right? If it is you will be better off
>swapping out the whole axle. If it is an open knukle you will have to
>swap from the knuckle out. The drum and disk spindles are different but
>that is not the problem. The caliper support is designed to bolt on with
>the disk spindles and knuckles.
>
>Laters
>--
>Don Grossman
>duckdon pacific.net
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pacific.net/~duckdon
>
>63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.
>
>
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 08:41:36 -0400
From: am14 chrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Rockers

Bob Herring writes: >>Do you know of a rocker arm interchange for the 400?
I overhauled a 77 400 out of a pickup to put in my 72. I have had all kinds
of trouble getting it timed. It back fires like a valve is open. It tests
fine on a compression test and the timing chain has been checked 3 times.
It has the original distributor.

I'm not very knowledgeable of the 351M/400. I'll let those in the know
jump in here.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 08:49:10 -0400
From: am14 chrysler.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Frame widths

There was a message about Frame widths sent to the List yesterday by me
that was meant for my Son. Sorry about that.

Azie
Ardmore, Al.


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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 09:15:00 -0400
From: "Hammell, John"
Subject: Subject: FTE 61-79 - Steering column turn signal collar instillat ion problem

John, I have replaced the shift lever and turn signal collar on my
67F250, I believe you said yours is a 76, so I am not sure how similar
these units are. I also had trouble "linking" up the shift collar with
the turn signal collar,it didn't seem to sit flush, but worked pretty
well when I got it all back together. You may be missing a washer or
two, again, I am not even hardly an expert on this but you may be able
to get an exploded picture of this from you local Ford dealer. I just
had my whole column rebuilt(that story is in the progress!) and when
they shipped it back the shift collar and turn signal unit was already
together, and seems to "link" up nicely.
Anyway, hope this is even a small bit of help. It feels good for a
change for me to be able to give out some help rather than me always
begging the "Great Ford Minds" of this list!!!!!!

John Hammell
67F250
83F150
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 09:27:41 EDT
From: JUMPINFORD aol.com
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

Actually the 73 still had closed knuckles with drum brakes, atleast the f-250
did, If I were you I'd switch the whole axle. Open knuckle frontends are
much easier to truss for added strength
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 09:39:08 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

oops! Are we talking 1/2 or 3/4 ton here?

Tony

At 09:27 AM 7/17/98 EDT, you wrote:
>Actually the 73 still had closed knuckles with drum brakes, atleast the
f-250
>did, If I were you I'd switch the whole axle. Open knuckle frontends are
>much easier to truss for added strength
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 07:02:49 +0000
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

Tony Marino wrote:

> oops! Are we talking 1/2 or 3/4 ton here?
>
> Tony
>
> At 09:27 AM 7/17/98 EDT, you wrote:
> >Actually the 73 still had closed knuckles with drum brakes, atleast the
> f-250
> >did, If I were you I'd switch the whole axle. Open knuckle frontends are
> >much easier to truss for added strength
> >== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html

1/2 ton 4x4's
- --
Don Grossman
duckdon pacific.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pacific.net/~duckdon

63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.


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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 10:47:27 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage

> Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 22:23:16 -0500
> From: "Michael R. Masse"
> Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage

> How do you tell when the opening vacuum is below cruise vacuum??
> And how do you adjust it if it's not? Different power valve?

If you run a Holley on a truck you should have a two stage power
valve. Settings of 5 and 10 are pretty generic to trucks with stock
cams but you need to actually put a vacuum gauge on the manifold and
drive it on level roads to determine the actual vacuum you have. If
you've never done this it will be a learning experience. Pretend you
are the power valve and picture yourself opening up and sucking in
large volumes of gas every time you see the needle drop below it's
value, say 10". You may be very surprised to learn how much of your
driving time is spent below 10". Something a vacuum gauge will teach
you is how to keep a steady throttle foot :-)

When you determine this value remember to take an average a bit lower
than your best reading under stabilized load. The slightest movement
of your foot will affect the needle and in normal driving you will be
dipping the needle quite a bit so you need to make a conservative
estimate of the average value. If on a level road with no wind you
can get it to hang at 16 like I can most of the time then let it hit
a bit of a hill and see how much it drops making your best effort to
keep it steady and at a steady speed. You may be surprised at the
drop :-) I haven't looked at mine yet but when I do I will be
considering something in the line of 10 - 12 top and 3 - 5 bottom and
may try leaner ones if this works well. Performance is the tell
tale. If you ease down on the gas and it stumbles then it may be
too lean.

Buy a power valve with the upper value a bit lower than your cruise
vacuum. If you cruise at 12 (calculated average) then 10 should work
but as mentioned you should put a vacuum gauge and pump on it to test
the opening vacuum at both stages to make sure it does what it's
supposed to do. If it's too rich you won't get the economy you want
and if it's too lean you will have flat spots in the rpm range you
normally use on the highway.

If you use a single stage you will be running too rich most of the
time due to the weight of the truck since this causes you to apply
more throttle to accellerate even mildly and can get into the power
valve pretty easily......or......you will run too lean at a point
that can damage the engne (WOT) because you lowered the value too
much to keep out of it at cruise. With a two stage you get partial
opening at moderate drops and still get full open at a good point for
heavy throttle.


78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hooo!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 10:50:51 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

> Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 08:46:58 -0400
> From: Tony Marino
> Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

> Actually- Wouldn't the 68 have king-pins and the 76-79 have ball
> joints making the swap impossible? Also- Disc brakes were used in
> '73 if I remember correctly- one of the revisions for the new body
> style?

Two wheel drive ford trucks have never had wish bone suspension as
far as I know? Either straight axle or twin I beams both take king
pins.

Four wheel drives have had trunion bearings and ball joints as far as
I know.

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hooo!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 07:53:38 -0700
From: tom
Subject: FTE 61-79 - RE: 460/NP435 into my 62

Jim
I don't know if the frame of an F350 is the same as an F100 but I used a
Transdapt motor mount cross member (from Whitney) to put in my 360/NP435
into my 62 F113.
Due to 4x4, I needed it a little higher than usual so fabbed up some
mount adapters out of 3", 3/8" sq tube. Worked great! also added a cross
beam in back for the rear mount on the tranny
Tom
Reno,NV

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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 11:13:28 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

Huh?

I don't remember saying anything about 2 wheel drive, or wishbone for
that matter! 8-) You're not trying to bring a C***y principle into this
conversation are you!

Tony

>> Actually- Wouldn't the 68 have king-pins and the 76-79 have ball
>> joints making the swap impossible? Also- Disc brakes were used in
>> '73 if I remember correctly- one of the revisions for the new body
>> style?
>
>Two wheel drive ford trucks have never had wish bone suspension as
>far as I know? Either straight axle or twin I beams both take king
>pins.
>
>Four wheel drives have had trunion bearings and ball joints as far as
>I know.
>
>78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
>78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
>78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!
>9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hooo!
>
>-- Gary --
>== FTE: Uns*bscribe and posting info www.ford-trucks.com/faq.html
>
>
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 11:45:17 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

> Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 11:13:28 -0400
> From: Tony Marino
> Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

> I don't remember saying anything about 2 wheel drive, or wishbone
> for
> that matter! 8-) You're not trying to bring a C***y principle into
> this conversation are you!

Ok, if you were refering to 4wd then where do the king pins fit in?
I know about trunion bearings and ball joints but no king pins?


78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!
9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hooo!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 12:13:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: hurdj VAX.CS.HSCSYR.EDU
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage

On Thu, 16 Jul 1998, Michael R. Masse wrote:

> How do you tell when the opening vacuum is below cruise vacuum?? And

See Gary's excellent post about driving with a vacuum gauge.

> how
> do you adjust it if it's not? Different power valve?

Yes.

Jim in Central NY
'79 F-150 (302!)
'92 Topaz (3.0l)
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 13:00:46 -0400
From: "David Butts"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Rockers

I've got 30.5 degrees BTDC on my 351M to get it to run right. At 8 it just
sputters and crys. I believe the reason I need so much timing is the new RV
CAM. The balancer could have slipped, or the new cam could be internally
different.
- -----Original Message-----
From: am14 chrysler.com
To: 61-79-list Ford-trucks.com
Date: Friday, July 17, 1998 8:48 AM
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Rockers


>Bob Herring writes: >>Do you know of a rocker arm interchange for the 400?
>I overhauled a 77 400 out of a pickup to put in my 72. I have had all kinds
>of trouble getting it timed. It back fires like a valve is open. It tests
>fine on a compression test and the timing chain has been checked 3 times.
>It has the original distributor.
>
>I'm not very knowledgeable of the 351M/400. I'll let those in the know
>jump in here.
>
>Azie
>Ardmore, Al.
>
>
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>

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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 10:23:41 -0700
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE Holley Tweaks


>
All right you guys, help me out here.

I have a 360 with an rv cam (really mild tho) and duraspark. I have a 6919
Holley on it (Jim Hurd will remember) into which I put a 10.5/5" two stage
power valve, to replace the stock 12.5/5 one. I also jetted down to .062".
I recently discovered a ruptured vacuum advance so I fixed it (10 initial,
about 34 total, it was a stock Ford one off another truck and I didn't want
to bother shimming it).

Then I checked the idle screws. These are backwards as you know (emission
carb). Outward to lean. Anyway, the truck ran best with the screws pretty
much all the way IN. They are out 3/4 turn and that's all.

I checked the accel pump and there looks like there's a bit of clearance at
idle.

Now the truck idles nice, a bit chunky. The exhaust is louder. At WOT the
thing just flies. I had no idea I had so much power under the hood. From
idle to cracked open it works fine.

Trouble is, at about mid range off-idle operation, I get a big bog when
trying to accelerate. It almost feels like the thing bogs until the first
stage of the power valve kicks in (the 10.5 one).

Now, I think that I could figure that out by seeing where on the vacuum
gauge the bog shows up. But can anyone save me a step or two?

Is 0.062 too small a jet size? Is it normal for the idle screws to be set
all the way in?? How much clearance shud there be on the accel pump at
idle?

Anybody else had this problem?


thanks,

marko in vancouver
marko dsm.ca

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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 10:34:27 -0700
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE Holley Tweaks

Just a follow-up:

As I said, I had a ruptured vacuum advance diaphragm which I fixed. So, I
figure the bog now might be caused by there being more vacuum at off idle.
In other words, when you opened up the throttle before, the metering block
vacuum port became a vacuum leak, and vacuum dropped accordingly. But
since the carb was set up to compensate, everything was okay. In other
words, the 10.5 stage would open up almost right away cuz the vacuum would
drop due to the ruptured diaphragm.

Now that the vacuum doesn't drop cuz the diaphragm is ok, the power valve
doesn't open as soon, so there's a leanness (confirmed by an occasional
backfire when cold) at this point, causing the bog.

Whadayathink?


thanks,

marko in vancouver
marko dsm.ca

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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 10:55:19 -0700
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Rims

At 07:04 PM 16/07/98 -0700, you wrote:
>Hey Marko where did you by those Marshalls and rims?
>Jake in B.C.
>65 250 Camper Special(flat black and still going)
>351c
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>
OK Tire on Main St. here in Vancouver. I'm sure there's a few of them on
the island. The old guy who used to run that location retired (no pun
intended) and the new owner is an (deleted), he even wanted to charge me
for tire rotation cuz he said the previous owner of the franchise sold out
and he didn't have to honor promises like that.

I convinced him to do the job, but if I hadn't been so busy I woulda spat
in the guy's face and left. And I'm a nice guy, don't get me wrong.

The franchise is only as good as its owner, and the previous owner of that
store was absolutely great.

But anyway, now you know. OK Tire carries Marshal. If you find one run by
a decent, honest guy you'll do well.

marko in vancouver
marko dsm.ca

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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 14:12:23 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - questions on DANA 44

Gary,

I'll blame it on my incompetance for lack of a better word. Sorry, My
apologies- The post originally suggested taking the knuckles and swapping
as a possibility, I was just mentioning that I didn't think that possible
'cause of the difference in the way the spindle attaches to the axle.

Tony

>> I don't remember saying anything about 2 wheel drive, or wishbone
>> for
>> that matter! 8-) You're not trying to bring a C***y principle into
>> this conversation are you!
>
>Ok, if you were refering to 4wd then where do the king pins fit in?
>I know about trunion bearings and ball joints but no king pins?
>
>
>78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
>78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
>78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!
>9000#, in ground vehicle lift, Woooo Hooo!
>
>-- Gary --
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 13:21:10 -0600
From: "Michael White"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE Holley Tweaks

>I checked the accel pump and there looks like there's a bit of clearance at
>idle.

How much clearance shud there be on the accel pump at
>idle?
>
>marko in vancouver

..........

According to "Super Tuning And Modifying Holley Carburetors" by Dave
Emanuel, there should not be any play in the accel pump linkage at idle. I
belive a pair 3/8" wrenches will snug it up for you.

Michael



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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 16:35:40 -0400
From: Joe & Jen DeLaurentis
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Dana 44 question

WEll it seems like i started war and still have no answer ...
its a 68 4WD dana 44 I want to swap 76-79 Dana 44 disc brakes
onto my dana 44 drum brake rear????A yes or no answer will work
to this question...Also anybody have a dana 44 front end for sale?
- --
Joe
Aka. Fordguy
1968 F-100 4x4 302 Np435 Bone Stock down to the wheel covers
1970 F-250 4x4 390 Np435 The Beast
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://web.p3.net/~shoman
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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 14:15:14 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - FE's & Gas Milage

>> How do you tell when the opening vacuum is below cruise vacuum??
>> And how do you adjust it if it's not? Different power valve?

>If you run a Holley on a truck you should have a two stage power
>valve. Settings of 5 and 10 are pretty generic to trucks with stock
>cams but you need to actually put a vacuum gauge on the manifold and
>drive it on level roads to determine the actual vacuum you have. If
>you've never done this it will be a learning experience. Pretend you
>are the power valve and picture yourself opening up and sucking in
>large volumes of gas every time you see the needle drop below it's
>value, say 10". You may be very surprised to learn how much of your
>driving time is spent below 10". Something a vacuum gauge will teach
>you is how to keep a steady throttle foot :-)


I agree with Gary... A sucuum gauge is a real handy thing for tuning,
and for learning "better mileage driving technique".
I've got one in my F100, and on flat, level 70mph cruise it reads
about 16". It's amazing tho how little extra throttle opening it takes
to drop it into the 0-5" range...
I've currently got a set of 7" enrichment springs in my edelbrock carb
and I may swap in a set of 4 or 5" springs next time I've got the
air cleaner off.
It only takes about 2 minutes to swap in a different set with the e-brock,
and the calibration kit comes with 3,4,5,7,and 8" springs.
I sure do love a carb that's easy to tune without spewing gas all over
the place every time I wanna change something.. (-:

Steve
Homepage: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 14:20:22 +0000
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dana 44 question

Joe & Jen DeLaurentis wrote:

> WEll it seems like i started war and still have no answer ...
> its a 68 4WD dana 44 I want to swap 76-79 Dana 44 disc brakes
> onto my dana 44 drum brake rear????A yes or no answer will work
> to this question...Also anybody have a dana 44 front end for sale?
> --
> Joe
> Aka. Fordguy
>

If it is an open knuckle front end you can swap from the knuckle out.
That would be YES.If it is a closed knuckle front end NO you can not
swap 76-79 Dana 44 Ford disk brakes.

- --
Don Grossman
duckdon pacific.net
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pacific.net/~duckdon

63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.


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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 17:55:22 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Dana 44 question

Humor an old man here-

I have a '70 F-100 4x4 dana 44 open knuckle, drum brake Ford.
I have a '78 F-150 4x4 dana 44 open knuckle, disk brake Ford.
Both trucks completely stock.

Either I'm blind or dumb, one has ball joints ('78) the other has "trunion"
bearings ('70)- (as Gary called it) I can't conceive how the spindles on
one will work on the other! I'll take pictures an post them if ya want to
see what I mean. If this *IS* the case, I have a spare dana 44 that I'd be
more than happy to convert the '70's brakes over with!!!! Joe- If you need
a front axle and are anywhere near Ohio, I'll sell ya' mine dirt cheap!

Now, on to another issue- This is not a war by no means! I hope it's not
coming across in that manner, this newsgroup is meant for learning and
helping other people, should I be wrong, I'd LOVE to know why! I'm open to
learning! I've gone to college for 5 years! 8-) (suppose to be 4, but
hey, nobody's perfect!) Don, please don't think I'm offending you-- You
knowledge greatly surpasses me on old Fords, but I just don't see how?!

At 02:20 PM 7/17/98 +0000, you wrote:
>If it is an open knuckle front end you can swap from the knuckle out.
>That would be YES.If it is a closed knuckle front end NO you can not
>swap 76-79 Dana 44 Ford disk brakes.
>
>--
>Don Grossman
>duckdon pacific.net
>http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.pacific.net/~duckdon
>
>63 F-100 4x4 with 3/4 ton running gear and most of the trimmings.

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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 17:18:18 -0700
From: sdelanty sonic.net
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Fun at Pick'n'Pull...

Got to goto Pick'n'Pull and meet fellow FTE member Pat Brown this morning.
Big Fun! (well, for me at least...)

Found *one* of the 2 plastic grill inserts for my '71 in very good shape.
Only gotta find one more for me, then I can start looking for some for
Tony M... no good turn signal lenses today.
When I left Pat, he was staring at a wheelbarrow full of power steering
parts for his truck. Bet I know what he's doing this weekend!

DuckDon, You missed out bigtime! We found 2 cammers for $125ea, and
a 427 side oiler with a richmond 5-speed for $225... but we bought them
all and left none for You! (Just kidding!)
Pat and I agreed that You have to go with us next time we make a P'n'P run,
but we ain't gonna settle for You buying us lunch at Dennys. I was gonna
let You off with taking us to Playa Azul, or maybe Fitch mountain Eddie's,
but I think Pat is shooting for Cricklewood or somewhere fancier ($$).(-:

Got to meet another FTE member face to face *and* goto the wrecking
yard today.. life doesn't get much better than that! err, does it?

Pat mentioned that Deacon has been awfull quiet lately.. I figure he's
got a new girlfriend or something and doesn't love us anymore.
C'mon Deacon, how 'bout some good song lyrics or words of wisdom for us
to show You still care! (-:

Steve
Homepage: http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.sonic.net/~sdelanty

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Date: Fri, 17 Jul 1998 20:50:14 -0400
From: "Jerry"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Re: ADDING BELLY TANK

> Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 10:32:07 -0700
> From: "Douglas W. Hack"
> Subject: FTE 61-79 - Adding Belly tank to Supercab
>
> My '78 F150 Supercab shortbed with 351M got all of 8MPG. With the stock
> 21 gallon rear tank I saw the gas station entirely too frequently. I am
> doing a lot of work to it transferring the 400 and complete
> drivetrain/etc. from a wrecked F250 to it. I keep looking at the belly
> tank on the F250 ('78 regular cab long bed) and wanting to put it under
> the Supercab. It seems the Supercab has a different crossmember that
> gets in the way, but it still looks like it might be possible. Has
> anyone done this one? If this tank won't work, what will?

Hey Douglas -
It just so happens I am about to finish the project of adding a mid-frame
and an aux (rear) tank to my 69 350. The donor truck was a 76 or 78 F250 (I
think) for the mid mount tank. The supports for the donor tank were a
bolted-on mini xmbr for the front end and a short strap between the side
frame rail and the riveted-in big xmbr. The mini bolted in perfectly
after I drilled two holes to mount it. (Frame rail widths have not changed
much (if any) over the years)
If your original xmbr is not in the correct place to support the rear of
the new tank....dont worry...be happy !! !
Just locate another donor truck (or fabricate) another mini one like the
front one. The only problem I had was the tank wouldn't mount up as high in
front as I wanted it and was held up about an inch by a section of my 69
xmbr bracket on the left side that didnt quite have enough of a curve to it
to match the curve in the tank. Most 73 up trucks all have this bracket
with the sharper curve in it. ) Grinding or cutting out a 1 x 3 piece out
of the side of it made the tank fit perfect......and I mean perfect. All
the bends, kinks, bumps, and bubbles of the tank matched my undercarriage.....


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