61-79-list-digest Thursday, May 21 1998 Volume 02 : Number 297



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Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1961-1979 Trucks and Vans
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In this issue:

RE: FTE 61-79 - Screw in cast iron "freeze" plugs
FTE 61-79 - M-block intake manifolds, etc.
Re: FTE 61-79 - Heater Line Routes
FTE 61-79 - Screw in freeze plugs
FTE 61-79 - Strange heater hose routing
FTE 61-79 - VIN Decoding Program
Re: FTE 61-79 - Heater Line Routes
Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs
RE: FTE 61-79 - re:re: Carbs open plenum spacer
Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs
Re: FTE 61-79 - Heater Line Routes
RE: FTE 61-79 - re:re: Carbs open plenum spacer
Re: FTE 61-79 - Aluminum Intake for 390
FTE 61-79 - RE: temporary garages
Re: FTE 61-79 - Screw in freeze plugs
Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs
Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs
Re: FTE 61-79 - Aluminum Intake for 390
Re: FTE 61-79 - 1966 Ford F100 Prices & Service Specifications for Trucks.
Re: FTE 61-79 - new member

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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:53:15 -0400
From: Sleddog
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - Screw in cast iron "freeze" plugs

'cause they don't come out unless you want them out!!!!! they are easier
to put in/remove when the block is in the truck too. mostly racers use em,
and blocks like the SVO 460 block comes from ford with them.

sleddog

- ----------
From: Keith Srb[SMTP:herbie netvalue.net]
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 1998 2:23 PM
To: 61-79-list ford-trucks.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Screw in cast iron "freeze" plugs


Screw in cast iron freeze plugs. O.K. This is a new one on me. They make
a screw in cast iron freeze plug? Why would you want to use something like
that ?

Thanks



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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 13:18:06 -0600
From: "Dave Resch"
Subject: FTE 61-79 - M-block intake manifolds, etc.

>From: "Dale and Donna Carmine"
>Subject: FTE 61-79 - intake manifold
>
>Can anyone tell me if I can bolt a non-egr intake manifold
>onto my egr equipped 351M. I assume that the exhaust
>crossover is simply blocked by the manifold, but I'm not
>sure. Or do non-egr manifolds still have the exhaust
>crossover without the provision for the egr plumbing?

Yo Dale:

You can put a non-EGR manifold on your EGR-equipped M-block. Other than
losing EGR function and some emissions legality, AFAIK, there are no other
negative side effects.

The Weiand Action Plus (#8010) and the Edelbrock Performer non-EGR (#2171)
both block off the EGR ports (and the Thermactor ports) on the M-block
heads. Neither has any internal plumbing for either air injection or EGR.
The claimed operating range for the Weiand manifold is 1000-6000 rpm, while
E'brock claims the Performer manifold operating range is idle-5500.

As for the Edelbrock manifolds, the carb mounting flange on the non-EGR
manifold (#2171) is pretty thin and (I've heard) you have to cough up extra
cash for a decent carb spacer/adapter. OTOH, the carb flange on the
Edelbrock EGR manifold (#3771) is pretty decent and it's at least as wide
as the stock Ford part (though, of course, the E'brock is a 4V flange and
not a 2V flange like the factory manifold).

The E'brock EGR manifold also comes with a decent 2V EGR adapter that
allows you to use the stock Motorcraft 2150 2V carb, so you don't have to
blow for the 4V carb at the same time to be able to use the manifold. The
E'brock EGR manifold is an emissions legal replacement for '75-'80
M-blocks, so it has all the EGR and Thermactor provisions. You can simply
block off the EGR passage in the carb flange (say, with a non-EGR spacer or
adapter) if you don't want to use it. Or, E'brock will be happy to relieve
you of another $40-50 for an EGR 4V adapter. Similarly, you can just plug
the Thermactor port on top of the manifold if you don't want to use it.

BTW: I have read claims (from Ch*vy owners!) that the Weiand manifolds
flow better from the factory than the E'brocks.

>my '79 f-150, 351M, has the smog pump driven from
>the crank. The motor was swapped in by the previous
>owner. Does that mean that my engine is from a car?

I am only going by my personal experience here, and the very last thing I
would want to do (besides drive a GM product) is appear to be some sort of
expert that I am not, but I have never seen a truck M-block (that I know
was an original truck engine) that had a crank-driven Thermactor air pump.
Maybe that means your engine was originally installed in a car, maybe not.
Maybe it means that car accessory brackets and pulleys were used on your
truck engine, maybe not.

Dave R. (M-block devotee)


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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 15:26:50 -0400
From: "John Miller"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Heater Line Routes


>The "T" is between the radiator,
>heater core and the off shoot connects to the
>carb. adapter. Strange! I don't think it's right,
>especially since none of the '68's I looked at
>at the Forge had this configuration. If anyone
>can shed some light I'd appreciate it.

You kind of lost me there, where is your truck from? this could be a
Northern option.. hmmm a yankee truck... or an altitude option... dunno,
can you describe a little better? not that I am all that familiar with the
model but still some sense should be able to be made of this.

John Miller, FoMoCoNUT Gibralter.net
96 F-350 Reg Cab XLT, 4x4, 460 w/ A4OD, My Baby "Baloo"
75 F-100 Reg Cab Ranger, 2wd, 360, C6, Daily Driver " Lucy"
and "always" looking ! ! !
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:34:04 -0500
From: John Strauss
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Screw in freeze plugs

>Obviously they aren't really necessary or you wouldn't be hearing
>numbers like 300k miles with no major engine work.........but they
>are fun and actually have a purpose on engines that see some hard
>work. Being of the same material as the block they help evenly
>distrubute the heat and also torque loads which tends to keep the
>cylinders more round under stress. The difference may be small,
>don't know but when I first saw the idea it imediately grabbed my
>imagination so I ran with it. I did my 460 that way and have no
>regrets but you better anti-sieze them if you ever plan to retank the
>block. I used square, male wrench lug type but the hex, female type
>is cleaner and stays out of the way of starter contacts.
>
Gary, how did you cut threads into the block? I have only seen these on
the 427 SOHC and side-oilers from the factory.
_
_| ~~. John Strauss
\, *_} jstrauss inetport.com
\( Texas Fight!

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:34:07 -0500
From: John Strauss
Subject: FTE 61-79 - Strange heater hose routing

>I have a '68 with a 360 and am in the
>process of putting A/C on it. (Thanks,
>Stu). The current heater hoses on it
>has a unique set up on it. I had hoped
>that I would see one like mine at the
>Forge but no luck. On one side the
>heater core is the heater control valve
>and terminates on the front of the manifold.
>On the other side of the heater core there is
>a "T" fitting. The "T" is between the radiator,
>heater core and the off shoot connects to the
>carb. adapter. Strange! I don't think it's right,
>especially since none of the '68's I looked at
>at the Forge had this configuration. If anyone
>can shed some light I'd appreciate it.
>
Ted, I have a '68 F-250 at home with a 360. I'll take a look and let you
know what I see.
_
_| ~~. John Strauss
\, *_} jstrauss inetport.com
\( Texas Fight!

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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 15:39:22 -0400
From: Tony Marino
Subject: FTE 61-79 - VIN Decoding Program

Hello All!

Well people, I'm going to be about the ump-teenth million person to ask to
have his VIN and engine numbers decoded!

Here's what I came up with- If somebody would be as so kind to do this for
me, in return I think I'll write a cgi database for the FTE home page, and
with Ken's permission, you'll be able to pop in all the information you can
get off your truck and see the results. That way we don't have to take up
list space with this sort of thing. Do you guys like that idea? What do
you think Ken? All I would need people to do is to send me the information
they have on each years, or if there is a book listing all of the years and
codes I could buy, so I can type all that stuff in.

Now, I just bought a '70 F-100 4x4 shortbed stepside, and I want to know
the story on it specifically:

The engine code is: G9AE-6015-B
The VIN: F11BKJ51173
Wheel Base: 115 (inches? No brainer?)
Color: M
Model: F113
Body: 3 3 A (numbers weren't stamped under label)
Axle: H3

Please E-mail me privately, and Answers are GREATLY appreciated!

Thanks!

Tony
tony pscico.com
www.pscico.com/~tony
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:43:55 -0700
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Heater Line Routes

At 01:56 PM 21/05/98 +0000, you wrote:
>Hey Folks,
>
>Enjoyed meeting everyone at the Forge.
>What a Blast!!!! Can't wait till next year!
>
>I have a '68 with a 360 and am in the
>process of putting A/C on it. (Thanks,
>Stu). The current heater hoses on it
>has a unique set up on it. I had hoped
>that I would see one like mine at the
>Forge but no luck. On one side the
>heater core is the heater control valve
>and terminates on the front of the manifold.
>On the other side of the heater core there is
>a "T" fitting. The "T" is between the radiator,
>heater core and the off shoot connects to the
>carb. adapter. Strange! I don't think it's right,
>especially since none of the '68's I looked at
>at the Forge had this configuration. If anyone
>can shed some light I'd appreciate it.
>
>Thanks,
>
> -Ted

Ted:

Where does the other end of the carb adapter go? I can check on my
friend's 69, it has a similar setup with the T to the carb adapter. I'll
tell you after the weekend.


marko

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:47:38 -0600 (CST)
From: Stu Varner
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs

A
>>I would appreciate it If I could get a photo copy of all the 4100 info.
>>Trying to create the ultimate owners manual as I build my truck along So I
>>won't have to search later in life again.
>>
>>Private email if you can help out.
>>Gratzi
>>
>>STU
>>Nuke GM!
>>
>
>Stu:
>
>I expect sharesies on this!!
Marko,
You got it big boy! Send me your snail mail.
Stu

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:47:47 -0700
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - re:re: Carbs open plenum spacer

I realize daily I don't know nearly what I thought I knew!
>
Don't worry Stu. For two whole months now (or is it closer to 3?) you get
to be the smartest again!


We'll miss ya (a little I guess)


marko in vancouver



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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:45:30 -0700
From: "Deacon"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs

From: Stu Varner
>Deacon, what do you think about rorad trip east with Keith, marko and
me to
>the nats in Tenn?

Let me get this straight. Your coming out here to ride back to Tenn? OK
by me! :) 4 of us in the cab of a truck for a couple thousand miles has
got to have some laughs along the way.

>I would appreciate it If I could get a photo copy of all the 4100 info.
>Trying to create the ultimate owners manual as I build my truck along
So I
>won't have to search later in life again.

See all the neat info your going to miss out on. :) All you need to do
is ask. Who loves ya baby?
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.cybervillage.com/ponycarburetor/spreadbore.htm

Later!

Deacon
deconblu gte.net
=============================
Nuke the unborn baby whales.
=============================
Deacon's
http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://home1.gte.net/deconblu/



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:53:08 -0600 (CST)
From: Stu Varner
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Heater Line Routes

At 01:56 PM 5/21/98 +0000, you wrote:
>Hey Folks,
>
>Enjoyed meeting everyone at the Forge.
>What a Blast!!!! Can't wait till next year!
>
>I have a '68 with a 360 and am in the
>process of putting A/C on it. (Thanks,
>Stu). The current heater hoses on it
>has a unique set up on it. I had hoped
>that I would see one like mine at the
>Forge but no luck. On one side the
>heater core is the heater control valve
>and terminates on the front of the manifold.
>On the other side of the heater core there is
>a "T" fitting. The "T" is between the radiator,
>heater core and the off shoot connects to the
>carb. adapter. Strange! I don't think it's right,
>especially since none of the '68's I looked at
>at the Forge had this configuration. If anyone
>can shed some light I'd appreciate it.
>
>Thanks,
Ted, I will photo copy the AC and heater hose section of the Helm/Ford
manual I just got in the mail. It is unused!! It should help you greatly.
Send me your snail mail privately and I'll ship to you.
It shoudl solve all the problems plus I have photos of the engine bay from
before the dismnantling. Pigeon Forge should be every weekend. man what a
time.

Stu
Nuke GM

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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 15:01:30 -0600 (CST)
From: Stu Varner
Subject: RE: FTE 61-79 - re:re: Carbs open plenum spacer

>oh, one more thing, you'd have to put in my cobra kit car i wanna build in
>the next couple of years- before i am too "afraid" to drive it!

I'll be glad to fabricate the frame for you. Should be no problem!!
You build my engine/ I buy parts/ I fabricate your snakey litlle kit car
that will blow everybodies doors off! DEAL?

>or maybe a 48 merc for 2wd truck pulling...
>
Sweet! Startin to sound like Marko with the Merc thing! :) I am just
jealous!!!!

Stu
Nuke GM!

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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 13:14:18 -0700
From: John MacNamara
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Aluminum Intake for 390

Marko Maryniak wrote:

> At 07:14 AM 21/05/98 -0700, you wrote:
> >
> >
> >Hello: For those people who would like an option to the Ford and
> >Edlbrock aluminum 4bl intakes for the 390, I have scanned an image of
> >the Ford Power Parts intake. If you email me privately, I can send the
> >picture.
> >
> >
> >Thanks
> >John
> >
> John,
>
> What I really want is that manifold and the eight webers on the 454 Ford
> that you sent me the article about!
>
> marko in vancouver

Me too!!! I saw one in my snake bite bulletin but it was $500 and no
carbs. Can't imagine how much those 8 webers cost, plus linkage, plus ???

Maybe someday

FE's Rule!!

Regards
John

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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 16:08:32 +0000
From: tfmf211 murphyfarms.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - RE: temporary garages

OX,

I have one. Works okay for me until my real garage gets built.
Be sure to put it on high ground and have a floor put in it.
Otherwise when the ground gets wet and starts to evaporate it
starts raining inside. Mine withstood a nor'easter with 50mph
plus winds with no problems.

Again the floor is the key behind proper initial installation.

Mine is a Cover-It.
1-800-932-4777
www.cover-it-inc.com

Later,

-Ted

___________
Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 13:52:14 -0400
From: luxjo thecore.com
Subject: FTE 61-79 - temporary garages

Howdy

I was wondering if anyone has picked up a temporary garage and how it
has held up. What brand did you get if so. I am thinking of getting one
big enough to house the bronc and my 21' boat.

OX
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 16:27:13 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Screw in freeze plugs

> Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 14:34:04 -0500
> From: John Strauss
> Subject: FTE 61-79 - Screw in freeze plugs

> Gary, how did you cut threads into the block? I have only seen
> these on the 427 SOHC and side-oilers from the factory.

The plugs are 1-1/4" pipe plugs and the holes are almost the right
size already but I made a tapered reamer with a flange to stop the
depth on it and just put it in a drill and ran it in. The cutter was
exactly the size I wanted for the right thread depth for the plugs so
it may not be for everybody but I bet someone out there sells a kit
for this.

The trick is that all the plugs are different sizes, enough to make a
difference in the depth at which they become water tight so you have
to make each hole by trial and error and mark the plugs for the hole
or you will have trouble when you try to install them and find out
they go too deep and block the water passage etc..

You could probably cut the threads without boring the hole if you had
the right tap or a set of taps with two lengths and starting
diameters etc.. I'm a cutter grinder so it was no problem for me to
make the cutter. I'm pretty rusty on what exactly went on there so
I'm going from memory here as to the difficulties I ran into and the
reasons I did things. I may have used the cutter to make the job more
uniform, not sure now.

BTW, you want to get the tap started striaght so the plug goes in
flush with the block and not lopsided too, there isn't much thread to
do the sealing so it all counts.

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 15:33:19 -0600 (CST)
From: Stu Varner
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs

At 12:45 PM 5/21/98 -0700, you wrote:
>From: Stu Varner
>>Deacon, what do you think about rorad trip east with Keith, marko and
>me to
>>the nats in Tenn?
>
>Let me get this straight. Your coming out here to ride back to Tenn? OK
>by me! :) 4 of us in the cab of a truck for a couple thousand miles has


2,000 miles in marko's big Merc, (i got shotgun the whole trip, i called it)
with marko's brains, Keith's sensiblitiy and our perverted sick wacked out
minds!
Marko, bring the cuban cigars from canada along with the Mist.

Oh I wouldn't miss that for any stiinkin thing in the whole wide world.
I believe we could sell tickets to the movie if we filmed it. Kinda like
Wild America, the movie. I'd do it in a heart beat!

What we, as an FTE organization needs to do, is have a one lap around America!
Idea here, Ken!!!

Stu

2 days to leaving, sniff sob boo hoo!

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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 16:34:50 +0000
From: "Gary, 78 BBB"
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs

> From: "Deacon"
> Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Autolite carbs
> Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:45:30 -0700

> http://www.ford-trucks.com//lc/lc.php?action=do&link=http://www.cybervillage.com/ponycarburetor/spreadbore.htm

Wait a minute the 4100 is a spread bore??? I thought all this time
you guys were talking square bore??

78 F-150, 2wd, 460, C-6, 235's
78 Bronco 351M, Np 435, Np 205, 33's
78 Lincoln Town Car, 460, C-6, 19.5' long!

- -- Gary --
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 13:48:23 -0700
From: Marko Maryniak
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - Aluminum Intake for 390

>FE's Rule!!
>
>Regards
>John

You got it John!

Anyway, here's the latest on my motor:

66 Mercury 410, bored 30 over
about 9:1 compression
michigan bearings
engle cam
cloyes true roller chain
stock oil pump
new valves/guides/shafts
deep rear sump 4x4 pan (of course!)
"S" code 4bbl intake (stock 410 part from '66)
Stan's tri-Y headers (chrome)
Autolite 4100 (cadmium kitted)
Duraspark ignition with big cap, Auto Line rebuilt distributor
Pent roof valve covers with Mercury script

Engine will be old ford blue, including valve covers
Pulleys will be Endura black (dull finish, not flat, not semigloss)
(Endura is the toughest paint there is, not anything related to viagra!)
alternator will be detail grey (eastwood)
alt pulley will be cadmium blue (eastwood)
air cleaner will be a gold bottom with endura black lid, and gold "mercury
410 marauder" sticker
there is this really cool factory balance tube for pcv/vacuum between the
front and rear of the intake manifold. it goes into brass fittings which I
glass beaded and clear coated (they look frosty, rather than shiny) and the
tube itself is cast grey and goes into the pcv valve.
the oil filter adapter and the pressure sender are clearcoated

What do you think, especially about the air cleaner idea? I saw a '64
mercury, um, montego I think (full sized 4 door sedan) with the 3
taillights and the slanted-in rear window. What a BADASS car that would
be! It had a 390 with a similar gold and black air cleaner, which gave me
the idea.

marko in vancouver
marko dsm.ca

BTW I changed my email address from marko helix.net to marko dsm.ca
Please note!!!

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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 17:04:36 EDT
From: GMPACHECO
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - 1966 Ford F100 Prices & Service Specifications for Trucks.

Where did you buy all those books ?

Mike in Seattle
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Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 15:30:13 -0600
From: Ryan Dorman
Subject: Re: FTE 61-79 - new member

You got lucky. Most of those old trucks will stay in those back yards till the
end of time,
People wont fix and drive them but they won't sell them due to sentimental
reasons..

Tony Marino wrote:

> Thanks OLD MAN!! 8-)
>
> Yeah, I might as well tell you guys that I added another truck to my
> collection making 4 now. It's a '70 as Stu said, shortbed, stepside, 4x4
> with a NP435, NP203, and another I-6! One owner, bone stock down to the
> rims, and I bought it in Montana. I live in Ohio and drove out there to
> pick it up. I couldn't believe the number of old vehicles I saw from S.
> Dakota on to Montana. Hundreds of old fords in people's back yards with no
> rust, and ALL 4x4's!
>
> I got a sweet deal on the truck, I left my checkbook at home on accident
> and the people were kind enough to let me take the truck home without even
> paying them, and that evening they also treated me and my friend to a prime
> rib steak dinner and homemade chocolate chip cookies! It's nice to know
> that there are still great people out there. I'll be adding pictures and
> the whole trip experience to my web page here soon, as soon as I pick all
> of the bugs out of my eyes and teeth from the trip! I'm sure I'll be
> asking a lot of questions here coming up, I'm a 73-79 man myself, but this
> truck is going to get the total resto just like the other.
>
> Tony
> tony pscico.com
> www.pscico.com/~tony
> ----------------------------------
>
> >>Great job on your website, by the way. Clean and well laid out.
> >Tony Marino did it. I just supplied the info. Go to Tony's link on my
> >site and check out his herd of Effies! He just got a new one this weekend
> >from Montana! A 70 model 4x4. I want him to share with the group but he's
> >still sleeping from being awake 45 hours straight. Kids today just aren';t
> >as tuff as they used to be!
> >
> >Stu
> >Nuke GM!
> >
>
> = Ford Truck Enthusiasts ==============================================
> Send posts to: 61-79-list ....


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